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Basketball or a night at the fights?

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posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 08:55 PM
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My search here did not show that this has been reported. Even if it has, I'm hoping my slant will be an original view of this subject.

As you may or may not know, the Detroit Pistons-Indians Pacers basketball game lat last week ended in violence. Several fans were injured. Players wnet into the stands after players. Fans pelted players with beverages, popcorn and chairs.


It would be easy to dismiss this incident as an aberration, to point to the thousands of other games that have been played without similar problems. But to do that would be to ignore the steady ratcheting up of player-fan hostility in all sports and the underlying issues that are particular to the NBA.


The NBA can trot out figures that would dispute any notion of its decline: solid attendance, steady TV ratings, lucrative sponsorships and advertising deals, strong licensing revenues, broader interest worldwide.


Yet it would be a mistake for Stern to take smug satisfaction in that and try to patch over the current flare-up with the suspensions and some beefed-up security.


There is a growing disconnect between many fans and the NBA, whose American players, perhaps more than those in any other sport, are perceived as arrogant, selfish and overpaid. Those images were reinforced this summer by the U.S. team at the Athens Olympics.


read AP story here

Now, I saw the replay of this from several angles many times. What possessed players to react this way? Too much beer? Arrogance and disrespect?
Whatever could these million dollar players be thinking? To go after a fan for ANY reason is beyond me.

ANd, on a local metro Detroit radio station, WRIF this morning, it was said that sporting events are not the only places where violence is showing up. Concerts are also falling victim to random acts of violence.
Are we doomed here as a society? Will being in a crowd become something to shun at any cost?

Pacers apologize for brawl n Detroit
no charges iminent
www.detnews.com...
www.detnews.com...
www.indystar.com...




[edit on 22-11-2004 by DontTreadOnMe]




posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 09:25 PM
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DTOM,

My guess would be that the players are trying to be like the rest of the world when it comes to mixing violence with sports.

Canadien's got their hockey players and European's got their soccer players, hey, and the American's got their NBA!



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 09:36 PM
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Well, I'm not sure that is it. Artest has apparently run afoul of the law. They "fan" who threw the intial beer is not stranger to the inside of a cell and has apparently 3 DUIs.

There has been violence in hockey forever. I remeber Tai Domei.
And, well, the Europeans take their soccer very seriously and emotionally, i guess.

This was ludicrous. The initial foul from behind by Artest and Wallace shoving back was not that unusual, I guess. The rest was unusual and unnecessary.



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 09:43 PM
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The players involved should be banned for life!The violence in sports is escalating, unfortunately some of the fans even encourage it, hockey comes to mind! By setting this type of example may quiet any future outbreaks, this puts a bad name to sports, the fans involved should also be charged and banned from future sporting events. I think AA would help some of them too!



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 09:50 PM
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I suppose I was being a little sarcastic at my comment on the NBA wanting to join the rest of the world when it comes to combining sports and violence.

It was uncalled for, especially when a player is making $millions/year and are "superstars" in many childrens eyes!

I know we're all human and make mistakes, but there is something that is called, "self-control."

I can't say what I'd do in the same situation, but if I were making the money these players do, I'd have to laugh at the actions of some irresponsible and "redneck" fans.

Now, Artest has lost $5 million pay for not showing a little self-discipline.



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:00 PM
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it's just that we're in a different time with everything. Now we've got gangsters playing sports. These ball players are and have been in with the wrong crowd ever since they were young. They now handle situations differently. We're just in a different era that's all. No mystery to it.



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:08 PM
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Here's a thought - what if they stopped selling alcohol at these events?



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:09 PM
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Would never happen, that's like saying stop selling hotdog at the events. Alcohol pays the bills.


LL1

posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:12 PM
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Artest was dead wrong....
Did he forget he had signed an NBA contract, and is no longer in the streets?
Funny thing is...
He didn't go after the one who had his teammate in a chokehold...
That would have been far too much of a challenge.
Oh no, he ran into the stand after the most innocent looking target.

Did you note the alleged cup thrower had his hand on Artest's back?



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:14 PM
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I know they would never ban alcohol but it makes people mean and stupid.



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:17 PM
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no these people who come from the hood stay with the same mentality through out their lives unless they change something drastically. It's their way of life and all they know because of the way they've been raised.



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:17 PM
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I agree with the initial assessment. Micro-Macro Cosom. It is a refection of the mood of our Nation the frustration the Binary Thought Process. The obvious Polarization of a People, a Country, a Planet.
And indications would lead one to believe the solution will only be found in Battle. Football at Pro and College level has shown the same. Politics reflects the same. Is it so hard to read the witting on the wall? The World is in a Madness.

TUT



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 11:52 PM
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I saw on an ESPN show that for the $385 ticket price floor level seating cost at the Palace you're given free drinks at the VIP bar or club or whatever it is they have at the arena, and then free drinks during the game. Having had free alcohol privliges at sporting events before myself, I assure you these guys were beyond drunk. With the extremely close proximity you are to the players at an NBA game, it was bound to happen. I'm just glad it was so entertaining and no one got hurt. I particularly enjoyed the two chubby guys getting flat out decked at the end of the whole thing.

This is hardly without precedent. Incidents like this have happened throughout the history of pro sports. Ty Cobb beat the bloody hell out of a heckler with no arms or legs. And that was 90 years ago. Hockey players have gone into the stands before. I happened to see this fight live when it happened on ESPN. A couple thoughts went through my head.....the season is over for the Pacers, and people are going to blow this way out of proportion. I was right on both accounts. This event was only earth shattering to people that don't watch sports and sports writers that believe sports are more important than they are.

Why did he do it? Like others have said, he's from the hood. A large majority of the NBA/NFL would be drug dealers and hustlers if it weren't for their athletic ability. Sorry for the sterotype.


Micro-Macro Cosom. It is a refection of the mood of our Nation the frustration the Binary Thought Process. The obvious Polarization of a People, a Country, a Planet.
And indications would lead one to believe the solution will only be found in Battle. Football at Pro and College level has shown the same. Politics reflects the same. Is it so hard to read the witting on the wall? The World is in a Madness.


This was simply a fight - nothing more, nothing less. Something that's happened in sports since the beginning of sports.



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 12:34 AM
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Originally posted by Lady Lily
I know they would never ban alcohol but it makes people mean and stupid.


alcohol doesn't make people mean and stupid who wheren't already mean and stupid to begin with, it just amplifies they're behavior and start acting like the assholes they already where.



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 12:42 AM
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Er, I knew this would just lead to reinforcing stereotypes. As PistolPete mentioned, Ty Cobb beat up a guy without arms or legs. The hood doesn't make you automatically violent. Usually it makes you street smart, which means you know when and when not to apply violence. Guys who don't learn street smarts don't generally survive the hood.

PS - Stereotypes suck.



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 01:09 AM
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From what I saw the fan threw a cup of beer on a laying down player. Screw the little punk I would have kicked his ass too



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 11:21 AM
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Originally posted by jeeze louise
I think AA would help some of them too!

Funny you should mention that!
Mr Green, the guy in the white hat's, attorney would neither confirm not deny if his client threw the cup on GoodMorning America today, pending the decision of INTENT. Mr Green then went on to say, that although he has been convicted of at least one DUI, he is now in AA and even has a sponsor.

I wonder if anyone thought to analyze what came out of that cup. If it was beeer, he may have violated his probation.

BTW, his rap sheet sounds even longer than Mr Artest's!!

[edit on 23-11-2004 by DontTreadOnMe]



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 11:43 AM
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Originally posted by DontTreadOnMe

Now, I saw the replay of this from several angles many times. What possessed players to react this way? Too much beer? Arrogance and disrespect?
Whatever could these million dollar players be thinking? To go after a fan for ANY reason is beyond me.


First of all, Ben Wallis (Sp) who push Artest for comiting a foul was WAY out of line to even push Artest. Second of all the foul that was called on Artest, the flagrant, was an agruable call.

Artest then walked right away from the action that was going on the floor after Ben Wallis pushed Artest and layed down on the scorers table.

Then this is where the first crime was commited. When the guy threw the pop on Artest when he was lying down.... THE FANS HAVE NO RIGHT TO ENGAGE, THROW, OR TOUCH THE PLAYER. NONE AT ALL. Therefore the WHOLE blame is placed onto the stupid, immature # disturbing fans shoulders.

Next, if the fans engage a player as did the guy who threw the pop and the guy that walked up to Artest they are putting themselfs in a position to be treated like a murder or assassin in the mind of the player (Remember Artest is a Rapper, probably has friends and enemys)... When your a player and somone walks close to you for no reason other that to scrap you get visions of that tennis star that was stabbed, or the skater who was beat. Remember? Therefore the player protect themselfs and their ego.

I would have done the same thing if a fan threw a pop at me after I was tring to cool the situation down (Artest).

I would have tried to hurt the guy that aproched Artest even more than Artest did, he only punched him a couple times. I would have grabbed a chair and beat that fuccccer till the gaurds pulled me off or he was a bloody pulp. THE FANS HAVE NO RIGHT TO ENGAGE A PLAYER, EVER.

Now, having said that Artest should not have done what he did when the guy threw the pop.... But if you notice he didnt punch that guy, just pushed his head to the ground. The punches first came from the fans and then the player protected their buddys and themselfs.

DETROIT PISTON FANS ARE NOW LABLED IN MY MIND AS TROUBLE MAKERS AND THE WORST POSSIBLE PLACE TO PLAY A PROFESSIONAL SPORT IN NORTH AMERICA CAUSE NOW THEY HAVE IT IN THEM THAT THEY ARE "BAD ASS".

ALL YOU DETROIT FANS THAT WERE THERE NEED TO HIRE A REPRESTITIVE AND HAVE HIM APPOLOGIZE FOR YOUR ACTIONS.... I hope your happy, you got the contender for the chamionship out of the race now (Indiana).

Detroit Piston Fans Disgust Me



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 12:13 PM
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Ive been thinking about another thing too.... A couple weeks ago Artest missed a couple games because he needed time off to finish his rap album that was coming out. Artest at this time told the press "Im tired, I needed time off to finish my rap album and my daughters album... I would like to have the whole year off, but "we" got a championship to win this year (meaning Indiana)." Thats not word for word. But close.

Its most obviously a coincidence, but something to think about at the same time as to the mind set of Artest... He could have been thinking that the first incodent he was in that he would push the envelope and try to get "time off".



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 12:16 PM
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....public+beer * players+steroids = WWF?




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