Spain orders arrests of Chinese ex president

www.cnn.com...

If Spain is serious these are some heavy accusations. I'm curious to see how this will play out since I'm sure those accused are still active in the affairs of global politics.

reply to post by marbles87


Hmm, very difficult to handle. China would never give them away. Unfortunately, justice for moral atrocities is not as thorough as it could be, in a more ideal world. This applies everywhere, however.

marbles87
www.cnn.com...

If Spain is serious these are some heavy accusations. I'm curious to see how this will play out since I'm sure those accused are still active in the affairs of global politics.

It's nice to see someone, a country even, trying to do something. But I think China will either ignore this or they may stop exporting to Spain as punishment (probably a reward actually LOL, less Chinese junk cluttering up landfills). More than likely they will apply to the EU to put their their "dog" on a leash or they might manipulate the economy of Spain to apply pressure. It is likely however retaliation will come from local sources pressured by China. Problem is though, the "dog" is right.

Cheers - Dave

reply to post by bobs_uruncle


I disagree with the term dog, since it by default implies a master, and that the actions of the dog are directed and the responsibility of said master. This is not the case even if I agree that in the EU not all the animals are equal, I can't remember any specific nation taking insidious or morally questionable actions from inside the EU in the strict behalf of another EU member. (The same can't be said in behalf of the US)

Getting to be quite the joke .. all these countries wanting to arrest ex-leaders of other countries .. nothing will ever come of it and as always the corrupt bastards all run free to live out their days ... nothing ever changes .. meh entire bloody world needs a reset ..

Panic2k11
reply to post by bobs_uruncle

 

I disagree with the term dog, since it by default implies a master, and that the actions of the dog are directed and the responsibility of said master. This is not the case even if I agree that in the EU not all the animals are equal, I can't remember any specific nation taking insidious or morally questionable actions from inside the EU in the strict behalf of another EU member. (The same can't be said in behalf of the US)

Well, since Spain signed the treaty, I guess the EU is the master as unfortunate as that reality appears. However, when I referred to a "dog," funny me, I was thinking along the lines of an intelligent utility dog that could see problems and act upon them without its "masters" intervention. Oh well, I will have to be more explanatory and clear in my rendering of thoughts. But the poster below your comment has the right idea, we need a complete reset of the world and probably a purging of the gene pool of the present day sociopaths and psychopaths in the government and banking sectors.

You take any issue with that?

Cheers - Dave

reply to post by bobs_uruncle

Well, since Spain signed the treaty, I guess the EU is the master as unfortunate as that reality appears.

I think you do not understand what the EU is, if for instance we compare it to the US the EU is not a federation so individual states are not really as dependent of the EU political structure and in many regards preserve a lot more independence than a State under the US federal government. There are also large differences in the type of governance than the EU provides it is specific to a lot of less areas than under a federation (not that I dislike the notion of a federal European state, just not under the current EU structure), and it mostly attempts to normalize the different EU economies and law systems and to a lesser point to centralize external relation (a major fail in that area, except to some degree in the economic area).

The EU is mostly a failed costly bureaucratic organ at this point, it serves the interests of the major economies and provides some normalizations (as I referred, some good some in-line with those interests) an not much more. Germany pressed for the premature adoption of the Euro to streamline its unification. France attempted to get out of the foot of the US (NATO) via an European Army (mostly to protect EU economic and strategic interests, including their own strategic defense sectors). The UK is a US puppet (most of its defense industry has now been co-opted into the US military complex) and continues to poison any significant advances that could occur, it will never accept joining into a real federal state. Then there is the US influence via NATO, FMI, World Bank etc (and UK) that tends to complicate things for the EU development at every chance like the unnecessarily fast expansion East (Germany was mostly interested in Poland) and into Turkey.

we need a complete reset of the world and probably a purging of the gene pool of the present day sociopaths and psychopaths in the government and banking sectors.

I agree with that but I see it also as an extremely dangerous proposition (especially today), in any case it will never happen in a way that benefits humanity (positive revolutions tend to be peaceful, fast and around very well defined goals) all other types of revolutions are always managed (even if they start in an independent way) and all are artificially induced (especially from outside). So we will probably not get a revolution but a collapse (several implosions that will bring it all down) and that will indeed put us all back in civilizational terms well worst than we are now. For the individualist that is now on skid row, if they are lucky this could be an improvement, but for most of humanity it will be a return to the dark ages.

Although the common thought on this is there is no way anyone would enforce this completely due to current state of mind that politicians are incapable of being prosecuted. But look at the NO mayor getting 20 felonies which will mean a lot of time. How could the world turn their back on an arrest warrant for crimes against humanity. If they don't do something there will be backlash. People will say "how can such crimes go without being seen in any court" would basically mean crimes against humanity is decriminalized.

marbles87
Although the common thought on this is there is no way anyone would enforce this completely due to current state of mind that politicians are incapable of being prosecuted. But look at the NO mayor getting 20 felonies which will mean a lot of time. How could the world turn their back on an arrest warrant for crimes against humanity. If they don't do something there will be backlash. People will say "how can such crimes go without being seen in any court" would basically mean crimes against humanity is decriminalized.

Kill a few people, you're a murderer. Kill a few million, you're a king.

Cheers - Dave

Panic2k11
reply to post by bobs_uruncle

 

I agree with that but I see it also as an extremely dangerous proposition (especially today), in any case it will never happen in a way that benefits humanity (positive revolutions tend to be peaceful, fast and around very well defined goals) all other types of revolutions are always managed (even if they start in an independent way) and all are artificially induced (especially from outside). So we will probably not get a revolution but a collapse (several implosions that will bring it all down) and that will indeed put us all back in civilizational terms well worst than we are now. For the individualist that is now on skid row, if they are lucky this could be an improvement, but for most of humanity it will be a return to the dark ages.

Although I agree with you to some extent on the EU, especially that it a wasteful bureaucracy that caters specifically to corporate interests, the intent of the EU has always been to create an integrated federal state of Europe and they have come a long way in doing that. The economic control of the individual countries provides all the leverage the EU needs to do anything they want through extortion and exploitation.

On the reset, from a technological vantage we are living in enlightened times, however from a sociological, financial and political standpoint, we have already started entering the dark ages. Everything is controlled by oligarchies, feudal or purely financial. The undoing of privacy through groups like the NSA is ushering in the fascist/totalitarian state. The global money power is pushing for a one world currency and government to tighten the chains on the serfs to steal more of the value of their collective labour. Education is no longer learning or learning to think critically, it is indoctrination. And our social systems place no value on people, just the "things" they can screw or products they can buy. There is not virtue or value in being sane in an insane world.

So I welcome the crash ;-) I've got my wood stoves out in the rural areas, one road in and the same road out. I'm stocked up pretty good, have fishing and hunting, run my own vegetable gardens and since I am highly technological I can build, design or fix pretty much anything. I realize most people are not prepared, they live in cities but that is their choice.

Cheers - Dave

This is a fantastic and noble stance taken by Spain regardless whether there are any "teeth" behind it. Argentina had originally done the same thing, but backed off after political pressure. However, an appeals court reinstated the lawsuit in June of 2013. There have been horrible crimes against humanity going on in China that are reminiscent of WWII and the world leaders need to stop actively hiding the evidence with their "closed-door" diplomacy agreements.

UN Reports on Live Organ Harvesting

EU VP of parliament on Organ Harvesting

Independent Investigation into Live Organ Harvesting

This stuff is actually going on and not to "executed prisoners", but religious and political dissidents (pretty much anyone the CCP doesn't like) and very few have the courage to speak out because they are so chickensh$% about losing favor with a big trading partner. I am excited whenever I see a country or public figure speak out as it will eventually force the issue out in the open and people can choose sides accordingly.

This is not about taking a military stance, but exposing the truth until the scumbags can hide no more. At some point, their own people will see how badly they have been lied to and the whole situation will change. I applaud the Spanish courts on this. The US needs to end its Closed-door Diplomacy agreement with China and set the same kind of example. Teeth or no teeth, it is just the right stance.

What perks my ears on this one is that a well established democratic NATION is requesting the arrest. Hard to go unanswered. If it was some small niche group or something then most could shrug it off as "haha in your dreams" but Spain is sending the warrant to Interpol to pick these people up and take them to trial. There is no way this won't strain relations and extradition treaties world over it's just to big of an accusation. Spain I'm sure has some damning evidence if they are even willing to THINK of something as world changing as this. If the politicians are brought before a court and evidence is presented that brings these claims to light it will not sit well especially China in general losing respect.