It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Social programming + the collapse of religion and values.

page: 20
30
<< 17  18  19    21  22  23 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 02:35 AM
link   
reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 





Just because something is normal in nature doesn't mean humans should follow. By that logic, preying on the weak and cannibalism should be considered ''normal'' because some species of animals do it as well.
Wow you are trying to equate canabalism to homosexuality. It seems like your harbor a lot of hate.

Serriosly though you didn't answer my question at all.

What is your definition of normal? How did you come to that conclusion?




TV is just one aspect of the medias mass hypnosis. Growing up/living in a society that has already been brainwashed by the media...can also leave one with the same effect.


Do you call living in society brainwashing? Hmm...that is a strange definition. I have lived in 42 countries throughout my life and passed through even more I consider myself lucky to have experienced so many cultures. I have also had the opportunity to learn a great deal of world history so when you speak of some great change that has only happened in recent times I am telling you very seriously that you are completely wrong.

I certainly hope you are not basing your beliefs off of ancient media.




posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 02:48 AM
link   

Lucid Lunacy
Society would come undone, eh?


Open your mind and contemplate this:
The level of atheism throughout the rest of the developed world refutes any argument that religion is somehow a moral necessity. Countries like Norway, Iceland, Australia, Canada, Sweden, Switzerland, Belgium, Japan, the Netherlands, Denmark and the United Kingdom are among the least religious societies on Earth. According to the United Nations’ Human Development Report (2005) they are also the healthiest, as indicated by measures of life expectancy, adult literacy, per capita income, educational attainment, gender equality, homicide rate and infant mortality. Conversely, the 50 nations now ranked lowest in terms of human development are unwaveringly religious. Other analyses paint the same picture: The United States is unique among wealthy democracies in its level of religious literalism and opposition to evolutionary theory; it is also uniquely beleaguered by high rates of homicide, abortion, teen pregnancy, STD infection and infant mortality. -Sam Harris


The Church has provided the moral foundation of the western world for 2000 years. The countries mentioned, in the above quote, are reaping the rewards of this. They are moving forward on the momentum of the moral drive the Church has provided. Harrise's analysis, such as it is, is dismally amateurish.

But there is more to it than this. The moral fibre of the world depends on the spiritual substance of the world. If mankind loses its spirituality this moral inheritance will evaporate. Avoid Harris. He, like Dawkins, is simplistic to the point of embarrassment. Lists of stastistics, isolated from the broad sweep of history, are misleading.
edit on 15-2-2014 by EnPassant because: (no reason given)

edit on 15-2-2014 by EnPassant because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 03:01 AM
link   
reply to post by EnPassant
 


You said a society without religion would fall apart. I showed societies that are primarily non-religous that are not only not falling apart but are doing better than societies that are primarily religious. You say that is "amateurish". Whatever logic helps you sleep at night.


But there is more to it than this. The moral fibre of the world depends on the spiritual substance of the world. If mankind loses its spirituality this moral inheritance will evaporate.

Great but that's speculative. No evidence for any of that.

No evidence of your biblical god nor his morality.

The Flying Spaghetti Monster and Raptor Jesus also disagree with you. They believe in secular humanism. They created the World they would know. Prove that wrong.


Avoid Harris, he, like Dawkins, is simplistic to the point of embarrassment.

Thanks for the suggestion but no thanks. My experience has shown me otherwise. Instead I will enjoy the likes of Sam Harris, Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, David Dennett, Dan Barker,Lawrence Krauss. Their debates and their books.


isolated from the broad sweep of history

That was all modern. Click the link. Look up the report.
edit on 15-2-2014 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 03:13 AM
link   

Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by EnPassant
 


You said a society without religion would fall apart. I showed societies that are primarily non-religous that are not only not falling apart but are doing better than societies that are primarily religious. You say that is "amateurish". Whatever logic helps you sleep at night.


But there is more to it than this. The moral fibre of the world depends on the spiritual substance of the world. If mankind loses its spirituality this moral inheritance will evaporate.

Great but that's speculative. No evidence for any of that.

No evidence of your biblical god nor his morality.

The Flying Spaghetti Monster and Raptor Jesus also disagree with you. They believe in secular humanism. They created the World they would know. Prove that wrong.


Avoid Harris, he, like Dawkins, is simplistic to the point of embarrassment.

Thanks for the suggestion but no thanks. My experience has shown me otherwise. Instead I will enjoy the likes of Sam Harris, Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, David Dennett, Dan Barker,Lawrence Krauss. Their debates and their books.


At the time of Christ the Roman Empire ruled. What kind of world do you think we would have today if this empire had been allowed to continue? Do you think, without the Church's influence, it would have suddenly become moral or would its darkness have continued to the present day? If it did Europe today might be in complete darkness. An Orwellian prison.
edit on 15-2-2014 by EnPassant because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 03:21 AM
link   

Lucid Lunacy
That was all modern. Click the link. Look up the report.


You can't isolate the modern world and analyse it without considering the historical factors that created it. The countries Harris mentioned are the way they are because they inherited their morality from historical Church influence.



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 03:33 AM
link   
reply to post by EnPassant
 

If you're basically asking me if I think Christianity is a positive moral force in the World then I would say no. I would say the good things they do are not begotten from faith in scripture since those good actions can be, and are, repeated by secularists. For example charity or caring for the ill. That's just humanism carried out by a Christian. Now burning a women because she's a "witch" you can claim as theological in nature.

As for what would have happened if the Roman Empire hadn't become Christian. No idea. Way too many variables to extrapolate that. I don't know and neither do you. I will say this though. There was some pretty awesome Greek philosophy going around then that trumps what I read in the Bible.



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 03:36 AM
link   
reply to post by EnPassant
 


The countries Harris mentioned are the way they are because they inherited their morality from historical Church influence.


Christianity owns morality. It's theirs and the heathens are merely borrowing it. We hear this a lot. It's asinine.

Do you believe morality existed prior to Christ? Prior to Judaism?
edit on 15-2-2014 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 04:04 AM
link   

EnPassant

Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by EnPassant
 


You said a society without religion would fall apart. I showed societies that are primarily non-religous that are not only not falling apart but are doing better than societies that are primarily religious. You say that is "amateurish". Whatever logic helps you sleep at night.


But there is more to it than this. The moral fibre of the world depends on the spiritual substance of the world. If mankind loses its spirituality this moral inheritance will evaporate.

Great but that's speculative. No evidence for any of that.

No evidence of your biblical god nor his morality.

The Flying Spaghetti Monster and Raptor Jesus also disagree with you. They believe in secular humanism. They created the World they would know. Prove that wrong.


Avoid Harris, he, like Dawkins, is simplistic to the point of embarrassment.

Thanks for the suggestion but no thanks. My experience has shown me otherwise. Instead I will enjoy the likes of Sam Harris, Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, David Dennett, Dan Barker,Lawrence Krauss. Their debates and their books.


At the time of Christ the Roman Empire ruled. What kind of world do you think we would have today if this empire had been allowed to continue? Do you think, without the Church's influence, it would have suddenly become moral or would its darkness have continued to the present day? If it did Europe today might be in complete darkness. An Orwellian prison.
edit on 15-2-2014 by EnPassant because: (no reason given)



the Church - right
KNOW YOUR POPES - enjoy
www.facebook.com...



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 05:34 AM
link   

daskakik

sk0rpi0n
Also if the ''acceptance'' of gays ''predated'' modern media, then why weren't gays marrying and parading a few (*cough* not neccessarily 3) decades ago in the US?

Maybe if all you are doing is looking at the US but even then the first gay pride parade, in the US, was in 1970 with picketing starting 5 years earlier. That was well over 3 decades ago, no matter how hard you cough.
edit on 15-2-2014 by daskakik because: (no reason given)
It still remains I never set a 3 decade time frame anywhere in the post. My other points have not been answered...as user lucidlunacy claimed gay acceptance predated modern media.



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 05:38 AM
link   

lucidlunacy claimed gay acceptance predated modern media.


You only needed one example to demonstrate it and you've already been given it.

edit on 15-2-2014 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 05:45 AM
link   

sk0rpi0n
Yet, all that changed, to the exact opposite in just a few decades. How did it happen? _________________________________________ My question is who or what transformed a once conservative culture into accepting ideas and values which were the exact opposite of what was upheld for so long?


1. television
2. automobiles
3. sex drugs & rock n' roll
4. homosexuality & bisexuality
5. psychiatry
6. sex drugs & music
7. sex
8. the internet
9. sex

plus alcohol.



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 05:48 AM
link   

Grimpachi
Wow you are trying to equate canabalism to homosexuality. It seems like your harbor a lot of hate.



At the very root and core of cannibalism is sexual immorality. Perversion and depravity.

Cannibalism is rare (pun intended).



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 05:49 AM
link   

daskakik

sk0rpi0n
Growing up/living in a society that has already been brainwashed by the media...can also leave one with the same effect.

Religion is also media.

Anyone who doesn't see that is also left with the same effect.
I made it clear that both religion AND the godless mass media can influence people. But the difference is that with religion we know the source of the ideas- our scriptures,our prophets and ultimately God. with mass media, the figures running it and the powers ultimately behind it are unknown. You don't know their moral standards and charaters. So its a matter of either having faith in God or faith in the mysterious powers behind the media. The anonymous unelected powers behind the mass media are have essentially rewritten the norms of society and gotten people to think its a good thing.



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 06:06 AM
link   

@ grimpachi...Wow you are trying to equate canabalism to homosexuality. It seems like your harbor a lot of hate.

I brought up preying on the weak and cannibalism as ''natural acts'', because you were claiming that homosexuality is normal because other species do it.

Serriosly though you didn't answer my question at all.

What is your definition of normal? How did you come to that conclusion?


''Normal''depends on context. We use terms like ''normal'' conditions, ''normal'' heart rates, ''normal'' occurence. In the case of sexuality, ''normalcy'' is between male and female. Sexuality, according to evolution, was to reproduce. According to religion, it was to ''go forth and multiply''.



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 06:09 AM
link   
reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 


the godless mass media can influence people.

As I showed earlier in the thread with *cough* evidence, the most popular news station in the USA is Fox News. Their most popular anchors are Christian. Take the name Glenn Beck, Bill O Reilly, or Sean Hannity and plug it into Youtube with 'Christianity' in the keyword phrase. Notice all the results for each. Notice the Fox News association. Notice the pro-Christianity discussed.

January 2014 marked Fox News's 145th consecutive month as the number one rated cable news channel. link

This again is an example of you ignoring information that shows you in error. Something you said you were not doing.
edit on 15-2-2014 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 06:13 AM
link   
relevant i think
Dale Hansen Unplugged: Celebrating our differences



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 06:23 AM
link   

edit on 15-2-2014 by Lucid Lunacy because: never mind




posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 07:20 AM
link   

Lucid Lunacy....As I showed earlier in the thread with *cough* evidence, the most popular news station in the USA is Fox News.
yet christians are powerless to have prayer in schools. Comedic.



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 07:31 AM
link   
reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 


They can do that at home or in church. And if they do it quietly or in private, then there's nothing to keep them from doing it at school.



posted on Feb, 15 2014 @ 07:48 AM
link   
reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 


It's not comedic. It's American. The problem again is that you're assuming we are a Christian nation. We are not. The fact we are majority Christian doesn't make us a Christian Nation. If another religion takes the #1 spot, say Hinduism, we would still have the same underlying principles we were founded on. Organized prayer in public schools is unconstitutional, and not because it's Christian.




top topics



 
30
<< 17  18  19    21  22  23 >>

log in

join