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Should the NFL be a dont ask dont tell league What are your thoughts

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posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:12 AM
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So Michael Sam comes out and says that he is openly gay and proud. Does anyone here think that he just put a huge target on his back? I have to say that I think that he did. Just from high school football alone anyone that played knows what goes on in the locker room when the coach leaves some coaches even encourage the madness from all that testosterone in the air. Don't bash me for the thread please just want to hear if ats feels that his time in the NFL is going to be just a little tougher. We know it has been for some other known gays.

Like I said gays in the NFL is no problem for me I love the violent hits but will they be centered on Michael Sam just a little more?


If I dont respond to any posts im sorry may have to check ats from my phone now the computer is not working to well after the baby just got to it any ideas on getting milk out of the keys and drying it up lol. Hope it keeps limping along shes a good old computer.
edit on 10-2-2014 by ed1320 because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:20 AM
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I don't follow American Football (Brit here) but it sounds like Michael Sam has just done one of the bravest things in major sport history.

I'm a soccer man myself, and openly gay players (not retired) are as rare as hen's teeth - America's Robbie Rogers is the most prominent one I can think of, and even he wasn't exactly huge - he never played top level in Europe. I understand he's back playing MLS though.

Anyhow, Sam might have painted a target on his back - but he sounds man enough to take it. It takes a pioneer to put his head up over the parapet, and take what comes from it. The whole point of doing so is the hope that the next time a Michael Sam feels the need to be honest about himself, the target will be smaller, the target after that smaller still.

Sexuality and sport is a hot potato, but given racism has largely been conquered in sport, one would hope homophobia will go the same way.

Good luck to that man!

edit on 10-2-2014 by KingIcarus because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:27 AM
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reply to post by ed1320
 


His teammates will rally around him like they did with Jackie Robinson in the American baseball major leagues. It's a different era now, and although he will be gay-while-defending he will be protected by teammates retaliating if he is targeted by illegal blocking or late hits.

Sam, by the way, for those who don't know like I didn't know, is the American college football defensive player of the year, and is expected to go high in the draft.
edit on 10-2-2014 by Aleister because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:32 AM
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I was really happy to see this. Mainly, because the sooner it becomes normal the less we have to hear about it. People bashing him or hating him isn't gonna change a damn thing.

So just suck it up, get on with football.

Other teams might have some asses trying to take cheap shots on him, which, hopefully so long as his team is supportive, it will call on his team mates to rough them up and teach them a lesson.

Then it can all go back to being about sportsmanship.

If you want to bring schoolyard arguments into professional sports, you may as well arm NBA players with glocks simply 'cause they grew up in a bad neighbourhood. Pretty ignorant stereotype that is right?

So is the other one.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:32 AM
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reply to post by ed1320
 

I don't see anything wrong with asking. Asking (outside the agenda of ridicule) is what we do when we're curious. Suppressing natural curiosity is one of the most misguided policies anyone ever dreamed up.

Don't tell?? What?? ... are you asking people to hide the truth? Again ... it simply sends the wrong signals.

Last ... What's up with all these people needing to sing it from the rooftops. I really don't care if you're gay. I'm not. I don't rub my gender preference in your face ... please keep yours to yourself.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:38 AM
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reply to post by Snarl
 


I agree sexuality should (ideally) be a private matter, but simply saying 'I am gay, this who I am and I'm proud of it' isn't rubbing anyone's nose in it. I doubt this chap will start playing in hotpants and eyeliner or whatever. I doubt there'd be any way at all of telling from his play or general conduct when with the team.

I say it's ideally a private matter, but it's harder when you're high profile - it's probably better to simply have it out there (no pun intended) and avoid the speculation and rumour.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:50 AM
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Well let us not be fooled. This has more to do with promoting a new sort of manhood, the "new man" than it does anything else. The pushers or the closeted types are always looking for a high profile poster boy in traditional "real man" vocations or occupations. It will be all the drama. There's no story here if the guy was a figure skater.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:55 AM
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reply to post by ed1320
 


It should be a "Who cares, we're here to play a sport not feel each other up and if your insecurities mean that you need to victimise someone instead of support them for being who they are then frankly you shouldn't be allowed to play yourself" kinda sport..

Sexual orientation in any sport should be a total non issue, it doesn't affect the way the game is played...



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 05:57 AM
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reply to post by KingIcarus
 

I get this.

I am gay

Here ... I'm starting to ask why you would want to risk bringing negative attention ... inviting it even. It's like a dare.

this who I am and I'm proud of it

Sorry if I'm being a boor or obtuse ... but I just don't get it.

If you're gay, I'm fine with that. If you wanna get in a fight with somebody over it ...



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:03 AM
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reply to post by Snarl
 


I don't think you're being a boor at all. I understand your view completely.

I think the idea of being 'gay and proud' is more about not feeling any less self-worth for being different. I don't think it refers specifically to being proud of being gay, as such, just being comfortable with your 'different' circumstances and not being ashamed of it - regardless of what others think.

I'm straight though, so I could be interpreting that wrong.

Anyhow, if this chap has any sense - he won't make a big thing of it all. It's very brave of him to come out like that, but 'normalising' it in sports would be best served by just getting on with the game. I'm sure the press will throw the odd question about it his way though - vultures that they are.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:06 AM
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reply to post by Snarl
 


In a few years it won't make a difference. But now some gay people have to proclaim it to make those "won't make a difference" times possible. Back to Jackie Robinson (I just saw the movie "42"), he couldn't not be up front, the color of his skin made him the target, and he purposely put that skin onto the ball field and led the way by being nonviolent for a year. Gay people have to "come out" to do the same thing, and Sam is doing just that. There has to be a first, tenth, and twentieth before there can be a generally-accepted "who cares?" moment, when it won't have to be declared anymore.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:19 AM
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Is it all really such a big deal?
I mean, seriously, why should someones sexual preferences come into the equation? It's like the current idiotic attempts to highlight "Gay" issues at the winter olympic games in Sochi, it's totally irrelevant to the event, which is sport, not sexual leanings!

The ones wanting to make their sexual preference an issue are the problem here. So you are Gay, great, now shut up and get on with things and get over yourself.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:20 AM
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Aleister
reply to post by Snarl
 


In a few years it won't make a difference. But now some gay people have to proclaim it to make those "won't make a difference" times possible.

It does not make a difference. Right now. The fact is the only thing that matters is if the guy can play football.

Back to Jackie Robinson (I just saw the movie "42"), he couldn't not be up front, the color of his skin made him the target, and he purposely put that skin onto the ball field and led the way by being nonviolent for a year.

Right. There is no hiding when you have darker skin than others.

Gay people have to "come out" to do the same thing, and Sam is doing just that. There has to be a first, tenth, and twentieth before there can be a generally-accepted "who cares?" moment, when it won't have to be declared anymore.

No, there does not. The only thing this guy did by making his public statement is to ensure himself of a lawsuit (in case he does not have the skills to make it as professional player) or ensure himself of some type of book deal. We all know the basket weaving classes he majored in are not going to cut the mustard.

The LGBT: "What we say in public has no ability to affect others. What you say in public will be automatically decried as homophobic and affects us greatly and in the negative, unless of course it is pro-gay."

No more neutrality.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:27 AM
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reply to post by Aleister
 

I don't know. I'm not ready to disagree ... but I don't know. The world's been aware of homosexual preference for a long lotta years. The tennis scene of the '70s (and earlier) comes to mind. Everybody knew, nobody made a big scene, and the world revolved smoothly on its axis.

Anyway ... I've said my piece. Come back to me in a U2U if you must.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:28 AM
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Just love the race argument being played here. Its just a smoke screen. Pretending that somehow blacks have opened a door for the gays. Cheep piggybacking is what it looks like and certainly never mind that many blacks don't like the analogy.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:28 AM
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"Don't ask, don't tell"?

How about we all just "don't care" at all?

Speaking of not caring, now that his coach knows, he can base plays on this guy being a target. Not that a coach would do that sort of thing, of course.

I can understand years of feeling/having to hide who you really are to society-at-large (okay, I can't completely understand) and wanting to finally just get it off your shoulders and be done with it.

This issue, unfortunately, is something we never seem to be getting anything done with. It just keeps coming up - over and over and over again. I guess it will take another generation or two for it to all finally sink in that it really doesn't matter.

Again, let's all just 'not care' together.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:31 AM
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reply to post by totallackey
 


It doesn't make a difference to me or you, but in America there is a large pool of people who see gays as some kind of insect to be avoided. There's a thread on ATS now which talks about open attacks on gay people in Russia, like it's a sport or something. So the fact that this young guy who is at the top of his profession in the college ranks wants to also break new ground for a world-wide persecuted minority (we're not even talking about the middle east and what happens to gays - and women - there), more power (and signing bonus) to him. The rights of gays in America are moving at a speed uncomfortable to those who are opposed to those rights, and to them it does make a difference, in a negative way. Sam is giving them a face to their discomfort, so they can yell things at him. Like Jackie Robinson had to endure to create a path for others to walk (or strike out). Tennis, ice skating, and gymnastic fans are used to gays by now, but some American football fans will be building mental barricades up until the point they don't.
edit on 10-2-2014 by Aleister because: (no reason given)

edit on 10-2-2014 by Aleister because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 06:34 AM
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reply to post by ed1320
 


It is 2014. The fact that an American football player feels the need to "come out", and it is expected that it will somehow stir the pot is amazing to me.

I've been in the army a little over two years since Don't Ask, Don't Tell, was repealed. You know what it changed? Nothing. We're still kicking ass and taking names. We're still all soldiers. We're still all people. Gay or straight we all have to abide by and obey the UCMJ and regulations governing our service. Not doing so will still get you a court martial, it will still get you administratively chaptered out of the service, it will still get you a pay dock, extra duty, and reduction in rank. Nothing has changed.

So much for the argument that repealing DADT would affect combat readiness. It hasn't.

It shouldn't affect football either. And it won't.

On a side note:

I do not watch nor am I a fan of football. I am just a fan of people expressing themselves and living as they wish so long as they do not impinge on the rights of others. Gay football players are no more a disruption than gay soldiers. Of which, I am certain, are more in number than most think.



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 07:13 AM
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All that matters is that he can play football to a degree that he is an asset to a team. People ask why say anything at all, why bring negative attention to yourself...

1) It shouldn't bring negative attention.
2) To not say anything requires hiding things from your team and coaches, from the press etc... People always want to know who celebrities date, they get stalked by the press. If he got 'outed' in any kind of way, his team mates could end up feeling betrayed. Not that it should make people uncomfortable but it does and that's reality for now, as such it should be on the table and not dropped like a bombshell.

Kudos to this kid for his bravery.

ETA: Alcohol and cotton swabs should take care of your keyboard.
edit on 2/10/2014 by Kali74 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 10 2014 @ 07:18 AM
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reply to post by Kali74
 


And it's also a way to let his groupies know which side the bread is buttered on. So this is ultimately self-serving too (more advertising dollars for ads to gay markets, more face time on television, etc). Ulterior motives are the American way, and even though this is brave, can't discount the extras that come with it.



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