Indonesians recognize 5 genders, while Americans recognize only 2

reply to post by crazyewok


you're just limiting your understanding to a limited mindset. i can say your mindset is wrong cos i only think in terms of 'human'; -- as long as you have sex with only humans then we are identical.

some people have a mindset of black and white...

taoistguy
i can say your mindset is wrong cos i only think in terms of 'human';

And I say your mindset is wrong as I think in terms of DNA.



As I said transexual can act and have sex with who the hell they like. Just dont expect me to join in with them!

reply to post by crazyewok


well, let's kiss and make up and agree to differ.

crazyewok
Until one can change ones DNA there is only Male and Female. You die the gender your born in.

Non PC I know but dont care.


If someone wants to act like the oppoiste gender fine. Go for it. But to me its only acting.

edit on 9-2-2014 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)

FINALLY! Someone posting in this thread who makes some freaking sense!

My lord, some of you people are insane.....You say stuff to make yourself sound and look good to others....There ARE only 2 sexes....Male and Female....Not all this other nonsense!

gardener
In contrast, the American Psychological Association recognizes 2 genders (making gender seemingly synonymous with biological sex *yawn*) meaning you are either male gender, female gender.

You can quibble as much as you like but there are only two genders - male of female. Being a male and feeling like a female is not a gender.

In the UK you can change gender, but you can only be a man or a woman.

Why is it so hard to recognise that that there are two and that these are biological? I mean, why stop at five and have even more gender categories if that simple distinction is not stuck to?

Regards

crazyewok

taoistguy
but our sexualities are broad.

XY

XX

Doesnt seem to broad to me.

Your one or the other.

Anything else is just physiological. As I said I knew a guy who thought he was a bat does that make him a bat?

Sorry to say but when I looked up XXY (which I learned about in biology class) I found there were others! There are actually 6 that have been identified. Looks like India left one off the list!

XX (Female) XY (Male)
XO (Turner) XXY (Klinefelter)
XXX (Triple-X) XYY (XYY)

Link to Source

It is sad that they call anything other than XX or XY 'abnormal.' Can't they refer to them as 'rare?' It is sad to think some people go thru life labeled abnormal because of their genetic make-up, when it is 'their normal.' Why can we all not just realize that all aspects of the human condition, exist on a continuum, and these labels are constructs of science which should be used with extreme caution!

reply to post by new_here


1) Theres a diffrence between a gentic defect and a healthy male or female deciding they want to ACT the opposite gender

2) Turners is a devestating gentical defect like downsyndrome and I would hardly call it a alternative "sex"

Kandinsky
Although I think there are just two genders, I haven't walked a mile in the high-heeled shoes of someone who feels profoundly left out by conventional male/female roles.

Beyond the labels and prejudice, it shouldn't be anyone's business when someone identifies with hazier gender dynamics.

I would agree. However, when someone demands to be accommodated based on this "identity" doesn't that make it other people's business?

paraphi

gardener
In contrast, the American Psychological Association recognizes 2 genders (making gender seemingly synonymous with biological sex *yawn*) meaning you are either male gender, female gender.

You can quibble as much as you like but there are only two genders - male of female. Being a male and feeling like a female is not a gender.

In the UK you can change gender, but you can only be a man or a woman.

Why is it so hard to recognise that that there are two and that these are biological? I mean, why stop at five and have even more gender categories if that simple distinction is not stuck to?

Regards

Step outside of the box with me for just a minute. Just consider the implications of this very real science discussed at the bottom of this post.

markosity1973
The indonesian are not the only people to recognise more than one 'gender' The term gender more meaning non typical personality traits and / or sexual attraction fhan their sex which is only determined by what plumbing we are born with.

If you look at the bible even, Jesus talks of a third gender with eunuchs;

For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

Matthew 19:12

The term eunuch in his day encompassed not only castrated males but also effeminate men i.e. gay people.

The Maori people in my homeland recognize Takataapui, the samoans have their Fa'afafine etc etc

What all of this shows is that many peoples around the world are far more accepting of the fact that some people are born 'different' and accept that they are just a natural part of the diversity of life, which they are

edit on 9-2-2014 by markosity1973 because: (no reason given)

"Eunuch" is a celibate human being in this scriptural passage.

Some were born celibate (not desiring sexual relationships from birth)
Some were rendered celibate by men (castrated males/females; unable to engage sexually)
Some chose to become celibate of their own will, to help their minds enter into Elohim after conversion (for the Kingdom of God's sake).

These scriptures have to do with whether it is more righteous for a celibate human to worship God, or one who has a lawful sexual relationship with their bound mate.

Both are accepted as Holy according to the Word of God.

God Bless,

taoistguy
reply to post by crazyewok

 

you're just limiting your understanding to a limited mindset. i can say your mindset is wrong cos i only think in terms of 'human'; -- as long as you have sex with only humans then we are identical.

some people have a mindset of black and white...

I would say he is correct, based on genetics, rather than "feelings." You may think only in terms of "human" but in reality humans are different and the sexes very much so.

new_here

crazyewok

taoistguy
but our sexualities are broad.

XY

XX

Doesnt seem to broad to me.

Your one or the other.

Anything else is just physiological. As I said I knew a guy who thought he was a bat does that make him a bat?

Sorry to say but when I looked up XXY (which I learned about in biology class) I found there were others! There are actually 6 that have been identified. Looks like India left one off the list!

XX (Female) XY (Male)
XO (Turner) XXY (Klinefelter)
XXX (Triple-X) XYY (XYY)

Link to Source

It is sad that they call anything other than XX or XY 'abnormal.' Can't they refer to them as 'rare?' It is sad to think some people go thru life labeled abnormal because of their genetic make-up, when it is 'their normal.' Why can we all not just realize that all aspects of the human condition, exist on a continuum, and these labels are constructs of science which should be used with extreme caution!


It's called abnormal because it is abnormal in that it is a genetic anomaly that reduces the intended functioning of the organism. Disease states are "abnormal." Some are not catching, some are not dangerous, but all are abnormal.

reply to post by crazyewok

1) Theres a diffrence between a gentic defect and a healthy male or female deciding they want to ACT the opposite gender

Is this true? They have all had their chromosomes analyzed then? No, I doubt it. So your above statement is your hypothesis/opinion.

NavyDoc


I would say he is correct, based on genetics, rather than "feelings." You may think only in terms of "human" but in reality humans are different and the sexes very much so.

Exactly.

This isnt about norms, social taboos or religion

Its about the DNA and the cromosomes they make up. Apart from some rare conditions its a case of XY or XX. You can chop bits off or add bits on and dress how you like but that still doesnt change your DNA. And when your long dead and buried and 10000 years time when a archaeologist digs your bones up they will identify you based on the gender you were originaly born with.

For once, the Americans are right.

reply to post by NavyDoc

I know that they are not the norm as compared to the average person. Merely pointing out that it is 'their normal' and this is their life, and it seems a bit harsh to call someone a mistake of nature. Just sayin. No put-downs intended towards anyone who feels differently than that.

new_here

Is this true? They have all had their chromosomes analyzed then? No, I doubt it. So your above statement is your hypothesis/opinion.

YES! Its dame right true,

A thai lady boy or whatever has the same chromosomes you and me have. There gender issues are purely physiological. If it was a gentical issue it would have been discoverd dam quickly life the conditions we already know about.

crazyewok

new_here

Is this true? They have all had their chromosomes analyzed then? No, I doubt it. So your above statement is your hypothesis/opinion.

YES! Its dame right true,

A thai lady boy or whatever has the same chromosomes you and me have. There gender issues are purely physiological. If it was a gentical issue it would have been discoverd dam quickly life the conditions we already know about.

Show me the data where they've analyzed the chromosomes of those in question. I sincerely would like to see it.

Also, we all do NOT have the same chromosomes! XX, XY, XXY, XYY, etc...

new_here

Show me the data where they've analyzed the chromosomes of those in question. I sincerely would like to see it.

You obvisouly know NOTHING about genetics.

Diffreing chromosomes would have been spotted a mile off. You can do simple lab analysis thats costs squat all so it rediculus to think that area hasnt been expored.

new_here
Also, we all do NOT have the same chromosomes! XX, XY, XXY, XYY, etc...

Petty or what? Yes XX and XY are the normal healthy pairs. That what I meant.

Any other combination results in disablement or miscarriage! stop portaraying XXY and XYY as normal and healthy! If they survive fetal deveopment without miscarriage then these poor people are left with serious mental and physical deficiencys.

crazyewok

NavyDoc


I would say he is correct, based on genetics, rather than "feelings." You may think only in terms of "human" but in reality humans are different and the sexes very much so.

Exactly.

This isnt about norms, social taboos or religion

Its about the DNA and the cromosomes they make up. Apart from some rare conditions its a case of XY or XX. You can chop bits off or add bits on and dress how you like but that still doesnt change your DNA. And when your long dead and buried and 10000 years time when a archaeologist digs your bones up they will identify you based on the gender you were originaly born with.

edit on 10-2-2014 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)

Well said. Factual and straight to the point. The way that the genes are supposed to work is XY or XX. Other, rare and increasingly so, arraignments are not the normal genotype and lead to many problems because they are a mistake in the genetic expression.

As Ewok said, absent rare genetic abnormalities that usually have other physical dysfunctions associated with them, all of these "gender identities" are not based in genetics but psychological. That's not to say that they should be treated poorly or abused or anything like that, but rather to point out the biology of the issue.

In the west, the rare condition of ambiguous genitalia, is not the issue it once was. Before they'd try to make their best guess and surgically correct the genitalia. Now, with genetic testing, we can match the plastic surgery to the genetic makeup of the individual.