Time to lose the 'Chemtrail and Geo-Engineering' Forum

reply to post by Sergeant Stiletto

Calling to abolish the forum - whatever your rationale - is simply a petty attempt to marginalize a topic you disagree with.

Just the opposite: by lumping geo-engineering in with chemtrails, it is geo-engineering that is being marginalized.

reply to post by DJW001


Well, now you can also see there are a fair number of members who also, sincerely and with good reasoning, disagree with that position and actually like things as they are. I figure we can all learn to make it work somehow.

Wrabbit2000
reply to post by DJW001

 

Well, now you can also see there are a fair number of members who also, sincerely and with good reasoning, disagree with that position and actually like things as they are. I figure we can all learn to make it work somehow.

Then why have none of them participated on this thread and made their case?

reply to post by DJW001


Early days of the chemtrail discussions here were crazy, speculative and heated.

I have watched the subject evolve with calmer, but still suspicious minds taking the lead in research and discussion. For me there has been a connection made between chemtrails and weather modification/geo-engineering right here on ATS.

reply to post by DJW001

They have..and I'm sorry you're not listening to that other side of the discussion to even acknowledge the fact they..and WE...exist.

Please remember, all of us on Staff are members first, foremost and always. It may not always seen that way at times..but it's absolutely true. You can even see a few folks who used to be mods and by personal choices, returned to being members with no overlap or issues. Again..Members before anything and to be real specific here..it means our opinions also count.

reply to post by Witness2008

Early days of the chemtrail discussions here were crazy, speculative and heated.

They still are.

I have watched the subject evolve with calmer, but still suspicious minds taking the lead in research and discussion. For me there has been a connection made between chemtrails and weather modification/geo-engineering right here on ATS.

Has anyone who once claimed that chemtrails were spraying Morgellons disease admitted that they were wrong and now subscribe to the geo-engineering theory? Probably not. Lumping chemtrails and geo-engineering together establishes a false equivalency that can actually stifle thinking on both subjects: if chemtrails 'are' geo-engineering, then they are not about population reduction. If chemtrails 'are' geo-engineering, then geo-engineering is already happening. If you believe in AGW, shouldn't you be supporting chemtrails? See how that goes?

What gives OP the right to shut down entire forums?

How about presenting your side of the argument better?

Or just staying away from it?

Everybody knows the gov. has been spraying us with silver iodide and God knows what else for decades...

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

They have..and I'm sorry you're not listening to that other side of the discussion to even acknowledge the fact they..and WE...exist.

I have been. One person called me a shill and two have accused me of attempting to stifle discussion; their way of stifling discussion, I guess. No-one has actually made a reasonable case for keeping things as they are, other than it may mean more work for the Mods. Clearly, any attempt to change things can result in hurt feelings, but is that any reason to resist change?

On the other hand, just about everyone else contributing to this thread seems to be in agreement with my reasoning.

reply to post by Signals

What gives OP the right to shut down entire forums?

No-one has even implied that the OP has that right. That privilege is reserved for the site owners.

How about presenting your side of the argument better?

I have explained that separating chemtrails and geo-engineering as topics for a single forum would be advantageous both for people concerned about geo-engineering and people who believe in chemtrails.

Or just staying away from it?

Staying away from what? Board business?

Everybody knows the gov. has been spraying us with silver iodide and God knows what else for decades...

That is not what this thread is about. If you wish to prove that claim, there is still a forum where that is the principle subject of discussion. They also discuss climate modification there, but not so much.

reply to post by DJW001


Well, I'd never call you or anyone else a Shill. That's base level debating and never positive, regardless.

Ahh Well.. What matters is we both have had a great opportunity to share our views and feelings ..even if any changes are slim to none for odds..and slim left town awhile ago.

Still, always fascinating to hear how folks would change ATS around in their own ways, if given the opportunity.

Have a good day!

reply to post by DJW001


Yes. Some of the debate is still heated. Case in point, this thread.

There has been a natural selection of the theories here over the years, and those of the more rational researchers have mostly silenced the not so rational, such as those that proclaimed being sprayed with pathogens. I'm sure that we will still see those more extreme views, and they are entitled to their views.

The problem with the forum is that nearly all the threads relate to chemtrails and there are very few about geoengineering - which is an interesting, scientific, subject but hardly one deserving its own forum?

reply to post by DJW001


It's deja vu! Could we please lose the "Geo-engineering Forum?"

Further, your concerns about geo-engineering are so overwhelming that you have put up a total of (1) one thread over 1.5 years ago in this forum. Cost analysis of aerosol solar radiation management published

Blown away, buddy, by your disinterested criticism.

Still...got to love your OP in the one thread you did put up so I gave it a flag.

AndyMayhew
The problem with the forum is that nearly all the threads relate to chemtrails and there are very few about geoengineering - which is an interesting, scientific, subject but hardly one deserving its own forum?

I disagree. Observations led to the chemtrail theory. The chemtrail theory led to much discovery into geo-engineering. Back in 2008 or 09 I was finding and posting information on studies and proposals for weather modification. Now that we all know that it is happening and that our early observations were correct, we can now discuss without speculation, the scientific wisdom or lack of, concerning altering our atmosphere and climate.

reply to post by luxordelphi


I wonder why you popped into my head while reading this thread?

Nice to see you again.

luxordelphi
reply to post by DJW001

 

It's deja vu! Could we please lose the "Geo-engineering Forum?"

Further, your concerns about geo-engineering are so overwhelming that you have put up a total of (1) one thread over 1.5 years ago in this forum. Cost analysis of aerosol solar radiation management published

Blown away, buddy, by your disinterested criticism.

Still...got to love your OP in the one thread you did put up so I gave it a flag.

Could you please explain why you think a forum dedicated to chemtrails is necessary? Could you explain why you do not think it is reasonable to allow geo-engineering threads to be posted elsewhere, given that solar radiation mitigation represents a very small percentage of geo-engineering proposals?

Witness2008

AndyMayhew
The problem with the forum is that nearly all the threads relate to chemtrails and there are very few about geoengineering - which is an interesting, scientific, subject but hardly one deserving its own forum?

I disagree. Observations led to the chemtrail theory. The chemtrail theory led to much discovery into geo-engineering. Back in 2008 or 09 I was finding and posting information on studies and proposals for weather modification. Now that we all know that it is happening and that our early observations were correct, we can now discuss without speculation, the scientific wisdom or lack of, concerning altering our atmosphere and climate.

This thread is not about the history or validity of chemtrails, it is about the necessity to have a forum dedicated to them. Do you feel it necessary? Why or why not?

DJW001
reply to post by tothetenthpower

 

But since threads about actual geo-engineering are so rare, they should not overwhelm Fragile Earth, which I believe is dedicated to Ecology. Geo-engineering is an ecological problem, not a conspiracy (at least not yet).

Indeed - geoengineering is real science, being discussed in public, with pro's and many, many cons, and deserves serious consideration and discussion.

The pollution aspect of aviation is also something that is real and in open discussion and is probably covered by fragile earth.

By linking chemtrails and geo-engineering in the title of a forum, it gives chemtrail theorists a 'buy.' They can just assume that chemtrails have been proven to be geo-engineering, when in fact, they are no such thing!

chemtrails OTOH, have always belonged in skunkworks.

reply to post by DJW001

Could you please explain why you think a forum dedicated to chemtrails is necessary? Could you explain why you do not think it is reasonable to allow geo-engineering threads to be posted elsewhere, given that solar radiation mitigation represents a very small percentage of geo-engineering proposals?

Because geo-engineering and chemtrails (jet emissions) are joined at the hip and efforts to artificially separate them create a situation like where are the boys? and where are the girls?

SRM, full blown, would look exactly like the skies look now - full of it.

Because geo-engineering is not so much a science as it is a conspiracy enabling gross polluters, like airlines, to continue with business as usual.

Because geo-engineering is not about sound ecological practices. It's about money.

Chemtrails are intimately tied up with geo-engineering because, like this thread, and that been here before feeling, they give us what, for debunkers, can only be called a time warp view of how wild the future skies will look.

Why not solicit interest for a "I survived putting up a thread in the geo-chem forum" if you are feeling vulnerable and put upon.

DJW001
reply to post by Goldcurrent

 

Shilltastic thread!!!

Please explain the meaning of this phrase.

Let's shut the whole site down while we're at it. I'm sure that would please most who infiltrate that poor section of ATS.

Why are you suggesting that the whole site be shut down? Or is that intended as sarcasm? I am certainly not suggesting that the site be shut down, I am suggesting that the forums be allotted in a way that serves the best interests of its users. Why should people who take environmentalism seriously need to wear the albatross of chemtrails around their necks?

Look, I'm sure you know exactly what I meant by my first comment.

Secondly, your suggestion that forums be allotted properly is a thin veil to put all geo-engineering discussion into skunkworks is an obvious attempt to quell any serious discussion of solar radiation management techniques.

It is quite a shame that you equate 'environmentalism' with chemtrails, but hey!! Your ilk are the ones that vehemently stalk the forum, ardently quashing any semblance of discussion. Do you get a bonus for a forum re-allocation?

This isn't a .gov or .edu site, or a scientific journal site, where members have untold resources to undertake years of scientific study to publish findings. It is a site that has 'speculation' on theories that everyday people identify, and try to make sense of things on hidden research they may not be privy to.

Surely you don't believe all technology and information is given to you from 30 year old textbooks now, do you??

Serious question. Why the concern?