Snipers Wipe Out US Power Station

page: 2
12
<< 1    3  4 >>

log in

join

posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 06:59 PM
link   
Awesome.

I hate AT&T

Remember, before the widespread surveillance, they let feds in their cell towers to spy on everyone back in the 90s.




posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 07:03 PM
link   
If they were that professional, they would not have left anything at all to be found. So, why leave the shell casings?



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 07:04 PM
link   
reply to post by Theeastcoastwest
 


I find the scenario intriguing. On the one hand you have a team of persons who used precision shooting to disable key parts of a major piece of infrastructure, which indicates a high degree of skill and determination, and is no doubt why the authorities are using words like "professional" to describe them. But,at the same time, they leave position markers and shell casings lying around for investigators to find, indicating that for all the accuracy of their shooting, they are not certain to be professional snipers at all.

When someone says the word professional, referring to a job of work undertaken by a sniper, I expect that apart from any feat of skill with a rifle, that they may have pulled off, that they have also picked up their shell casings, and erased every track that could lead to someone discovering evidence that they were ever there, other than that which is presented at the point of impact of the round, with the target.

Either the authorities are playing some sort of game with the shooters, or trying to make people afraid, by over stating their prowess, or the shells and the markers are a red herring, and the people responsible are exactly as dangerous as reported, or worse. Whatever the scenario, leaving casings and stuff around is not a hallmark which I associate with a professional marksman, especially not one involved in a crime like this attack on energy infrastructure, in one of the most security obsessed nations on the planet.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 07:06 PM
link   
reply to post by dlbott
 


Maybe it's the same reason a lot of hackers hack stuff for no reason.

Maybe they are bored and need a job.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 07:07 PM
link   
reply to post by qmantoo
 


Why not leave the shell casings?

No prints no problem...



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 07:12 PM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


Not necessarily true. There is more than fingerprints that can be left on a casing. There could be residue of a particular oil, or coating, or impression from the gun it was fired from. The less data an offender offers an investigator, the better for them, and the harder it is to track them. Giving the brass, no matter how apparently useless you think it might be, to the investigators in this way is careless, even if it does not provide an immediate method of identifying the culprit. The devil is in the details.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 07:22 PM
link   
reply to post by TrueBrit
 


Yeah, they can tell what kind of gun it was fired from. Your analysis of lubricant is humorous.

If you think about it, expediting the get away would have been more important than picking up shell casings. No prints no problem! Getting caught with the guns, regardless of whether or not they left the casings at the scene, would have resulted in a conviction. Best to just get away from the scene of the crime and get rid of the guns quicker. It might take a while to find every last casing, especially if they bounce in weird places. Without the guns or finger prints, the casings will not result in a conviction.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 07:28 PM
link   
Why are they calling this terrorism!?

In order for something to be terrorism, people have to be terrorized! lmao

This was vandalism. Felony vandalism, but still just vandalism. lmao terrorism. These guys are funny.

Who was terrorized? AT&T?

AT&T sucks anyways and they overcharge for everything. Make it a misdemeanor. They probably helped some customers who were on the fence make a good decision.


"Hey honey, the U Verse is acting up!"

"It must be those damn terrorists again...."

Bringing spousal terrorism to a husband near you. Fear this team of terrorists!
edit on 5-2-2014 by FreeWillAnomaly because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 07:37 PM
link   
You know what happened...

I bet a bunch of Comcast shareholders were bored, and returning from a gun show.

One of them was like "hey, I got an idea....."

One year later:

"A team of professional terrorists blah blah blah....."

"Hey! That's us! Duuuudddeee!"



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 08:38 PM
link   
Never letting a good crisis go to waste.

More gun laws, and more spying.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 09:18 PM
link   

Wrabbit2000


It's nothing overly creative ...in hindsight... but no one really goes out and does this, either. Even the extreme groups who think of themselves as being capable.

This is a sobering development for a new type of approach. Not a welcome one ...as adapting the tactic could do very bad things elsewhere and I'll leave it there to save from giving brand new ideas on a serious issue.

* They also cut area net access .. wow.. so they showed they could cut all forms of outgoing alarm or communications for a brief period too. Bad thing here... just bad.


Especially that the net access was thrown in the mix, it would seem anyone with the capability to pull something off so flawlessly would have realized that the overall effect would have been minimal.

With that in mind, I can only imagine it as a drill or a threat.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 09:25 PM
link   

neo96
Never letting a good crisis go to waste.

More gun laws, and more spying.


I think that a potential reason that this died down after local coverage is that it doesn't fit any gun law agenda's narrative.

Snipers tend to use low-capacity magazines and often bolt action rifles. This situation seems to re-inforce the argument that it's not the weapon in someone's hand but rather the intent of the person holding it.

When the media seems to want to stratify everything into terms of black or white these days, this would be a very blurry topic that couldn't NOT connected to a gun control discussion should it hit mainstream news.

Piers Morgan:

" Yah Yah dangerous guns, magazines, ban them."

NRA

"2nd amendment, drum mags, freedom, America."

Third party:
" Guns, in responsible hands but acknowledge intentions are an unpredictable variable and can't always protected against."

Crowd:
" hahahaha wait, what?"



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 09:30 PM
link   

FreeWillAnomaly
Why are they calling this terrorism!?

In order for something to be terrorism, people have to be terrorized! lmao

This was vandalism. Felony vandalism, but still just vandalism. lmao terrorism. These guys are funny.

Who was terrorized? AT&T?

AT&T sucks anyways and they overcharge for everything. Make it a misdemeanor. They probably helped some customers who were on the fence make a good decision.


"Hey honey, the U Verse is acting up!"

"It must be those damn terrorists again...."

Bringing spousal terrorism to a husband near you. Fear this team of terrorists!
edit on 5-2-2014 by FreeWillAnomaly because: (no reason given)



Would you consider a militant organization detonating a nuclear missile on a remote island, as a demonstration of their power, terrorism?

I think this could easily be seen a an organization's demonstration of their ability to neutralize power and communications to an area of the United States.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 09:38 PM
link   
reply to post by Theeastcoastwest
 


lmao yeah right.

Seriously?

All you have to do is add just a little bit of security and improve the response time slightly to prevent this from happening. It was not a demonstration, nor a test run.

All they demonstrated is that they were way too bored.

Now, hackers and satellites - there is a real threat.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 09:41 PM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


Add security to 10,000's of substations and transformers? Really? Better rethink your strategy.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 09:45 PM
link   

whywhynot
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


Add security to 10,000's of substations and transformers? Really? Better rethink your strategy.


Why?

10,000 X 10 - 100,000 people X 5 = only 50,000 2.5 25,000

Time to rethink the job market.

Plus, increasing security doesn't necessarily require human assets. Reinforced steel, surveillance, and an increased response time would work as well.

Yes, it will cost money, but not enough to damage the economy any more than it already has been. Plus, those jobs put money back in the economy.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 09:58 PM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


Putting a security guard on the substation wouldn't stop a high powered rifle shooting from a half mile away. You can't encase the transformers in concrete and steel and still maintain them besides the cost and time to do it would be crazy. Where does the money come from? Just print some more? It is a mess and your suggestion doesn't begin to solve it. AND, even if you did how about the 7,000+ power plants each with between 3 and 12 main transformers? Same thing? What about the 200,000 miles of HV transmission lines? Post a guard say every mile? Ok lets say that you double the price of our electricity in the US and protect it a little better. They then just go after another one of a million soft targets. Only solution that comes close to working is to find the terrorist before they attack.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 10:19 PM
link   
I went back and looked at this a bit closer. Actually, a lot closer. I'm still not interested in war gaming hypotheticals when our nation is as open (free) as it is ..but this specific incident has me confused here.

'Sniper' tends to imply some long distance shooting which would require skill and effort to learn. The Op Source link indicates on an aerial map where the hits were vs. where the snipers were. It's fuzzy within 10-15 feet in error for the size of the markers they're using, but with shell casings left behind, I imagine they could be fairly sure of those positions on the photo-diagram.

From those two positions to the points of hits ranges between 130yrds to about 225 yards. We can get that by going to the power plant in Google Earth, matching photos (which are almost identical for bushes and landmarks to be easy) and use the "Ruler" tool that allows point to point measuring in a variety of units from centimeters to miles.

Well, 225 yards is enough to stand and watch for a few minutes on a shooting range for being a bit unusual. I mean, it takes some practice...but nothing a regular hobby shooter couldn't have done. 19 minutes for 17 hits with 2 people shooting? So over 2 minutes per person, per hit on average ..again, for 225yrd outside shots? Oookay... It's middle of the night for the timeline but...to a "sniper", that should make it easier I'd think..not harder.


...So what made a Navy team quoted in the OP source say it looked like a Professionally planned action? I'm just not seeing it after the above effort made.



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 10:21 PM
link   

whywhynot
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


Putting a security guard on the substation wouldn't stop a high powered rifle shooting from a half mile away. You can't encase the transformers in concrete and steel and still maintain them besides the cost and time to do it would be crazy. Where does the money come from? Just print some more? It is a mess and your suggestion doesn't begin to solve it. AND, even if you did how about the 7,000+ power plants each with between 3 and 12 main transformers? Same thing? What about the 200,000 miles of HV transmission lines? Post a guard say every mile? Ok lets say that you double the price of our electricity in the US and protect it a little better. They then just go after another one of a million soft targets. Only solution that comes close to working is to find the terrorist before they attack.


Well, duh, if you can! That is ideal, obviously.

However, it has to be expected that you will not find all terrorists before they attack (and I am by no means saying these guys were terrorists, they did minimal damage - a rich guy's daughter's birthday party on a yacht with some famous rapper performing costs more than this did).

Look, to be honest, our nation has a problem with providing actual security. We think we can stop things before they happen, and if that doesn't work we will make arrests later. Well that mentality is stupid and gets people killed every year. Sorry if I am not sympathetic about some people losing U verse for a day.

Yeah, you could encase the transformers for a price most likely. Really, when it comes to things like this - if it is a low-value target like this one, increased surveillance combined with a faster reaction time would work for making the arrest. Imagine if a drone had been around to track the suspects until they could be apprehended or killed if necessary.

For high value targets - you better damn well pay for that security, because there is no way to catch EVERY potential terrorist before they strike. At least not that I know of.

I'm not really worried about it anyways. Our security agencies have done a freaking outstanding job at preventing human casualties post-911. Don't care about U verse. People complain all they want, but I have yet to hear of an unjust prosecution or detention of a US citizen at least stateside.

Think about it - this was the largest "domestic terrorist attack on the power grid in the US" and all that happened was some people lost power for less time than the last major snow storm in MI and some people lost U verse for a day. That is not terrorism. That is just funny.

I am more worried about your every day murder and all the school shootings than terrorism at this point. Our nation needs to be more pro active with security. No more before and after mentality. Stop it WHEN it happens too.

ETA: Oh, and your half-mile radius is probably not relevant to most
edit on 5-2-2014 by FreeWillAnomaly because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 5 2014 @ 10:30 PM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


Oh, and I am not talking about stupid stuff like feds in cell towers going after drug dealers and school police arresting people for fights! If people would focus on what is important, maybe active security is an implementable reality.





new topics
top topics
 
12
<< 1    3  4 >>

log in

join