It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

20 Million Felons, 47 Million on SNAP, 13 Million on Welfare, 15 Million Unemployed

page: 9
36
<< 6  7  8    10  11  12 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 10:04 AM
link   

vkey08


So you are saying that if a family is really in need because of the economy or whatever reason, that we as a nation should not help them? That we should let people die because of no fault of their own? (I'm not talking about the people that abuse the system, I'm talking about a family that may have fallen upon hard times due to illness/medical issues or layoffs etc)

That's pretty cold and cruel... I'm sorry but that goes against everything I believe in...

It is not the job, responsibility or in the design for the Govt to do so.
What you want is a Govt, that picks and chooses who gets free stuff by stealing from others they pick and choose from.



vkey08
As far as letting the cities experience this, it happened, what part of that didn't you get, right after Sandy it happened.. It was a mess to the point that force wasn't working there were just TOO MANY people..

And the States should have dealt with this. Not the Fed Govt.
And the States weren't ready, as they rely on the Fed Govt to do most things.

If that doesn't show as a shining example of Govt dependency, I don't know what does.




posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 10:13 AM
link   
reply to post by macman
 


What your saying right now would lead to absolute chaos.

Maybe in the 1850's what your saying was plausible but we have mega cities with 10's of millions of people. These cant just go start a farm and grow crops and build houses like the quakers.

Whatever you think your solution is is a bigger problem then the problem your addressing. Theres 50 other changes that need to be made before cutting 50 million people off food stamps.

Its ok to feed people.

Your going to keep your position and im going to keep mine.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 10:24 AM
link   

onequestion
reply to post by macman
 


What your saying right now would lead to absolute chaos.

Maybe in the 1850's what your saying was plausible but we have mega cities with 10's of millions of people. These cant just go start a farm and grow crops and build houses like the quakers.

Whatever you think your solution is is a bigger problem then the problem your addressing. Theres 50 other changes that need to be made before cutting 50 million people off food stamps.

Its ok to feed people.

Your going to keep your position and im going to keep mine.


So, continue to steal from some, to give to others.

Eventually, the money will run out and those that produce will stop producing.

Which hurt do you and others want? Hurt now? Or bigger hurt later?

It is insane when people justify what the Govt does, when the "feeding people" or "it's for the children" is attached, where any other time, it would be seen as it is. Theft and fraud.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 12:28 PM
link   

macman

onequestion
reply to post by macman
 


What your saying right now would lead to absolute chaos.

Maybe in the 1850's what your saying was plausible but we have mega cities with 10's of millions of people. These cant just go start a farm and grow crops and build houses like the quakers.

Whatever you think your solution is is a bigger problem then the problem your addressing. Theres 50 other changes that need to be made before cutting 50 million people off food stamps.

Its ok to feed people.

Your going to keep your position and im going to keep mine.




So, continue to steal from some, to give to others.

Eventually, the money will run out and those that produce will stop producing.

Which hurt do you and others want? Hurt now? Or bigger hurt later?

It is insane when people justify what the Govt does, when the "feeding people" or "it's for the children" is attached, where any other time, it would be seen as it is. Theft and fraud.


So you would advocate letting a major portion of our population go sick and hungry just because you think it's theft? It is not theft for a government to care about and provide for the welfare of it's citizens.. Esp if people wont' help each other..

Here is a question for you: If you saw a family with small children suffering would you just pass them by becuas eit's not your problem and they should be able to fend for themselves? I certainly wouldn't and don't, but obviously you think anyone that ends up in a situation where they can't for whatever reason is just mooching, which is the furthest thing form the case.

You sound like Ron Paul "Communities will take care of their own we dont' need any regulations at all"



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 12:36 PM
link   

vkey08

So you would advocate letting a major portion of our population go sick and hungry just because you think it's theft? It is not theft for a government to care about and provide for the welfare of it's citizens.. Esp if people wont' help each other..

I hate to break it to you, but the Govt does not "care" about the people.
And how is it not theft?
I work for a paycheck. The Govt reaches in, removes a portion and gives it to others.

Now, if I work for the same paycheck, and you reach into my wallet and remove the same funds, it is theft.

You, nor the Govt earned that money. You, nor the Govt has any right to it.


vkey08

Here is a question for you: If you saw a family with small children suffering would you just pass them by becuas eit's not your problem and they should be able to fend for themselves? I certainly wouldn't and don't, but obviously you think anyone that ends up in a situation where they can't for whatever reason is just mooching, which is the furthest thing form the case.

And here is where the bleeding heart always confuses the 2 scenarios.
I have no problem personally helping people in need. I encourage it and I also do it.
The Govt TAKING from me to give a fraction of what is stolen to the same people is what I have a problem with.


vkey08
You sound like Ron Paul "Communities will take care of their own we dont' need any regulations at all"

The Country was designed and built as such.
It is only when Progressives bastardized the laws, that gave us what we have.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 12:49 PM
link   
reply to post by vkey08
 


you have to understand that there are posters on ATS that want to see chaos, disharmony, and strife in America, some are foreign, some are domestic. the larger the population that suffers, the more likely anarchy will prevail. when there are enough people, that have nothing to worry about losing, then chaos will take over. this will lead to a law enforcement crackdown, and if it becomes too large, the national guard will be called upon. there are many in the country and abroad, that would love to see it happen, some for a radical change in our own government, others to cripple the US entirely...so...to work together to solve problems goes against the agenda.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 12:57 PM
link   
reply to post by jimmyx
 


Yeah, because that is exactly what is wanted.

People to starve, chaos, children dieing in the streets and so on....

Sure sure then, sure sure.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 02:06 PM
link   
reply to post by Snarl
 


Fact of the matter IS America has a problem, one which people as yourself will ignore as long as possible. However it will come and smack you in the face eventually.

The ARROGANCE of some people is astounding!

What we have been told is an out-right lie, and the goal posts are being moved to hide this lie. Hard work and keeping your nose clean are not sure-fire ways to avoid poverty anymore.

The game is rigged and people such as yourself who don't fall under the lamp at this time, are ignoring it and finding every reason to place blame on victims of this game.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 02:09 PM
link   

Xtrozero

onequestion

What about the 50-100 million other americans who dont have the same opportunities you have had?


Why don't they have the same opportunities?





Does this question REALLY need be asked? Wait...do you think every person has the same opportunities?



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 02:27 PM
link   

vkey08

jimmyx

macman

onequestion


Until we create conditions for economic prosperity do you think we want 50 million hungry jobless americans running around?


I work a day job, that pays very very well. I worked my way up into this position.

I also started another company last year. We are already in the black and are have sold the same amount in just the first month, as we did for 6 months last year.
We sell in an industry that is kind of a "Want" rather then a "Need".

There is prosperity all around. It all comes down to how bad to you want it, and will you work for it.



a couple of questions...
1...did you grow up in a loving 2 parent family?
2...did you live in a neighborhood that WASN'T "ghetto-like" in it's poverty and crime?
3...did you attend schools that were mostly safe, had good teachers, and had parent participation?
4...did you have others, outside your parents, that helped you, and were kind to you, in your early life?
edit on 3-2-2014 by jimmyx because: (no reason given)


No, single parent family in the worst part of Los Angeles, we still got by ok..
No, ever been in the area around 6th Ave?
HA! no....
Not really, got in my first knife fight at age 13, was brutally raped shortly thereafter and again two years later, was left for dead a couple of times...

But let's see me now......

I have two daughters that I raise alone (Yes I know who their father is, he died 6 years ago in the line of duty)
I have a very good job, that pays my bills for the most part, and provides for my family.
I have a secondary job that I do because of my love for it, not because i HAVE to..
I have friends and family around that are loving and caring.
I live in a rural area that is beautiful...

So how you grow up, is not indicative of how we will turn out...

PS: oh and yeah I'm the ATS Czar of Coffee and Other Caffeinated Beverages... due to the site elections a few years ago ^_^ just a fun aside...
edit on 322014 by vkey08 because: (no reason given)




You invalidated the intelligence displayed in your post with this "So how you grow up, is not indicative of how we will turn out...". We are products of our environment, plain and simple. OF COURSE there will be exceptions, but that's what they are EXCEPTIONS.

How much did the father of your daughters help you? SInce he died in the line of duty it sounds as though he had a pretty stable employment?

I can get into SO MUCH how you had luck on your side...even with your bad luck...you had some good luck to bless you!



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 02:35 PM
link   

macman

vkey08


So you are saying that if a family is really in need because of the economy or whatever reason, that we as a nation should not help them? That we should let people die because of no fault of their own? (I'm not talking about the people that abuse the system, I'm talking about a family that may have fallen upon hard times due to illness/medical issues or layoffs etc)

That's pretty cold and cruel... I'm sorry but that goes against everything I believe in...

It is not the job, responsibility or in the design for the Govt to do so.
What you want is a Govt, that picks and chooses who gets free stuff by stealing from others they pick and choose from.



vkey08
As far as letting the cities experience this, it happened, what part of that didn't you get, right after Sandy it happened.. It was a mess to the point that force wasn't working there were just TOO MANY people..

And the States should have dealt with this. Not the Fed Govt.
And the States weren't ready, as they rely on the Fed Govt to do most things.

If that doesn't show as a shining example of Govt dependency, I don't know what does.




Even IF it isn't the design or job of our current government, it should be. It should really be common sense that because we no longer live in a FRONTIER country, that the resources are claimed, that people can't just pick up their belongings, fill the wagon and go find land out West...LOL...all while fighting off Injans and cougars...WE HAVE TO LIVE AT THE WHIM OF A GOVERNMENT. Our only worry is to insure our government is as fair as possible. IMPOSSIBLE...long as we have people manning it...who don't believe in government.

What's with you and most on the RIGHT with this "free stuff" crap you spew at breath-taking speed? WHO, exactly, is asking for free stuff? I have seen very few people who have. While we are on the subject of "free" should we discuss who REALLY wants free or next to free stuff?

The problem is people such as yourself have to die out...not said to be mean. But people such as yourself were meant to live in the 19th Century maybe...we have longed moved past that! Your type is holding this entire world back. Wishing to pretend that we still live in a world where someone can pull themselves up by their boots and rely only upon themselves. THAT'S A FILTHY LIE that has brainwashed to many people.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 02:38 PM
link   

onequestion
reply to post by macman
 


What your saying right now would lead to absolute chaos.

Maybe in the 1850's what your saying was plausible but we have mega cities with 10's of millions of people. These cant just go start a farm and grow crops and build houses like the quakers.

Whatever you think your solution is is a bigger problem then the problem your addressing. Theres 50 other changes that need to be made before cutting 50 million people off food stamps.

Its ok to feed people.

Your going to keep your position and im going to keep mine.




People such as macman are delusional. He will have no response which makes any sense because he KNOWS deep down (I hope) that his stance is ridiculous. He and others forget that we live in advanced cities such as Chicago and New York......wait........perhaps that's the problem? They live in rural areas and forget that there are such things as cities?



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 02:40 PM
link   

macman

onequestion
reply to post by macman
 


What your saying right now would lead to absolute chaos.

Maybe in the 1850's what your saying was plausible but we have mega cities with 10's of millions of people. These cant just go start a farm and grow crops and build houses like the quakers.

Whatever you think your solution is is a bigger problem then the problem your addressing. Theres 50 other changes that need to be made before cutting 50 million people off food stamps.

Its ok to feed people.

Your going to keep your position and im going to keep mine.


So, continue to steal from some, to give to others.

Eventually, the money will run out and those that produce will stop producing.

Which hurt do you and others want? Hurt now? Or bigger hurt later?

It is insane when people justify what the Govt does, when the "feeding people" or "it's for the children" is attached, where any other time, it would be seen as it is. Theft and fraud.




Simple solution: We need to get the people who think as you out of our society. Perhaps, set some wilderness in Canada aside and let you all go live like Daniel Boone and eat squirrel and meet up in evenings and brag about how you built your log cabins all on your own muscle?

Get the people who don't want to participate in a society out of here so the rest of us can progress. The farmers with the mindset, replace them with team players. Same for every other occupation.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 03:28 PM
link   

DZAG Wright

Even IF it isn't the design or job of our current government, it should be.

Well, at least you admit the Govt wasn't designed for it.

But, now you want to restructure the Govt for your own ideals based on Socialism.
Care to show where that works?


DZAG Wright
It should really be common sense that because we no longer live in a FRONTIER country, that the resources are claimed, that people can't just pick up their belongings, fill the wagon and go find land out West...LOL...all while fighting off Injans and cougars...WE HAVE TO LIVE AT THE WHIM OF A GOVERNMENT. Our only worry is to insure our government is as fair as possible. IMPOSSIBLE...long as we have people manning it...who don't believe in government.

Now my heart is bleeding.
All that complaining and excuses just made my butthole bleed a little.



DZAG Wright
What's with you and most on the RIGHT with this "free stuff" crap you spew at breath-taking speed? WHO, exactly, is asking for free stuff? I have seen very few people who have. While we are on the subject of "free" should we discuss who REALLY wants free or next to free stuff?

Oh good hell.
It is exactly that. Those that receive the handout are not working for it. Unless you consider breathing and filling out some Govt forms as work.



DZAG Wright
The problem is people such as yourself have to die out...not said to be mean.

I just might cry now.
I guess people like you live forever?




DZAG Wright
But people such as yourself were meant to live in the 19th Century maybe...we have longed moved past that!

Ahhh, okay then. That is why to pass 90% of this Socialist Utopian crap, you and the people you support in Govt have to circumvent the normal processes.
Sure sure then.


DZAG Wright
Your type is holding this entire world back.

I'm glad to hear that.



DZAG Wright
Wishing to pretend that we still live in a world where someone can pull themselves up by their boots and rely only upon themselves. THAT'S A FILTHY LIE that has brainwashed to many people.

Yep, I guess we all have to just wait for Govt to come and push me forward.

Your lazy. Plain and simple. And honestly I don't know how you even were able to log into ATS, as I don't know of a Govt program to assist people with this.

edit on 4-2-2014 by macman because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 03:29 PM
link   

DZAG Wright




People such as macman are delusional. He will have no response which makes any sense because he KNOWS deep down (I hope) that his stance is ridiculous. He and others forget that we live in advanced cities such as Chicago and New York......wait........perhaps that's the problem? They live in rural areas and forget that there are such things as cities?



You are now using Chicago and NY as your shining example?????

Yeah, okay. Now I know for sure your full of crap.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 03:31 PM
link   
reply to post by DZAG Wright
 





So, round people like me and and haul us away.

Didn't Hitler do that as well???

But, I am sure your not like Hitler......




He was a little bit more savvy with his pitch.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 05:03 PM
link   
reply to post by macman
 


Were did you get the illusion that living off of foodstamps and welfare is a good life?

Have you ever lived in projects/ public housing? Could you support your family off of 170 a month for food?

You realize most welfare families have fathers and mothers that work off the books with min wage jobs and still barely scape because of an increase in cost of living?

No government stop reaching in my pocket.

Thats your only answer its weak you don't address any issues with any solutions or you are unwilling to acknowledge that its impossible for people to go grow and build and create their own communities out in the wilderness.

Your only position is stop taking taxes from my check, your not saying, stop taking taxes from my check for war, or stop taking taxes from my check to pay congress, or stop taking taxes from my check to give in foreign aid, or the for the space program.

Nope, you just hate poor people. Thats so , odd.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 05:25 PM
link   

Boog911
As a law enforcement officer of 13 years, I have put my share of felons in jail or prison. And for the most part, I am satisfied with my arrests. But dealing with the criminal element has jaded me on several levels. I rarely see somone wanting to be re educated on their crimes but instead see people just wanting a free pass, manipulating the system for their own benefit. Recidivism is rampant with most criminals. They are full of excuses for their special crime but VERY RARELY do I see remorse for their acts. Only when all cards have been played and there is no other alternative but to beg for forgiveness do I see any remorse. One problem is that the court system is set up as a money making machine. In most counties I know, the courthouse is the biggest business in town. Why punish someone by a long jail term when we can fine them, release them, re catch them and fine them again. A terrible circle that is.

That is one of the most succinct (and accurate) statements from an LEO I've ever seen on this site. I'm only commenting on it so I can refer back to it in the future.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 08:08 PM
link   

onequestion


Were did you get the illusion that living off of foodstamps and welfare is a good life?

It shouldn't be the good life. Yet, millions get on and live that way for a lifetime.
Must not be too bad, the income controlled housing in my area has people with new cars, big screens and such.


onequestion
Have you ever lived in projects/ public housing? Could you support your family off of 170 a month for food?

Nope, as I would never allow my family to reach that point.


onequestion
You realize most welfare families have fathers and mothers that work off the books with min wage jobs and still barely scape because of an increase in cost of living?

Okay. And????
Min Wage jobs are there as a stepping stone to move up. Not to stay in.
If someone doesn't progress, it is not the fault of society or the business of the Govt to offset their costs in life.
Politicians offering more free stuff to the masses is called vote buying.


onequestion
No government stop reaching in my pocket.

Yes. The Govt did nothing to earn it.


onequestion
Thats your only answer its weak you don't address any issues with any solutions or you are unwilling to acknowledge that its impossible for people to go grow and build and create their own communities out in the wilderness.

It is at least a start. I am not here to offer fixes for everyone. Not my job. In fact, it is the job of the individual to do that. Not everyone else's via Govt.


onequestion
Your only position is stop taking taxes from my check, your not saying, stop taking taxes from my check for war, or stop taking taxes from my check to pay congress, or stop taking taxes from my check to give in foreign aid, or the for the space program.

Yes to all of it. Until the Govt gets control of its spending, stops stealing from people at a huge rate, it all needs to stop.

And, just to correct your statement. I am not for spending more money on the current wars. I have different reasons for that, but that is neither here nor there.


onequestion
Nope, you just hate poor people. Thats so , odd.

Yep, that is exactly what it is.
That is about the lamest statement yet.

But, I guess I hate them SOOOO much that I give 10% of my income to charity.


Yeah, I just hate the poor. Don't forget to add Gays, Blacks, Midgets, Albinos and those that are color blind.



posted on Feb, 4 2014 @ 08:41 PM
link   
reply to post by macman
 


PS i stared your response. You may not care but your civil enough to respond for an intellectual perspective rather then emotional and for that i am willing to participate in furthering the discussion with you where i would usually stop. You may not care but im just relating to you.



It shouldn't be the good life. Yet, millions get on and live that way for a lifetime. Must not be too bad, the income controlled housing in my area has people with new cars, big screens and such.


Its not the good life trust me. Public housing is riddled with crime and children who grow up in these areas and attend the schools have a much lesser percentage success rate and in some communities they have a smaller percentage for suvival or staying out of prison. Dont give me personal responsability crap for people ages 13-16 either because they dont even know better. Hell most people dont get it figured out till their mid twenties. I know i dont have it figured out yet and im 28. I dont expect a 13 year old to figure it out either.

Right but a big screen tv cost 500 bucks. Its a one time charge thats easier to save up for then a consistant montly charge for rent. You can save up for a big screen easier then you can take on a car payment or rent.




Nope, as I would never allow my family to reach that point.


Oh yeah? You rely on the community that buys the product of whatever industry your in. If something happens to that community youll be in the same situation like many people in the construction industry around the nation who lost their jobs when the housing boom stopped. Tell that to the millions of skilled trade worker reducating themselves while their family is put up in someone elses house so the husband can start a new career.




Min Wage jobs are there as a stepping stone to move up. Not to stay in. If someone doesn't progress, it is not the fault of society or the business of the Govt to offset their costs in life. Politicians offering more free stuff to the masses is called vote buying.


Its simple math. There isn't 50 million middle America jobs. This is due to an ever integrated world economy, a falsly inflated real estate market and advancing technology.

Most of these jobs will never come back due to technology. Do you suggest we round these poor people up and kill them?




Yes. The Govt did nothing to earn it.


Right there should be no income tax. A sales tax i can agree with but not an income tax. Here we agree.




It is at least a start. I am not here to offer fixes for everyone. Not my job. In fact, it is the job of the individual to do that. Not everyone else's via Govt.


Right but your not offering a solution which means you are not a part of the solution.

If your not a part of the solution then your a part of the problem. Were not diasgreeing with you on your stance on government were trying to tell you we need a solution before we create a situation of chaos in America which will destroy you and everyone in it.




Yes to all of it. Until the Govt gets control of its spending, stops stealing from people at a huge rate, it all needs to stop.


Everyone including myself is agreeing with you on this. However this is not what point is being made, the point being made is that we need to discover the steps necessary to get these people off of welfare without starving or killing them. Thats the point.




But, I guess I hate them SOOOO much that I give 10% of my income to charity.


Right but giving chairyt isnt creating sustainable jobs. Youd be better off finding an apprentice and moving them into your house and teaching them your trade. Now that would help the problem.

Were not disagreeing on anything were just not agreeing on a solution. It would help more for us to unify under the same umbrella and work towards a solution. Can you help do that instead? The division in this thread is pointless. Lets all agree to work towards a solution instead of disagreeing over symantics can you get down with that?
edit on 20142America/ChicagoquAmerica/Chicago1928422014 by onequestion because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
36
<< 6  7  8    10  11  12 >>

log in

join