Deciphering the Pagan Stones

a reply to: beansidhe

I wonder when it dates from, whether before, during or after the Pict stones. In other words, did they take it from the Picts or did the Picts inherit it. Or were they simultaneous?

The concept of an archetype /ˈɑrkɪtaɪp/ is found in areas relating to behavior, modern psychological theory, and literary analysis. An archetype can be…:

…a statement, pattern of behavior, or prototype which other statements, patterns of behavior, and objects copy or emulate; …
…a Platonic philosophical idea referring to pure forms which embody the fundamental characteristics of a thing; …
…a collectively-inherited unconscious idea, pattern of thought, image, etc., that is universally present in individual psyches, as in Jungian psychology; …
…or a constantly recurring symbol or motif in literature, painting, or mythology (this usage of the term draws from both comparative anthropology and Jungian archetypal theory).


A group of memories and interpretations associated with an archetype is a complex ( e.g. a mother complex associated with the mother archetype). Jung treated the archetypes as psychological organs, analogous to physical ones in that both are morphological constructs that arose through evolution.

en.wikipedia.org...

originally posted by: beansidhe
a reply to: Logarock

Yes, you would. Like the one found on a class 4 stone in Orkney?

Weather is gorgeous here thanks. The tulips are out, the cherry trees are in flower, it's a beautiful day. How about you?

I cant quite make it out but is that design in the Pict circle nearly identical to the design in the circles on the Queen/Kings throne? Is the Winsor line infused with any of that Royal Scot blood?

And yes the tulips came up about a week ago. We have a nice tulip tree in the yard that bloomed but had a killing frost one night about 3 days after they opened. However the other flower bearing early trees missed it by days and are out now. Still waiting for some like the apple trees. Grapes are budding well and the Asparagus is coming up.

a reply to: Wifibrains


I am familiar with this Jungian idea but hold that much of the similar iconography is passed down by initiates, scribes the general keepers of the esoteric.

a reply to: Logarock

That would account for the preservation of the iconography locally, but does not explain how the same symbolism shows up world wide...

a reply to: Wifibrains

That is the Sanda stone, from Sweden:



What is especially interesting is that it has been dated to around 500AD, making it contemporaneous with our stones. Now that is exciting, because it suggests shared values early on. The Viking raids are put at about 8th C normally.

Jung, hmm, yes, no, yes, no, maybe. I prefer Aaron Beck, I have to say. I think that people were mobile, moving and talking, trading, marrying etc and passing on beliefs this way. I'm not dismissing archetypes, it's one of the areas Jung wrote about that I do agree with, and I'm definitely open to those kind of ideas. More to add, I'll be back later

originally posted by: beansidhe
a reply to: Ramcheck

Wow, that's a kind of in-your-face-site, is it not (might explain my hook nose though, lol!)?

Yes I too avoid such websites where multiple exclamation marks and large, bold text clouds the good work they may actually have done. Point of interest though, If you look at the bottom of it though they do talk about the Cimmerians.

DP - delete at your leisure.

a reply to: beansidhe

I come from Anglesey, grew up there...been to the little church that is on the site..St Mary's church.....there is a very good book written on the subject and makes a very strong case for it being true...I'll have to see if I can find it for you.

As to what do I make of it?.....I'm not sure to be honest. If it was Mary Magdalene I could make sense of it because she was a herbalist, shamanic/druidic in her practices and chronologically speaking after the Romans had left Anglesey there was still a very strong druidic society in Anglesey, and to this day it is still regarded as the 'headquarters' so to speak.

Rainbows
Jane

a reply to: Logarock

Nope not even them....believe me

Rainbows
Jane

More on the Sanda stone. As far as I can work out, it depicts the Norse concept of the Universe. Ygdrassil, the world tree, is shown in the middle and above is Jormungandr the serpent.

Midgard is a realm in Norse mythology. Pictured as placed somewhere in the middle of Yggdrasil, Midgard is surrounded by a world of water, or ocean, that is impassable. The ocean is inhabited by the great sea serpent Jörmungandr (Miðgarðsormr), who is so huge that he encircles the world entirely, grasping his own tail. The concept is similar to that of the Ouroboros.

Wiki link

Serpent's don't feature much in Scandanavia, or Scotland, unless I'm mistaken. This seems to have come from elsewhere, and carried over from hotter lands.

The Ouroboros or Uroboros (/jʊərɵˈbɒrəs/; /ɔːˈrɒbɔrəs/, from the Greek οὐροβόρος ὄφις tail-devouring snake) is an ancient symbol depicting a serpent or dragon eating its own tail.

The Ouroboros often symbolize self-reflexivity or cyclicality, especially in the sense of something constantly re-creating itself, the eternal return, and other things such as the phoenix which operate in cycles that begin anew as soon as they end. It can also represent the idea of primordial unity related to something existing in or persisting from the beginning with such force or qualities it cannot be extinguished. While first emerging in Ancient Egypt, the Ouroboros has been important in religious and mythological symbolism

Did I write it here or did I just read it? Anyway I can find it again if need be, but one of the Druids' teachings was about reincarnation.
It is possible that the double discs represent something of this idea for the Picts although we don't see the serpent around the discs. The fact that the artist of this stone chose to combine the two (snake and discs) suggests to me that they are related.

Oh, and another snake lady for you Wifi, this time from Sweden and again around 500AD:

a reply to: beansidhe

Will respond to your post about combs quickly since I was getting that type of cereal for my kid just now.
Decided might as respond to that comment you made with a little tidbit. Will post some of the stuff I messaged you last week later, and some other stuff at some point. Just this for now:

Comb the word Comb for clues.
Comb (anatomy)

A comb is a fleshy growth or crest on the top of the head of gallinaceous birds, such as turkeys, pheasants, and domestic chickens.

Honeycomb = Hexagon / Hexagram

Comb (Disambig)
Crest (disambig)

But back at comb:

v.intr.
1. To roll and break. Used of waves.

Further down

5. something resembling or suggesting this, as the crest of a wave.

Note the connection?
Crest toothpaste?
Combs have Teeth (But Brushes have Bristles lol)

Note the connections between Teeth/Tooth + Cutting or Dividing Theme words.
Also hygienic references.

Note also "Crown" is related to "Crest" on the anatomy/head reference.
And Dentists will put a Crown or Cap on a Tooth.

So what am I doing?
The Cosmic "Oral B-Glide" ?
Which just means 'Surfing the Sine Wave' in my lingo.

There is so much to this particular Nexus I don't even know where to start.
When I figure out what I wanna post I'll do that then.
I have like 20 things I want to do right now so forgive me.

a reply to: Logarock

I cant quite make it out but is that design in the Pict circle nearly identical to the design in the circles on the Queen/Kings throne?

I can't make it out either, it's too hard to be sure.
Asparagus - oh, that sounds too good! We've missed the frost this year, it's been quite mild so far (touch wood) so I'm hoping it doesn't come now just when my pear tree is about to flower. Nothing worse than a late frost

a reply to: muzzleflash

Good to see you, you sneaked in there while I was writing!
Seems to be a comb-crown-king link possibly. In a few sources I've read now it's claimed that the mirror and comb always appear together - this isn't true, there are numerous occasions where they appear separately.
Personally I think comb means something alone, as does mirror. Comb could be something about royal-ness, or closeness to God, purifying oneself for God etc. Mirror may mean something lunar/feminine or queenly, possibly.

Funnily enough, I came across this while I was looking for Wifi's stone:



Bildstein Runestone

I just need to find out what it says!

originally posted by: beansidhe
We're thinking about the carved Pict stones from much later on, like this one.

There are loads of stones in Wales with very similar designs to these on them. Here are a few.

originally posted by: beansidhe
More on the Sanda stone. As far as I can work out, it depicts the Norse concept of the Universe. Ygdrassil, the world tree, is shown in the middle and above is Jormungandr the serpent.

Midgard is a realm in Norse mythology. Pictured as placed somewhere in the middle of Yggdrasil, Midgard is surrounded by a world of water, or ocean, that is impassable. The ocean is inhabited by the great sea serpent Jörmungandr (Miðgarðsormr), who is so huge that he encircles the world entirely, grasping his own tail. The concept is similar to that of the Ouroboros.

Wiki link



Serpent's don't feature much in Scandanavia, or Scotland, unless I'm mistaken. This seems to have come from elsewhere, and carried over from hotter lands.

The Ouroboros or Uroboros (/jʊərɵˈbɒrəs/; /ɔːˈrɒbɔrəs/, from the Greek οὐροβόρος ὄφις tail-devouring snake) is an ancient symbol depicting a serpent or dragon eating its own tail.

The Ouroboros often symbolize self-reflexivity or cyclicality, especially in the sense of something constantly re-creating itself, the eternal return, and other things such as the phoenix which operate in cycles that begin anew as soon as they end. It can also represent the idea of primordial unity related to something existing in or persisting from the beginning with such force or qualities it cannot be extinguished. While first emerging in Ancient Egypt, the Ouroboros has been important in religious and mythological symbolism

Did I write it here or did I just read it? Anyway I can find it again if need be, but one of the Druids' teachings was about reincarnation.
It is possible that the double discs represent something of this idea for the Picts although we don't see the serpent around the discs. The fact that the artist of this stone chose to combine the two (snake and discs) suggests to me that they are related.

Oh, and another snake lady for you Wifi, this time from Sweden and again around 500AD:

Lol, that's her!

She hasn't changed much!




There is a little hint of the Pictish beast in the three serpents in the upper section of that stone also.

a reply to: muzzleflash

The Comb thing has always annoyed me too to be honest. A plausible explanation for it would go a long way to explaining at least part of several Pictish stone carvings.

a reply to: urbanghost

They're a good match, definitely. Same 4 armed cross, dragons etc.
I don't know how much of the thread you've read, but we're thinking that the Picts and the Cymry/Britons were close at times and allies. Y Goddoddin was found near Edinburgh, and a large part of that area was occupied by Britons (Welsh) at various times. More scholars are agreeing that the Picts would have spoken a Welsh-ish language before Gaelic. We're also getting a sense of neighbouring Celts being 'fed' into Scotland via Ireland to keep the Romans back.
But mainly we're trying to get a sense of what life was like for celtic clans in Britain, and for the Picts especially. As I'm sure you're well aware our history is not necessarily as we have been taught it and a while back we were looking at Alan Wilson's work. Scotland relies heavily on the Welsh Triads etc and the Irish Annals for our own history - we have no written sources in our 'Dark Age'.
Overall we're trying to understand the symbols on the stones, and looking at similarities from other cultures of the era and before. It's good to have you aboard.

a reply to: Wifibrains

Lol, she's still looking good. Yes, that snake has a snout, well spotted. The beastie is quite often shown as much larger than other things, and always hovering or floating - I wonder if it's that sort of idea, a world serpent/beast idea?

originally posted by: Ramcheck
a reply to: muzzleflash

The Comb thing has always annoyed me too to be honest. A plausible explanation for it would go a long way to explaining at least part of several Pictish stone carvings.

Agreed It's definitely an annoying one - it seems so out of place.

Thanks everyone for the kind responses and letting me pop in! I appreciate that a lot.
Now to respond to the recent comments you guys made:

The Comb seems to pretty versatile. It can be anything.

It's "God" because + - , the two Triangles of the Hexa-Sexagram (Star of David-Divide). From Honeycombs.
So that's just a stylized variation of the Yin Yang concept with additional connotations.

It's the Head concept, and the Speak/Mouth+Eye/Sight concepts (Oral)
Note this correlation: Tooth / Sooth / Sleuth / Booth - it's Smooth and it Soothes the Foot ? (hahaha).

Sooth+ Say ? Tooth + Say?
Hmmm, it's all very interesting.

So since we also have a reference to waves, we have an additional "sound-sight" connection.
The "super string harmonics" make up All of Existence in a sense.

Superstring theory is an attempt to explain all of the particles and fundamental forces of nature in one theory by modelling them as vibrations of tiny supersymmetric strings.

'Superstring theory' is a shorthand for supersymmetric string theory because unlike bosonic string theory, it is the version of string theory that incorporates fermions and supersymmetry.

So "Combine" the "Comb References", lol.

So we have the "Coronation".
"Coronation" is also referring to the Dental Specialty.

Coronation, tune by Oliver Holden, first published in 1779, used for the hymn "All Hail the Power of Jesus' Name"

So it's the Coronation of Jesus also, which is important because of why?
Coronation Grapes

That is a connection between "Cor-Bread" and "Cor-Wine", which I just noticed.
Corona

A corona (Latin, 'crown') is a type of plasma that surrounds the Sun and other celestial bodies.

It's got "Teeth" or "Rays of Light" which can also be like a crazy man's "Hair".

from the Ancient Greek κορώνη (korōnē, “garland, wreath”).

Also connects with Spectrum and Prism.

Spectrum - Specter - Special - Speck - etc
Wreath - Wraith (Heathen Faith? lol..)

Jump to the "Micro" now...Coronavirus

The name "coronavirus" is derived from the Latin corona, meaning crown or halo, and refers to the characteristic appearance of virions under electron microscopy (E.M.) with a fringe of large, bulbous surface projections creating an image reminiscent of the solar corona.

While writing this I forgot half of the stuff I wanted to point out. Sorry I might be losing my steam I've been up all day. I'll post again soon with some more responses to a few posts I have in mind, adding whatever might be relevant to their findings.