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so I suspect that there is an actual animal at the heart of the myth. the horse eels in your pic are no more real then the feathered serpant...
that salamanders are sacred in some cultures is a given, and they look like feathered serpants like the lungfish does...
but that only satisfies part of the requirements for being the origin of the myth
I mention the african lung fish because they are the same size as the ones pictured carved to scale
First off these carvings are not carved to scale in any fashion. For Pete sake you got people riding horses. Do you think maybe they are small faire horses with small faire riders then?
And there is an actual animal at the heart of the myth.....a seahorse.
Alulim was the first king of Eridu, and the first king of Sumer, according to the mythological antediluvian section of the Sumerian King List. Enki, the god of Eridu, is said to have brought civilization to Sumer at this point, or just shortly before.
The Sumerian King List has the following entry for Alulim:
"After the kingship descended from heaven, the kingship was in Eridug (Eridu). In Eridug, Alulim became king; he ruled for 28,800 years."
In a chart of antediluvian generations in Babylonian and Biblical traditions, Professor William Wolfgang Hallo associates Alulim with the composite half-man, half-fish counselor or culture hero (Apkallu) Uanna-Adapa (Oannes), and suggests an equivalence between Alulim and Enosh in the Sethite genealogy given in Genesis chapter 5. Hallo notes that Alulim's name means "Stag".
Shea, however, suggests that Alulim may be the same man as the biblical Adam.
Because her devotees practiced such magic wherever three paths joined, Hecate became known to the Romans as Trivia ( tri "three," and via "roads").
‘Picti’ may be related to a Latin word that means ‘to paint’. The Romans first write about the Picti in AD 297. In AD 368 a Roman historian named Ammianus Marcellinus noted that:
...the Picts, divided into two tribes called Dicalydones and Verturiones… are roving at large and causing great devastation.
Many historians have said that the Picts were the ‘painted people’; that they may have decorated and tattooed their faces and bodies with dyes. The Irish called the Picts the ‘Cruithne’. The Romans used ‘Picts’ as a general term that covered many separate tribes.
Some historians now believe that the Romans may have simply misheard the name ‘Pecht’ or ‘Pect’. In Old Norse the Picts were called the Péttir, Péttar or Peti. Old English names included Pehtas and Peohtas.
The Picts are renowned for their silverwork and for their many intriguing sculptured symbol stones.
Scottish placenames starting with ‘Pit’ - for example Pitlochry, Pittenweem and Pitsligo - retain a fragment of the language of the Picts that was borrowed by later peoples. ‘Pit’ is thought to mean a ‘share’ or piece of land.
Here her role as initiator is revealed, as she remains the constant throughout the triple cycle of life/ death/ rebirth.
Once the Cailleach was known as a triple goddess, her sisters/ other sides are the Cailleach Bolus and the Cailleach Corca Duibhne. In some tales the Cailleach Bheare is the wife of the sun god Lugh, but she is said to outlive many husbands, whilst remaining youthful herself, and mothering many children. Here we see an example of the earth goddess’s fecundity enduring whilst her lover rises and falls throughout the solar year. The Cailleach’s great age signifies her position as keeper of the mysteries, and as gateway to the infinite. She serves as midwife for the dying year as tenderly as she holds the seeds of the new, warm and safe in her lap beneath the earth, whilst her cauldron bubbles, hinting of the new life that will eventually come, after the long sleep that is the winter.
Neolithic burial mounds, often considered entrances to the underworld, were known as ‘Cerridwens courts’. Several stone ‘cauldrons’ containing human bones have been found in burial mounds in Ireland, and are likely to signify that this belief stretches as far back as 3000 BCE
Only a few deities are well documented in literature and Hecate is one of the many who are largely absent, especially before the fourth century. Also....one has to bear in mind that there is only so much factual information out there from paintings, plates, the Hymns, etc., regarding the Goddess Hecate and the rest of the written material is merely speculation and should be taken as such. For instance, the mention that Hecate had many children. There is only one factual evidence in which Hecate may have had one child, Skylla, and it was not from Hermes but from Porkys. I have read some sources state that Hecate had many children and some with Hermes which is mere speculation with no evidence. In fact, the only association Hecate has with Hermes are their roles as chthonic Deities and/or guardians of the common people. For those reasons above, I am careful in what I believe to be information on Hecate or any other Deity for that matter and I tend to take more to heart on what scholars have to write than anything else.. Anyone can write a book but the difference is between whether it is factual or mere speculation on the author's part.
Hecate is an ancient Goddess from an earlier pre-Greek strata of myth. The Greeks found Her difficult to fit into their scheme of Gods. Some came to see Her as a daughter of the Titans, Perses and Asteria and thus cousin to Artemis. Others saw Her as an even more primal Goddess, making Her a daughter of Erebus and Nyx. What is so confusing here is if Hecate was seen as a daughter of minor parents such as Perses and Asteria, why would Zeus "give" Her so much power and ruler of Earth, Heaven and the Underworld, and He favored Her above all.
It has been speculated by one author that Hecate was not a Moon Goddess before the Roman period. He says that torches alone does not make Her a Moon Goddess. However, Hecate’s grandmother is Phoebe, the Moon. Hecate’s father, Peres, is an old Sun-God, and when there is a Sun God, there is always mention of a Moon Goddess, and so Hecate’s ancestry therefore reflects her heritage as an ancient Moon Goddess. Plus a few passages of Sophokles evokes a very clear picture of Hecate that Her torches seem to pair her specifically with Helios, the Sun God. Aristophanes speaks of Hecate’s torches showing the way at night: ("and you, oh daughter of Zeus, holding up two flaming torches...show the way...so that I may search for the thief"). (Many believe that Hecate is not the daughter of Zeus as Hecate is Pre-Greek. Also there is a picture of Hecate holding the Sun God Zeus when he was a small child.)
In the Pre-Olympian Deities, in tales concerning the beginning of things, three great Goddesses play the part of Mother of the World: the Sea-Goddess Tethys, the Goddess Night ( whom Zeus stood in sacred awe of) and Mother Earth. They constitute a trinity. All through mythology, one comes across three Goddesses. What is more, they do not merely form accidental groups of three–usually a group of three sisters–but actually are real trinities, sometimes almost forming a single Threefold Goddess. It might be because in earlier times, the calendar year was by the Moon. The lunar month was divided into three parts, and our moon had three aspects: as the waxing, the full and waning sign of a divine presence in the sky.
The lands of Pitcairn lie in the Parish of Leslie in Fife, and are reputed to be one of the oldest of the ancient Kingdom
reply to post by Danbones
the tuning fork
here is why I doubt it
scroll down to Astyanax's post
The Antikythera mechanism (/ˌæntɨkɨˈθɪərə/ ANT-i-ki-THEER-ə or /ˌæntɨˈkɪθərə/ ANT-i-KITH-ə-rə) is an ancient analog computer designed to predict astronomical positions and eclipses. It was recovered in 1900–1901 from the Antikythera wreck, a shipwreck off the Greek island of Antikythera. Although the computer's construction has been attributed to the Greeks and dated to the early 1st century BC, its significance and complexity were not understood until a century after its recovery, in the 1970s, when it was analyzed with modern X-ray technology. Technological artifacts approaching its complexity and workmanship did not appear again until the 14th century, when mechanical astronomical clocks began to be built in Western Europe.
Professor Michael Edmunds of Cardiff University, who led a 2006 study of the mechanism, said:
This device is just extraordinary, the only thing of its kind. The design is beautiful, the astronomy is exactly right. The way the mechanics are designed just makes your jaw drop. Whoever has done this has done it extremely carefully ... in terms of historic and scarcity value, I have to regard this mechanism as being more valuable than the Mona Lisa.
—30 November 2006
reply to post by Logarock
She meant a lot, I'm convinced she is our Cailleach, the winter face of the Goddess who shaped the earth, the destroyer Goddess and the destroyer of men. In Spring, her summer 'face' is revealed, as Bride, bringer of life and fertility, and who was 'christianised' as St. Brigit. It makes a lot more sense to me, than Bel.
I can't remember where I read it, but they suggested that the Caledonii took their name from her, and so Caledonia (Scotland) is Cailleach's land.
The Roman's crappy psy-op clearly didn't work, but nice try!
reply to post by Logarock
i didn't miss it I don't see it as germain to the conversation
i tried to help you but you refuse fine
you insult me because you can't really match up here
I have what I wanted to learn from this thread what you think is immaterial to that understanding