How to stop the friends zone

reply to post by bigvig316


I just wanted to thank the crew for those videos, I was laughing at my desk and people were looking at me like I was a crazy person (which I am).

Op!

Practice flirting, practice on everyone who is paid to put up with you. The cute store clerk, your waitress, the lady at the dry cleaners, just start having fun. Then when you are in the situation with a girl that has caught your attention you know what to do. If a girl can't take a joke, it's much better to find out in the first 60 seconds while you make fun of her shoes she probably spent hours picking out. Oh and do some homework, pick up a few fashion magazines and see what women are reading, it gives you something they don't expect to talk about. Talk to anyone you want, get the conversation going and then push it into areas that are fun like...I can't believe what that woman is wearing, yeah her, the one with the granny panty lines my blind uncle Bart could see from his front porch. I bet you have several pairs just like them back at home for your comfy days on the couch.

Make it fun, but when they start to talk about ex's or even the current guy, flip the conversation around. "Hey I'm not a shrink, but if you wan't to talk about "that" let's schedule an appointment next Tuesday I charge 400$ an hour but for now let's keep it light, I'm enjoying this beer."

Always remember, there is someone else around the corner just dying to meet you so don't get hung up on "the one".

brandiwine14
Unless the women you are going after all taken already the whole friend thing zone is just a ruse. It is what women say when they just are not into you.

This is good, you can use this to your advantage, beat them to the punch.

After a minute or two of conversation, "Hey you are all right, you might make a good friend if you play your cards right." Mean it when you say it, but remain playful afterwards, it's not what attractive women are used to hearing and it can make them wonder.

Be patient! She will eventually fall for you or she just simply doesn't like you! No attraction no sparks! But to me it's important being friends with a guy first.

Jarring
Not to mention girls with daddy issues can be easily manipulated and assholes are all-but too eager to take advantage of it.

Whoa, 'Bama. That stings. haha
I am not refuting that girls that have "Daddy issues" have some issues to work out. But not all girls with such issues have them for life.
And not all girls that have or have had such issues are easily maniuplated. Perhaps at one time, whilst embroiled in the issues. But give girls who have worked those issues out some credit.

Now, I'm going to have to give a frownie on that one.

boncho
reply to post by MarioOnTheFly

 

A gentleman never kisses and tells (while on a dry spell) for if the future lady found out I know not how, she would forever see you in bed with that cow.

I just really have to use this somewhere, somehow.

StarlightNine

Jarring
Not to mention girls with daddy issues can be easily manipulated and assholes are all-but too eager to take advantage of it.

Whoa, 'Bama. That stings. haha
I am not refuting that girls that have "Daddy issues" have some issues to work out. But not all girls with such issues have them for life.
And not all girls that have or have had such issues are easily maniuplated. Perhaps at one time, whilst embroiled in the issues. But give girls who have worked those issues out some credit.

Now, I'm going to have to give a frownie on that one.

lol -_-; my bad, was just tryin to make a point.

You need a good wingman to help you out and give you tips. I've been thinking of starting a "Hitch" type of matchmaker business (but I hate to use that word in this context, but hey the fact is that time is valuable and plus we all gotta eat) to help people find love. I used to be just like you, except I couldn't even really get girls in the friend zone. And then something just clicked and I understood...yet I can't quite put it into words. I would have to meet you and see you "in action" with a practice girl and then teach you how to make the proper corrections. You have to find the perfect balance between being a manly man who makes them feel protected and beautiful and sought after, and a smart, sensitive funny guy who can make them laugh (this is crucial) and make them feel like they can talk to you about anything and let them know you aren't going to try to control them with jealousy and dominance. Basically a lot of stuff you already probably know from your time in the friend zone. But some light hearted jealousy can be a good thing. Just don't get too serious and paranoid with it...you need just enough to make them feel desired and almost, in a way, competed over.

But you also have to remember that all women are different so there is not one single method that will work with every woman. You have to be able to adapt on the spot but if you already know the lady in question you won't really have to do that. But what you can do is refine a method that will work with 70-80% of the women You prefer.

Anyway, I wish you luck. Just try to remember to "grow a pair" and try to practice some moves cause it's the only way you will learn. Don't fear rejections because it's not the end of the world and plus women who rejected you once may accept you later so its REALLY not the end of the world and if anything she will remember that you like her. Forget allthe bs you have been trying because it obviously isn't working. Stop trying g so hard and just be yourself and be more honest. Stop worrying about trying to create an image of what you think they want. (Sorry if some of this doesn't apply to you, I'm partly just thinking of advice I would have given my own old self and hoping some of it will work or click with you so don't take offense) Girls can tell when you're trying to create an image and besides girls probably do not even want a guy who is like this image you are trying to create. Just be the sweet guy you really are but lose the fear. Show them you have the courage to openly pursue them.

Show that you are listening when they speak and that you care about their concerns, but don't be afraid to also show that you are a man and that you are not afraid to go after what you want. You want her right? Well doesn't she deserve not only the truth, but also a good man like you who will take good care of her heart? Then give her what she deserves man! Stop "lying" to her by pretending you don't want to get to know her better in Every way. As soon as things seem to be going well, make a big move. Like holding her hand. If she let's you do that, she will let you kiss her, so do it! Smile at her first, and if she smiles back definitely go in for a kiss. Even if for some crazy reason it doesn't work, at least she will know you are a real man and had the courage to try it! Looking back, I realize there are a LOT of girls I could've dated if only I had the courage to TRY!

If you're nervous, be honest and say so (she deserves honesty remember?? So don't lie to her by omission). You could just smile and say "sorry, I'm a little nervous because you're very beautiful and I'm not very good at this". Turn it into a compliment for her. Smiling is important to. If you're smiling it means it's a nice happy or humorous but otherwise comfortable situation and not a creepy one. Even if she doesn't go for it keep on smiling and just say "well that's ok, I just had to try because you're just so gorgeous and seem like a nice and fun person, so, anyway, I hope you don't hate me now", and then she will probably say of course she doesn't hate you, but she just doesn't feel that way about you. You have to be ok with rejection and dont give up on yourself after a few failures. Its a learning exoerience. It's OK to be a helpless guy who admittedly doesn't know a lot about females. None of us do. Girls think that's cute and it makes them feel empowered that you think of them as so mysterious and perhaps somewhat unattainable...

So, I hope some of that helps. If not, then hey what can I say, like most guys i don't know a lot about females... i just know I've become more successful over time. As I'm sure you will too!

Jarring

StarlightNine

Jarring
Not to mention girls with daddy issues can be easily manipulated and assholes are all-but too eager to take advantage of it.

Whoa, 'Bama. That stings. haha
I am not refuting that girls that have "Daddy issues" have some issues to work out. But not all girls with such issues have them for life.
And not all girls that have or have had such issues are easily maniuplated. Perhaps at one time, whilst embroiled in the issues. But give girls who have worked those issues out some credit.

Now, I'm going to have to give a frownie on that one.

lol -_-; my bad, was just tryin to make a point.

Okay then.


No, your points were good. But most of us have either Daddy issues or Mommy issues of some nature and to some extent.
We can't allow that to muck up our relationships. Or use them as excuses?

And I'm not saying put anyone on a pedestal, the reasons being some of the result in which you mentioned. But when you do end up loving someone, the special treatment happens on its own.

bigvig316
can someone tell me how I can stop ending up in the friends zone with women. every woman I try to hit it off with, I always end up in the same place. Should I stop treating them like equals and start treating them as property. Seem like women always try to go out with scumbags.

Try Not Caring. Really. As soon as you show interest, you start the ball rolling toward the friend zone. Essentially what you have to do when you meet someone new is say, "Oh, hi. Nice to meet you." Quick handshake if appropriate, quick public, almost but not quite insincere smile, then go back to what you were doing before this intrusion.

If she is interested, she'll find a way to circle back around and ask what you are doing, and you can explain it briefly, then go back to what you were doing. It's like fishing. If the fish knows you are trying to catch it, it will avoid you. Being not-quite approachable will stir desire in her, or it won't. If you are not her type, too ugly, or TOO NEEDY, there's nothing you can do AND there's nothing you should WANT to do. It's a waste of your time.

In other words, she is not necessary for you to have a fulfilling life. Recognize that and you'll be fine.

reply to post by bigvig316


If you can learn one thing in life learn this.

Attraction is not a choice.

Women especially fall for guys that make them feel a certain way.

If you can't make a woman feel that way about you. Then no amount of gifts, diners, spending time together will make her fall in love with you.

Even if that person that they fall in love with is bad for them.

So what to do?

Become the person that she wants to fall in love with.

Spoon boy: Do not try and bend the spoon. That's impossible. Instead... only try to realize the truth.
Neo: What truth?
Spoon boy: There is no spoon.
Neo: There is no spoon?
Spoon boy: Then you'll see, that it is not the spoon that bends, it is only yourself.

bigvig316
can someone tell me how I can stop ending up in the friends zone with women. every woman I try to hit it off with, I always end up in the same place. Should I stop treating them like equals and start treating them as property. Seem like women always try to go out with scumbags.

Ok this has nothing to do with treating women like property. Attraction is all about perceived availability. You are trying to hit it off because you are available and as a result are broadcasting that on all channels. So the signal the woman is receiving is "I need or want a girlfriend and will do whatever it takes". The signal she needs to be receiving is "It does not matter to me if you are into me or not I have a life with or without you in it". Be relaxed, be yourself and quit asking yourself if this is the "one" and trying to turn her into the "one". Ideally you are single so you should be casually dating at least two women at the same time. That should keep you from focusing too much on just one.

reply to post by boncho


Now your situation is the opposite. You don't really care what these women think so you are broadcasting the "I don't need or want you signal". Not much you can do other than politely point out you are with your girlfriend and that their interest while flattering is not wanted.

reply to post by bigvig316



I don't understand all of these 'strategies' and games really, when you get down to it.
Why the need for them. If you're playing at what you don't really want to play at, you will always be a loser in the 'game' anyway.

No need to 'pretend' you aren't available, no need to put on the air of 'I don't really care if you like me.'

Maybe this is the whole problem with relationships.

If you want someone you just do. No need to play at anything other than that. So we get rejected. If you're really in need of love, you wipe the blood off of your sleeve and try again.

It is the whole world playing games that is the real problem.

reply to post by StarlightNine


It is rather simple what you view as strategies and games is really all hardwired into us. The fact is most boys and girls are born knowing this from the time little Johnny decides that he likes little Sally and randomly puts gum in her hair. You're not gonna change that which evolution has done to us so you might as well just accept what is and make the best of it.

KeliOnyx
reply to post by StarlightNine

 

It is rather simple what you view as strategies and games is really all hardwired into us. The fact is most boys and girls are born knowing this from the time little Johnny decides that he likes little Sally and randomly puts gum in her hair. You're not gonna change that which evolution has done to us so you might as well just accept what is and make the best of it.

No. I don't think I'll be accepting that which I have no need for. Simply because others choose to deal with love and relationships this way, doesn't mean I'm going to suffer the disease.

Regardless of 'hardwiring,' one always has the choice to re-program their hard drive.

They are all simply childish games. When people stop playing games, they will get exactly what they need and desire. Well, most of the time. But the chance is so much greater when not playing masquerade.

reply to post by bigvig316


BIGVIG316

Hey I just wanted to know how all this advice went? Was any of it useful, or are all of us (myself included) complete dumb-assess when it comes to initiating action LOL?

At the very least I hope you got a laugh out of it.

1) A-B-C: always be closing.
It is partly a numbers game. I've posted before about a college friend who decided to lose his virginity in a weekend. He propositioned over SEVENTY women. Like, number 76 took him home for the rest of the weekend.....

2) Watch Craig Ferguson
CF is the master at flirting for the goal. And he misses a lot. But he excels at dialing up his game just to the point where the woman is beginning to be overwhelmed by it, and then he quickly backs off. His trademark phrase: "Was that a bit TOO creepy, what I did just then?" If she doesn't say "Hell Yes, Dammit!" Then he waits fifteen seconds and then touches her elbow or leg. If Flirting is poker, then bet all your money on every hand.

3) Put THEM in the friend zone first!
If a female rejects you, for God's sake DO NOT hang around like a horny hound-dog. IF you do that, she's keeping you in the friend-zone as a back-up for a rainy day. One that never comes. So let her know by your body language that you are NOT hitting on her. Make a point to hit on everyone else around her. Roomates, maids, teachers, and even pets. But treat her like your Aunt Agnes.

4) Use friends as beards.
Ask one of your "friend-zoners" to hang on you in a bookstore or coffee house, so you can flirt with all the women who think you have a girlfriend. I actually had a female friend who did this for me, while her boyfriend was out of the country. It was insane how well that worked. She would touch my arm when she talked, she'd lean on me, etc. Honest to God, when she got up to go to the bathroom, another women handed me a napkin with a phone number on it. A salesgirl once wrote her number on my receipt, just in case I needed to make a return. And yes, sometimes the beard goes crazy from seeing other women hitting on you, and she hits on her yourself. That's how I lost my virginity. But that's another story, for another thread.

5) Don't be desperate.
No one likes it. Not even a hooker. It's pathetic. Always hold something back. Always maintain at least some air of mystery. The familiar is boring. And there is no sin worse than being boring.

6) Resolve to ask 2 girls a week on a date.
And I mean a real date. Not coming over to watch you play a video game. And not sitting silently next to each other in a dark and roaring-loud movie theater. A date is brunch, or a museum tour, or feeding ducks in the park. A chess game, or a bicycling date through the park. or a free concert as your nephew performs in the school play (seriously). And the most expensive of those was... brunch. See, a real date is when you spend time with a woman, talking about the things you both like and believe and are afraid of. And you touch her elbow and hopefully stroke her hair back into place at least once.

7) If she rebuffs you, stay nonchalant.
Don't act like the date is over. DO NOT talk about it. Don't beg. leave it alone. Be a gentleman. But decide at the end of the date whether to make one last-ditch play for it. I have had two "saves." in that situation. One led to immediate sex. The other became my girlfriend of over a year.

8) Only ask a woman on a specific date.
Do not say, "Gee, would you like to, maybe go out with me sometime?" I have said this, and have the woman say back that she would not ever want to go out with me. Not sometime, not ever. Be as specific as possible. If she is a real lady, she won't say "no," she'll regretfully tell you she has plans. Don't ask what they are. Just wait a couple of weeks, and invite her to a different kind of date: the symphony, the opening of an art gallery. Unless she acts excited, or give you details of why she can't (basically, unless she shows genuine regret, and future interest) move on. You are one girl closer to the right one.

I've been married for two decades now, to the best kisser I ever met.

Willie Nelson once said the reason he learned to play the guitar and sing was to attract women.

I took his advice. It works! And when you get rejected; you always have your guitar. And most of the time; that's enough.

Have you ever say no to her and stop paying attention? I am serious if you like her and she only wants to be a friend then ignore her and go on with your life. Does she know your feelings? If she does stop making her the center of your world, stop calling her, if you go to a party with her don't stay with her the whole time, make her get her own drink, don't tell her everything... you don't owe her any explanations what so ever... Then 2 things will happen either she notices you mean more to her or she doesn't care. in either case you will know for sure and can move on. If she doesn't know then ask her on a date, and make sure she understand you want to go out with her on a date. Tell her you want to see where it goes nothing more nothing else. If she says yes good for you if she says no then read this again.

The friend zone does not exist. My successful relationships were with women I was friends with for months or years first. I think most women looking for serious relationships want to be with a man who is their best friend. It just makes sense.

Ok, I don't know if this has been said somewhere else, as I don't have time to go through all your advice on this, but.....

The friend zone happens when a woman can't see herself with you. You either said or did something that has put you there, or she has an issue she's trying to work out and you don't fit what she is needing for that. If it is the former, what you need to do is evaluate what you said/did to make you a friend and not a lover. Did you mention a past girl you might be hung up on? Did you mention how happy you are single? Did you do anything that could be a turn off by the opposite sex?

If that answer to all that is no, then, it's the latter. The solution to that is, accept being friends and move on to another girl. If there is even a twinkle of interest there, she might move you out of that dreaded friend-zone.