POLITICS: School Orders Boy to Cover Tee Shirt

I saw a kid wearing a shirt that said. "JESUS IS A C*U*N*T" Should that shirt be allowed in school too??

[edit on 11-22-2004 by groingrinder]

A few years back the Houston, texas scholols (some of them) got sick and tired of the gang related dress and low pants, etc. now every kid wears the same (ugly) uniform. Call it 1984 revisitism if you want but gang related incidents dropped off to practically nothing.

Schools are not meant to teach individualism- that is a parents job (yeah, after the sex there is a job involved). Public school is meant to teach a kid how to participate meaningfully in society.

Take your brat to private school if you want them to learn civil disobedience and lead them in a protest march so that you (responsible parent that you are) can show them by example how to protest in a meaningful way.

Be sure and take pictures so little Johnny can show his kids what 'daddy' and gamps looked like when they were arrested for protesting 'save the snails.'

I pay the same taxes as you and I have no problem with it.

But then again, I am not brainwashed.

[edit on 22-11-2004 by jmilici]

Originally posted by groingrinder
I saw a kid wearing a shirt that said. "JESUS IS A C*U*N*T" Should that shirt be allowed in school too??

[edit on 11-22-2004 by groingrinder]

Read my post will ya! There is profanity in that shirt so not it should not be allowed. Also thier is supposed to be a separation of church and state in anything funded by the government. Well jesus falls under church and public school falls under state. Again I am for the constitution. That means everything.

The kid and his mom are wrong. Public school is not the place for the minor student to make this political statement, unless it's during a class discussion in civics, and then only until the teacher tells him to drop it. He should focus his energies on getting an education rather than being the squeaky wheel. He made his point. Now it's time for him to learn and toi respect what the law allows. Rather than get her son expelled, his mom should speak to an attorney who specializes in education law. She and son will then learn what are the limits of political speech by a public school student on school grounds. This is not included.

What place does that political statement have in math, history, grammer, geography, chemistry, history, shop, phys ed, or any other class the kid will be attending? It is nothing but a distraction from what he's there to do. There iare many places where he can express his political views. This is not one of them unless the school chooses to allow it.

The fact that many people agree with the content of the boy's T-shirt political statement is totally irrelevant to the issue. The truth of falisty of statement has no bearing whatsoever on whether the boy has a right to do wear the T-shirt. Personally, I would applaud a requirement that public school students wear uniforms when on school grounds. It would go a long way toward creating an atmosphere in which the kids are better able to focus on learning than the many distractions that currently engage their attention.

The way I see it if people on the whole werent so damn anal-retentive and got their panties twisted about over stuff, the shirt wouldnt even be a damn issue. People with some sense about their heads wouldnt pay the shirt any mind, and thus it would cease to be an issue. Instead people take offense and get up in arms about him either being told not to wear it, or the fact he gets away with it. Why can't people just deal with more important tasks, like not getting arrested with drugs, or not driving drunk and killing a family of four on the way home from thanksgiving dinner. No hope left for this planet of half-brained apes that can't see a bigger picture to save their own hides

Originally posted by ludite
Public schools are to educate.

Perfectly true. So lets see some real education rather than the mindless pre-programmed PC crap that kids are taught these days.

Sometimes I wonder if it's all a conspiracy to churn out more and more uneducated kids in order to make them either work minimum wage all their lives or have to join the military to get the education that they should have got at school. Needless to say, these very people will supply cannon fodder for Dubya's neverending war.

Originally posted by groingrinder
I saw a kid wearing a shirt that said. "JESUS IS A C*U*N*T" Should that shirt be allowed in school too??

[edit on 11-22-2004 by groingrinder]

that is clearly profanity, and against the dress code.
his shirt did not fall under any classifications in the dress code.
therfore, he should be allowed to wear it. the excuse that he was wearing it 'just to get attention' is LAME. OF COURSE he was trying to get attention.
and, i personally admire his awareness of the state of the state, and his fighting spirit. you gotta ask yourself, when kids are wearing such a thing as a homemade shirt expressing strong dissent, ....why? i hope this scares the hell out of the criminals in the white house. that one little kid is more damaging to them than a platoon of iraqis with rocket launchers.
of course, it doesn't scare them at all, because 1984 happened in 1948.

original thought is what made america great. freedom to explore ideas.
i can't believe someone on this thread actually called 'freedom' an 'obscure right'. THAT is scary.

Thank's billybob, finally a voice of reason.

dubiousone my pink floyd t-shirt would be disruptive in your opinion correct? You know what, my coworker has a shirt on that says polo with a little horse. That is very disruptive. You don't see me crying about it.

dubiousone "We don't need no thought control"

Originally posted by alternateheaven
The way I see it if people on the whole werent so damn anal-retentive and got their panties twisted about over stuff, the shirt wouldnt even be a damn issue. People with some sense about their heads wouldnt pay the shirt any mind, and thus it would cease to be an issue. Instead people take offense and get up in arms about him either being told not to wear it, or the fact he gets away with it. Why can't people just deal with more important tasks, like not getting arrested with drugs, or not driving drunk and killing a family of four on the way home from thanksgiving dinner. No hope left for this planet of half-brained apes that can't see a bigger picture to save their own hides

We're not talking about people here, we're talking about kids. Kids who disagree with the guy's shirt might get uptight about it and start a fight or an argument or cause other disruptive behaviour. THIS is the bigger picture. The administration is making the student turn his shirt inside-out for the safety of himself and the other kids.

It has nothing to do with BRAINWASHING, left wingers. ALSO, what's up with this kid wearing the same shirt 3 times in two weeks? His parents need to get this kid some new clothes.

I'm all for kids getting involved in politics, BUT, there's a reason that kids can't vote. There are potential dangers involved with kids fighting over politics - for instance, if I was a kid and I saw this shirt being worn by this kid 3 times in two weeks, I would say something like "HEY STINKY LIBERAL, NICE SHIRT, LEFT WING TRAILER TRASH PARENTS TOO BROKE TO AFFORD TO BUY YOU CLOTHES, STINKY?" And it would be on.

Zip

Posted by: jmilici
dubiousone my pink floyd t-shirt would be disruptive in your opinion correct? You know what, my coworker has a shirt on that says polo with a little horse. That is very disruptive.

You don't see me crying about it.
dubiousone "We don't need no thought control"

I totally agree with you. I do not and did not advocate thought control. Is it "thought control" to maintain an atmosphere that's conducive to learning in grade school and high school?

Why do you call it "thought control" to preclude kids in school from making a political statement regardless of which classroom they happen to be in and regardless of what the teacher's prgram is for that day? Is it alright for the yell out in the middle of math class and say "The Real Terrorist is in the White House"? During study hall or other quiet time set aside for kids to do homework, is it alright for this kid to go from student to student and make his political statement? Where do you draw the line? The kid must learn how to pick his battles and his battleground.

Why should this student be allowed conspicuously display his political message on his T-Shirt throughout a class session where it is in the face of the teacher and the other students who may find it distracting?

A large percentage of today's kids are totally distracted from learning and graduate with a C, D, or nearly an F average, or don't graduate at all, and then are left with a very hard life economically. Demanding that kids pay attention to the subject they are in class to study and learn is not "thought control".

Do you think a kid ought to be able to impose his political view on everyone else in the room who couldn't give a rat's ass about what he thinks and who rather focus on learning the subjects they are studying? No-one is telling this kid what thoughts to entertain. He is merely being told that this particular conspicuous message on the front and back of his T-shirt is not allowed on school grounds. That's a lesson in life. You learn what's tolerated and what isn't. You learn how to put your message forth.

Some people feel so strongly about their message that they will violate rules to express it. Maybe that's what this kid is doing. I give him credit for the courage. However, he is mistaken to think that an exception should be made just for him. He has made his point. He learned the school's rules about this. Now he needs to make better choices about how, when, and where to make his statement. He made a choice. Hopefully he learns from it. Part of a sound education is learning to make valid distinctions. Some on this thread seem not lto have learned that lesson yet.

There's a time and place for this kid to make his political statement. There is likely an opportunity to make that statement within the context of the classroom. The manner in which he has chosen to make it is not allowed in his school. He can be crybaby about the restrictions or he can think about it rationally and find ways to get his point across that are not in violation of school rules.

Posted by: jmilici
dubiousone my pink floyd t-shirt would be disruptive in your opinion correct? You know what, my coworker has a shirt on that says polo with a little horse. That is very disruptive. You don't see me crying about it.

P.S. to jmilici:

Maybe you're hypersensitive to that knitted polo pony logo and yet able to stuff your tears or unable to express your emotions appropriately. Therapy might help. Choose your therapist wisely.

You said your coworker has a shirt that says polo with a little horse. Sounds like you're an adult and not subject to the rules and restrictions that apply to minor kids attending public school. I suggest you spend some time and effort in thinking about your failure to draw the distinctions that apply to this subject.

Thought control-

Free speech didn't fly without being shot so now it's thought control.

How about dumbness?

Wearing a shirt with any political statement to a public school could be reason to go home. School is not a forum. It is supposed to be a place of learning basic skills.

Some folks think that just because they pay taxes it then buys them a license to disrupt others. So this (dumb) kid wins then next week wears a swastika short that says �Hitler stopped too soon�

Free speech, thought control!

I just wonder how many free speech advocates have taken part in a real world march? Close to zero I suspect- it's easy to rant behind a terminal and let ones 'virtual self' rant.

On the kid- spank him THEN send him home for being stupid. Sue his folks for wasteful use of public facilities and money. This is not about free speech, it is about what are schools for-

Little Suzy wears a thong to school because she has such a pretty hinney? Right

Originally posted by ludite
Thought control-

Free speech didn't fly without being shot so now it's thought control.

How about dumbness?

Little Suzy wears a thong to school because she has such a pretty hinney? Right

Hello, dumbness? How dumb are you. They are just music lyrics I was using to make a point. I am not even going to bother explaining myself you will just never get it.
I
t still is about free speech regardless about what you say. You didn't shoot it down, no one has. It still is free speech. Just like when I was in school and I wore my shirts condemning the first gulf war. I never got in trouble, or even asked to take it off. Why you ask? A little thing called FREEDOM OF SPEECH. Ever heard of it? Oh yeah, had a few debates with people but never got in a fight. My history class actually spent a class going over the implications of the war and peace protestors and the such. It turned into one of the best classes of the year.

And my point still hasn't come across either. Once again I will restate my question.

dubiousone my pink floyd t-shirt would be disruptive in your opinion correct?

To add to that How about "give peace a chance" shirt or a simpson shirt or garfield or whatever other shirt with a logo on it. People like to read those kind of shirts. They might even laugh at them. Does that mean they should be banned from school becouse they are disruptive? H$ll NO.

To have freedom of speech means that you can't get arrested for criticizing the government. This kid has freedom of speech. Maybe this will clear up some of your apparent confusion.

Zip

We slip sideways from �the president is an idiot� to �Garfield� wow, same statements.

Anyone that wears a Garfield shirt is just saying �hey, look at me I'm stupid�

They still shouldn't be allowed to make statements that are disruptive in school. What is school for?

You wore 1st Gulf War shirts- your Principle was wrong- you should have been sent home and your parents REQUIRED to come in for a conference.

OFF the school grounds- hey, what ever you want is fine by me. I don't even care if you burn crosses and drag around dead cats. That is not the ISSUE- the issue is not free speech. The issue is school. School~

Originally posted by jmilici
I am not even going to bother explaining myself you will just never get it.

Remember, Ludite, because we disagree with jmilici, we are dumb bags of meatflesh that can't understand anything that people tell us.

Zip

EDIT: I'd like to add that I have never seen an anti-first-Iraq-war shirt in my life and I seriously doubt their existance. I think you're lying. Whether or not you favoured Iraq's invasion of Kuwait is a completely different topic of discussion, but for now I'm calling you out as being a liar about this t-shirt subject, jmilici. I could be wrong, though.

Zip

[edit on 22-11-2004 by Zipdot]

Originally posted by ludite
We slip sideways from �the president is an idiot� to �Garfield� wow, same statements.

Anyone that wears a Garfield shirt is just saying �hey, look at me I'm stupid�

They still shouldn't be allowed to make statements that are disruptive in school. What is school for?

You wore 1st Gulf War shirts- your Principle was wrong- you should have been sent home and your parents REQUIRED to come in for a conference.

OFF the school grounds- hey, what ever you want is fine by me. I don't even care if you burn crosses and drag around dead cats. That is not the ISSUE- the issue is not free speech. The issue is school. School~

Never once did I say �the president is an idiot� please point out to me where I said that. Stop putting words in my mouth.

So you think a person is stupid for wearing a garfield shirt. Wow man you really are ignorant. Thanks for calling me stupid. I actually hold a 3.9 GPA, work as an electrical engineer, grew up on the streets of new york and I'm stupid just because I have a garfield t-shirt? But this is america and I can respect your opinion.

It's only disruptive when the teachers make a big deal out of it as well as the principal.

No, my principal was not wrong and my parents did not have to go in for a conferance. My parents did not agree with my opinion but they tought me to stand up for what I believe in. They did not teach me to be a mindless conformist like you. They tought me to question. They tought me that there is no greater freedom than to question.

As far as your burning crosses and dragging around dead cats not beign the issue then don't make it one. Again I never once said anythjing like that. As a matter of fact I have 5 cats. No I do not believe in religion but I respect people that do. I would never burn a cross either.

But unlike you and like I stated before, this is america and I can respect your opinion.

Originally posted by Zipdot

Originally posted by jmilici
I am not even going to bother explaining myself you will just never get it.

Remember, Ludite, because we disagree with jmilici, we are dumb bags of meatflesh that can't understand anything that people tell us.

Zip

EDIT: I'd like to add that I have never seen an anti-first-Iraq-war shirt in my life and I seriously doubt their existance. I think you're lying. Whether or not you favoured Iraq's invasion of Kuwait is a completely different topic of discussion, but for now I'm calling you out as being a liar about this t-shirt subject, jmilici. I could be wrong, though.

Zip

[edit on 22-11-2004 by Zipdot]

That's fine but there is no way I can prove it to you so I guess you will never know. I will say this though, just because you never seen one doesn't mean that it never existed.

And you do relise how easy it is to make a t-shirt right? You do not need to be a t-shirt manufacturer to make one. Walk into any flea market or mall in the USA and I can gaurentee atleas 5 people can make t-shirts with logo's on them.

Remember, Ludite, because we disagree with jmilici, we are dumb bags of meatflesh that can't understand anything that people tell us.

I like your play on words. Make me look like I am insulting you so I must be wrong. This thread is getting out of hand and I will be the mature one here and say you are right. I concede to you. I will no longer be involved in this thread.