Tesla's device, the size of a blender, puts out more electricity than the Four Corner Power Complex

masterp
Searching the web for legitimate resources on 'electro radiant event' and 'cold electricity' yields nothing. All I get is free energy sites.

Electricity come 3 main forms, including:-

"Pushing" electricity, used in motors, fans, compressors etc.
"Hot" electricity, used in ovens, heaters, boilers etc.
"cold" electricity, used in fridges, freezes and air conditioners etc.

The "smarts" for electricity is in smoke, as when you see smoke coming from a electric device you know it will no longer work!

XL5
Bedlam, how could MHD be used as a booster? You would need to power it with some sort of battery that has less power to weight then jet fuel, so you would come out at a loss.

There is a particularly interesting design configuration for jet engines *coffhintcoff* that allows the use of somewhat more conventionally designed jet engine components in a hypersonic airframe.

You see a bit of research done on it here and there in the open lit. In the un-open lit, there's a lot more research done on it. It's popular at the moment. Further, deponent sayeth not. I wasn't aware anyone much was onto it until someone from ATS dropped a question on U2U.

However, speaking strictly about the open literature, one can find interesting tidbits. I like the paper by Theresa Benyo at NASA Glenn. Basically, you contrive to slow the incoming airflow with inlet design and a nice MHD generator up front. You end up with a gob of electrical power and significantly slower moving high volume air, you run that through an engine of whatever sort you'd like that's maybe happier that way - she uses an Allison J-102 but you could use something else - then you take the power you got up front and some more from an alternator on the turbine and use it to run an MHD accelerator out the back, jacking the exhaust up to truly hellacious velocities.

It's a way that one could, if one wanted, manage to move hypersonic airframes around with a turbine or something that might not be really keen on hypersonic air intake. Maybe.

reply to post by hellobruce


Well, there's also positive and negative electricity.

CSB: Way back in undergrad EE, we had this logic lab where you had to breadboard asynchronous state machines. You couldn't leave until everyone was done. Everyone had finished but this one guy who wasn't getting anywhere, and we were tired of waiting, so we contrived to get the grad student teaching the lab out the door for a minute and the rest of us jumped on the guy's bench and finished it for him. We used the jumper wire that was left over from the other benches since we didn't have time to make it pretty, too, so it was a hodge-podge of whatever color wire there was about the right length.

The grad student came back in, and we thought we were going to get out but this guy started pulling the wires off his setup.

"What the hell are you doing? It's done"

He looked at us suspiciously and said (I kid you not) "Positive electricity only runs in red wires, negative electricity only runs in black wires"

Bedlam, in that case couldn't the turbine be completely removed if you used compressed air to start it?

I personally do think there is some huge store of energy out there that can be tapped, how, not sure. I'd just be happy if a MHD or another simple device could be made to run on propane/gas and get even 30%eff. and have great power density as well.

XL5
Bedlam, in that case couldn't the turbine be completely removed if you used compressed air to start it?

I personally do think there is some huge store of energy out there that can be tapped, how, not sure. I'd just be happy if a MHD or another simple device could be made to run on propane/gas and get even 30%eff. and have great power density as well.

Nah, then you'd have a perpetual motion machine. The jet in the middle provides energy input, you're just using the fore and aft MHD units as a sort of super nozzle, slowing the intake and accelerating the exhaust, only with MHD you can get some unintuitive effects.

No what I mean is, it is still powered by fuel but the output MHD pulls the heated air out the back and the intake MHD powers the output MHD. Air would be used to start it.


Edit: I tend to spew out thoughts/ideas in point form but without the "points", the "drawing energy from an unknown source" part was one of those points.

XL5
No what I mean is, it is still powered by fuel but the output MHD pulls the heated air out the back and the intake MHD powers the output MHD. Air would be used to start it.


Edit: I tend to spew out thoughts/ideas in point form but without the "points", the "drawing energy from an unknown source" part was one of those points.

edit on 5-2-2014 by XL5 because: clarity

Maybe you could make a sort of jet engine out of it? Ha. Hadn't thought about that. Ok...you got me wondering now, have to poke around and see if I can find any hint someone did this.

chr0naut
Why do people think that they can draw some random grouping of electromechanical/electromagnetic components and achieve over unity energy supply?

One of two options:

1. They don't think they can achieve anything, they are just hucksters trying to trick people. And it works, because (and ATS proves it) very few people know anything about how this stuff actually works so it's easy to trick them. If someone knows jack chit about cars it's easy to tell them their muffler bearings and headlight fluid need replacing, and that it's going to be an expensive job because it requires a unicorn drill.

2. They are deluded (after being exposed to so many folks from the first group) into thinking that they are knowledgeable and able to design such devices. They think looking at random old tesla sketches has educated them to the point of being able to create miracles. They have a list of tech sounding names which they pull from to construct their devices.

People in general are just astoundingly ignorant when it comes to anything technical, it's really sad. Do they know anything about current, voltage, magnetic fields, how all those things interact with each other? Not a clue. They make claims that are easily proven false with a few bucks of scrap electrical equipment.

It's just so funny, you get people posting other people's ideas for free energy devices. They declare that these devices work as advertised, and if you disagree they get angry with you. You ask if they have ever built it, they say no, but they are sure it works. They saw a video, or their friend was at a dude's house once where it worked. Something like that.

You ask them extremely basic questions about how a certain portion of the device is supposed to work, and they either ignore you, are honest and admit they have no idea how it works (then how can they declare it does work?) or they try to explain it with faux-tech-babble. Which, to those who actually know what they are talking about, sounds completely ridiculous.

But unfortunately, there are so many ignorant people out there, and to them they can't tell it's BS. It's like someone who speaks german listening to someone speaking fake German. It means nothing, and those in the know, know. And it looks foolish. But to the ignorant it looks cool, and the ignorant buy it, and bask in it, and wholly accept it soaking it in to their deepest parts of their mind responsible for acceptance.

Then they regurgitate the BS and the ignorance, and once again fool fellow ignorant people, and the ignorance and stupidity grows and grows, and grows and grows. Spreading it's rot far and wide.

If you can't beat them, join them. $10,000 or so coming in from BS free energy devices. Previously I tried to bring the truth to these people but they attacked me and said I didn't know. Now I sell them the very devices I used to attempt to prove as fake, and laugh with their money in my hand.

That's the ultimate- you design fake device, you know it's fake. Person buys device, you tell them (obviously not appearing connected to seller) how it's a fake device, and they defend it! It's such a funny feeling. they make claims, holding a device in their hands i built, yet they still refuse to accept the truth. It's that ultimate sad and funny statement about the human condition.

can't beat them join them, make money off them, and then laugh when they find the maker of the product they defend, is the very person attacking the idea of these ridiculious devices lol. not this one obviously, not been featured yet on ATS, but the smaller boards are suckers for free energy devices, and they are so cult like they will defend defend even when you know it doesn't work because you built it lol how sad.

Funny funny

reply to post by James1982


Every point there you have hit squarely on the head!

All these free-energy proponents have to do is wheel one out; let's have a look at it and take some proper measurements.

Sorry, all this BS about about inventors being bumped off or at least frightened into silence has got to be nonsense. Imagine headstrong, maverick students discovering this stuff. It would be out on the web and on multiple forums and websites within minutes. They wouldn't give a toss about the effect such a discovery would have on society (one of the reasons 'They' keep this technology secret - apparently). These students would revel in being the ones who released this knowledge to the world.

Such research is not discouraged. Look at all the cold fusion experiments that followed the 'discovery' by Fleischmann and Pons in 1989. University labs all over the world tried to reproduce the effect, no one tried to prevent them. Maybe it gave the oil/gas/coal oligarchs a few sleepless nights, but the cat was out of the bag. Unfortunately on this occasion the cat was dead, but it may not be in future.

What is interesting is how and why so many people (mostly with little if any knowledge of any science) keep believing this stuff, churning out websites and plans, etc. without a single working model. I think psychologists could learn a great deal by studying the free-energy brigade!

reply to post by rubberchicken


All of these points (perfectly valid and points that I have brought up on many many occasions) can be summarized as the 'alternative' stance of ignoring established documented theories that have piles and piles of supporting data... because... well just because.

The sky is red people... dont you see it? all those people saying the sky is blue... its because of the government man!

rubberchicken
reply to post by James1982

 

Every point there you have hit squarely on the head!

All these free-energy proponents have to do is wheel one out; let's have a look at it and take some proper measurements.

Sorry, all this BS about about inventors being bumped off or at least frightened into silence has got to be nonsense. Imagine headstrong, maverick students discovering this stuff. It would be out on the web and on multiple forums and websites within minutes. They wouldn't give a toss about the effect such a discovery would have on society (one of the reasons 'They' keep this technology secret - apparently). These students would revel in being the ones who released this knowledge to the world.

Such research is not discouraged. Look at all the cold fusion experiments that followed the 'discovery' by Fleischmann and Pons in 1989. University labs all over the world tried to reproduce the effect, no one tried to prevent them. Maybe it gave the oil/gas/coal oligarchs a few sleepless nights, but the cat was out of the bag. Unfortunately on this occasion the cat was dead, but it may not be in future.

What is interesting is how and why so many people (mostly with little if any knowledge of any science) keep believing this stuff, churning out websites and plans, etc. without a single working model. I think psychologists could learn a great deal by studying the free-energy brigade!

Yeah I don't buy it either, it would be impossible to keep under wraps. Flood every corner of the web with it, it won't go away. It will be downloaded on millions of computers all across the planet. There is no way any government could control it.

The only way they could control such technology is if it's incredibly complex, and requires absolutely monumental investment, the type that only a few countries could even manage to afford. That type of tech is self protecting, because nobody is going to accidentally come across it in their garage. I could believe that the government is possibly in search of, in development of, or possibly even in possession of some type of device that would seem somewhat magical and free-energy like that requires the type of investment I was talking about. Although even that would be really really hard to believe, because with a project that massive keeping it a secret in non-WWII like atmosphere isn't going to happen.

Then we are left with the relatively easy, small scale, made from junkyard parts type free energy devices. These are the ones impossible for the government to suppress, if they actually existed. Anyone could build them, it would be impossible for the information to be destroyed. It's so silly how these people always claim the working plans are right here or there for these types of devices, freely available on the internet. Well wait, doesn't that contradict their previous claim? They say the government suppresses the tech, then they say it's freely available on the web? This is why I don't feel bad providing energy machines to these people.

These are my bread and butter, I feel a bit ashamed, but justified at the same time. I've been too worried mentioning it here on ATS because there is a pretty large presence of the free energy crowd here, and I was afraid of what I'm saying getting out where I don't want it. But I don't see how anyone would make the connection, more so I know none of those people would WANT to make the connection if you know what I mean.

Like I said I feel ashamed but justified. Not technically ripping anybody off, the devices do exactly what I claim they do. The buyers are just too stupid to understand what that claim even means. It's difficult for them to even figure out if it was "working" how they thought it was supposed to anyway. Placebo effect makes it easy for them to convince themselves it work, and they WANT it to work. So I don't feel ashamed. Because these people flat out refuse to use logic, to accept any corrections, to look in more useful directions and locations.

If someone keeps eating poop, and you keep telling them it's poop, they shouldn't eat it, but over and over they keep shoving in their mouth and gulping it down, telling you it's not poop, but it's wonderful king crab. No it's poop you say. Delicious crab they respond. Eventually you just start selling them your crap and calling it crab, because they don't WANT to know the difference. That's THEIR fault. I don't feel bad about doing it, just about admitting it

rubberchicken

What is interesting is how and why so many people (mostly with little if any knowledge of any science) keep believing this stuff, churning out websites and plans, etc. without a single working model. I think psychologists could learn a great deal by studying the free-energy brigade!

2 words: crank magnetism.

Crank magnetism is a term popularized by physiologist and blogger Mark Hoofnagle to describe the propensity of cranks to hold multiple irrational, unsupported or ludicrous beliefs that are often unrelated to one another.[7] Crank magnetism may be considered to operate wherever a single person propounds a number of unrelated denialist conjectures, poorly supported conspiracy theories, or pseudoscientific claims. Thus, some of the common crank characteristics (see above)— such as the lack of technical ability, ignorance of scientific terminology, and claims that alternative ideas are being suppressed by the mainstream— may be operating on and manifested in multiple orthogonal assertions. For example, Hoofnagle's fellow blogger Orac has discussed crank magnetism in relation to the writings of British columnist Melanie Phillips, who denies anthropogenic global warming and who has promoted Intelligent Design and the discredited view that the MMR vaccine causes autism in children.[8] Blogger Luke Scientiæ has commented on the relationship between the number of unrelated claims that magnetic cranks make and the extent of their open hostility to science.[9] He has also coined the phrase "magnetic hoax" in relation to hoax claims that attract multiple crank interpretations.[10]

reply to post by FreedomCommander


12000000 volt waves, thats alot of volt waves!

ill bet you could oscillate alot of air with that kinda whatever-thats-a-measurement-of

James1982
If someone keeps eating poop, and you keep telling them it's poop, they shouldn't eat it, but over and over they keep shoving in their mouth and gulping it down, telling you it's not poop, but it's wonderful king crab. No it's poop you say. Delicious crab they respond. Eventually you just start selling them your crap and calling it crab, because they don't WANT to know the difference. That's THEIR fault. I don't feel bad about doing it, just about admitting it

Yeah, I'm working on a gadget to fill you with free electrons, because health or something. There's a big crowd that thinks if you walk around barefoot on dirt that electrons from Gaia will fill your body and fix some putative lack of electrons in your body.

Ok, fine. I can sell you a bracelet that strips electrons off of air and transfers them to YOU! No grounding needed. It won't do anything more for you than "grounding" did, but if you think that works, here it is, cross my palm with some silver.

The trick is to get the cost down. I guess I could make a "magic" bracelet with a claim that it transfers electrons to you but is pure hokum, but you ought to at least get your negative charge for that $49.99, I say.