Homeland Security Secretary: Illegals Have ‘Earned Right to be Citizens

Night Star
reply to post by Leonidas

 

Plus you still havent addressed the reality of why they are here, people and companies hire them by the millions. As long as there are jobs and people willing to hire them, they will come. Not all Americans believe as you do that they are a problem.

Exactly! They are hired because companies can pay them peanuts and treat them like crap. Like I said, if you take away the jobs and freebies, they will have no desire to be here. We need to enforce existing laws and companies won't be allowed to hire them.

How are you going to take away the jobs? It is illegal to hire illegals now, and it still happens in huge numbers.

reply to post by Leonidas


No, I would not be satisfied. You don't change your laws in order to make people innocent. Laws are in place for a reason. Good reason at that.

If a murderer committed murder, and was in prison for murder... would you be satisfied if murder was made legal in order to set them all free?

Same premise.

OpinionatedB
reply to post by Leonidas

 

No, I would not be satisfied. You don't change your laws in order to make people innocent. Laws are in place for a reason. Good reason at that.

It has happened throughout American history.

The repeal of Prohibition made millions of law-breakers innocent overnight.

Countless changes to immigration law going back as far as 1790's up to present times have made people previously considered criminals under the law into law-abiding citizens.

But the real point I was making was your objection to their presence was based on law, when it clearly isnt.

reply to post by Leonidas


By our laws being 'enforced'. Right now, only some companies are caught and made to pay fines. We need for all companies to be responsible for their actions. We need for all companies to hire citizens.

Night Star
reply to post by Leonidas

 

By our laws being 'enforced'. Right now, only some companies are caught and made to pay fines. We need for all companies to be responsible for their actions. We need for all companies to hire citizens.

That would work if there was the political will do so. There isnt.

Regardless of current laws and peoples feelings about whether these people should be here or not, they are here and removing them humanely is pretty much impossible so a more creative solution has to be found.

reply to post by Leonidas


You have yet to demonstrate how removing people humanely is an impossibility.

I would expect for you to say such things you would have some sort of proof.. as in.. which countries have refused to take back their own people, and where are the case reports of these instances?

I have never heard such things and as such I would like to see proof of these allegations.

OpinionatedB
reply to post by Leonidas

 

You have yet to demonstrate how removing people humanely is an impossibility.

I would expect for you to say such things you would have some sort of proof.. as in.. which countries have refused to take back their own people, and where are the case reports of these instances?

I have never heard such things and as such I would like to see proof of these allegations.

edit on 1-2-2014 by OpinionatedB because: (no reason given)

How do you prove where someone is from if they have no form of I.D. and wont disclose where they are from? What do you do with that person? There are millions. They aren't all Mexicans, as I am sure you are aware.

Do you guess where they are from based on how they look or their accent?

reply to post by Leonidas


Generally starts with what language they speak.

As I said, where is the proof that Mexico or any other country is refusing to take back people who crossed the border illegally.

Its not a game of what if's here. Lets work on fact alone.

OpinionatedB
reply to post by Leonidas

 

Generally starts with what language they speak.

As I said, where is the proof that Mexico or any other country is refusing to take back people who crossed the border illegally.

Its not a game of what if's here. Lets work on fact alone.

The facts are you cannot deport someone to a country they are not a citizen of. It happens every single day. It is not a hypothetical problem, it is a real, practical everyday problem.

Wait, so you are saying that if they speak Spanish they must be Mexican? You aren't are you?

Had our laws have been enforced many years ago, we woudn't be in this predicament today. How many amnesties have we had? After the last one we were promised a secure borders and NO MORE AMNESTY. THEY LIED! With each amnesty comes millions more illegals. This has gotten so out of hand it is ridiculous.

Millions of our citizens are jobless, suffering, falling through the cracks...we have homeless and hungry and things are not improving. Something has to be done and soon. Amnesty has had a negative impact for the citizens of America. It hasn't worked in the past, only made things worse.

reply to post by Leonidas

The facts are you cannot deport someone to a country they are not a citizen of. It happens every single day. It is not a hypothetical problem, it is a real, practical everyday problem

Deport the ones we are sure of first. Secure the border and enforce our laws and those still here will not be able to work or recieve freebies. Believe me, they will go home by themselves because they will not have a choice.

reply to post by Leonidas


So basically, you have no proof of anything you say.

Thanks but no thanks, I will take fact over someone's opinion, and yours apparently has nothing to back it up by way of factual data.

Spanish and any other language has dialectical nuances, a native speaker is able to pinpoint the area in which someone is from based on dialect and accent and speech patterns as a general rule.

Night Star
Had our laws have been enforced many years ago, we woudn't be in this predicament today. How many amnesties have we had? After the last one we were promised a secure borders and NO MORE AMNESTY. THEY LIED! With each amnesty comes millions more illegals. This has gotten so out of hand it is ridiculous.

Millions of our citizens are jobless, suffering, falling through the cracks...we have homeless and hungry and things are not improving. Something has to be done and soon. Amnesty has had a negative impact for the citizens of America. It hasn't worked in the past, only made things worse.

But they werent, so you have to deal with the situation as it is today.

OpinionatedB
reply to post by Leonidas

 

So basically, you have no proof of anything you say.

Thanks but no thanks, I will take fact over someone's opinion, and yours apparently has nothing to back it up by way of factual data.

Spanish and any other language has dialectical nuances, a native speaker is able to pinpoint the area in which someone is from based on dialect and accent and speech patterns as a general rule.

edit on 1-2-2014 by OpinionatedB because: (no reason given)

I gave you proof, you just refuse to accept it because it doesnt fit your narrative. You cant send someone from Guatemala to Mexico because they "sound" Mexican to you.

You cannot deport a person to a country they are not a citizen of..

What do you plan to do with all those people in question while you sort it out? Will they be free to roam about the country until you figure out their dialect and then - on that basis alone - get a country to accept that person as a citizen?

You suggestion is ludacris on the face of it.

Night Star
reply to post by Leonidas

 

By our laws being 'enforced'. Right now, only some companies are caught and made to pay fines. We need for all companies to be responsible for their actions. We need for all companies to hire citizens.

Can I infer from your statement that - as a citizen - you will gladly carry around you "Papers" to be presented to any official who asks or at every checkpoint along the road?

As a good citizen, you would helping the greater good by accepting these simple measures to ensure a citizen only country.

reply to post by Leonidas


We already carry Identification and use it frequently. If you are stopped by a cop in a vehical, you have to show papers for that. We use our licenses all the time for proof of identification. The trouble with illegals is that they steal ID's and use fraudulant paperwork.

Night Star
reply to post by Leonidas

 

We already carry Identification and use it frequently. If you are stopped by a cop in a vehical, you have to show papers for that. We use our licenses all the time for proof of identification. The trouble with illegals is that they steal ID's and use fraudulant paperwork.

The point being, regardless of the law, there is no means to remove 11-33 million people from the country. We do not want the military rolling through our streets rounding up men women and children to be held until their immigration status is determined.

A new solution that takes this unbending reality into consideration is required.

reply to post by Leonidas


If you moved to another Country illegally and all of a sudden were told that you would lose your job and couldn't get any benefits, would you stay? Some of our illegals have already self deported. Give them enough of a warning to save up and they will leave. Our money is worth a hell of a lot more in their home countries.

reply to post by Leonidas

“There is no quality here, only quantity,” said Kenneth Palinkas, president of the National Citizenship and Immigration Services Council. “USCIS is not equipped to handle this workload, and due to political interference in its mission, is not empowered to deny admission to all those who should be denied due to ineligibility. We have become a visa clearinghouse for the world, rather than the first line of defense for a secure immigration system.”

You may feel we can't deport the illegals and the president of National Citizenship and Immigration Services Council feels we cannot handle the workload of processing all those illegals to become legal. It would be a disaster and those who normally wouldnt qualify would get through. Not only that, it would encourage millions more to come as it always has in the past. To most Americans this is unacceptable.

Using cnsnews as a source of legitimate info is a mistake. The speaker did not say that the people in America illegally have "earned the right to be citizens ".

He said that those in the country (many of whom since birth) who wish to become citizens and have earned it through civic participation, raising families here, etc deserve a method to be able to try to gain their citizenship.