Conservative Ideas cannot sustain a Poor majority.

amfirst1
reply to post by Xeven

 

The poor has every opportunity to become the 1%. They are given free education and financial aide to be doctors, lawyers, etc.

If they choose to flip burgers or do nothing. Then they have no right to want to get paid a 6 figure job. Obviously, they did it to themselves, so they should embrace the suck like Peilosi said.

Oh please?!?!? It's hardly that cut and dry and you know it. There are of course opportunities and help sometimes but you make it sound like everyone has access to those in the same ways and to the same degree and that's not true. Also, Free Education is hardly a good example for you to use in support of your argument. The public education system is pretty sad nowadays.

I agree that if someone chooses a low end job they shouldn't expect to live high on the hog off of it. Those jobs are typically for those starting out or second jobs or chosen simply so one doesn't have to apply themselves more than absolutely needed. However to say that is always the case is naive.

I've known plenty of people of various skill sets and within various lines of work who have failed to achieve the 1% status without them choosing it. Sometimes it happens for reasons that are totally unavoidable too. As they say Sh!t Happens! Also, I've seen it happen because of someone or some group actively trying to keep others from success. I'm not saying it's like that every time, but it happens. For those and other reasons I find it not only incorrect but also rude and dismissive for you to simply blame others being less than successful, economically speaking that is. They don't all "do it to themselves".

As for Pellosi, I've got something for her to embrace and suck right here!!

reply to post by mOjOm


U know to get into the 1% u just have to make 6 figures. U guys act like everyone in the 1% are billionaires.

It's not impossible to do if u r dedicated.

Who says conservatives don't love the poor

they love them so much they created millions more.

reply to post by Xeven


This is trending a LOT right now. I've been not paying attention to politics for awhile, but I used to watch it very closely, and some big changes are coming. The old narratives are getting ripped to shreds. What's falling away is the business vs. government narrative. What we've got is a situation of really big businesses who have in many ways become the government, through influence. They shape policy to their interest through lobbyists, and use this to their advantage (and thus have no interest in "small government".) This goes from parts of the left, to parts of the right.

Then what you have is a whole bunch of businesses who are realizing they aren't on the same team as these govt. entangled businesses, and are getting screwed - not just through that cronyism, but also from the wealth inequality. They are looking at customers with less and less money, unless they're selling Rolexes. You also have a sizeable part of the left, who advocate for things like social programs, but look at things like the prison industrial complex - funded by government - as well as all the war, etc, and want no part of it. Some people call this the libertarian left.

What's for sure is there are NO solution to this through the old right vs. left mindset: For instance, should those businesses left in the cold push for a raise in taxes, and a form of wealth re-distribution KNOWING that the money is going to go to the cronies? Or should they fight for much smaller (Ron Paul style) government and hope the market can sort it out (when the conies aren't officially government, they are companies and mostly work behind the scenes). People on the left face the same issues: Should they attempt to get more money for government for aid knowing its doled out to cronies, or should they seek to bring down the corrupt mess, and in so doing, shrink government, potentially handing more power to corporations? There are plenty on the left, I can tell you, who feel way better about leaving local business owners with some money alone, than the idea of taxing them for another war or prison expansion. And I don't need to tell you there's people on the right who feel the same way, even though they wouldn't mind paying taxes for really effective and worthwhile aid to people who really need it.

So the old scene is falling apart. The question is, what next?

reply to post by tridentblue


How many of you work with the completely lost poor black teenagers and young males - who were raised by either their "grandma" or through the "foster kid" program?

The first 2 things you need to get rid of is the CIA and their illegal drugs (no birth parent around due to drug abuse and subsequent incarceration, or death) and then the legal "big pharma" drug pushers that made these kids get hooked on prescription drugs at an early age because the "welfare parent" at the time got more money if they acted up in kindergarten.

These people have no chance at anything - they are dumbed down, drugged up, and a victim in the streets they live in - They want to be "crazy"/mentally ill, because they know they will be feed and not preyed upon when they aren't "locked up".

The next thing that needs to be looked at is the non-moral world they have been forced to live in - where everyone is a victime - there is no christian values that you can find anywhere in their world - except for the "grandma" that tried.

Look at the dumbed down school system - thanks to our liberal, democratic "leaders" -

Why not school choice? Why not vouchers to have a struggling - almost always single mom - or grandma - to have their kid learn some real education and some values through a charter school or religious school - instead of being bully-ed by their gang-member, illegal-drug selling peers in the "public schools"

Why not have kids where uniforms - to keep the "social" one-up-man-ship/materialistic culture from keeping kids learning how to read?

How about seperating girls and boy s through those so important pubescent grades - making learning more important than "catching his or her eye" and learning to put condoms on bananas?

I'm really ranting now.....

reply to post by Happy1


Honestly, sounds like your in the status quo conservative column. Talking about the lack of Christian values and so forth. But I have to ask you: what big force comes to put these values in place? To make the kids put on uniforms? Only government. What force has the power to make sure people are praying? to make sure gay people aren't having sex? Or people smoking weed? Only surveillance and big government. You can have conservative values all you want, but when it comes to translating that into policy, its a disaster, because you have to enact big government to get them, while promising small government to donors.

What the status quo "conservative" values led to was the presidency of GWB. What did he do? Expanded surveillance, with more private sector involvement (cronyism + big government), started a war using more mercenaries than ever before (cronyism + big government), Dick Cheney made sure only his company, KB&R got the no bid contracts for serviging the troops (Cronyism + big government)
www.mirror.co.uk...
Was that because they were liberal? Nope. Its because these so called "conservative" values called for these wars, Just like they call for being tough on criminals who really don't need it, which means putting people in a privately owned prison room and feeding them at a cost of $30,000 a year to taxpayers, (cronyism + big government) even though the US has one of the biggest populations on earth. It means fighting an endless, losing drug war (big government) to keep hippies from their weed. It means spend, spend, spend, while pretending to care about small government.

People have gotten wise to it. Whether you find homosexuality gross or not, people are no longer willing to spend one red cent on keeping people from being gay, smoking weed, or doing other things in their own homes that don't hurt people. People are not interested in more wars, or unneccessary incarcerations or any of that, especially throwing government deeper into debt to achieve it. That means that these old structures are falling apart. I don't care about other people's values because its too damn expensive to change them. That includes all these traditional conservative social values as well. I don't condemn these personal values, but they don't translate into effective policy.

And I'm not trying to rag on you for being a conservative, if you are. All these same contradictions are ripping up the left right now too. The left believes in the power of government to get things done, wants the people, not rich corporations to decide our destiny, but in funding the government, we fund these corporations, who basically exert huge control over the government. So its a mess, and I'm saying that as someone who has voted with the left on many issues. The disillusionment is bipartisan.

BTW you're post started with a question to "any of you". I assume you're talking to people on this thread. I'm an individual, not affiliated with any group.

Absolutely! Just look at the incredible job that liberals have done with our inner cities all across America over the last 50 years. There's no violence, no poverty, nothing like that in places like Detroit, Washington DC and Chicago, just to name three liberal success stories. And apparently, the citizens love it, because they keep voting for more! I guess that, as the saying goes, people really do get the government they deserve.

Liberalism, at least in the US, survives primarily by exploiting the poor and uneducated with all sorts of grand promises that just never seem to come true because of some convenient excuse. It amazes me that people still buy their bull****, but they do. Here's a hint, folks: they're simply using you to remain in power, and they only throw you the scraps from their table like you would throw scraps to your dog.

reply to post by Happy1

Look at the dumbed down school system - thanks to our liberal, democratic "leaders"

Man are you wrong. It was the Republicans that doubled the size of the dept of education and then cut the funding to it. Also there should be no vouchers for private or religious schools. A parent chooses to send their kid to a private school instead of public school but they shouldn't have to pay school tax for the county they live in something they are forced to do and imo isn't right. And the government can't back anything religious so it's obvious why the religious schools shouldn't get vouchers.

reply to post by Xeven


Ideas like individuality, self-reliance, personal responsibility are pretty much self-explanatory.

reply to post by Xeven


Once we address our issues from a culture perspective rather then political perspective then well start seeing changes in policy.

Right now everyone is so too selfish too egotistical and too afraid for any change to happen. Once we can fundamentally address that then policy and economic changes will be a byproduct.

reply to post by beezzer


How can we have self reliance in a system of forced debt? The average american right now cant even afford to go to legalzoom and start an LLC let alone apply for business liscenes and insurance. Not even mentioning everything else that probably goes along with it.

reply to post by onequestion


What's your solution?

Mine is simple. If we can return to a culture of self-reliance, the government won't become so necessary.

People need to become responsible for their own futures.

reply to post by beezzer


Its a paradox. Scale back regulation and enable a free market.

Create the conditions for self reliance.

reply to post by Xeven


While I totally agree with you in principle, I think you may be underestimating the level to which they will go in order to sustain their authority and ideology.

Even though it's true that living in poverty is a direct contributor to unhealthy lifestyles and shorter life expectancies. Not to worry, they have a plan for that.

You see, not only are they defunding public education and social welfare programs, (to insure that you and your offspring stay dumb & poor) they're making sure that your employer has the right to deny you insurance coverage that may include contraception to insure that the supply of new poor, dumb slaves goes un-interrupted.

www.breitbart.com...

Stop blaming Republicans for cutting funding.
The US spends plenty on schools. The schools just don't do a good job teaching the kids. I don't blame the school necessarily, it's the culture the schools have to teach in. When I was a kid if I failed I got my butt kicked. Now if your kids fails it's the teachers and schools fault. People need to take responsibility for their kids.

reply to post by vor78


Exactly. The smaller the government the more prosperity. The larger the government like liberals believe in the less prosperity. Most regulations are created to selectively enforce on the small businesses not big business because the regulators are occupied by top business executives.

This is the problem because not many jobs are being created because it's too difficult for new business to jump over the government red tapes. The big business don't want them in the competition so they use their regulators to hold them down.

Is it the mandate of conservative ideas to sustain a poor majority ?
What conservative ideas would prevent a person from making money, and thus not be poor ?

I am broke, but not poor. I feel the need to conserve, what does that make me ?
When I am flush, I tend to be liberal with my spending, often resulting in my brokeness.
Perhaps if poor people were conservative, they would not be poor.
'conservative' and 'liberal' are words, before they are political ideologies.
I think many people express both of these leanings.

"In general, the art of government consists in taking as much money as possible from one party of the citizens to give to the other." - Voltaire

buster2010
Man are you wrong. It was the Republicans that doubled the size of the dept of education and then cut the funding to it. Also there should be no vouchers for private or religious schools. A parent chooses to send their kid to a private school instead of public school but they shouldn't have to pay school tax for the county they live in something they are forced to do and imo isn't right. And the government can't back anything religious so it's obvious why the religious schools shouldn't get vouchers.

This time, I have to disagree with you Buster. But only in the respect that you would advocate to exempt the parents of children going to private/religious schools from public school taxes.

Under that premiss, it could also be argued that people without any children should also be exempt from school taxes. IMO, that policy would destroy the tax base of our public education system and it would be counterproductive for the advancement of our society as a whole.

It would personally save me a lot of money as my children are now adults, but I doubt it would be the right thing to do for my grandchildren.

Actually conservatives like the Tea Party has the best solution to create wealth.

The Tea Party movement was founded on ENDING THE FED. If u end the FED and give the power to print the dollar back to the treasury. Then we can wipe out all debt. The FED owns 60% of the national debt and China owns about 30%. If u nationalize the FED or just get rid of them all together, u erase the debt. U print and pay off CHina. Then the treasury can print as much as they want to fund all social programs, education and whatever. There would be zero debt. All problems would be resolved.

This would help the liberals the most. If somehow we can get the brainless liberals to open their eyes and take the bananas of their ears and stop buying into the establishment talking points that the TEA PARTY is evil, we can unite and END THE FED. We can solve almost all problems in the US.

The elites survive from dividing the masses. If the liberals realize how much the TEa Party goals will help them. Then we can win. Otherwise keep complaining and nothing will be solved.

amfirst1
reply to post by Xeven

 

The poor has every opportunity to become the 1%. They are given free education and financial aide to be doctors, lawyers, etc.

If they choose to flip burgers or do nothing. Then they have no right to want to get paid a 6 figure job. Obviously, they did it to themselves, so they should embrace the suck like Peilosi said.

Yes...what a paradise the US is. Where education is free.....riiiiiight.....and Burger flipping is entirely optional since "everyone" can get the dream job they want...

Seriously...are you for real?