Dr. Jacques Vallee ~ The Control System

Autograf
reply to post by 1ofthe9

 

It just seems to me that the old grimoires, along with newer material such as Crowley and the Lovecraft mythos, potentially represent a means of 'getting in touch' with the phenomenon, if we are to accept Vallee's "Magonia" hypothesis. According to those traditions, following certain practices, many completely arbitrary-seeming but steeped in the sands of time, will attract the attention of otherworldly spirits.

One oft-debated topic in the occult world is why basically all ceremonial rituals seem to work, even when they are 'made up'. This includes up to evocation of spirits to visible form, off-the-cuff chaos magick, etc. People have attempted to summon Lovecraftian deities and gotten results. But another old warning to the magician is that you may not be actually contacting the entity you are looking for, but another that answers the call. This, too, fits with the unpredictable nature of the UFO phenomena.

Yup. I gave it a try, and ended up sleeping through an entire day and waking up feeling like I'd been beaten with a sack of hammers. Wish I remembered the dreams.

Autograf
reply to post by lostgirl

 

Right. This gets into yet another sidetrack, but psi in general is rather feared and taboo. And it seems to have a strong connection to all this mystery.

On the contrary, I think this actually gets us back 'on' track, because Vallee's (particular) "Control System" bears some degree of 'relation' to psi phenomena...

Speaking of 'sidetracks', am I the only one who has noticed that whenever the thread starts to head toward a focus on discussing the 'particulars' and conjectures of Vallee's (specific) Control System, i.e. the 'woo', the 'why', and the 'what' of it, within 2 to 4 posts we suddenly find ourselves 'switch tracked' down a major tangent?

Could this in fact be the 'System' itself attempting to 'control' the conversation such that in all these 78 pages we've yet to keep the discussion headed in the pertinent direction long enough to reach a point of beginning to 'really' delve into any possibilities for the 'what' and the 'why' of the 'woo' and it's existence?

reply to post by lostgirl


One possible avenue of research might be to compare the field reports of the more curious sort of ritual magicians with UFO reports, looking for commonalities such as lights, EM effects, mists, humanoids, abduction type experiences. There are a few hard-to-find books that might be useful for this.

And then there's an entire website full of Goetic experiments:
imperialarts.livejournal.com...

lostgirl

Autograf
reply to post by lostgirl

 

Right. This gets into yet another sidetrack, but psi in general is rather feared and taboo. And it seems to have a strong connection to all this mystery.

On the contrary, I think this actually gets us back 'on' track, because Vallee's (particular) "Control System" bears some degree of 'relation' to psi phenomena...

Speaking of 'sidetracks', am I the only one who has noticed that whenever the thread starts to head toward a focus on discussing the 'particulars' and conjectures of Vallee's (specific) Control System, i.e. the 'woo', the 'why', and the 'what' of it, within 2 to 4 posts we suddenly find ourselves 'switch tracked' down a major tangent?

Could this in fact be the 'System' itself attempting to 'control' the conversation such that in all these 78 pages we've yet to keep the discussion headed in the pertinent direction long enough to reach a point of beginning to 'really' delve into any possibilities for the 'what' and the 'why' of the 'woo' and it's existence?

edit on 3-3-2014 by lostgirl because: correction

Maybe we're the control system.

If you guys are talking about Crowley and magick; why do you suppose he would go to the trouble of compiling Liber 777, and for that matter, The Book of Thoth, if the point was to just make up whatever you want?

Every one of Crowley's procedural Libers and the Rites of Eleusis are built flawlessly upon the framework of the cornerstones of western hermetic practice, the symbol systems of astrology, tarot, the hermetic qabalah and alchemy. His whole body of work is meant to reinforce the same themes.

Also, how on earth is Lovecraft a means of "getting in to touch with the phenomenon"? You know the only two guys that really published much about that were the author of the Simon Necronomicon and Kenneth Grant. The author of the Simon Necronomicon is Peter Levenda, and the book is his longest running practical joke, and Kenneth Grant? Someone may as well post Crowley's Lam and really take us down the tubes.

I honestly don't think that performing interpretive dance routines for the Control System is going to do it.

I keep thinking about ancient legends, folklore and Biblical writings. I think they are all the same story, told in different ways.
'Cone heads' are possibly what we now consider aliens....or the sons of God that mated with the daughters of men? They seem to have been able to enslave man.
Archaeological sites show advanced knowledge. How did Mary get pregnant if it wasn't artificial insemination? How did Noah get two of all (except unicorns ) on the Ark, if it wasn't stem cells, or something like that?

Do most, if not all, of humanity carry this 'alien' DNA?
Where did they go? And why didn't they share their advanced knowledge with us before they left?

My mind has been toying with the idea that MAYBE they didn't leave; maybe THEIR knowledge continued to advance, and they learned how to reside in a different dimension that is parallel to ours. Maybe the reason that some are able to access the 'woo' side of life has something to do with a shared DNA; communication on an electromagnetic cellular level.

Our scientific advancement may have nothing to do with aliens 'sharing' technology with us, but rather the natural progression of science.

I really think if ALL scientific fields collaborated with each other ,and compiled all research data, our understanding of the universe would take a giant leap forward.

( I hope I don't sound too nutters... )

Ms. Nugget

This is required reading for anyone that is preparing to summon Shub-Niggurath and his Thousand Young...

The Doom That Came to Chelsea

reply to post by Bybyots


This isn't about what I think about Crowley (a brilliant syncretist), it's about re-examining the grimoire tradition with an eye to the parallels with UFOlogy. The difficult part seems to be finding records of the actual workings from the grimoires, or enough records to draw conclusions.

Bybyots
This is required reading for anyone that is preparing to summon Shub-Niggurath and his Thousand Young...

The Doom That Came to Chelsea

I like Grant because he's so purple and spooky with his ideas, Bertiaux is another fun read (interdimensional were-spiders!). I still haven't work out exactly what could be used to get the attention of a Control System...but I have some ideas.

reply to post by Autograf


Autograf,

You know you are one of my favorite peeps, but Crowley didn't synchretize anything, he restored it; that was his opinion of what he was doing and I agree with him. People sometimes don't appreciate what would not be available without Crowley.

As far as the grimoires are concerned, which one? I'm no expert but I'm not a slouch either; which did you have in mind?



P.S. Hey, I meant to add that I was excited to see that you had brought up Abramelin, it does seem to at least get us off in to an unexplored cul-de-sac of all this stuff. I think it is a neat model for describing how one might get a response from the CS, but in this case it has some religious overlaps, I mean, we are talking God and stuff.

It's a neat way to think about it but I myself just don't know quite what to do with it yet, which is good. Best I can think of at the moment is that it is not really a group thing, as you know, and I think that the results would look like this or this.

reply to post by 1ofthe9

I like Grant because he's so purple

Heh, that's a good one; close, but to be accurate he's mauve.

P.S. Hey, I thought of a question, a lot of folks, and it seems that that would include many on this thread, seem to think that Crowley and his work represent some sign or indication of The Control System (not the pantomime one, I guess). I also get the impression that folks think that those that would mimic the CS, go to Crowley's work as some sort of "play-book".

So, how do you suppose that Aleister Crowley managed to bite off such a sizable chunk of that real estate?

Drug use/ritual sex?

I also have Agrippa's Three Books of Occult Philosophy, The Grimoire of Pope Honorious, and Albertus Magus's book of secrets. Side hobby I picked up while researching this. I haven't seen anything UFO related, unless elemental spirits count.

reply to post by 1ofthe9

Drug use/ritual sex?

Are you serious? I'm really asking; if you don't want to talk about it, I understand, not everyone is interested in this stuff.



Also, we have been easily throwing UFOs, World Mythology, Folklore, and shady government black-projects together willy-nilly for some 79 pages (over 1580 posts) of this thread and you draw the line when it comes to any correlation between the occult and the CS at Honorius and Albertus Magnus.



Okay, grimoires are off the table.




P.S. C'mon 1ofthe9, you've been a strong participant in these threads, is that your final answer: drugs and ritual sex?

I don't know if this has been brought up here (too many pages to wade through), but what of the connection between Crowley, Jack Parsons, and the straight line that leads to NASA?

Surely there must be a link between the invocations and summonings of Parsons, and his solid rocket fuel which more or less made space flight and moon trips a possibility, at least from what I can gather.

reply to post by cuckooold

Surely there must be a link between the invocations and summonings of Parsons, and his solid rocket fuel which more or less made space flight and moon trips a possibility, at least from what I can gather

There must? How? I can find none other than the inspiration provided by science fiction and a desire to blow-shi#-up.

reply to post by Bybyots


I'd forgotten about After Angel, but seen it recommended before. That's definitely the sort of thing I meant.

Abramelin's book is actually the most intriguing to me because of its holistic approach and plain speech. But I'm interested in all of the extant descriptions of the nature and origin of spirits, with regards to this approach. I would also say the work of Dee and Kelley may be useful - people keep reporting unexpected effects when meddling/playing with it - the band Tool, for example. Even Faust comes across as a UFO story if read in a certain light.

reply to post by 1ofthe9


I believe traditional elemental spirits do count, and the nuanced description of them to be found by combining many sources has interesting parallels with the EDH.

Crowley was what we would now call a contactee, and like many in modern times, felt compelled to spread that message he was contacted with. Literal interpretations of channelling aside, was Aiwass and his message simply a forerunner of today's Exopolitics movement?

I had an experience once, a few years ago. I was pretty much outside in the back of where the warehouse I worked, talking to one of the people I work with on cool summer night.

As I was heading inside, walking up a set of stairs just to finish whatever I had to do. I could see a satellite that virtually looked like a star, and was quite big compared to other satellites I have seen. And I was starring at it for a few moments, by walking slower, to get a better glimpse of it.

When I head inside, a few seconds after, a strange feeling had come over me. It felt almost metallic at first, however, I felt life somewhere a moment later, but nothing I could describe before...The best word I could describe was....alien, very alien. And as that was happening, I felt a whisper/voice, asking me something. It asked, "Why don't you get a better job". Sometimes I wish I listened.

There, I said it.

reply to post by Autograf

Literal interpretations of channelling aside, was Aiwass and his message simply a forerunner of today's Exopolitics movement?

Jesus H. Christopherson, man, don't decimate the box, we needs at least the bits to find our way back home.

Hey, how's this for recursion?

William Bloom was too sick to do anything for three years after he made the demons touch his wand at the end of his performance of the Abramelin Operation. After he was well enough he wrote a book called Devas, Fairies and Angels: A Modern Approach and went on to become a faculty member at Findhorn, which brings us fully around that particular cul-de-sac and returns us to our regularly scheduled thread.

"Throughout history, in all cultures, in all major religions and in all geographical areas, men and women have talked and written about beings and creatures who belong to another magical, religious or psychic dimension. These creatures are not human beings in another dimension but are a distinct and different life-form."

Devas, Fairies and Angels: A Modern Approach

Finally a consensus of sorts and to whatever degree it might be. Unless the 'materialists' of science are correct and we're just mentally 'tossing off' about the nature of the enigma, then the 'occult' lineage of all that we are discussing is fairly well defined and a well-worn path.

Where does that leave the question and some sort of disposition about the nature and intent of the phenomenon?

I think the first page of Electromagnetism, UFOs, and the Weaponization of Alien Technology gets down to business fairly quickly and even manages to fit Parsons in.

I'll leave the whole 'new world order' aspect aside for now, while at the same time pointing out the state of the world political stage and it's subsequent conjuring/intent by the military-occult complex. It's there. What do we make of it?

For me, the question becomes: Who are the good guys, if indeed they exist among--or amongst--us?

It seems that light and darkness, higher self/lower self/conscious/subconscious, yin/yan, black hats vs white hats--however we might construe it--has some basis in our destiny/challenge.

On a smaller point that might lead to greater epiphanies: Yeah, it seems Crowley--as Autograf pointed out--was a mere 'channeler.' Of what? That IS the question.