Russian MFI

Oh! I'm sorry I wasn't specific enough 5 U.S. F-15's have been SHOT DOWN in A2A combat need the proof???

yo Siberian Tiger, where's that drawing of the 5th generation aircaft?

Originally posted by khruschev

The unbeaten mark is held by the USAF - not the F-15 in general.

One was shot down as I said, but I will provide info as soon as I get it. About the Israel claims, well they claim as well not to have nuclear weapons but apparently they do.

I would like to see that info
As for Isreal, I have heard conflicting reports, so I am not saying I believe them, just saying that it is what they are saying.

You Russians are going to have to build a few operational Mig 1.44's before you can say they can beat a Raptor.

We actually have built two of them. One for ground tests, and one for flight tests, which is fully operational. If you mean operational as to be used within the Air Force or Naval Aviation, we will have to wait as the project has been revived, but we have PAK-FA coming from Sukhoi as well. My remark which you have quoted was just for fun

i meant used in the AF/Navy - and so you know, my coment was in jest as well

Originally posted by SiberianTiger
Oh! I'm sorry I wasn't specific enough 5 U.S. F-15's have been SHOT DOWN in A2A combat need the proof???

Yes, we do

Originally posted by SiberianTiger
Oh! I'm sorry I wasn't specific enough 5 U.S. F-15's have been SHOT DOWN in A2A combat need the proof???

By all means please provide us with link to the proof. And for gods sake, not someones blog or jihadspun eh?

Oh come on,i watched the history channel 3 days ago and i know that the number of shotdowns is a flat 0

[edit on 30/11/04 by W4rl0rD]

Originally posted by Dima
yo, u are wrong in using FR Yuogsalvia, its time for me to act smart, first of all, its supposed to be FYROM, which stands for Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia

Serbia and Monentenegro are one country, as well as Bosnia and Herzegovina, so, it seems thta i'm not thats tupid after all, okay, u're complaining about me, hello, u haven't made a good argument so far, so u're the one that is defending russia in a worse manner, plus, i'm providing sites now, so, u can't blame it on me if a site lies, (which i doubt venik does)
so be quiet, crap, i don't want to hate russian people, u'r starting to make me though

Could you please stop using that "yo" all the time? I telling this for you, because it makes you look stupid.

Do you even know what FYROM is? And why? I see you know what it stands for, but you don't know what country it is apparently. Well take a look at this map:



Before break up of SFR Yugoslavia (SFR standing for Socialistic Federative Republic of) Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Serbia, Montenegro, and Macedonia (not the regions in Greece) were all part of one country the SFRY.

After the war ended, Slovenia, and Croatia became independent states. Bosnia and Herzegovina got its independence too, with the Republic Srpska being part of it, where all the Bosnian Serbs lived and still live. Serbia and Montenegro, stayed together, forming what is left of Yugoslavia, and got the name FR Yugoslavia (FR standing for Federal Republic of). Both Serbia and Montenegro were part of this as two separate Republics forming a Federal Republic. Republic of Serbia has two autonomous provinces, which are under control of Republic of Serbia. Republic of Montenegro has almost no control over these two, besides the power it exerces through Federal government, which controls bothe Serbia and Montenegro. Serbian government controls the governments of the autonomous provinces.
Republic of Macedonia got its independence as well, but since Greece has a region called Macedonia because of historical reasons, they protested that ex-republic of SFRY should get a different name. That's why it is called FYROM (Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia). Kosovo and Metohija have nothing to do with FYROM.
FR Yugoslavia got in war with Albanian terrorists (KLA-Kosovo Liberation Army) over the future status of Kosmet (Kosovo and Metohija). The Albanians wanted Kosmet to become independent and later on occupied by Albania, while, since Kosmet has always been Serbian, Yugoslav and Serbian government did want to let it go. KLA started attacks on Yugoslav Army, Serbian police, and Serbian civillians living in Kosmet, where their ancestors have lived for centuries prior to this. US government, with the presindent Bill Clinton, backed Albanian terrorist organisation KLA, and provided food, money, weapons and training for their fighters. In 1999, when President of FR Yugoslavia rejected to withdraw Yugoslav troops from Yugoslav territory, a US-led coallition together with NATO members excluding Greece performed air strikes against FR Yugoslavia, mostly targeting Republic of Serbia for 72 days (which I have spent in FR Yugoslavia). After that Milosevic order Yugoslav troops to withdraw and KFOR troops moved into Kosmet. These were supposed to be the peace-keepers, but they failed to protect Serbian and other non-Albanian population. Russian contigent was forced to withdraw their troops from Kosmet, because they weren't given the strategic positions in order to maintain peace, and to protect non-Albanian population from attack performed by KLA. Since Russian withdrawal even less Serbs and non-Albanians live in Kosmet.

Recently, FR Yugoslavia, changed name to State Union of Serbia and Montenegro. It's government has much less influence over those of Republic of Serbia and Republic of Montenegro. This happened along with the change of constitution, and made these two state members even closer to separation. A referendum might happen soon in Republic of Montenegro to let the population decide whether they want to stay as a part of the State Union or not. At the time of the war in 1999, when the F-117A, and F-16C were shot down name of the country was FR Yugoslavia.

Before, I thought you had problems with Geography. Now I think you have problems with History, and English Language too. As well as with your behavior and respect.

I won't argue about whether I have made a goo argument or not, but at least most of what I say I am sure about, and isn't a pure misinformation. I am not defending Russia here. I am providing facts and information. I can't blame on you if a site lies, but I can blame on you for not checking whether it lies or not. And I am sure that everyone can speak of Venik's reputation as of a misinforming one.

And the last person who can tell em to be quiet is you, especially me being who I am and 31 years older than you. You should really learn how to respect people if you want to be respected as well. And it doesn't touch me that you are starting to hate Russia and/or Russian people. I don't care if you or you don't and whether it is because of me or not.

You have voted khruschev for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.

Great response Khruschev. I learned something new today!

[edit on 30-11-2004 by engineer]

Before, I thought you had problems with Geography. Now I think you have problems with History, and English Language too. As well as with your behavior and respect.

Behaviour and respect, u taught me how annoying people could really be and how just, friggin annoyign, yea thats the only word i can describe u


I won't argue about whether I have made a goo argument or not, but at least most of what I say I am sure about, and isn't a pure misinformation. I am not defending Russia here. I am providing facts and information. I can't blame on you if a site lies, but I can blame on you for not checking whether it lies or not. And I am sure that everyone can speak of Venik's reputation as of a misinforming one.

What, so u think i've only looked at venik's website on plasma stealth technology, shutup, i've searched it up on google, half-way up the yin-yang, and why do u say venik's is not a reputable site? huh, give me info

And the last person who can tell em to be quiet is you, especially me being who I am and 31 years older than you. You should really learn how to respect people if you want to be respected as well. And it doesn't touch me that you are starting to hate Russia and/or Russian people. I don't care if you or you don't and whether it is because of me or not.

so what if your 31 years older than me, respect, i believe it is u that satrted this half-firefight, u were acting as if i'm some moronic 12 year ood, frig, where do u get u're maps and info, here's one thats rights, its from the CIA

u're the only russian person that i've met that is an annoying ******* *****
,u give russia a bad name, really

"u have ben tainted by the dark influence, it will soon consume you" i'm talknig about american propaganda

cia.gov...

Originally posted by Trent

Originally posted by GrOuNd_ZeRo
I had a friend who's father worked for lockheed martin...

He claimed that they are working on an active camoflage for it that will render it virtually invisible...Something with LEDs acting like a chameleon's skin...

Only for Bond's plane though

I don't know if it is Lockheed, but the US is DEFINATLY working on active visual camo for it's aircraft. The US military has confirmed this numerous times.

But even though the aircraft itself has been revealed to the public, the stealth systems designed to suppress acoustic, infra-red, radar and even visual signatures are likely to be as highly classified as ever.

Sources suggest they may include active camouflage systems to reduce visibility by using panels or coatings that change colour or luminosity.

source

I can find more if you want, but I do promise - the USAF has said in public that visual stealth is a main priority for next generation stealth aircraft.

Originally posted by engineer

There were 5 Mig 29 shootdowns by US planes, 4 from F-15C's and one from an F-16CJ. All were AIM120's. On the first day of operations, a Royal Dutch Air Force F-16 MLU also shot down a Mig 29, also with an AIM120

Hate to argue with this fact but the Dutch Airforce RECENTLY (2003 I believe) received their AIM-120's, so the dutch F-16 used a AIM-9 more than likely.

Also we are trying to aquire Tomahawk Cruise-missiles for our next generation frigate, "De Zeven Provincie�n" which is possibly the most advanced Frigate currently...

As for the F-15's being shotdown, i'd believe it, the F-15 has a HUGE RCS.

How well is the F/A-22 protected VS an attack from a R-27EM missile?

The F-22s have so much stealth that they would probably kill the enemy before they fired the R-27,otherwise its stealth and heat emission hiding would make the missle work much harder to hit its target.

Originally posted by W4rl0rD
The F-22s have so much stealth that they would probably kill the enemy before they fired the R-27,otherwise its stealth and heat emission hiding would make the missle work much harder to hit its target.

so much stealth? ok, who here is a radar operator? before anyone makes any judgment on this whole stealth issue i would like them to have some facts. personnaly i dont have any idea how well the "stealth" works on an f-22, or any other aircraft for that matter. ive heard it is mostly hype, but again this is just what ive heard. if anyone can reliably say they KNOW that this stealth has a significant effect, and prove it, then fire away. personnaly im keeping an open mind as to its validity.

i would have thought that the heat signature of the engines would be a problem for stealth aircraft, also the thrust vectoring nozzles are not exactly inconspicuous when in use.

who knows which aircraft is better than which, oyu can get information on either aircraft that will support your argument on the web. mostly its all conjecture and propaganda put up by people who reall y dont know what they are talking about. i admit to being unknowledgable on the true performance of either aircraft and will find it hard to believe anyone who says that they do. to have this information would mean they wopuld have to work in thwe upper echelons of the respective design bureaus and aqir forces, and i dont think that people in these positions would be bandying about this sort of information on either aircraft.

so by all means voice your opinion but its pretty much a given that the substantiating information will be somewhat erroneus.

Originally posted by Dima








Before, I thought you had problems with Geography. Now I think you have problems with History, and English Language too. As well as with your behavior and respect.

Behaviour and respect, u taught me how annoying people could really be and how just, friggin annoyign, yea thats the only word i can describe u


I won't argue about whether I have made a goo argument or not, but at least most of what I say I am sure about, and isn't a pure misinformation. I am not defending Russia here. I am providing facts and information. I can't blame on you if a site lies, but I can blame on you for not checking whether it lies or not. And I am sure that everyone can speak of Venik's reputation as of a misinforming one.

What, so u think i've only looked at venik's website on plasma stealth technology, shutup, i've searched it up on google, half-way up the yin-yang, and why do u say venik's is not a reputable site? huh, give me info

And the last person who can tell em to be quiet is you, especially me being who I am and 31 years older than you. You should really learn how to respect people if you want to be respected as well. And it doesn't touch me that you are starting to hate Russia and/or Russian people. I don't care if you or you don't and whether it is because of me or not.

so what if your 31 years older than me, respect, i believe it is u that satrted this half-firefight, u were acting as if i'm some moronic 12 year ood, frig, where do u get u're maps and info, here's one thats rights, its from the CIA

u're the only russian person that i've met that is an annoying ******* *****
,u give russia a bad name, really

"u have ben tainted by the dark influence, it will soon consume you" i'm talknig about american propaganda

cia.gov...


Someones going the right way to getting his lil ass banned! Ya gotta calm down kiddo

dude i dont think the CIA's maps are anything to be trusted if they where one of the people that helped spice up the 45 min claim. just noteing.

I cant hold this in anymore - i just checked the forums not logged in and the only member i have blocked has posted.

Stuey1221 and Devilasp - your lack of grammar and spelling infuriates me.
The concentration of errors between your 2 posts does not print a pretty sight of the UK schooling system. Please read what you have written before you post it.

Originally posted by Vanguard
I cant hold this in anymore - i just checked the forums not logged in and the only member i have blocked has posted.

Stuey1221 and Devilasp - your lack of grammar and spelling infuriates me.
The concentration of errors between your 2 posts does not print a pretty sight of the UK schooling system. Please read what you have written before you post it.

How does this advance the topic at hand? BTW, your second word in should be "can't." What you've posted is, according to Meriam Webster, is:

1 : affected singsong or whining speech

I guess that's fairly apt after all.

Originally posted by Vanguard
I cant hold this in anymore - i just checked the forums not logged in and the only member i have blocked has posted.

Stuey1221 and Devilasp - your lack of grammar and spelling infuriates me.
The concentration of errors between your 2 posts does not print a pretty sight of the UK schooling system. Please read what you have written before you post it.

Whoah, 1 moment please, i only typed the part about getting banned, it didnt quote properly for me, if you look at what i quoted from then look at what i posted you'll see similarities, and just what was wrong with my grammer, i used a profanity hence the fact it looked stupid, as for schooling i did pretty damn good in my English GCSE/A-Levels

It's been addressed, back to the topic please.

Originally posted by intrepid
It's been addressed, back to the topic please.

Yeah, i think you put your post as i was writing mine, my bad! I haven't read all the way through this post, just curious as to whether the Eurofighters been brought into it?? Im about as useful as a glass hammer when it comes to aircraft knowledge so i wont try and act clever