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NEWS: Children for Oil

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posted on Nov, 21 2004 @ 07:10 PM
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But we can at least drop food for them or soldiers can hand out food when they are around the children. We dropped food frequently under the saddam regime as I remember. But, it would be interesting to see where the denser locations of malnourished children remain. We need to reserve forces for these kinds of operations.




posted on Nov, 21 2004 @ 07:16 PM
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Originally posted by Jamuhn
But we can at least drop food for them or soldiers can hand out food when they are around the children. We dropped food frequently under the saddam regime as I remember


I imagine that the sections of Iraq that are having problems with malnutrition are the heavy populated areas of sunnis were the "insurgents" and "terrorist" are located, and due to the "security" concerns and the hostilities in the area that is the reason that food is not deliver in that country.

People needs to understand that the country of Iraq is broken down with the war and people does not wake up everyday and go to their regular jobs and get pay every week.

I think that Iraq is going to face some humanitarian crisis and already US has been warn about that.

US is responsible for the well being of the people of the country it has invaded.



posted on Nov, 21 2004 @ 07:16 PM
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Originally posted by Jamuhn
But we can at least drop food for them or soldiers can hand out food when they are around the children. We dropped food frequently under the saddam regime as I remember. But, it would be interesting to see where the denser locations of malnourished children remain. We need to reserve forces for these kinds of operations.

Right now that's probably the only way to safely get food to them. FYI, The food and medicine we dropped during Saddam's regime went to his military, especially the medicine.

The only problem is that the military are so strapped now that it would be difficult. Where is the UN?

I saw a news brief the other day on TV. The soldiers at one location routinely handed out candy to the Iraqi kids. But if the soldiers didn't have candy, the kids would cry out "Ali Baba! Ali Baba!". Kinda cute.




posted on Nov, 21 2004 @ 07:25 PM
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Originally posted by Majic
The actual title of the article is: Children pay cost of Iraq's chaos.

The article does not mention oil at all, ...
I, for one, would prefer to see ATSNN adhere to some modicum of journalistic integrity. Deliberate distortions like this make ATSNN look biased and untrustworthy.



Majic - I think you are confusing the concept of "journalistic integrity" with the notion of "blind unthinking imitation" - a skill I have never acquired.

...As you noticed - I did not simply rewrite someone else's work. I did my own thinking and came to my own conclusions - based on the facts.

Many people will look at the same facts and come to other conclusions. C'est la guerre. But it's not a foul.

...FYI - Critical thinking actually is encouraged in certain circles. Yea me!


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posted on Nov, 21 2004 @ 07:31 PM
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Originally posted by jsobecky

Originally posted by soficrow

Originally posted by jsobecky

We can start to help our own children in the poverty lines by going after their parents and making them accountable.



To say that poverty in this world is matter of "personal choice" is disrespectful, callous and really truly unbelievably ignorant.

[edit on 21-11-2004 by soficrow]

Read my response, and then read it again, and then for good measure, try to comprehend what you read.

Where did I say that poverty is a matter of presonal choice?

Where? I challenge you to show me.


...You said you want to hold the parents of poor children accountable - which presumes that they are not accountable, and implies personal choice.

...If that is not what you meant to presume and imply - I simply do not understand the point you were making. Could you explain please?

Thanks.



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posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 01:41 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
obviously you don't believe Saddam was guilty of any of the things I pointed out. And, yes it is the terrorists that are blowing up the oil fields and killing innocent civilians deliberately with car bombs. But to a sympathizer like you, that is OK. Apologize all you want for them, they are still scum.

And I never said it was right for us to be over there. So, like soficrow, you need to get a clue in your Thickheaded reasoning and stop misquoting me.




No what I believe is we went over there for oil, woopie do da that Saddam killed his own people.. there are far more worst tyrants than him on this planet, the only reason other than based on lies and no proof or inaccurate proof is for oil..

I lil lesson on how bad Saddam really is..

There are worse dictatorships around the globe, but you did nothing about them.

On 9/11, 30000 Chilian citizens died from Pinochet.

More than 900,000 people have been butchered in Indonesia.

More than 1,500,000 people have died the last 5 years in Africa.

More than 50,000 people have been slaughtered by Turkey invaded Cyprus.

More than 5,000,000 Armenians have been killed by Turks.

As you state its a good thing, you a yet completely wrong.. so what Saddam is killing his own people, they can deal with it just like they did before...

Also isnt it in Saudia Rabia(SP?) where they still kill women for looking at a guy wrong... so if u think about it same stupid laws all over...

Face Facts only reason we are there is for Carlyle and Haliburton can get a wad of money in the trillions, and a crap load of oil..


[edit on 22-11-2004 by ThichHeaded]

[edit on 22-11-2004 by ThichHeaded]



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:14 AM
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Error parsing the following line segments:


the only reason other than based on lies and no proof or inaccurate proof is for oil..

I lil lesson on how bad Saddam really is..

you a yet completely wrong..

Unrecognized language or nonsensical structure
************************************************************
Error integrating the following arguments into reason:



There are worse dictatorships around the globe, but you did nothing about them.

On 9/11, 30000 Chilian citizens died from Pinochet.

More than 900,000 people have been butchered in Indonesia.

More than 1,500,000 people have died the last 5 years in Africa.

More than 50,000 people have been slaughtered by Turkey invaded Cyprus.

More than 5,000,000 Armenians have been killed by Turks.

Face Facts only reason we are there is for Carlyle and Haliburton can get a wad of money in the trillions, and a crap load of oil..

An intervention in Chile would have been construed as imperialistic coffee-bean theft.
Lame attempt of damned if you do, damned if you don't.
************************************************************



[edit on 22-11-2004 by jsobecky]



posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 11:02 AM
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jsobecky - I'm not clear how your comments above are meant to contribute to this discussion... ?

Also, you challenged me to respond to your earlier post. I did, with a question, but have yet to hear back. ....?


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posted on Nov, 22 2004 @ 10:09 PM
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You didn't respond. You asked me what I meant by accountable. And you did this after saying

To say that poverty in this world is matter of "personal choice" is disrespectful, callous and really truly unbelievably ignorant.

You see, soficrow, the correct way to do things is to ask someone what they meant before you accuse them of something. But you did things back-asswards. You made assumptions, insulted someone, put them on defensive. Then you ask them to explain what they meant.



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posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 12:10 AM
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I MONITOR THIS EXCHANGE SHAKING MY HEAD............

quote: Originally posted by Majic
The actual title of the article is: Children pay cost of Iraq's chaos.

The article does not mention oil at all, ...
I, for one, would prefer to see ATSNN adhere to some modicum of journalistic integrity. Deliberate distortions like this make ATSNN look biased and untrustworthy.

Soficrow responds,

Majic - I think you are confusing the concept of "journalistic integrity" with the notion of "blind unthinking imitation" - a skill I have never acquired.

...As you noticed - I did not simply rewrite someone else's work. I did my own thinking and came to my own conclusions - based on the facts.

Many people will look at the same facts and come to other conclusions. C'est la guerre. But it's not a foul.

...FYI - Critical thinking actually is encouraged in certain circles. Yea me!

As a professional journalist working for one of the big three networks, your confusing journalistic integrity with personal opinion (an editorial).

a professional journalism is SUPPOSED to be non-biased, and let the story and information sell itself. The fact that you altered the actual title of the article cited DID imply bias on your part. Adding opinion to the facts distorts the report and changes it from news to an editorial.

Editorials should be labled as much and not masquerade as legitimate news. This type of bias in news reporting DOES remove legitimacy from ATSNN.



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 07:47 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
You didn't respond. You asked me what I meant by accountable.



You said, "We can start to help our own children in the poverty lines by going after their parents and making them accountable. "

IMHO - I clarified the obvious meaning of your statement and then gave you the opportunity to revise it. Which you have yet to do. Leaving the obvious interpretation to stand - you implied that the parents are personally responsible for their children's poverty.

If that is not what you meant, you need to expand the statement and explain yourself better.



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[edit on 23-11-2004 by soficrow]



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 08:09 AM
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Originally posted by CazMedia
The fact that you altered the actual title of the article cited DID imply bias on your part. Adding opinion to the facts distorts the report and changes it from news to an editorial.



I am not aware that writers are mandated to plagiarize a reference article's title. Also, atsnn's submission requirements explicitly state:



"Additional comments: When you use the ATSNN submission form, (this) next field is for your comments on the story where it is your chance to provide your spin and/or opinion on the reference news article. "


For the record - the notion of "objective observation" and hence 'objective reporting' is a fallacy. The atsnn format simply formalizes a standard academic approach, and mandates (rather pragmatically) a particular structure.

IMHO - your and others' attacks simply reflect a campaign to maintain "support of the status quo" as the dominant bias here at atsnn. ...Also IMHO, the majority of "news" stories here on atsnn already DO support the status quo, and promote the current administration's agenda.

All I'm doing is bucking the tide - I'm not changing the rules. What you're doing is demanding that my bias reflect your own. Not a democratic position at all. Smells like censorship to me.



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posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 08:35 AM
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Originally posted by slank
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The Bush administration and most Bushies talk about caring for children when they raise the abortion issue, but when you get right down to it they don't give a #@!* about living children.

Newsflash!
Democracy is not only a political system, it is rooted in healthy dispersed economic activity. It happens when the broad base of the population feels economically empowered and engaged.


That statement that republicans 'don't give a #@!* about living children'
was beyond reprehensible as well as being just plain wrong. And BTW
children in the womb ARE LIVING. They breathe, they sleep, they wake
and open their eyes, they suck their thumbs, they hiccup, their hearts
beat, they respond to sound both positively and negatively, AND they
definately feel pain. Surgery on children in the womb is done with
anestesia on the unborn child. Except abortion .... they are murdered
without any pain relief ... saline burns them to death, suction rips them
apart, partial birth abortion jabs a stick in their brain and sucks it out ...
painful legalized murder without pain relief.

Newsflash! (to use your words)
We live in a REPUBLIC .. with democratic institutions. This isn't a
democracy. You are right when you say the economy grows
when the population feels economically empowered and engaged
... that's why the dems way of 'tax and spend' is wrong. It takes
the money away from those who should be empowered to spend
their own money as they see fit.



[edit on 11/23/2004 by FlyersFan]



posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 09:22 AM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan

That statement that republicans 'don't give a #@!* about living children'
was beyond reprehensible as well as being just plain wrong.



If we look at the effects of current policies and actions, and not just what the Bush republicans say they "believe," then we see that slank's statement has validity.

...Rates of malnutrition, chronic illness, homelessness, loss of medical insurance, and even infant mortality are rising dramatically in the USA. Masses of people are unemployed - those who do find work are forced to take pay cuts and hold down several part time jobs, without benefits. ...The list goes on and the picture isn't pretty. Americans fear for their own futures now, not just what their children might face.


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posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 01:34 PM
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Originally posted by soficrow


IMHO - I clarified the obvious meaning of your statement and then gave you the opportunity to revise it. Which you have yet to do. Leaving the obvious interpretation to stand - you implied that the parents are personally responsible for their children's poverty.

If that is not what you meant, you need to expand the statement and explain yourself better.

Obvious to you, maybe. But that's looking at it through your own eyes.

You didn't clarify anything. You insulted and attacked. Till you go back prior to that point and remedy it, I don't need to expand anything.




posted on Nov, 23 2004 @ 10:12 PM
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Originally posted by jsobecky

We can start to help our own children in the poverty lines by going after their parents and making them accountable.


...Go after them for what, jsobecky? An $8.2 TRILLION dollar national debt and a USD that's in the toilet, right? ...and for not having a job because all the jobs:

a) got outsourced to other countries, OR
b) went to slave labor in privately owned American prisons.

Most poor people I know work their butts off trying to make ends meet AND be good parents.

To say parents should be "made accountable" for their childrens' poverty is to imply that poverty in this world is matter of "personal choice" - and it is disrespectful, callous and really truly unbelievably ignorant.

At this point, it is quite clear that you, jsobecky, said EXACTLY what you meant. I am not interested in wasting my time trading insults or playing mind games.

...The world and this nation are facing a number of crises - if you choose to fiddle while Rome burns, that's your choice. But please do not try to make me dance. You're playing the wrong song and besides, your instrument is out of tune.


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posted on Nov, 24 2004 @ 01:17 PM
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An overview of the Iraq situation from the International Red Cross/Red Crescent:

www.coe-dmha.org...


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posted on Nov, 24 2004 @ 02:27 PM
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Originally posted by CazMedia


Editorials should be labled as much and not masquerade as legitimate news. This type of bias in news reporting DOES remove legitimacy from ATSNN.


AMEN! And it's only increasing in frequency and severity IMO.



posted on Nov, 24 2004 @ 04:49 PM
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Originally posted by Valhall

Originally posted by CazMedia


Editorials should be labled as much and not masquerade as legitimate news. This type of bias in news reporting DOES remove legitimacy from ATSNN.


AMEN! And it's only increasing in frequency and severity IMO.


I agree - anyone reading the atsnn front page would think that war and terror are the only important issues facing the nation and the world today. They would not know there's a water crisis, disease crisis and climate crisis about to strike - all at the same time.

They would not know that the money needed to deal with these crises already has been spent. They would think the best contribution they could make would be to line up, sign up and fight.

...Any free-thinking observer would conclude that atsnn exists just to sell war and troll for troops, if they didn't read ats's published ambitions.

The perception of bias often is in the eye of the beholder. The propensity to label is another thing entirely.

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posted on Nov, 27 2004 @ 05:32 PM
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I did a search to update this thread and found the following 2 articles. The first is called "I Am Become Death - The Destroyer Of The Worlds." The second article's title is "Fort Benning Set to Expand."



www.paktribune.com...

"Known as the "city of mosques" for its more than 200 mosques, Fallujah is also known for refusing to add Saddams name to the call for prayers from its ancient minarets. It is located on the banks of river Euphrates, the largest river in Southwest Asia. The 1700 miles long Euphrates is linked with some of the most important events in olden history.

The city of Ur, found at its mouth, was the birthplace of Abraham. On its banks stood the city of Babylon. In the past, the army of Necho was defeated on its banks by Nebuchadnezzar. Cyrus the Younger and Crassus perished after crossing it. Alexander traversed it and continued his journey eastward.

...Fallujah has been laid waste. ...It is a hell on earth of crushed bodies, shattered buildings and the reek of death.

...Parents have been forced to watch their wounded children die and then bury their bodies in their gardens. An Iraqi journalist, reporting in the city for the BBC and Reuters, said: I have seen some strange things recently, such as stray dogs snatching bites out of bodies lying on the streets. Meanwhile, people forage in their gardens looking for something to eat. Those that have survived this far are looking gaunt. The opposite is happening to the deadleft where they fell, they are now bloated and rotting...

...US general John Sattler declared: We have liberated the city of Fallujah. ...The assault on Fallujah is a pure and simple Nazi-style collective punishment, not liberation.



From Fort Benning Set to Expand:



www.11alive.com...

Nearly 6,000 new soldiers are set to move to Army post in western Georgia, which is already a major training center for recruits, airborne troops, infantry soldiers, officers and reservists preparing for combat in Iraq and Afghanistan.

...Overall, the Army will increase by 30,000 soldiers over the next three years and 23,000 of them will be infantrymen who will train at Fort Benning, the Army's only infantry-training center.

...The post itself is planning $1.5 billion worth of construction projects within about seven years to accommodate the expansion.




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