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We do NOT live in a police state! Please move on.

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posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 06:46 PM
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reply to post by Grimpachi
 


Like i said Grim, there isn't a comparisson because we are suppose to be the model. At this point we are only able to compare to what our goals are set out to achieve.

By this standard we are a police state. My opnion of course but please take the time to analyze that thought correctly so you can share my opinion
.




posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 06:47 PM
link   

Grimpachi
reply to post by Sremmos80
 


You would need to be specific as to which laws you are talking about so I could reference them.

And yes I have lived in countries where there were permanent and mobile checkpoints throughout the country where everyone was stopped cars and persons searched, papers shown and it wasn't unusual to have authorities come into residences to have a look around where again papers were shown at least until they knew your face. I will start drawing true comparisons once the US starts blocking websites and censoring youtube.



This previous post? Where you asked me to name laws??



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:12 PM
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kx12x
Answer me this, have feds ever shown up at your door and thrown you into prison for criticizing the government? Never happened to me. And ATS isn't exactly an obscure/hidden website that the government doesn't know about. Anyone who thinks otherwise is deluded.

Also, I'm pretty sure I can buy a firearm anytime I want. If we look at history, the government would have us all disarmed long before things go full police state.

Is there a lot of government overreach? Sure. But that doesn't equate to a police state.


The USA is an emerging police state, so being critical of it does not always mean you will end up in prison. However things like this have been increasing: Man Posts On Facebook About “Police State” And Guess Who Shows Up?

Many on this site agree there is an agenda in place to take down the 2nd Amendment. California has started to confiscate legally purchased guns from 'prohibited people.' Connecticut is also taking action to confiscate certain legally purchased guns.

The foundation of a police state is already here, we the informed concerned citizen it will not be allowed to be built.


edit on 18-1-2014 by jrod because: typO gremlin



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:16 PM
link   
reply to post by jrod
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:20 PM
link   

projectbane
reply to post by jrod
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)


I can almost guarantee Fox news is not running a piece on police states, furthermore most on this website would take what fox news had to say with a grain OF a grain of salt. Since you still wont address it i will ask again, How does the 100 mile constitution free zone not go against EVERYTHING you posted in OP? Maybe 3rd times a charm



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:22 PM
link   
reply to post by onequestion
 


Look you are more than welcome and within your rights to that opinion and I understand your sentiments but there isn't anyway I can honestly say our country resembles or is a police state.

I guess it is just a matter of perspective and for me the places I have been and things I have experienced I cant draw that parallel. I am not saying some things need to be fixed in this country because they do in fact NY has some policies right now that are simply unconstitutional but it is localised there for now and I think they will be short lived(I hope).

Like I said maybe it is just perspective but if I ever go back to and see some of the wonderful people I have met in other countries and tried to say my country had become a police state I would fully expect to become a laughing stock or worse.




Sremmos80

Grimpachi
reply to post by Sremmos80
 


You would need to be specific as to which laws you are talking about so I could reference them.

And yes I have lived in countries where there were permanent and mobile checkpoints throughout the country where everyone was stopped cars and persons searched, papers shown and it wasn't unusual to have authorities come into residences to have a look around where again papers were shown at least until they knew your face. I will start drawing true comparisons once the US starts blocking websites and censoring youtube.



This previous post? Where you asked me to name laws??


No this one.




You know I never said everything was okey dokey.

edit on 18-1-2014 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)

edit on 18-1-2014 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:34 PM
link   

Sremmos80

projectbane
reply to post by jrod
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)


I can almost guarantee Fox news is not running a piece on police states, furthermore most on this website would take what fox news had to say with a grain OF a grain of salt. Since you still wont address it i will ask again, How does the 100 mile constitution free zone not go against EVERYTHING you posted in OP? Maybe 3rd times a charm


The 100 mile constituion free zone is only in effect near boarders. FOR A REASON!!

They are allowed to check you and search your laptop etc. The boarders of the USA have been abused time and time again. The failing of respective governments to prevent criminals and those pesky foreign boarder jumpers freely coming and going without correct immigration checks is now costing the US billions a year.

The boarders NEED securing properly! If this inconveniences people living near these zones then that is a small price to pay for national security. The US is a prime target for terrorists, free loaders and large criminal enterprises that have used the "weakened" boarders of the US to ply their activities.

IT can be somewhat troublesome for people living in reach of these zones, but they are not forced BY any law to remain there. (not saying they have to leave or stay) but the NEEDS of the MANY outweigh the NEEDS of a few.
Its called living in a society!! Harboring terroristic views agaisnt the USA need affirmative action and immediate solutions.

Whether the zone will prove to be useful is yet to be determined. Time will tell.

Just for your info I live SMACK BANG inside the zone!!!!



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:38 PM
link   

Grimpachi
reply to post by onequestion
 


Look you are more than welcome and within your rights to that opinion and I understand your sentiments but there isn't anyway I can honestly say our country resembles or is a police state.

I guess it is just a matter of perspective and for me the places I have been and things I have experienced I cant draw that parallel. I am not saying some things need to be fixed in this country because they do in fact NY has some policies right now that are simply unconstitutional but it is localised there for now and I think they will be short lived(I hope).

Like I said maybe it is just perspective but if I ever go back to and see some of the wonderful people I have met in other countries and tried to say my country had become a police state I would fully expect to become a laughing stock or worse.

Kind of like a millionaire telling a homeless person they don't know how lucky they are.


Sremmos80

Grimpachi
reply to post by Sremmos80
 


You would need to be specific as to which laws you are talking about so I could reference them.

And yes I have lived in countries where there were permanent and mobile checkpoints throughout the country where everyone was stopped cars and persons searched, papers shown and it wasn't unusual to have authorities come into residences to have a look around where again papers were shown at least until they knew your face. I will start drawing true comparisons once the US starts blocking websites and censoring youtube.



This previous post? Where you asked me to name laws??


No this one.




You know I never said everything was okey dokey.

edit on 18-1-2014 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)


Again no one here is saying we are worse off here then in NK or any of the other countries you have seen that are in a full blown state. What we are getting at is the fact that tides are shifting that way and a foundation is being set in place. Patriot Act and NDAA both provide ways to completely circumvent all due process for as long as they want. I understand you reservations to compare it to what you have seen in your travels and I'm sure we don't look anything like that. IMO if they keep passing laws like the ones above its only a matter of time. Right now they can set up checkpoints any where in that 100 mile zone and do what ever they want according to the letter of the laws that have been put in place.



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:39 PM
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Sremmos80

projectbane
reply to post by jrod
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)


I can almost guarantee Fox news is not running a piece on police states, furthermore most on this website would take what fox news had to say with a grain OF a grain of salt. Since you still wont address it i will ask again, How does the 100 mile constitution free zone not go against EVERYTHING you posted in OP? Maybe 3rd times a charm


I have many people to reply to. YOU are not significant anymore than others. But there is your libertarian view "me me me me" like a child whining for his moms attention!

No but it s a show for people who liked to be egged on. They continuously have guests on who pander to the fears of the population. The distort every piece of incoming news into something that it is not. They encourage the "fear" factor....like when they continuously kept spouting on about the "birth certificate" riling people up, splitting a country!!

And for one they don't tell the truth on there.



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:40 PM
link   

rojectbane
reply tupeurl=http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread993504/pg8#pid17442531]post by jrod[/url]
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)

People are scared because every time most people deal with a cop they are getting billed for services they don't want, have to spend a whole bunch of money on an attorney and many poor people plead guilty to jacked up charges that don't fit the offense and only benefit the state corporation and not the community just so they don't have to sit in jail for months. Count yours self as lucky. Some places, like where I live in Colorado, the justice department is run by a bunch of over ambitious, greedy bureacratical zealous unconstitutional pigs that don't care about due process or their oaths and the law, instead just making money off non crimes like traffic tickets which you don't need a license to travel on public roadways but they twist the definitions of everything same with taxes to make it sound like you have to pay them to exercise any rights, When that is fraud. They also insanely trump up charges and will find a way to llegally screw your life up u any way they can and are merciless in their tactics because they know they can scare u into a deal every time. They have nothing to lose in the process and are never held accountable and they are in business to make money nit to protect the slaves. The system only breeds smarter criminals and doesn't reduce crime mainly aggravate it by taking more money away from society and acting like the victim cuz all they do is sue your assailant for a bunch of money and u the real victim don't get a dime



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:42 PM
link   

projectbane

Sremmos80

projectbane
reply to post by jrod
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)


I can almost guarantee Fox news is not running a piece on police states, furthermore most on this website would take what fox news had to say with a grain OF a grain of salt. Since you still wont address it i will ask again, How does the 100 mile constitution free zone not go against EVERYTHING you posted in OP? Maybe 3rd times a charm


The 100 mile constituion free zone is only in effect near boarders. FOR A REASON!!

They are allowed to check you and search your laptop etc. The boarders of the USA have been abused time and time again. The failing of respective governments to prevent criminals and those pesky foreign boarder jumpers freely coming and going without correct immigration checks is now costing the US billions a year.

The boarders NEED securing properly! If this inconveniences people living near these zones then that is a small price to pay for national security. The US is a prime target for terrorists, free loaders and large criminal enterprises that have used the "weakened" boarders of the US to ply their activities.

IT can be somewhat troublesome for people living in reach of these zones, but they are not forced BY any law to remain there. (not saying they have to leave or stay) but the NEEDS of the MANY outweigh the NEEDS of a few.
Its called living in a society!! Harboring terroristic views agaisnt the USA need affirmative action and immediate solutions.

Whether the zone will prove to be useful is yet to be determined. Time will tell.

Just for your info I live SMACK BANG inside the zone!!!!


So you agree that due process has been eliminated in that zone, so lets call it a police "zone" then, not a police state. We just need that 100 miles to be 3500. That is what you are saying. So how are the people in that 100 mile zone "free" if they can be stopped and searched any time the gov deems necessary?
In no way should my rights be striped from me, living in San Diego county, because the gov can't keep the borders secure. Maybe they should stop bailing bank companies out for BILLIONS of dollars and focus that money on the border
edit on thSat, 18 Jan 2014 19:47:45 -0600America/Chicago120144580 by Sremmos80 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:43 PM
link   
The same people who say they live in a police state, will then use the First Amendment to protect their freedom of speech, not knowing that that's not what it actually does.



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:44 PM
link   

projectbane

Sremmos80

projectbane
reply to post by jrod
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)


I can almost guarantee Fox news is not running a piece on police states, furthermore most on this website would take what fox news had to say with a grain OF a grain of salt. Since you still wont address it i will ask again, How does the 100 mile constitution free zone not go against EVERYTHING you posted in OP? Maybe 3rd times a charm


I have many people to reply to. YOU are not significant anymore than others. But there is your libertarian view "me me me me" like a child whining for his moms attention!

No but it s a show for people who liked to be egged on. They continuously have guests on who pander to the fears of the population. The distort every piece of incoming news into something that it is not. They encourage the "fear" factor....like when they continuously kept spouting on about the "birth certificate" riling people up, splitting a country!!

And for one they don't tell the truth on there.


No but you replied to post with the question in the same post....twice.... So you do keep replying to me, just avoiding the questions I ask you



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:48 PM
link   

MOSTwanted

rojectbane
reply tupeurl=http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread993504/pg8#pid17442531]post by jrod[/url]
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)

People are scared because every time most people deal with a cop they are getting billed for services they don't want, have to spend a whole bunch of money on an attorney and many poor people plead guilty to jacked up charges that don't fit the offense and only benefit the state corporation and not the community just so they don't have to sit in jail for months. Count yours self as lucky. Some places, like where I live in Colorado, the justice department is run by a bunch of over ambitious, greedy bureacratical zealous unconstitutional pigs that don't care about due process or their oaths and the law, instead just making money off non crimes like traffic tickets which you don't need a license to travel on public roadways but they twist the definitions of everything same with taxes to make it sound like you have to pay them to exercise any rights, When that is fraud. They also insanely trump up charges and will find a way to llegally screw your life up u any way they can and are merciless in their tactics because they know they can scare u into a deal every time. They have nothing to lose in the process and are never held accountable and they are in business to make money nit to protect the slaves. The system only breeds smarter criminals and doesn't reduce crime mainly aggravate it by taking more money away from society and acting like the victim cuz all they do is sue your assailant for a bunch of money and u the real victim don't get a dime


You cant say MOST people who deal with COPS have a bad experience. How do you know MOST people???? Do you have this in hard copy or is this opinion?

It seems you have a negative opinion of your state and town? That you feel aggrieved for some action not to your liking.

I read posts like yours and I fail to actually see this going on everywhere I look. The NEWS channels have a way of over exaggerating everything to create headlines. It EXTREMELY funny to me that people on this site ATS hate the MSN yet USE it continuously to back up their crazy and wild ideas when it fits with their theories. IF it doesnt fit they discard it as something purposely hiding something.

So i think you must fall into that category because what you have said is either from personal experience of being ARRESTED for a crime and then having it trumped up and making a deal!! Or you are reading the MSN news too much and believing everything you read if it fits your idea. One or the other!



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:49 PM
link   

Sremmos80

projectbane

Sremmos80

projectbane
reply to post by jrod
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)


I can almost guarantee Fox news is not running a piece on police states, furthermore most on this website would take what fox news had to say with a grain OF a grain of salt. Since you still wont address it i will ask again, How does the 100 mile constitution free zone not go against EVERYTHING you posted in OP? Maybe 3rd times a charm


I have many people to reply to. YOU are not significant anymore than others. But there is your libertarian view "me me me me" like a child whining for his moms attention!

No but it s a show for people who liked to be egged on. They continuously have guests on who pander to the fears of the population. The distort every piece of incoming news into something that it is not. They encourage the "fear" factor....like when they continuously kept spouting on about the "birth certificate" riling people up, splitting a country!!

And for one they don't tell the truth on there.


No but you replied to post with the question in the same post....twice.... So you do keep replying to me, just avoiding the questions I ask you


Well I checked back and YOU are right. I missed your post and did not reply with the answer you were looking for. MY sincerer apologies I was not targeting you for lesser treatment. I will try to answer everyone when I can.
edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:54 PM
link   

projectbane

MOSTwanted

rojectbane
reply tupeurl=http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread993504/pg8#pid17442531]post by jrod[/url]
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)

People are scared because every time most people deal with a cop they are getting billed for services they don't want, have to spend a whole bunch of money on an attorney and many poor people plead guilty to jacked up charges that don't fit the offense and only benefit the state corporation and not the community just so they don't have to sit in jail for months. Count yours self as lucky. Some places, like where I live in Colorado, the justice department is run by a bunch of over ambitious, greedy bureacratical zealous unconstitutional pigs that don't care about due process or their oaths and the law, instead just making money off non crimes like traffic tickets which you don't need a license to travel on public roadways but they twist the definitions of everything same with taxes to make it sound like you have to pay them to exercise any rights, When that is fraud. They also insanely trump up charges and will find a way to llegally screw your life up u any way they can and are merciless in their tactics because they know they can scare u into a deal every time. They have nothing to lose in the process and are never held accountable and they are in business to make money nit to protect the slaves. The system only breeds smarter criminals and doesn't reduce crime mainly aggravate it by taking more money away from society and acting like the victim cuz all they do is sue your assailant for a bunch of money and u the real victim don't get a dime


You cant say MOST people who deal with COPS have a bad experience. How do you know MOST people???? Do you have this in hard copy or is this opinion?


How do you know most people have had GOOD experiences with cops? How do you not see that is the SAME logic? Do you have that all cops are good in a "hard copy"? You are allowed to you use your personal experiences to back up your claim, but if some one else uses theirs they are just a no good criminal that is just lying at this point...



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 07:59 PM
link   

Sremmos80

projectbane

MOSTwanted

rojectbane
reply tupeurl=http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread993504/pg8#pid17442531]post by jrod[/url]
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)

People are scared because every time most people deal with a cop they are getting billed for services they don't want, have to spend a whole bunch of money on an attorney and many poor people plead guilty to jacked up charges that don't fit the offense and only benefit the state corporation and not the community just so they don't have to sit in jail for months. Count yours self as lucky. Some places, like where I live in Colorado, the justice department is run by a bunch of over ambitious, greedy bureacratical zealous unconstitutional pigs that don't care about due process or their oaths and the law, instead just making money off non crimes like traffic tickets which you don't need a license to travel on public roadways but they twist the definitions of everything same with taxes to make it sound like you have to pay them to exercise any rights, When that is fraud. They also insanely trump up charges and will find a way to llegally screw your life up u any way they can and are merciless in their tactics because they know they can scare u into a deal every time. They have nothing to lose in the process and are never held accountable and they are in business to make money nit to protect the slaves. The system only breeds smarter criminals and doesn't reduce crime mainly aggravate it by taking more money away from society and acting like the victim cuz all they do is sue your assailant for a bunch of money and u the real victim don't get a dime


You cant say MOST people who deal with COPS have a bad experience. How do you know MOST people???? Do you have this in hard copy or is this opinion?


How do you know most people have had GOOD experiences with cops? How do you not see that is the SAME logic? Do you have that all cops are good in a "hard copy"? You are allowed to you use your personal experiences to back up your claim, but if some one else uses theirs they are just a no good criminal that is just lying at this point...





No I have very good reasons for saying that. Mine are from professional personal opinion. I am not saying that others can not, but its easy for people on ATS to come on here and derail a thread by just saying it "happened to me".

After all, i created this thread and therefore asked for full explanations as I knew that most on here could NOT do that based on their ineptitude of knowing any real facts. They prefer the band wagon and its fits my theory approach!!



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 08:02 PM
link   
reply to post by Grimpachi
 


I know Grim but thats not what im saying.

Im saying compare the current state of the US to what the idea of the US is and define what a police state is from that and not comparing it to another police state.

Projectban please addres what i have presented in my last few post please.



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 08:06 PM
link   

projectbane

Sremmos80

projectbane

MOSTwanted

rojectbane
reply tupeurl=http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread993504/pg8#pid17442531]post by jrod[/url]
 



It just seems to me that people have been scared into having this state of mind (but not by any credible source or reason)....maybe watching that stupid program....what's its called oh yeah "fox news".


edit on 18-1-2014 by projectbane because: (no reason given)

People are scared because every time most people deal with a cop they are getting billed for services they don't want, have to spend a whole bunch of money on an attorney and many poor people plead guilty to jacked up charges that don't fit the offense and only benefit the state corporation and not the community just so they don't have to sit in jail for months. Count yours self as lucky. Some places, like where I live in Colorado, the justice department is run by a bunch of over ambitious, greedy bureacratical zealous unconstitutional pigs that don't care about due process or their oaths and the law, instead just making money off non crimes like traffic tickets which you don't need a license to travel on public roadways but they twist the definitions of everything same with taxes to make it sound like you have to pay them to exercise any rights, When that is fraud. They also insanely trump up charges and will find a way to llegally screw your life up u any way they can and are merciless in their tactics because they know they can scare u into a deal every time. They have nothing to lose in the process and are never held accountable and they are in business to make money nit to protect the slaves. The system only breeds smarter criminals and doesn't reduce crime mainly aggravate it by taking more money away from society and acting like the victim cuz all they do is sue your assailant for a bunch of money and u the real victim don't get a dime


You cant say MOST people who deal with COPS have a bad experience. How do you know MOST people???? Do you have this in hard copy or is this opinion?


How do you know most people have had GOOD experiences with cops? How do you not see that is the SAME logic? Do you have that all cops are good in a "hard copy"? You are allowed to you use your personal experiences to back up your claim, but if some one else uses theirs they are just a no good criminal that is just lying at this point...





No I have very good reasons for saying that. Mine are from professional personal opinion. I am not saying that others can not, but its easy for people on ATS to come on here and derail a thread by just saying it "happened to me".

After all, i created this thread and therefore asked for full explanations as I knew that most on here could NOT do that based on their ineptitude of knowing any real facts. They prefer the band wagon and its fits my theory approach!!



So there has been countless people on here that have told you personal experiences, my self included. And all you ever have to say to that is that we just have a "world against me" attitude. So I'd say we all have just as good reasons as do you. Unless you know us personally and have seen what we say happened different then we say. Then you have no merit to say our experiences mean less to the issue then your own



posted on Jan, 18 2014 @ 08:07 PM
link   

onequestion
reply to post by Grimpachi
 


I know Grim but thats not what im saying.

Im saying compare the current state of the US to what the idea of the US is and define what a police state is from that and not comparing it to another police state.

Projectban please addres what i have presented in my last few post please.


WHAT??? "compare the stat of the US to the idea of the US"

Idea is massively subjective, 310 million people with different ideas of what the US should be, many political groups with their ideas, and the countless religions with theirs. There is NOT just ONE ideal or idea that would be significantly more important that another. The greatness of the USA is that MANY ideals are brought together and interlinked with many different aspects of cultures from all over the world. To use the comment you did just makes a mockery and simplifies this AWESOME country!!



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