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Fukushima radiation… what you need to know and why

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posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 08:53 PM
link   

dragonridr
Lets explain it this way dirt will act as a natural filter allowing water to seep out but at the same time acts like a filter to heavier elements like tritium etc. Works alot like an oil filter in your car. Oil passes through the heavier sludge gets caught in the filter. This is why the radiation level spikes when measured per liter. There is less water but the same amount of radioactive material and you end up with huge numbers per liter. Now your right its a serious issue because they need that water to keep the fuel rods cool.Your looking at 3 to 5 years to cool them down. See when a fuel rod is exposed to air it has to rely on air convection to remove heat and its just not capable of removing enough heat.Where water is forced convection meaning as water heats up cooler water travels under it. Now since we have never had a fuel rod melt down we are not entirely sure what happens. But lets say i wouldnt want to be around if one does.


Please provide your source stating that dirt will filter out radioisotopes. How is Tritium a heavy element. Its an Isotope of Hydrogen which is the lightest of elements its lighter and smaller than the whole H2O molecule. Also please explain your 'less water but same amount of radiation' statement it just doesn't make sense. And water and air convection is the same when air is heated up it rises and cooler are is replaced the reason it is not as effective in cooling is because its less dense and the specific heat of air is a lot lower than water. Also we have had nuclear fuel rods melt down there have been multiple civilian and military meltdowns the US govt. has even purposely melted down rods for testing.




posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 08:57 PM
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reply to post by RickinVa
 


ALPS restarted on the 01/10/14,
also you need to remember and to mention that ALPS
is still in the hot phase of Testing!
ALPS

It is a very bad Research when you base your Opinion
only on Article from Russia Today!

You are able to see if ALPS is working or not
in their Reports, that simple and you don't need Rt.!

edit on 24-1-2014 by Human0815 because: tip



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 09:38 PM
link   

Human0815
reply to post by RickinVa
 


ALPS restarted on the 01/10/14,
also you need to remember and to mention that ALPS
is still in the hot phase of Testing!
ALPS

It is a very bad Research when you base your Opinion
only on Article from Russia Today!

You are able to see if ALPS is working or not
in their Reports, that simple and you don't need Rt.!

edit on 24-1-2014 by Human0815 because: tip



I posted 5 links as reference for my post.... I suggest you go back and read them because you are clearly mistaken...If you would like to address the issues in the post, please do. ALPS is offline... has been for a few days now and is not expected to come back online anytime soon. ALPS does not filter 99% of radiation, again f you would like to discuss this as well, please do.. it's on topic

I do not trust any information from Tepco. Plain and simple.


The topic of my post was why ALPS is basically a failure.... if you would like to discuss this, please do...Thanks!


edit on R472014-01-24T21:47:13-06:00k471Vpm by RickinVa because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 10:02 PM
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reply to post by RickinVa
 


You can't discuss a Topic when your knowledge is based
on wrong Information!

Tepco provided and provide the Information if ALPS is
working or not, Rt mention it only when it stopped but
never when it is going back Online!

Tepco provide a regular Update every 72 Hours what is goin
on with the Water and you can see if ALPS is working or not!

See such a Update

Also ALPS is only one Huge Instrument but not the whole Water Treatment.



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 10:11 PM
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reply to post by poet1b
 


Actually this is wrong,
also Strontium Test/ Measurements need a very long Time,
afair. ca. 500 Hours,
this means that the actual Test are at least 21 Days old!

Strontium in the Environment



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 10:14 PM
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Human0815
reply to post by poet1b
 


Actually this is wrong,
also Strontium Test/ Measurements need a very long Time,
afair. ca. 500 Hours,
this means that the actual Test are at least 21 Days old!

Strontium in the Environment


posted to wrong post
edit on R162014-01-24T22:16:41-06:00k161Vpm by RickinVa because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 10:17 PM
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Human0815
reply to post by RickinVa
 


You can't discuss a Topic when your knowledge is based
on wrong Information!

Tepco provided and provide the Information if ALPS is
working or not, Rt mention it only when it stopped but
never when it is going back Online!

Tepco provide a regular Update every 72 Hours what is goin
on with the Water and you can see if ALPS is working or not!

See such a Update

Also ALPS is only one Huge Instrument but not the whole Water Treatment.



Then we just agree to disagree... I think there was more than enough information provided. Are you saying the file from tepco that was used in one of the links is false?



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 10:29 PM
link   

Human0815
reply to post by RickinVa
 


You can't discuss a Topic when your knowledge is based
on wrong Information!

Tepco provided and provide the Information if ALPS is
working or not, Rt mention it only when it stopped but
never when it is going back Online!

Tepco provide a regular Update every 72 Hours what is goin
on with the Water and you can see if ALPS is working or not!

See such a Update

Also ALPS is only one Huge Instrument but not the whole Water Treatment.


In that Ineptco's 'report' you referenced I see words like 'planned', 'forecast', 'accumulated water' and 'Simulation Results'... I don't see any actual 'results' of how many tons of water has actually been filtered. Please point out exactly where it says ALPS is actually up, running and working as it is claimed to be?
edit on 24-1-2014 by wishes because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 10:30 PM
link   
reply to post by RickinVa
 


No, you said that the Tepco Files are false, not me!

I try to tell you that Rt provide only the Information about failures
but never when there are steps forward.

Rt provide Infos for People who are negative,
their Customer believe in Doom Porn, that the World Conspiracy
is ruled by Israel and that we all go to Die,
all this People create a negative Loop with the Result of unhappiness,
suffering and pain!



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 10:43 PM
link   

Human0815
reply to post by RickinVa
 


No, you said that the Tepco Files are false, not me!

I try to tell you that Rt provide only the Information about failures
but never when there are steps forward.

Rt provide Infos for People who are negative,
their Customer believe in Doom Porn, that the World Conspiracy
is ruled by Israel and that we all go to Die,
all this People create a negative Loop with the Result of unhappiness,
suffering and pain!


we will just agree to disagree to stay on topic



posted on Jan, 24 2014 @ 10:57 PM
link   
reply to post by Human0815
 




TEPCO restarts water treatment system at Fukushima January 10, 2014 ]TEPCO has been running the system on a test basis and hopes to start full operation in April. But ALPS has been hit by a series of troubles and it remains unknown whether the system can operate reliably.

fukushimaupdate.com...

Running it on a test basis... 'hopes' to start full operation in April... doesn't sound like it's up and running at all to me... only been 3 years, what's another few decades to let these clowns play.
edit on 24-1-2014 by wishes because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 25 2014 @ 03:19 PM
link   
reply to post by Human0815
 


What is wrong?

Please add some specifics.

Are you claiming strontium is not what makes up most of the radioactive materials in the waste water?

Not all strontium is radioactive. This has nothing to do with what I posted.



posted on Jan, 25 2014 @ 04:33 PM
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poet1b
reply to post by Human0815
 


What is wrong?

Please add some specifics.

Are you claiming strontium is not what makes up most of the radioactive materials in the waste water?

Not all strontium is radioactive. This has nothing to do with what I posted.


Strontium is the second most common fission product after Cesium.

Its less abundant in water because strontium it self is water insoluble but it dose react with water to to create water soluble compounds and that is how it finds it's way into water.



posted on Jan, 25 2014 @ 08:43 PM
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Everybody is ignoring the things they do not want to discuss about ALPS... or OOPS.

1. It hasn't achieved a 99% removal rate of radionuclides.
2. It won't be able to achieve 99% without a change of its core radionuclide removal process.
3. It creates a large amount of highly radioactive toxic sludge... or slurry if you prefer that word, same thing basically.
4. The sludge/slurry has to be stored somewhere for thousands of years.
5. The containers to store the sludge/slurry have not been approved by the Japanese government.
6. Tepco has no long term plans for storage of the sludge/slurry created by ALPS.

I do not care about other filtration systems in place at Fukushima... this discussion is about Tepco claiming that ALPS can clean the water of 99% of its radionuclides so it can be dumped in the ocean... it can't plain and simple.

Anybody want discuss these issues?

Or do we just rely on the fact that Tepco says "Go to sleep my little sheep... everything is going to be fine"??????

I posted a link to a file that I thought was from Tepco, it's actually a file from the Ministry of Economic Trade and Indusrty (METI) dated Nov 29. 2013 that basically says ALPS has major problems. Please do not repeat that I said every file from Tepco is false... I said I do not trust the information from Tepco.... especially when they try to make people look through rose colored glasses but when I see information from a closed meeting that someone posts for the public to see... I have to investigate that.

Link to pdf from METI... it is in Japanese so I would like to get a second opinion on the exact translation of what it says from a neutral party who can read Japanese. www.meti.go.jp...

When information is posted to a thread that ALPS is the greatest thing since sliced bread, well I have to verify that for myself... I couldn't.... too many questions about the tests of ALPS so far... and none of them have been very positive.

Sadly for me, it has come to the point where I just simply have to ignore posts from users who keep posting the same things over and over... it does no good for the thread, it's an attempt to divert the thread away from certain topics and takes away from discussion by renewing debates on things we have already debated numerous times.

Attack the ball, not the player!!!!



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posted on Jan, 25 2014 @ 09:59 PM
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reply to post by RickinVa
 


Yes, I'm very interested in what they're doing (and not doing) there. I wasn't able to find anything substantial that the ALPS is up and running and performing to such a high standard, perhaps there are things in that report I wasn't able to see. I came across some debates about where the waste is going and am guessing they'll force it on the poorest neighborhoods or country. As far as I'm concerned they should put in in Abe's and the Tepco/IAEA officials backyards and see then how well they can solve problems.



posted on Jan, 25 2014 @ 10:04 PM
link   

wishes
reply to post by RickinVa
 


Yes, I'm very interested in what they're doing (and not doing) there. I wasn't able to find anything substantial that the ALPS is up and running and performing to such a high standard, perhaps there are things in that report I wasn't able to see. I came across some debates about where the waste is going and am guessing they'll force it on the poorest neighborhoods or country. As far as I'm concerned they should put in in Abe's and the Tepco/IAEA officials backyards and see then how well they can solve problems.


It's hard to find information but it's there if you look for it.. I personally think to dismiss something simply because Tepco didn't say it is just wrong... I try to look at all sources for information, and sometimes you have to pull a lot of weeds before the flowers can breathe.... I, myself, do not arbitrarily dismiss information from Tepco. But they have a huge financial interest in everything they say or put out to the public. Just like some of the doom prophets out there.
edit on R072014-01-25T22:07:24-06:00k071Vpm by RickinVa because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 25 2014 @ 10:49 PM
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reply to post by RickinVa
 


I tried using several online translators but it really is hard to make out.... anybody read Japanese out there that could translate this to English? Somebody that could care less about Fukushima? I just want a neutral third party.



posted on Jan, 25 2014 @ 10:53 PM
link   
reply to post by RickinVa
 


I said since we started to talk about ALPS that you need to read
the Files because it was clear that ALPS it self is still in a Test Phase


It is also clear that the final Sludge is highly toxic.

You need also to understand that the Filtration is not only based on ALPS
but on 4-6 other Facilities.

Sadly i cant post Images from a Pdf but i will look for it,
nice as i am!



posted on Jan, 26 2014 @ 02:32 AM
link   

BGTM90

dragonridr
Lets explain it this way dirt will act as a natural filter allowing water to seep out but at the same time acts like a filter to heavier elements like tritium etc. Works alot like an oil filter in your car. Oil passes through the heavier sludge gets caught in the filter. This is why the radiation level spikes when measured per liter. There is less water but the same amount of radioactive material and you end up with huge numbers per liter. Now your right its a serious issue because they need that water to keep the fuel rods cool.Your looking at 3 to 5 years to cool them down. See when a fuel rod is exposed to air it has to rely on air convection to remove heat and its just not capable of removing enough heat.Where water is forced convection meaning as water heats up cooler water travels under it. Now since we have never had a fuel rod melt down we are not entirely sure what happens. But lets say i wouldnt want to be around if one does.


Please provide your source stating that dirt will filter out radioisotopes. How is Tritium a heavy element. Its an Isotope of Hydrogen which is the lightest of elements its lighter and smaller than the whole H2O molecule. Also please explain your 'less water but same amount of radiation' statement it just doesn't make sense. And water and air convection is the same when air is heated up it rises and cooler are is replaced the reason it is not as effective in cooling is because its less dense and the specific heat of air is a lot lower than water. Also we have had nuclear fuel rods melt down there have been multiple civilian and military meltdowns the US govt. has even purposely melted down rods for testing.


Simple water is easily absorbed into dirt hydrogen is not it bonds differently oxygen likes to bond with everything. This is why we get explosions. Now tritium which is 3 hydrogen atoms also known as H3 all over the moon and an excellent fuel source. Any way back to the discussion tritium will not make it as far as water and this causes it to condense. Ill use the example of a coffee filter. water easily passes through it however the grains that make up coffee do not. So all the water passes through and only some of the chemicals in coffee the rest remain in the filter. This works the same way water leaves some tritium escapes but alot more water does. This is why they can use it to gauge if there is a leak in the tank. If tritium levels rise water is leaking out. Now air convection and water convection are different water uses whats called forced convection. This is because water has pressure which changes the way it interacts with heat. In water a mass transfer occurs taking heat with it this is called advection.



posted on Jan, 26 2014 @ 02:44 AM
link   

Human0815
reply to post by RickinVa
 


You can't discuss a Topic when your knowledge is based
on wrong Information!

Tepco provided and provide the Information if ALPS is
working or not, Rt mention it only when it stopped but
never when it is going back Online!

Tepco provide a regular Update every 72 Hours what is goin
on with the Water and you can see if ALPS is working or not!

See such a Update

Also ALPS is only one Huge Instrument but not the whole Water Treatment.


Yes the original water filtration system was called sarry thats still running its problem was it wasnt designed to handle the additional load placed on it it was a closed system. Now with the accident all water on site has to be treated and supposedly Alps filters out all but tritium. I know they've had severe problems with it i think mitsubishi might want to redesign the tank since that seems to be the biggest problem it leaks and clogs alot. This is what happens when people who were not trained assemble the system perhaps.



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