China Plans To Seize South China Sea Island From Philippines, Says "Battle Will Be Restricted"

elysiumfire
dragonridr:

...the US would own the skies over China...

The air war would be fought over the Philippines, not China. You attack mainland China at your peril. The problem with Americans is that they have access to computers by which they are able to display their innate stupidity for the whole world to see.

There would be no air war over the Philippines. China has zero ability to project air power there if the US stepped in. China would either concede defeat, or the air war would continue to mainland china where the US would eventually take control and annihilate their infrastructure until China had enough. You INVADE China at your own peril. Landing large amounts of troops would be disastrous for the US, and would not occur.

EA006

OccamsRazor04

EA006

China 100% would never succeed in landing troops on our mainland, they have zero force projection powers. Zero. Look at their naval power compared to the US. China would also lose all the land they have purchased world wide as the US and it's allies simply took it all. China does not have any ability to defend this land.

Aren't there Chinese troops in Mexico?

I'm sorry what US naval blockade did those troops have to go through? Moving peacetime troops has what to do with trying to move several hundred thousand troops to the US? Unless you think a few troops in Mexico (who would attack the Chinese troops for us most likely) are going to invade the US I fail to see your point.

Yawn, they didn't bring anything with them?. Just a bunch of troops?
America *uck yeah

edit on 12-1-2014 by EA006 because: Manners

Show me what they have. Now, when the war starts, and the US tells Mexico to "detain" all Chinese forces or we will start bombing the Chinese in Mexico what do you think Mexico will do? You think Mexico will be pleased that China tried dragging them into a war with the US? Mexico will be PISSED and ensure all Chinese forces in Mexico are not a problem. It's hilarious you think a small force in Mexico will conquer mainland US. Hilarious.

EA006

Please show me what China has that would allow it to either A) bomb the US mainland via aircraft or B) land troops in the US mainland. I will wait for it.

All warfare is based on deception. China has friends with this capacity, even if and i doubt this, they can't get them there themselves.

Something I thought about saying earlier, but didn't.

If the US and China really came down to it, how long would they stay the only ones involved. There is a reason this is in the WWIII forum. Who would likely jump in to help China and would they have the transports that China lacks. Heck, just being able to move through Russian territory to invade through the Arctic cuts the distance needed for transport. If they're fast enough, they could potentially establish a northern beachhead and move down that way.

Japan tried it.

Now, a Japanese military force had stepped foot on American soil – and the 500 had grown to over 5,000 men. Although Kiska and neighboring Attu (which had been overrun two days previously) were part of the distant Aleutian Islands they were, nevertheless, American. Plans were immediately drawn up to retake the island, known as the Aleutian Campaign. The campaign would not succeed for over a year and would claim many American lives.

It failed for various reasons, among them the inability of the Japanese to keep their supply line open, but they weren't captured or killed, either. They escaped and in the ensuring investigation over 100 more Americans were killed by the leftover booby traps and unexploded ordinance.

If the Chinese planned it correctly, this could be a potential avenue for invasion that wouldn't relay as heavily on long distance transport making it easier to move a substantial force depending on when and how it was done - the Bering Sea is not kind.

EA006
reply to post by Krazysh0t

 

If that is your final stance on this, Happy hunting. You're in for a shock.

LOL. Again, our military spending outpaces the next TEN or so other countries. That includes China and whoever they can dig up to help them. Then you can go ahead and add the UK, Australia, Japan, South Korea, Philippines, New Zealand, France, Germany, Italy, Greece, maybe Russia, Mexico, Canada, and whoever else wants to help divvy up the large swath of land known as China. If you think that a war with China will be anything but a bloodbath of Chinese blood, you are gravely mistaken. I don't care how many people there are in China, our technological superiority is just massively ahead of theirs.

EA006

Please show me what China has that would allow it to either A) bomb the US mainland via aircraft or B) land troops in the US mainland. I will wait for it.

All warfare is based on deception. China has friends with this capacity, even if and i doubt this, they can't get them there themselves.

So basically you have zero evidence China can do this, but will still say they can because it makes you feel good to believe it. Sweet. I will stick with facts, and will wait for you to show me how China can do this .. as it is 100% impossible for them to have friends that can do it, as there is NO NATION ON EARTH that can successfully invade the US mainland. You clearly have no idea about worldwide naval forces.

ketsuko
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

I guess it depends on where the theater winds up being. Are we assuming an invasion of US soil or fighting over in Asia again? If the latter, does it matter that they can't send their men our way? We would be coming to them.

Yes, because we would not be landing boots in Asia, thus their troops are worthless in mainland China. We would be sending in small special forces units, controlling the skies, and then bombing them into submission. We would never attempt a land invasion of China, there would be no point. So the only use for Chinese troops is to land them on our soil.

I like to keep a few things in mind when considering China. They matter...a lot, IMO.

First is economy of scale and they have us beat by a country mile for the very same reason the US came out how it did from World War II. Geographically, we can't put every area of China's soil at risk or gain full air superiority. Nor can they, to us. We both know it, and the result is war machine on both sides, protected enough to grind away for a long long time, if it didn't escalate to WMD quickly.

China could numerically lose the same as every man, woman and child of the U.S. Population ..and only have lost about 1/4 of their population.

China doesn't spend as much as we do...but we're complete idiots too. We happily pay the WORLD'S R&D tab for high tech military development we then sell the end results of like toys at christmas for pennies of profit and call it a good day. The rest of the world just has to get a copy to reverse engineer or outright steal the tech/plans and they just saved a fair portion of the 600+ Billion a year the US puts out. (and of course, China doesn't have bases in every little back corner of the globe..and a base in range to support that one)

Krazysh0t

ketsuko
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

I guess it depends on where the theater winds up being. Are we assuming an invasion of US soil or fighting over in Asia again? If the latter, does it matter that they can't send their men our way? We would be coming to them.

Ok, let's assume that the conflict will be in East Asia. The Philippines aren't very big, they can only hold so much. Not to mention they can be easily bombed from the sea. China would have a difficult time defending them without air and naval support. Infantry numbers would be worthless in that regard. Again, China may have the people, but does it tech to arm and utilize all of them? We have drones and non-nuclear ICBM's that we can launch at any Chinese target, whether in reclaimed Philippine territory or in mainland China. We could EASILY soften the Chinese up while gearing for a full scale invasion. As soon as we win the air war over China's mainland, it will just be a matter of time before they lose. Again the casualties will heavily favor the Chinese. We will have some, but it won't be too bad.

You've confirmed my suspicion. You haven't thought this through.
America nuked the Japanese because estimated casualties were over 500k. Not many eh?

reply to post by OccamsRazor04

Mexico will be PISSED and ensure all Chinese forces in Mexico are not a problem. It's hilarious you think a small force in Mexico will conquer mainland US. Hilarious.

Found this funny. I don't know how many Chinese troops are down in Mexico but unless it's a ton of them it's doubtful they'll even make it as far north as Austin.

elysiumfire
OccamsRazor04:

How does having nuclear weapons magically allow you to transport troops over the Pacific to the US mainland?

Point out where in my post I mentioned anything about troops. You won't find it because I didn't write about it! I wrote about the projective power of their nukes, not troops. Are you really this incapable of discerning what I meant?

No, you must simply have reading comprehension issues since I discussed nuclear attacks in the post of mine you replied to. I clearly stated they have no way of projecting CONVENTIONAL forces, and then said they can use nukes but they wouldnt.

You replied saying I am wrong and they can force project because they have nukes. So my question remains, how do nukes give them magical force projection powers for CONVENTIONAL forces as that is what I stated they can not project. Maybe Americans just get a better education and can understand English better.

EA006

Krazysh0t

ketsuko
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

I guess it depends on where the theater winds up being. Are we assuming an invasion of US soil or fighting over in Asia again? If the latter, does it matter that they can't send their men our way? We would be coming to them.

Ok, let's assume that the conflict will be in East Asia. The Philippines aren't very big, they can only hold so much. Not to mention they can be easily bombed from the sea. China would have a difficult time defending them without air and naval support. Infantry numbers would be worthless in that regard. Again, China may have the people, but does it tech to arm and utilize all of them? We have drones and non-nuclear ICBM's that we can launch at any Chinese target, whether in reclaimed Philippine territory or in mainland China. We could EASILY soften the Chinese up while gearing for a full scale invasion. As soon as we win the air war over China's mainland, it will just be a matter of time before they lose. Again the casualties will heavily favor the Chinese. We will have some, but it won't be too bad.

You've confirmed my suspicion. You haven't thought this through.
America nuked the Japanese because estimated casualties were over 500k. Not many eh?

Are you seriously comparing American military might of the 1940's to today's military? Do I even have to refute this point out of silliness? Can we just move along?

OccamsRazor04

EA006

Please show me what China has that would allow it to either A) bomb the US mainland via aircraft or B) land troops in the US mainland. I will wait for it.

All warfare is based on deception. China has friends with this capacity, even if and i doubt this, they can't get them there themselves.

So basically you have zero evidence China can do this, but will still say they can because it makes you feel good to believe it. Sweet. I will stick with facts, and will wait for you to show me how China can do this .. as it is 100% impossible for them to have friends that can do it, as there is NO NATION ON EARTH that can successfully invade the US mainland. You clearly have no idea about worldwide naval forces.

Your not thinking this through either. I don't favor the Chinese in any way. "we've got better sh*t than them so they can't do it"
Germany had superior armaments that's why you nicked them after the war. You just built stuff faster than them. Superior numbers.....

TDawgRex
reply to post by ketsuko

 

Well, lets see how the average American thinks after a couple of cities have been nuked. or have had biological warfare introduced.

I think that China is not above those tactics if they are losing a "Restricted battle".

I think you don't understand the reverence they have for China. For them it's the only part of the world that matters. They know if they use nukes we will as well, and we will destroy China. They would be responsible for destroying the only part of Earth that matters. They would instead choose to not do so, and lie in wait until they can rise again. Nukes could mean the end of China for the rest of history.

Bassago
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

Mexico will be PISSED and ensure all Chinese forces in Mexico are not a problem. It's hilarious you think a small force in Mexico will conquer mainland US. Hilarious.

Found this funny. I don't know how many Chinese troops are down in Mexico but unless it's a ton of them it's doubtful they'll even make it as far north as Austin.

I'd say that they'd make as far as Brownsville.

Maybe a mile or two further. LOL

Krazysh0t

EA006

Krazysh0t

ketsuko
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

I guess it depends on where the theater winds up being. Are we assuming an invasion of US soil or fighting over in Asia again? If the latter, does it matter that they can't send their men our way? We would be coming to them.

Ok, let's assume that the conflict will be in East Asia. The Philippines aren't very big, they can only hold so much. Not to mention they can be easily bombed from the sea. China would have a difficult time defending them without air and naval support. Infantry numbers would be worthless in that regard. Again, China may have the people, but does it tech to arm and utilize all of them? We have drones and non-nuclear ICBM's that we can launch at any Chinese target, whether in reclaimed Philippine territory or in mainland China. We could EASILY soften the Chinese up while gearing for a full scale invasion. As soon as we win the air war over China's mainland, it will just be a matter of time before they lose. Again the casualties will heavily favor the Chinese. We will have some, but it won't be too bad.

You've confirmed my suspicion. You haven't thought this through.
America nuked the Japanese because estimated casualties were over 500k. Not many eh?

Are you seriously comparing American military might of the 1940's to today's military? Do I even have to refute this point out of silliness? Can we just move along?

It's a different military. yes. It's not 1940's Japan you'd be fighting. It's modern day China. Silliness?

ketsuko

EA006

Please show me what China has that would allow it to either A) bomb the US mainland via aircraft or B) land troops in the US mainland. I will wait for it.

All warfare is based on deception. China has friends with this capacity, even if and i doubt this, they can't get them there themselves.

Something I thought about saying earlier, but didn't.

If the US and China really came down to it, how long would they stay the only ones involved. There is a reason this is in the WWIII forum. Who would likely jump in to help China and would they have the transports that China lacks. Heck, just being able to move through Russian territory to invade through the Arctic cuts the distance needed for transport. If they're fast enough, they could potentially establish a northern beachhead and move down that way.

Japan tried it.

Now, a Japanese military force had stepped foot on American soil – and the 500 had grown to over 5,000 men. Although Kiska and neighboring Attu (which had been overrun two days previously) were part of the distant Aleutian Islands they were, nevertheless, American. Plans were immediately drawn up to retake the island, known as the Aleutian Campaign. The campaign would not succeed for over a year and would claim many American lives.

It failed for various reasons, among them the inability of the Japanese to keep their supply line open, but they weren't captured or killed, either. They escaped and in the ensuring investigation over 100 more Americans were killed by the leftover booby traps and unexploded ordinance.

If the Chinese planned it correctly, this could be a potential avenue for invasion that wouldn't relay as heavily on long distance transport making it easier to move a substantial force depending on when and how it was done - the Bering Sea is not kind.

India would most likely jump in on America's side, along with other Asian nations. Russia knows the outcome and would stay neutral .. I could possibly see Russia joining in to take some Chinese land. Allowing China to move through Russia would open them up to be bombed by US forces thus destroying Russian infrastructure. China would have NK as an ally .. that's about it.

Now Russia might provide some secret aid .. but nothing that can be directly traced back to them.

OccamsRazor04

TDawgRex
reply to post by ketsuko

 

Well, lets see how the average American thinks after a couple of cities have been nuked. or have had biological warfare introduced.

I think that China is not above those tactics if they are losing a "Restricted battle".

I think you don't understand the reverence they have for China. For them it's the only part of the world that matters. They know if they use nukes we will as well, and we will destroy China. They would be responsible for destroying the only part of Earth that matters. They would instead choose to not do so, and lie in wait until they can rise again. Nukes could mean the end of China for the rest of history.

I've pretty much agreed with you for the most part throughout the thread, but I will have to disagree with you here. Not to say that you aren't correct; just to say that I would NEVER rule nuclear use out for a country in possession of nuclear weapons. You never know what someone will do when cornered, and we'd have a very good chance of cornering China pretty quickly if we went to war with them.

reply to post by ketsuko


Japan had SERIOUS naval power and SERIOUS force projection capabilities. China does not.

reply to post by OccamsRazor04


I think that I do understand China. Maybe to well. They are more nationalistic than your average American. They also, on the average, think that they are better than everyone else. Their own polls show this as well as the leaders saying such.

But they are seriously mistaken, if they think that Americans are weak kneed when attacked.

But I digress, this topic is about China attacking the Phillipines isn't it. And how we would respond.

EA006

Krazysh0t

EA006

Krazysh0t

ketsuko
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

I guess it depends on where the theater winds up being. Are we assuming an invasion of US soil or fighting over in Asia again? If the latter, does it matter that they can't send their men our way? We would be coming to them.

Ok, let's assume that the conflict will be in East Asia. The Philippines aren't very big, they can only hold so much. Not to mention they can be easily bombed from the sea. China would have a difficult time defending them without air and naval support. Infantry numbers would be worthless in that regard. Again, China may have the people, but does it tech to arm and utilize all of them? We have drones and non-nuclear ICBM's that we can launch at any Chinese target, whether in reclaimed Philippine territory or in mainland China. We could EASILY soften the Chinese up while gearing for a full scale invasion. As soon as we win the air war over China's mainland, it will just be a matter of time before they lose. Again the casualties will heavily favor the Chinese. We will have some, but it won't be too bad.

You've confirmed my suspicion. You haven't thought this through.
America nuked the Japanese because estimated casualties were over 500k. Not many eh?

Are you seriously comparing American military might of the 1940's to today's military? Do I even have to refute this point out of silliness? Can we just move along?

It's a different military. yes. It's not 1940's Japan you'd be fighting. It's modern day China. Silliness?

Did China keep pace with American military buildup following WWII? No? They actually fell behind the modern world by about 50 years and only JUST caught up like 20 years ago? You don't say... I'd say that our modern tech easily outnumbers as well as is far superior than anything they'd sport. AGAIN we outpace military spending by the next TEN countries combined. Are you not registering that fact? Then we have half the world as our world allies. All China has is a boat load of people that they cannot send en mass to anywhere.