Let’s say that I am a business. Why should I care for your family?

1. Minimum wage based on 1965 should be over $20/hr now. If wages were proportionately increased by scale, you wouldn't have to take care of your employees.

2. You passed NAFTA and sent jobs away that paid well enough for employees to pay for their own benefits.

3. You started the benefits idea to save money. You save by not retraining. You save by getting a wholesale price for insurance in group costs. You save by having fewer accidents and absents from health. You started it to attract better employees, and to keep them from wanting to change jobs. That spoiled competitive wages.

Try to stop thinking just capitalistic, think about others.

(I owned/ran a successful business for 20 years)

reply to post by TDawgRex


In a word .................... no

BUT

My old boss retired recently, he was old school, it was all about quality, he didn't know my family but made sure to know what was going in our lives and treated us accordingly, kid gloves when in times of trauma and an iron fist when needed.

I respected him and would work all the hours under the sun if he so asked.

I have a new boss now, new school, it's about figures and office speak, he isn't in the least bit interested in us.

Result ? Drop in productivity, rise in resentment and a loss of moral.

Look after your workers ?

Not necessarily but at least show an interest in them.

Cody

Because it is questions like this one that got us into this situation in the first place from what I understand.

Business should be as involved in the family ... as government. IOW, the very idea of this is simply a HUGE mistake.

If you know what you're worth, being employed should be no problem for you. If you can't find a job, start your own business and compete your ass off. *Note* competing your ass off will tire you out faster than working a shovel or a sledge hammer. In ascending order of difficulty ... I have worked for others, I have worked for myself, and I have owned a business.

As a business owner I knew better than to take on more than I could handle. Each employee was promised a salary ... and they got paid. Anyone who wanted to hassle me didn't get paid anymore. I had one guy quit on me for a better deal elsewhere. He was begging for his job back inside of a year. Some people will never realize what they're worth.

I find it a LOT easier working for someone ... than making the big bucks. The money's not worth it.

Personal to brotherman: You're getting screwed too frequently. There's a reason for this.

reply to post by Snarl


It's easy to say I am getting screwed too frequently when you are not me and I have to do something. I know going into some jobs it isn't always the best deal but it is what I have to do at the time to pay my way. I never had a silver spoon I grew up poor, I don't have anything, it's really easy to say one thing or another but you are not here to see how it all works here and now with me at least. Its really easy to bully a guy that hasn't eaten in 4 days that can't sleep cause its #ing cold, the whole nature of the beast isn't to get good employees or people that are good to stay, why do you think temp agencies are so popular? I don't want to hear about how often I get screwed, I think everyone is getting screwed quite a bit some get it others do not. I'd like to hear your reasoning for why I get screwed frequently and there is a reason for it, what is this reason? Do we know each other or something?

reply to post by Brotherman

You have knowledge and skill. I read what you wrote. My observation lead to a simple conclusion. I learned that the hard way myself, and apparently, you will too. FTR, I started poor and busted ass all the way to the top over a 20 year span. My 'silver spoon' is kept because it was crafted with my own two hands.

If you felt offended by my previous post, I'm sorry. That was not intended. I certainly do not post here with bullying in mind.

-Cheers

reply to post by Snarl


I never had an upper hand I served in the USMC since I was 17 till 23 as an 0311 serving 4 tours in OIF came home to nothing went homeless twice, I am the gutter, and I've been patiently changing things because I don't like them. To be honest if I had real freedom I'd do it like my grandpa he had a farm he taught all of us, my uncles, and my cousins, me, welding, mechanics, carpentry. Offensive I'd like to hear why you surmise you say there is a reason I get screwed. I told you, I get screwed because I don't have anything and the people that have anything to gain know it, some people call it good business others call it getting ass raped. Yeah it is offensive it sounded a whole lot like you know something; "personal Brotherman...", "there's a reason." I always like the advice, well you can afford the internet..., or the just get up and move, or the I know because of 20 plus years, or Mcdonlads is always hiring, or join the military, or sometimes you got to do $hitty jobs and work your way up, or the maybe your approach is wrong... and on and on and on. No it's not that it is this, things in America are all kinds of cattywampus all kinds of screwed up you have more people my age with every bit of drive and want educated, skilled, and motivated with no job market to get into without almost a lottery system of hiring. On top of that you have a greedy get rich off the back of every body else echelon, and to complicate it more you have the government sponsoring the temp agencies and their whole goal is to take part of your wage to fill an apparent "demand"

Yeah it did come a cross as not just offensive but almost a personal assault, sorry if I sound like the assh0le but it's warranted by how it was read.

EDIT: I do realize what you said in your last, I am just saying that I still don't think that it is that simple for others that are in differing situations to commonly agree and I hold no animosity or dislike towards you. I do mean what I said though.

When you have a society based on personal gain at all cost you end up with a bunch or cutthroat greedy selfish ignorant people. It's all about numero uno and F- everyone else. The government banks and corporations can all attest to that. Then you have the self righteous tell you the system worked for me.

reply to post by TDawgRex


To claim to BE a business (or a corporation) instead of a person is abandonment of fellow people. It is done but shouldn’t be. In the end, we are all people. The old cliché, you scratch my back, I scratch yours is true. WE ALL MAKE THE WORLD GO ‘ROUND. Our world, the world we live in. This earth isn’t just a planet, it’s our livelihood. If we are capable of ignoring the needs of other people while drowning in our own greed, we are the same people guilty of destroying our own livelihood. Our own existence is dependent on each other.

Does that mean we should work like slaves to support the lame a$$es? No, we all should be working for the good of each other. But that isn’t happening.

A short severe crisis solves many ills and a long one creates many more.

reply to post by TDawgRex


There is an "entitlement mentality" now.

Workers expects either government or business to take care of them.

I remember a time when people used to take pride in taking care of themselves.

reply to post by TDawgRex


You should care as part of the unwritten social contract of a civilized society. Otherwise you/your company are merely a parasite feeding off of the labor of others without an equitable trade-off for the other parties involved.

If you don't care about the health and well-being of your employees, why should you expect them to care about the health and well being of your business?

reply to post by kosmicjack


I work for a company.

They get a product for my time.
I get money for producing that product.

Why does it need to be complicated any further?

reply to post by beezzer


see above

beezzer
reply to post by kosmicjack

 

I work for a company.

They get a product for my time.
I get money for producing that product.

Why does it need to be complicated any further?

You may get money and/or benefits. It's all the same thing, more money to pay your own premiums for health care or less income and they pay your healthcare premiums. In the end, the Employer pays about the same, but now, your benefits are taxable. Why is this so difficult to figure out.

kosmicjack
reply to post by TDawgRex

 

You should care as part of the unwritten social contract of a civilized society.

Unwritten? Again, why should the employer care?

Otherwise you/your company are merely a parasite feeding off of the labor of others without an equitable trade-off for the other parties involved.

I disagree. The employer gets a product from the labor of the employee.
The employee gets rewarded with money for producing the product.

A symbiotic relationship because one cannot survive without the other.

If you don't care about the health and well-being of your employees, why should you expect them to care about the health and well being of your business?

The employer should just be concerned about the product and their customer base.
The employee should be concerned with producing the product is a safe environment and getting paid.


Why place an emotional element into it?

reply to post by beezzer


Because employees are PEOPLE. There is an emotional element to them whether you like it or not. As a hard working and loyal person, I am far more likely to give 110% and stay loyal to a company that treats me well than I am to a company that treats me as nothing more than a resource. If a company goes the extra mile to give me benefits, pay me well, and treat me like a PERSON and not a number, I will go above and beyond for that company. I will work my ass off for them, and stay with them through the good and bad.

If a company treats me like garbage or considers their only responsibility to be signing paychecks, chances are I will be biding my time and going to work while applying at other places until something better comes along.

Treat your employees well and be selective about who you hire, and they will reward you back with increased productivity and loyalty.

You should care about your employees and give them as many benefits and as high a pay as you can afford to. That's the bottom line. There is a point...a number that you can't go over. If you are losing money then you need to cut back to make a profit. I believe, though, that giving as high a wage and the best benefits it beneficial to your company. It's employee moral, higher productivity, less turnaround, less new higher training costs, better recruiting and on and on and on. When the cost of your benefits is so high that you're not making money...that's the line. We all know that treating people well pays dividends down the road in all kinds of meaningful and profitable ways. Edit to add that there are two issues here...treating people well because it's the right thing to do, or, if that doesn't matter to you...treating people well because selfishly it will make your business more profitable in the long term.

reply to post by DeadSeraph


That almost sounds like backmail though.

Treat me nice, or you won't get a good product out of me!

Companies used to pay nice wages, good benefits and yet unions would always demand more. Until the point where the companies became unsubstainable.

The individual is responsible for his/her own happiness, health, security.

It is not the responsibility of the government, corporations, to insure that a person is happy.

beezzer
reply to post by DeadSeraph

 

That almost sounds like backmail though.

Treat me nice, or you won't get a good product out of me!

Companies used to pay nice wages, good benefits and yet unions would always demand more. Until the point where the companies became unsubstainable.

The individual is responsible for his/her own happiness, health, security.

It is not the responsibility of the government, corporations, to insure that a person is happy.

Good point. I mean, factories in china have suicide nets to prevent their employees from plunging willingly to their own deaths and they still manage to make a profit and churn out decent products. Case closed I guess...

beezzer
reply to post by DeadSeraph

 

That almost sounds like backmail though.

Treat me nice, or you won't get a good product out of me!

Companies used to pay nice wages, good benefits and yet unions would always demand more. Until the point where the companies became unsubstainable.

The individual is responsible for his/her own happiness, health, security.

It is not the responsibility of the government, corporations, to insure that a person is happy.

Beezzer, REALLY??? You know as well as I that a person seeking employment will seek the highest benefits or wages possible. This is true beyond hundreds of years. Quit acting all innocent about the situation and face the reality even you acknowledge, unless of course, you are just trying to get a rile from the ATSer's.