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The Challenge of Baiting Anti-Christian and Similar Threads for Believers

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posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 10:41 AM
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reply to post by Klassified
 



You are right of course, in a perfect world we are supposed to walk away.


However how would you handle being put to death?

I am afraid I am to bullheaded to go willingly.




posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 10:43 AM
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0zzymand0s
I don't have any beef with those who are actually "Christ-like." If you live as Christ lived and do as he did, you are salt of the earth as far as I am concerned. Sadly, it has been my experience that most who claim to be Christian are anything but. They pray loudly and openly to glorify themselves. They keep more than 1 coat or 1 pair of shoes. They pay more attention to (and seek to emulate) Paul of Tarsus than they do Jesus Christ.


See? This is my problem with all of it. This is the default position. Oh, you are a Christian? Then you must be some worldly bastard who just mouths these things and doesn't believe them at all. And if anyone dares raise their head to say, "but ..." You feel justified in shouting them down or ignoring them.

You've already built such an impossible standard for what a Christian must be to really be a Christian (you do know that Christ was perfect and that no one else is or can be, right?) that no one else will ever measure up as far as you are concerned and thus you don't have to give them any credence. It's a very naet position to take, especially since no one posting on the 'net could possibly fit your standard.


Way to make a self-fulfilling prophecy.
edit on 11-1-2014 by ketsuko because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 10:43 AM
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DeadSeraph

jimmyx
for all of you constant religious whiners...it's not what you believe, nobody cares. it's what religious people have tried to do with that belief. go to your churches, pray and sing, speak in tongues, go through all the rituals you want. that is not the point, and most of you know that already.


Is that so? Maybe you can explain to me then why someone found it necessary to go so far as to hack my account and post anti-christian rhetoric under my name in just such a thread as the OP is referencing? What was that? an effort to liberate me from my own archaic, outmoded bronze age belief system? Was it an altruistic act veiled as an invasion of my privacy and dignity?

The OP is 100% correct.
edit on 11-1-2014 by DeadSeraph because: (no reason given)


WOW, that's scary, that's truly taking it to new lengths.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


Yes, but by some people's descriptions (atheists) merely talking about your faith in a positive way could be considered proselytizing. I figure that in a thread whose purpose is explicitly to talk about religion it's fair game to talk about, and to a certain extent, any speaking about being a Christian and what that means to you personally is proselytizing whether you intend to convert anyone by doing so or not.

So, if we are to stop all proselytizing, then by my understanding, I ought to stop talking about it all together. But how am I supposed to engage in discussions if I can't even do that? That's a bit extreme.

Merely by talking about what it means to you, you are proselytizing. When atheists talk about their lack of belief, they are also proselytizing although they don't look at it that way.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 10:49 AM
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reply to post by ketsuko
 





You've already built such an impossible standard for what a Christian must be to really be a Christian


Exactly.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 10:56 AM
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reply to post by Stormdancer777
 


Then there are the ones who get mad at you if you pull up verses or Biblical examples to support your position. I've had that happen once or twice. Why get involved in a debate with a Christian if you're not willing to accept that they will use scripture as part of their backing, especially when you talking about topics concerning right and wrong?

It's like getting caught up in a debate with a constitutional conservative and expecting them to defend themselves using something other than the COTUS.

It's the foundational document of our faith. Of course, you may not believe in it, but the Christian does and uses it as the basis for their faith. Asking them to completely disallow the major basis for their belief is like asking an MMA fighter to engage without two legs or an arm or leg.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 10:57 AM
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THANKS TO ONE AND ALL for y'all's ongoing posts.

I still have some other high priority stuff going on in my life. This thread is racing along so fast, I'm not likely to keep up for some days to come. Sorry. I'll do what I can.

Please just know that I'm reading all the posts as quickly as I can and starring those I find to be truest and most apt statements.

And, when I can comfortably get to respond in sequence picking up where I last left off, I'll do that.

There are a lot of really perceptive and pregnant posts already.

May learning and growth occur for all of us.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 11:02 AM
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I would like to note . . .

There used to be more of it . . . thankfully there's less now . . .

It used to be the case that if a Christian said anything about anything that even hinted of their Christianity, they were castigated up one side and down the other, flayed alive and salt and vinegar poured in the wounds . . . by a dogpile of posters. . . .

FINALLY folks began to realize that EVERYONE MUST WRITE OUT OF THEIR COSMOLOGY, THEIR PERSPECTIVE, THEIR WORLD VIEW.

And, guess what . . . the atheists et al did NOT get the EXCLUSIVE "right" to write out of their cosmology, perspective and values while Christians were totally prevented from doing so.

Thankfully, THAT absurdity did not reign here very thoroughly very long.

We still occasionally read some stupid rants toward such a ridiculous absurdity but not near as much any more. Thankfully.

Face it, deal with it--on any topic, when it comes to values and perspective, WE ALL WRITE OUT OF OUR VALUES AND PERSPECTIVE AND OUR OF OUR COSMOLOGY.

That includes Christians. So far, they still have the RIGHT to do that. And, it IS IMPOSSIBLE to write much of much significance WITHOUT doing so.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 11:26 AM
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ketsuko

0zzymand0s
I don't have any beef with those who are actually "Christ-like." If you live as Christ lived and do as he did, you are salt of the earth as far as I am concerned. Sadly, it has been my experience that most who claim to be Christian are anything but. They pray loudly and openly to glorify themselves. They keep more than 1 coat or 1 pair of shoes. They pay more attention to (and seek to emulate) Paul of Tarsus than they do Jesus Christ.


See? This is my problem with all of it. This is the default position. Oh, you are a Christian? Then you must be some worldly bastard who just mouths these things and doesn't believe them at all. And if anyone dares raise their head to say, "but ..." You feel justified in shouting them down or ignoring them.

You've already built such an impossible standard for what a Christian must be to really be a Christian (you do know that Christ was perfect and that no one else is or can be, right?) that no one else will ever measure up as far as you are concerned and thus you don't have to give them any credence. It's a very naet position to take, especially since no one posting on the 'net could possibly fit your standard.


Way to make a self-fulfilling prophecy.
edit on 11-1-2014 by ketsuko because: (no reason given)


To be honest, what Ozz said was no different than Jesus's actions against the Pharisees. While I would hold off on dismissing someone's faith if they owned more than 1 pair of shoes or more than 1 coat, the point would be those that bathe themselves in worldly possessions (like the Pharisees did). I believe that is the point Ozz was trying to make, which is an acceptable one. Correct me if I'm wrong Ozz.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 11:54 AM
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Stormdancer777
reply to post by BO XIAN
 





Though . . . I think, usually, the understanding so many have on the other side is quite shallow, cursory, glib, greatly flawed. Interestingly . . . even some who have evidently lived as a "Christian" and studied it extensively somehow end up sounding like they've never had more than a shallow EXPERIENCE of Christ. That's more than a little mystifying, puzzling.



Exactly, somewhat the point I made on another topic if someone debating the Bible doesn't even reference the Bible or have any Biblical knowledge whatsoever, their agenda is obvious, I have seen points made by atheist that have no bases in the text, the Bible can be so complicated.

They are just parroting what they have heard.
edit on 103131p://bSaturday2014 by Stormdancer777 because: (no reason given)



Now take that statement and substitute bible for science and atheist for Christian because that happens in almost every thread dealing with evolution or origins of the universe even ones dealing with the age of the earth.

Christians troll those subjects non stop and writing a thread complaining about it will not stop it however we will keep educating the ones who have the capacity to learn, but some go off on rants o where you can't even read their posts its like they have another language all unto themselves. I may be wrong, but I think I see some familiar posters here that are perpetrators of the same thing they are complaining about.

They know who they are.


edit on 11-1-2014 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 11:59 AM
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Would someone offer their full definition of "baiting" in this context? Keep in mind I already know that the dictionary says "to deliberately taunt or annoy someone" as well as "prepare (a hook, trap, net, or fishing area) with bait to entice fish or animals as prey" both from Google Dictionary.

The OP includes the term in the title, so the term is of primary relevance to the discussion. Many of you have used the term in your responses.

The reason I ask is that the ATS T&C very clearly forbids "political-baiting" and offers very specific definitions of same. It does not address religious baiting, although there are ample requirements to treat each other with respect.

This is not merely a rhetorical question. I believe that if we really understand each other better, we can avoid personal insults and concentrate on the subject matter, which I assume, is the primary reason we're all here anyway.

```````````````````

I made a logical error in my earlier post in this discussion in which I used false dichotomy. There are not only two possibilities: belief or non-belief. There is both physical and non-physical evidence that can be used both by people of faith and people of reason. We're all spectrums of rationality and irrationality, but the truth is very rarely purely one or the other. In fact, although a particular argument may take me in a temporarily different direction, I typically remain in the condition of Schrodinger's Cat.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:06 PM
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reply to post by BO XIAN
 


The simplest solution is to use 1 John 1:9 before posting any replies. Let the Holy Spirit guide your post.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:10 PM
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reply to post by freedom7
 


when we truly should be afraid is when everyone loves us and enjoys every word we say. That's normally a sign that somewhere in our lives we're compromising and becoming friends of the world. Something Christ explicitly warns us against.

Sorry to interrupt the back-patting here,
but, are you saying that being confrontational is part of your 'job'?

I haven't got past your post here in the thread yet, so I don't know what more there is to follow --
but this comment inspired me to jump in.

It sounds like you are TRYING to be a divisive, judgmental person, and you welcome being 'persecuted', and intend to behave in a way that keeps it in motion.






posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:13 PM
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reply to post by Gryphon66
 


BAITING, to me . . . in the context of these issues, this thread, and on ATS constitutes:

A thread title and/or OP or post which displays the following:

1. Fairly deliberate
2. Pointed, prickly, fiercely provocative wording in an evidently obnoxious, seemingly mean-spirited way
3. toward triggering a response from those targeted with the baiting
4. which the baitER can then easily and dramatically POUNCE on with great bile, bitterness, resentment, anger, hostility, haughtiness, insult etc.
5. asserting that the responses to the bait are the most ignorant, stupid, clueless, unscientific, baseless, totally false stinking pile to ever pollute the multiverse and particularly ATS.

more or less . . . imho.

mileage may vary.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:16 PM
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reply to post by Grimpachi
 


That would be because the mainstream theory of evolution has no scientific basis. There is no way for ape to become man. We all change within our own species, but creatures can not become a new species.

Much of what science observes regarding missing links within "human evolution" is evidence of cross genetic manipulation, which is recorded not only in the Bible, but the Sumerian tablets, Greek mythology, and other ancient myths. Why does "science" continue to ignore these factors.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:18 PM
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reply to post by Gryphon66
 


I am not sure what some are considering as bait but it may be somthing like these.



Intelligent Design is a self evident truth
Proof of God - Evidence that Cannot be Denied!
"Proof" of God.
Proof of God is found in Israel - Video
Undeniable Proof of Intelligent Design
The proof that God exists
Proof that Light is from God - Quantum Mechanics of Creation
Proof of God in Logic and Absolute Truth
The Real Scientific proof of GOD
No More Faith. I Have Real Proof of God.
100% Flawless Proof of God
We Have Proof God Exists
Scientific Proof of God – The Evidence,WITH SCIENCE AND THE BIBLE
Irrefutable evidence that God exists.
Instantaneous Synchronicity: Proof of God?


For me that screams bait but I think they refer to titles that express the opposite view.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:25 PM
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BELIEVERpriest
reply to post by Grimpachi
 


That would be because the mainstream theory of evolution has no scientific basis. There is no way for ape to become man. We all change within our own species, but creatures can not become a new species.

Much of what science observes regarding missing links within "human evolution" is evidence of cross genetic manipulation, which is recorded not only in the Bible, but the Sumerian tablets, Greek mythology, and other ancient myths. Why does "science" continue to ignore these factors.


Great post thanks for demonstrating exactly what I was talking about. First you claim there is no scientific bases then leave out the fact we are apes and sum it all up acknowledging science completely disagrees with you so your assume that science must be wrong with absolutely no evidence to back that up.

This post apllies to you


edit on 11-1-2014 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:27 PM
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reply to post by BO XIAN
 


The advice 1 would offer would be to remember the who you represent in discussion. When doing so it helps to control patience with deniers of that what you are attempting to share.
The patience allows you the transmitter of the information to sense those you are interacting withs mind states.
Meaning some are just taking jabs out of denial related ignorance.
This group would require more patience as they experience more. Ever see what EA*RTH time does to a un matured mentality 55 years around SOL? It the mentality begins to loosen up in the areas once held so secure to, a look inward can begin for others it still may take longer. The look inward is Contact even the most labeled brutal or powerful of society begin to LOOK after time and so contact is made after their lives experiences begin to rerun within the consciousness.

Some are really ignorant and may be just looking for you transmitting the information to clarify or bring Light even to a situation(s) they may have or be experiencing in their lives here... This is a target group potentially if reached early enough.

If not sensed again thru interactions which required your patience, then astray may you have lead some who again just are or may be looking for you transmitting the information to clarify or bring Light to their lives experiences.

Example- a child or group of children grow up in poverish 3rd world in-between or 1st world lowered economic conditions. How do you bring GOD to them when they experience many tribulations which convince-detach them even if incorrect that if there is a GOD the is not caring for them?
The return energy is many systems mental systems that then fuel physical action systems of extreme GLOBAL nefariousness.
Many are terrorized, deceived and lead astray from GOD then and walk into the arms of another group think that requires no GOD attachment, just good gimmickry & conscious deception even if not aware of SOUL/SPIRIT/INTERNAL ENERGY acts that may be done to them in parasitic from elsewhere as they host for being ignorant and then spreading it here in the observable physical.

Lenses uncleaned, perhaps left that way as to prevent the ignorance illusion emitted not to spread to far from its illusionist further entrapping the eye on thyself elsewhere and its close by followers them same suspending them like tranquilized safari animals in soul there why active somewhat here time. Another conspiracy...

With these types of mind states at play you transmitting must be prepared to remain balanced in your approaches to said examples for again how can you bring clarity to those who have witnessed generations LOST in what appeared to be a endless GAME played against those labeled weak even if elsewhere they are within salvations Eyes and Arms...

Those of you who truly have the compassion to spread the words in the name of the GOD in which you represent in order to help your fellow CREATOR Creations, remember to keep balanced for @ times you may too be tested by the testers (not all physical either) making sure your integrity is sound and true to THE you represent.

LOVE LIGHT ETERNIA*******
NAMASTE
edit on 1/11/14 by Ophiuchus 13 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:30 PM
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reply to post by BO XIAN
 


Bo, okay, now I've read through the entire thread.

I'm wondering if you would kindly give your response/thoughts about a topic I started today:
That of "fringe" Evangelical mega-pastors claiming that "a Good Christian would not suffer from PTSD".
Right Wing Evangelicals Claim 'Good Christians' Can't Get PTSD

I have no idea to what 'pigeon hole' you assign me, but I'd still like your input and reaction to how the 'extremists' behave.

Thanks, whether you decide to participate in it or not.



posted on Jan, 11 2014 @ 12:41 PM
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BO XIAN
for not always being 100% warm and fuzzy sweetness and light in the face of their constant stabs to the heart and genitals






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