dragonridr
reply to post by Utnapisjtim
Your math is wrong a Stadium is 1/7 mile, 229.9 meters. this means we divide 12000 by 7 and we get 1714.28 miles and then we times that by21 we get 36000 miles for earths circumference .Problem is thats wrong the earth's circumference is 24,901miles.Meaning either god didnt know the answer or your theory is wrong pick one.
Source: www.metrum.org... (the footnotes)
Natural History II.21. According to Pliny the Roman stadium is made up of 625 feet whereas the Greek stadion of equal length comprised 600 feet. This implies a relationship between Roman and Greek feet of 600/625 or 24/25.
The oldest competition in these Games was the foot-race over a specified distance - the stade or stadion, which was 600 feet in length. As the foot (or pous) was not absolutely standardised throughout Greece, a stadion could vary in different locations from 177 m in length at Delphi to 192 m at Olympia. At Nemea small posts survive along the side of the track which mark every 100 feet along the stadion.
reject
reply to post by Utnapisjtim
You didn't answer my question: Where in revelation does it even imply the length of new Jerusalem was meant to be 1/21 the earth's circumference?
Is this just like you saying your height is 1/x the circumference of the earth? What does that prove? Absolutely nothing.
What's even the point of harping on something that was figured out previously some 300 years ago? Absolutely nothing.
You're even just speculating which of the various "stadia" the guy used as there were several.
This is all absolute non-sense.
iterationzero
reply to post by Utnapisjtim
Which length of a foot are you using in your conversion between stade and modern units of length?
Part archaeology, and part Herodotus and Eratosthenes definitions of the stade: Either 1/600 of an arc-degree or 1/700 of an arc-degree. Using Herodotus, which is most likely when looking through arcaeological evidence, it gives: 1° equals 600 stades gives a stadion roughly 185 meters long, and the circle of the Earth to be 216,000 stadia/stades or aprox. 40,000 km.
Utnapisjtim
dragonridr
reply to post by Utnapisjtim
Your math is wrong a Stadium is 1/7 mile, 229.9 meters. this means we divide 12000 by 7 and we get 1714.28 miles and then we times that by21 we get 36000 miles for earths circumference .Problem is thats wrong the earth's circumference is 24,901miles.Meaning either god didnt know the answer or your theory is wrong pick one.
Care to provide a source?
Herodotus defines a stadion as 600 feet, implying 600 stadia per arc-degree, thus defining the circumference of the Earth quite precisely given a stadion length of aproximately 185 meter. This is the Greek standard. The Latin standard was 625 feet per stadion, bt their foot was smaller than the Greek one.
Eratostheses defines an arc-degree as 700 stadia
There are also other definitions. But your numbers aren't even close I'm afraid.
Source: www.metrum.org... (the footnotes)
Natural History II.21. According to Pliny the Roman stadium is made up of 625 feet whereas the Greek stadion of equal length comprised 600 feet. This implies a relationship between Roman and Greek feet of 600/625 or 24/25.
and
The oldest competition in these Games was the foot-race over a specified distance - the stade or stadion, which was 600 feet in length. As the foot (or pous) was not absolutely standardised throughout Greece, a stadion could vary in different locations from 177 m in length at Delphi to 192 m at Olympia. At Nemea small posts survive along the side of the track which mark every 100 feet along the stadion.
www.ancient.eu.com...edit on 12-1-2014 by Utnapisjtim because: Added last quote and source
no, its just math.
Utnapisjtim
You mean that is most likely a coincidence, I don't. Also 1/18 and 1/21 are rather peculiar ratio for it to be coincidence, don't you think?
Revelation 21:12 It had a great, high wall with twelve gates, and with twelve angels at the gates. On the gates were written the names of the twelve tribes of Israel.
Revelation 21:14 The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
Nobody even knows which "stadia" Eratosthenes used and you're claiming you know what the vague revelation's "stadia" is?
Utnapisjtim
What's even the point of harping on something that was figured out previously some 300 years ago? Absolutely nothing.
If you don't see the obvious relation between the size of the Earth and Kubus Kristi, why do you even care to post in a thread you obviously don't comprehend?
You're even just speculating which of the various "stadia" the guy used as there were several.
This is all absolute non-sense.
I'm not speculating. The Stadion is an astronomical measurement unit, that given which system you use, equals one arc-degree to either 600 or 700 stadia.
Go to "The Architecture of Ancient Greece: An Account of Its Historic Development" by William Bell Dinsmoor to read a free book on the subject.
Since there were many theories and calculations in circulation-- about the proportions of the Earth, the greel podes- (foot-) and stadion-measures varies from place to place, depending on which of these schools they based their measurment on. However, a stadion was the standard length of the Olympic running track, so there is quite a lot of arcaeological material to base this research upon. Several such tracks are around 185 meters long, but like I said, other canons of measurement was circling, but still, a stadion was equalled to either 600 or 700 podes in ancient Greece, 'podes' being 'Greecian feet'. The Romans had a shorter foot-measure, thus the Latinised Stadium was calculated as 625 Roman feet. These two measures was designed to represent the physical length of one arc-degree of the Earth's circumference, giving the generic value of ≈ 185 meters.
Stadion (unit of length)
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Stadia (unit of length)" redirects here. For the land surveyor's device, see Stadia rod. For other uses, see Stadion (disambiguation).
The stadion, Latinized as stadium and anglicized as stade, is an ancient Greek unit of length. According to Herodotus, one stade is equal to 600 feet. However, there were several different lengths of “feet”, depending on the country of origin.
Stade name
Length (approximate)
Description
Itinerary 157 m used in measuring the distance of a journey.[1]
Olympic 176 m 600 × 294 mm
Attic/Italic 185 m 600 × 308 mm
Babylonian-Persian 196 m 600 × 327 mm
Phoenician-Egyptian 209 m 600 × 349 mm
Which measure of the stadia is used can affect the interpretation of ancient texts. For example, the error in the calculation of the circumference of the Earth by Eratosthenes[2] or Posidonius is dependent on which stade is chosen to be appropriate.
even jesus believed the earth was flat and very small.
matt 4:8-98 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. 9 “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”
Utnapisjtim
iterationzero
reply to post by Utnapisjtim
Which length of a foot are you using in your conversion between stade and modern units of length?
Part archaeology, and part Herodotus and Eratosthenes definitions of the stade: Either 1/600 of an arc-degree or 1/700 of an arc-degree. Using Herodotus, which is most likely when looking through arcaeological evidence, it gives: 1° equals 600 stades gives a stadion roughly 185 meters long, and the circle of the Earth to be 216,000 stadia/stades or aprox. 40,000 km.
iterationzero
So if the circle of the Earth is actually 216,000 stades, and the cube is 12,000 stades on a side, how does that impact your initial claim that the cube is exactly 1/21 of the Earth's circumference when it's actually 1/18?
dragonridr
Your problem is your trying to use a unit of measure that didnt exist when the bible was written because the hebrews knew nothing of it. A stadia was a surveying instrument developed by the greeks. Greeks invented modern surveying techniques by using what's known as a stadia rod and a telescope. There unit of measure was set on arcsecond so by using these measurements it will always be some degree of the circumference of the earth. Though they were slightly off on their measurements.And even used varying degrees at different times in their history.
adjensen
That the Church taught that the Earth was flat is a Nineteenth Century hoax.
The rather mundane fact is that most educated Christian writers accepted Greco-Roman teachings about the earth and cosmos and quickly moved on to more urgent matters of sin and salvation. No Christian authority of any consequence ever taught that the earth was flat. (Source)
Utnapisjtim
iterationzero
So if the circle of the Earth is actually 216,000 stades, and the cube is 12,000 stades on a side, how does that impact your initial claim that the cube is exactly 1/21 of the Earth's circumference when it's actually 1/18?
Since the stade was not standardised other than by Herodotus who defined 1° = 600 stades, and Eratosthenes who defined 1° = 700 stades (as you noticed, this gives two rather differents lengths of the stadion).
When I started this thread I did so after having played with the numbers of Eratosthenes, since I recognised the 252,000 (not 250,000, but 700 stades per arc-degree) number from elsewhere and had myself a Eureka-moment. At that point I was unaware of Herodotus.
However, after doing some more research into the matter, another ratio showed up, the Herodotus one, and it showed to be much more precise than the former and in full accordance with archaelogical finds and our geometrical system, as he calculated the 360° of the Earth as being 216,000 Greek stadia, giving the length of the New Jerusalem to 1/18th of the Earth's circumference, and a stade at about 185 meters and an Earth circumference at around 40,000 meters. I appologise for the confusion. When I discovered Herodot I could no longer edit my OP.
I posted a new (and more precise) calculation here: www.abovetopsecret.com...
dragonridr
You are running around grabbing measurements from different sources and using different measurements meaning no matter what your math will be wrong.However it will always seem correct because the stadium was based on the circumference of the earth by its very nature you're going to have it come out to some degree of a circle. Since the stadium itself is a measurement of circumference.
Utnapisjtim
dragonridr
You are running around grabbing measurements from different sources and using different measurements meaning no matter what your math will be wrong.However it will always seem correct because the stadium was based on the circumference of the earth by its very nature you're going to have it come out to some degree of a circle. Since the stadium itself is a measurement of circumference.
I agree with everything you say here (well most of it anyway, also what I excluded from the quote above). BUT. My intention was never to define the stadion (Gr.) or stadium (Lat.) in millimeters or US feet or similar. BTW stadia is plural of stadium.
My intentions was to show that John in his Apocalypse fixed the Kubus Kristi (sic.) as measuring 12,000 stadia in length. Seeing that 12,000 is 1/21th of 252,000 and 1/18th of 216,000, it lead me to the idea that John knew about these calculations of Earth's dimentions, and "knew" the Earth was a globe, or at least circular in shape, contrary to what many believe. And given the measure of 12,000 stadia, equals 1/18th or 20° of "Herodot's Earth"-- and by divising a 185m stadion measure based on archaeology, he might possibly be implying the approximate circumference of our home planet, or circa 40,000km. If he knew that measure, that is, we don't know that, for John never defines the stadion/stadium, and to do so can turn hair grey for sure, because of what you discribe. But many ancient buildings and running tracks &c show that a stadion measuring about 185m was widely used, both in Greece and her succeeding empire, Rome.
I hope that cleared up somewhat.
Utnapisjtim
dragonridr
Your problem is your trying to use a unit of measure that didnt exist when the bible was written because the hebrews knew nothing of it. A stadia was a surveying instrument developed by the greeks. Greeks invented modern surveying techniques by using what's known as a stadia rod and a telescope. There unit of measure was set on arcsecond so by using these measurements it will always be some degree of the circumference of the earth. Though they were slightly off on their measurements.And even used varying degrees at different times in their history.
The Bible was written down over a period spanning several millennia. The stadion was known to John who was living in Greece, being exiled at Patmos, and simply because he refers to it in his much riddled book.
And you are quite correct, Troyan measures (which the US and British metre is losely based on) as well as the Sumeri-Babylonian anatomical measures are based on combined human and astronomical proportions and ratios. This way they put Man in direct relation with the Cosmos and thereby the gods and the divine. On arm's length a "hand" equals 1/36th (10°) of the horizon, and the cubit on arm's length equals 1/6th (60°) of the same horizon (a cubit being 6 hands) and so on. From the thumb up to the stade and further, these were both anatomical and astronomical measurements.
This observed link between human anatomy and the Cosmos is the main reason behind the Sumerian base-60 system of 360° in a circle, 12 months in a year and so on that we still use today for odd reasons-- as well as several measurement metres that has been in use through the ages.edit on 12-1-2014 by Utnapisjtim because: Changed 1/10th into 1/6th for the length of the cubitedit on 12-1-2014 by Utnapisjtim because: Added arc-degrees to the two examples with hand and cubitsedit on 12-1-2014 by Utnapisjtim because: Edited 'your hand' into 'a "hand"'
dragonridr
No since he got those measurements based off the holy of hollies. He believed that was important not the circumference of the earth.Oh one more thing and they were based in the furlong.
dragonridr
No since he got those measurements based off the holy of hollies.