Insane Clown Posse Defends Fans, With F.B.I. Lawsuit

The Michigan rap group Insane Clown Posse filed suit on Wednesday against the Justice Department and the Federal Bureau of Investigation, saying that the United States government had made the “unwarranted and unlawful decision” to classify fans of the band as criminal gang members, leading to their harassment by law enforcement and causing them “significant harm.”

The lawsuit was filed in Federal District Court in Detroit by lawyers for the band and for the American Civil Liberties Union of Michigan.

Insane Clown Posse filed an earlier lawsuit against the F.B.I. in 2012, seeking the documents that the bureau had used to reach its determination that Juggalos should be classified as a gang.

Insane Clown Posse Defends Fans, With F.B.I. Lawsuit

In 2 years we will see again this news and said third time's the charm.

here is a ATS thread about last suit

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by Indigent

Whoop whoop!

I endorse their message of inclusiveness and miracles.

These guys are still around? They must be in their 60's by now.

I must admit I never knew they had a fanbase until moving to an area that could be considered heavy with the "poor white trash". I started noticing their little logos and decals spray-painted places and stuck to beat up old pick ups.

When I finally Googled "Juggalo" I laughed and laughed and laughed.

To think that these terrible "rappers" decades after being deemed utter trash and complete failures as musicians and artists actually had some hillbilly fanbase in rural America. Which brings me to another anomaly: the racist "wigger". Pants sagging, bass thumping, and still out there throwing around racist terms and burning crosses.

It's a world of contradictions. Interesting in a stupid and pointless sort of way.

reply to post by gladtobehere


Believe it or not, they also have a Christmas album.
I found "Santa is a Fat Bitch" to be quite enlightening. Especially the act of shooting Santa in the face. The FBI thing is silly, but this is just free publicity which as they get older, their fanbase needs replenished with more angsty hormone driven barely pubescent boys whose parents don't care what they download.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


All that aside, certainly you do see the importance of what they are doing here, right? The FBI has been a heavy hand used by the government in culture wars for decades.

Normally I would be one if the last people to comment on anything to do with ICP.

BUT....

Oddly enough I have had to deal with this "assumption" in the last few months myself.

My daughter's birthday was in November and she turned 16. She is currently in the 10th grade. She came home with a laplander/stocking cap with Jack Skellington printed on it with some crazy coloring here and there. She promptly put the hat on while they were all waiting for the buses to load when the principal came over to her and made her remove it. When she asked why she could not wear the hat, he stated that it was an ICP hat and it promoted gangs and gang like behavior and if he saw it again she would be suspended.

She took the hat off and tried to show him the label inside the hat so he could see that it was The Nightmare Before Christmas and not ICP. He would not look and would not hear it. Needless to say, I was not happy when I heard this because she had tried to tell him and he refused to listen or look. Essentially he ASSumed things that were not so, made a judgement on it, then refused to hear that he had made a mistake. We had a meeting of the minds in the end.

The ASSumption should not have been made in the first place IMO. We try to teach our kids not to stereotype, yet we have many adults that do it all to often. People with power do it too often as well.

I hope they win even though I could do without hearing them sing.

bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

 

All that aside, certainly you do see the importance of what they are doing here, right? The FBI has been a heavy hand used by the government in culture wars for decades.

It depends on how you look at it. To me assigned designations by the FBI or the SPLC or whoever essentially have the same credibility as the ICP themselves.

Everyone is playing with half a deck here.

Now if you are the type of individual to actually care what the FBI thinks then yes this nonsense needs to stop and good for the ACLU backing the lawsuit.

Realistically it wont change a thing and this new America where everyone is a terrorist isn't going to go away despite how many groups sue the feds.

Two ways to beat them: 1) keep suing and fighting in court in perpetuity (even then the feds will just keep doing what they're doing) or 2) stop reacting to their nonsense and just ignore them

If there ever was a group that needed to be shunned and ignored its the federal government.

I guarantee even without the FBI designation these kids who wear clown make-up, vulgar phrases on their clothing, get blackout drunk as a cultural meme would be under police scrutiny anyway and always were.

I dont need to identify with some group to make myself a shining red beacon for police attention. I just need to behave like a jackass. Behaving like a jackass was a target of police scrutiny long before being a "Juggalo" was. It just so happens that there is a lot of jackass behavior that goes along with being a Juggalo.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


I'm "hillbilly" and I have never met a "Juggalo" or ever seen anything pertaining to Insane Clown Posse here where I live in WV. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, I'm just saying that in my 42 years alive, and I get around my state, I've never encountered it--and I'm a guitarist/musician/song writer. I always LOL @ ICP and see them as a joke(no offense to fans). I know no one who likes their music.

Anyways, I don't know why anyone would harass someone just because they are a fan of them. Unless, they are a cult and do evil deeds. IDK, I may do a little research when I get time.

the owlbear
reply to post by gladtobehere

 

I found "Santa is a Fat Bitch" to be quite enlightening.

This ^^^^^ made me literally I ran across that on Vevo a few weeks ago by accident. I concur with your view on it.

reply to post by Fylgje


Hmmm I would have thought WV was a ripe place for the Juggalo.

I see them all over Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont and upstate New York.

Their little hatchet man logos are all over the place on cars and street signs and buildings and the word "Juggalo" is a staple of graffiti spots all over the Northeast.

They're based in Michigan so maybe it's more of a Northern half hillbilly thing and not a genuine Appalachia hillbilly thing.

This is insane. There are scores of hardcore hip-hop and death metal whose fans could be considered a 'gang', at least a lot more so than ICP.

What really irks be about this, is people are being denied entry into the Armed Services because of their ICP tattoos.

I have been an ICP fan for years.. I'm a 40 year old white guy and I am 100% without a doubt not a gang member.

To label me as a gang member because I like the music or pull me over because I put a hatchet man sticker on my windshield is just stupid.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

I dont need to identify with some group to make myself a shining red beacon for police attention. I just need to behave like a jackass. Behaving like a jackass was a target of police scrutiny long before being a "Juggalo" was. It just so happens that there is a lot of jackass behavior that goes along with being a Juggalo.

lol, when I read this I laughed and laughed and laughed.
but you see, you do identify with a group, this group johny, this group. A conspiracy, tin foil hat wearing, bunker prepping, anti government web site group mate , which does make you a target, A bigger target than a bunch of make up wearing teenagers.
LOL

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

It's a world of contradictions. Interesting in a stupid and pointless sort of way.

Contradictions definitely.

But the joke is on their fans. ICP have been evangelical christians all this time.

Very interesting. ICP is christian music. lol

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


You may be right.

But the only two ways to enact change are to either use the system to defeat itself, or violent uprising. I know which one I am not really wanting.

reply to post by grey580

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

To think that these terrible "rappers" decades after being deemed utter trash and complete failures as musicians and artists actually had some hillbilly fanbase in rural America.

They are from Detroit their biggest fan base is Detroit, about as far from "hillbilly rural" America as you can get.
I grew up in the suburbs and I'm a fan

reply to post by PLAYERONE01


No doubt I'm on a list or ten. Thanks to the the hyper-paranoid government and ignorant public we're all on somebodys list.

I just meant in that quoted piece that it's silly to be upset with being stereotyped or cataloged in such a way. Even when its done by the feds because everyone everywhere at some point in time is watched and scrutinized.

The example of the Skelington hat above is gold. Pure ignorance dictating actionable policy. That has always been a problem and always will be a problem until society as a whole decides both stop giving a # about what other people do and stop giving a # if somebody should happen to be giving a # about what you do.

Folks who were into metal years back were all church-burning satanists that eventually got the FBI to do a whole investigation into satanism in America that found nothing. Anyone in the 80's and early 90's who was into rap music was a gangster and drug dealer. Anyone into grunge around the same time was a suicidal heroin addict. Liked disco in the 70's? You must have been part of a coc aine smuggling ring.

If you're going to put on a shirt with any sort of brand or logo on it you're going to be stereotyped by somebody. If enough people put that same shirt on you're going to be stereotyped by the government.

There really is no point in getting upset about it since that will never, ever, ever change.

Oh god... as a former pre-pubescent poor kid scrub wannabe, I listened to these guys when I was a teen.

There's nothing gang-related about this group at all, it's just a bunch of kids wanting to be in a group. They're music fans. Justin Bieber has his Beliebers, ICP has their Juggalos/Juggalettes/Ninja/Ninjettes.

I honestly don't even think they'd be able to organize themselves well enough to be a gang.

Given the apparent absurdity of this whole thing I had to look into it a bit.
It looks like these Juggalos are not the Juggalos you are looking for:

While the majority of fans exercise their lifestyles in a peaceful manner, a small portion of this group have added a criminal element that has slowly been taking hold in certain states.

NGIC Juggalos Report

So some criminals are identifying themselves as "Juggalos" and this information was taught to law enforcement and some PD's interpreted it backwards as all "Juggalos" are identified as criminals.

Gee, police overreaching to classify a larger group as targets, whoda thunk it?! Got a Ron Paul bumper sticker? How about an NRA sticker? Maybe a "legalize it" one?

I don't see how the lawsuit can work in the ICP's favor. It isnt their fault or the feds fault that crimes have been committed by individuals identifying themselves as Juggalos yet it's not like they can just change the name or the feds can just ignore a common identifier used by the criminals themselves as a valuable piece of investigatory information. The feds will simply argue that these are not the Juggalos named inthe report. Because they arent.