Why do you think your "God" does not make it's existence obvious or communicate in an obvious man

reply to post by Xeven

God could save everyone with a simple hello.

I doubt it.
Even if every human were to hear that "hello" from God, the skeptics would still be out trying to debunk it.

Would be easy for everyone to believe if God would just say hello.

But the Creator had different plans...
Had God willed, he could have created us all as believers, but His plan is to test us.
Choosing as sentient humans to believe in God is what seperates the believers from the disbelievers.

reply to post by Wandering Scribe

If God is preserving our free-will and right to choice by not presenting Himself in an undeniable fashion to us, then what right does God have to condemn us to Hell after this life has ended if we chose not to believe in Him?

God has a right because He has given us intelligence to make the right choice. You can use it as a tool to reach the truth or use it to deny it. A little reflection would start guiding any in the right way.. unless he/she already does not want the truth to be a certain way.

Before you were born, you agreed to amnesia. Because you knew Everything, and while that sounds nice it gets very very boring. Why do people play videogames set deep in the past before medical advancements or communications tech and the only way to defend yourself at the start is a sword? Its the sense of adventure... we crave that. We crave mysteries to solve. Your previous existence as a spiritual being offered none of that. You wanted the feeling of discovering something for the first time.

I was watching my 3 or 4 year old nephew once and I was in a hurry to get out the door. He had gotten his shoes on and without thinking twice i kneeled down and tied them for him within like 5 or 6 seconds and hardly even glanced at his face during it. After I finished iwas like "ok buddy lets get goin". Then I noticed he was in tears. He must not have reacted as I started the first shoe becausehe was basically in a state of shock i guess. I knew he couldtie them. He just sshowed me the day before how he had recently learned how and was real proud. But i was in a hurry and didn't think it was a big deal. Now irrealize i had taken away his one shred of dignity. Needless to say, he could notbe consoled and Ii soon realized it would actually get us out out the door faster if i untied them and let him go them himself. He had had a smile on his face as we walked out the door. Dried rivers of tears were visible on his face and some snot was running out his nosea llittle. But by God he was beaming. You see, until recently, shoe tying was in the realm of adults only, just like driving a car, using an atm machine, etc. It was, at that ttime in his life, his crowning achievement. It was a matter of utmost pride and accomplishment. But why would he be upset just because a more skilled being helped him to complete a task much faster and better? Know the answer to this and you will know the answer to why we would be ups et with god if he suddenly gave us all the answers and solved every mystery... we would be upset after we died.

We agreed to come to this place in this form and have this experience. Amnesia is a critical part of it. We wanted to not know if there was a god. We wanted to try try to find true love in a world where lovers can torn apart by any number of factors...It makes that love even more precious knowing how fragile it is and that it might disappear at any moment. It's what makes LIFE so precious. God is line the Dungeon Master and we are players in the game. We have free will, god controls the parameters like laws of physics and stuff. Some people think coincidences or deja vu or synchronicity, vivid dreams or sudden strong feelings are evidence of godly communication... are they? I have no idea... it's a mystery to me. Isn't that wonderful??

All the pain and suffering you witnessed or experienced will seem like less than a mosquito bite after you die. Life itself will be like a handful of blinks of the eye or perhaps less than one blink in duration. Does this mean it's ok to kill rape torture maim mindlessly? No. That would be failing the game. While it is just a game, it is a game of utmost importance..maybe.

sk0rpi0n
reply to post by Xeven

 

Even if every human were to hear that "hello" from God, the skeptics would still be out trying to debunk it.

That actually has to happen before you can make that claim. In any case, I can guarantee there would be far less atheists in the world than there are now.

But the Creator had different plans...
Had God willed, he could have created us all as believers, but His plan is to test us.
Choosing as sentient humans to believe in God is what seperates the believers from the disbelievers.

Belief requires existence. I can believe in Spiderman, but that doesn't make him real. God doesn't have to interfere with day to day human lives to let people know that He exists. Just the mere act of saying hello like the person you just quoted would be good enough for a large portion of the population.

If during your whole life, your father was absent, but your mother periodically tells you that he loves you but even she doesn't know where he is, are you required to love him back? I would certainly feel no connection to him. Love is a two way street. If God wants me to love him, he needs to show why I should do that.

reply to post by MystikMushroom


pretty darn good explanation for the people "God talked to me".

Star for that one.

reply to post by Xeven


Because he made man in his image and thus we can decide for ourselves. If he would reveal himself, people would no longer need FAITH. God in the end wants someone who can save themselves not someone who waits for him to reveal himself so he can say: "Ok! Now that you gave me the answer I will love you God and believe."

FAITH is what is important here. The definition: strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof or complete trust or confidence in someone or something.

If he wanted robots he would of programmed robots that do as he sees fit all the time, that obey without question, but he didn't he made us with free will we can evaluate, change our minds, lie, manipulate, be honest, cheat, measure...Choices.

Why should he submit to your will? Just to make you happy? Who are you?

reply to post by bitsforbytes


In other words, God's version of Obamacare . I get it.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


What can I say ? That was the platform that was presented during the last campaign.

reply to post by bitsforbytes


God doesn't need to make humans into robots to let people know He exists. All he has to do is just say something, ANYTHING. Heck he could even appear to people and be silent if He wants. People would still be able to deny him, but at that point it becomes a conscious decision to rebuke him, not a logical line of thought in not believing in something that has no proof of existence. Faith is stupid.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

The same was in the beginning with God.

All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

reply to post by Krazysh0t


Faith is not stupid. Do you have proof that God doesn't exist? No! Really, so i guess you have faith in the fact that he doesn't exist. See how that works?

I rather have faith he does.

reply to post by bitsforbytes

Faith is not stupid. Do you have proof that God doesn't exist? No! Really, so i guess you have faith in the fact that he doesn't exist. See how that works?

I rather have faith he does.

If he does exist, that in itself is proof that he is indifferent. Which is effectively the same as not existing. Which is to say, he might as well not exist for all the good he does. Still got people getting raped and murdered and starved and diseased all over the planet. Not to mention two world wars and a Holocaust.

This video gives you a pretty good idea of what he's all about.

bitsforbytes
reply to post by Krazysh0t

 

Faith is not stupid. Do you have proof that God doesn't exist? No! Really, so i guess you have faith in the fact that he doesn't exist. See how that works?

I rather have faith he does.

No faith is definitely stupid. I don't have faith one way or the other. As it should be. There is no evidence for his existence or against it, therefore there is no reason to take either stance. Not everyone is a believer or non-believer, look up the definition of agnosticism.

Faith is like believing as a child that hiding under your covers is your safe zone and nothing can hurt you. It feels nice when you don't know any better, but it is based in delusion and any adult telling you that would look silly doing so.

Simple reason

Man decided to go it alone in eden as he thought he could do things better (through the devils prompting).

So he his giving us what we want indepedance.

We asked for it, he gave it.

And we are makeing a total mess of it.

But thats what we asked for.

Eventually when we have made a big enough mess of things he will come in and say "i told you so" reset things to how they should be and then we will live to how we were meant to, and if anyone else get ideas about running things "better" we can just point and say we tried that and we screwed ourselfs over duh!

God does not cause bad things to happen or good things. He is just watching, doing what most people want, staying out of our buisness and letting humans run ourselfs, He cant be blamed for anything that happens only we can.


PS Im Christian but I dont belong to any of the major faiths .

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Your funny, you say that God gets people raped and murdered. God said not to kill pretty clearly in the 10 commandments and Jesus also stated that you shouldn't do to others what you don't want done to you. God is not responsible for all those actions. He clearly told us we are to be judged which means that we know what we are doing or should know what we are doing.

The examples you give sounds more like humans who are lost and need a moral compass. Humans who made really bad choices.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

Had God willed, he could have created us all as believers, but His plan is to test us.

Doesn't the definition of "omniscient" sort of preclude the necessity for tests? It's ironic how God is omnipotent and omniscient until those traits actually come in useful. Then suddenly, according to people like you, he decides he doesn't need to actually utilize those traits. Much to our detriment and his ineffectivity.

I will be blasted for this at some point, but I really don't care anymore.

God the true God does talk to you. The thing is we are more and more distracted to be able to listen or see the signs as they were not to mention being to stubborn and egotistical.

In synchronicity or seemingly random things like a string of yellow lights when you are in a rush or a snow storm blocking you from going out with the wrong person...You will be told it is coincidence or being superstitious, but I believe there is more to it and have let it successfully guide me and my heart.

Humanity is entering into I believe it's rebellious teen years (young adult) years and therefor just like a those examples no bit of fire and brimstone or threats or flaming bushes will get our attentions. We need to start figuring out stuff on our own and learning some lessons the hard way break some of that stubbornness and wake up before we really ruin things, both personally and as a species.

Sure we will continue to have gentle nudges or quiet whispers to help guide us or set us on track. I have to believe God is at least in the backseat hoping we don't wreck the car (sort dinging the hell out of it right now...I mean of course our Planet).

reply to post by Krazysh0t

Belief requires existence. I can believe in Spiderman, but that doesn't make him real. God doesn't have to interfere with day to day human lives to let people know that He exists.

Like it was said earlier, Had God willed, he could have created us all as believers, but His plan is to test us.

Besides, we all get the same canvas to start with. Believers from all walks of life believe without ''seeing'', so the non-believers will not have an excuse on a certain fateful day.

reply to post by bitsforbytes

Your funny, you say that God gets people raped and murdered. God said not to kill pretty clearly in the 10 commandments and Jesus also stated that you shouldn't do to others what you don't want done to you.

I like to think I'm funny, but I'm actually being serious right now. According to biblical estimates, God is responsible for the equivalent of four Hitlers worth of murders. That's not to mention the natural deaths resulting from Adam and Eve's expulsion from the garden following God's failure to effectively exercise his power.

God is not responsible for all those actions. He clearly told us we are to be judged which means that we know what we are doing or should know what we are doing.

He also designed the context which shapes those decisions. Not to mention that out of the entire vast universe, he chose to give his most evil creation Earth to play with, knowing full well how it would affect the human species. He made an informed decision to corrupt the majority of his most prized creation. In fact, it could be argued that he knew who would sit in each seat in hell and why, even as he built the place. He determined your fate before your grandfather took his first breath.

Besides, isn't there some great big "Divine Plan"? Which means that every act of good and evil is in accordance with that plan. Which means that he approved it. Not one act takes place without his prior approval, otherwise he's not in complete control.

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? - Epicurus

bitsforbytes
reply to post by AfterInfinity

 

Your funny, you say that God gets people raped and murdered. God said not to kill pretty clearly in the 10 commandments and Jesus also stated that you shouldn't do to others what you don't want done to you. God is not responsible for all those actions. He clearly told us we are to be judged which means that we know what we are doing or should know what we are doing.

The examples you give sounds more like humans who are lost and need a moral compass. Humans who made really bad choices.

Thats the point. He has given us standard to live by. He has given guidence through Jesus.

But at the end of the day we are our own people and gave complete independance from god. So if Humans choice to ignore his guidance then its on our own heads.


When he finaly has enough and resets the earth he will have a pretty solid case for saying his way was the right way and is humans were selfish fools for ignoreing him.