America Has A Constitution Free Zone? WTF!!????

nenothtu
The story in the OP says that the case arose because some cat crossing the border "was ordered" to enter his password, and got popped with some extremist videos on his laptop, which he claims were used for research purposes - and they probably were.

Where he went wrong was in complying with that "order".

"order" ME to enter a password, and see how far that gets ya. I don't give a crap if the only thing on the computer is grandma's secret peanut butter cookie recipe, I ain't doing it. It's a matter of principle, and that principle is laid out in the 4th and 5th Amendments of the Constitution - no illegal warrantless searches, and no compulsion to produce testimony against self.

That's all you really need.

Unfortunately, if you refuse, they would probably still arrest you and you'd have to get a lawyer to sort it out. Even if they are violating your rights, there's not much you can do about it until you talk to a lawyer if they don't care about your rights.

nenothtu
"order" ME to enter a password, and see how far that gets ya. I don't give a crap if the only thing on the computer is grandma's secret peanut butter cookie recipe, I ain't doing it. It's a matter of principle, and that principle is laid out in the 4th and 5th Amendments of the Constitution - no illegal warrantless searches, and no compulsion to produce testimony against self.

While you can certainly refuse to hand over the information, you can possibly be jailed for it. This is actually a pretty grey area of the constitution and rulings over handing over passwords have been about 50/50, even on appeals. There's no concrete precedent set yet.

On one hand you can argue that handing over documents results in self incrimination and this has been upheld a few times. On the other hand it has been argued in the past that they have every right to the documents because the 4th and 5th only apply if you have a reasonable expectation of privacy. Going through a checkpoint which says they WILL search your documents has no such expectation and therefore you have to hand over the requested documents if they're on your person. Furthermore, they argue that your private data is only your decryption key which they don't require you to turn over, only the information encrypted with it. Therefore you have to turn it over. This has been upheld many times, and people have spent time in jail charged with contempt for refusing to turn over a password.

Your best defense here is to hand over the encrypted device, and when asked for a password say that you forgot. This puts the burden of proof on law enforcement to prove you know the password which is not an easy feat to accomplish. They can't legally jail you under contempt for asking you to provide something you're unable to provide.

The lesson of this story? Our constitution means so little these days that it's best to create your legal defenses assuming it won't protect you.

Don't worry. Everything will be ok. In this time all the colors of man are showing. The good and bad will ying yang and all will continue in the cycles in cycles.

This is so retarded it can't be real and if it is, then it's time to reform that law. Seriously what info on a laptop or iphone do they think they need to look for? They think someone might be doing espionage? Well I hate the break the news to ya but you don't need a laptop or a USB storage device to transfer data. It's called cloud computing and cloud storage. Jesus no wonder our government is failing we got a bunch of retards at the helm.

sean
This is so retarded it can't be real and if it is, then it's time to reform that law. Seriously what info on a laptop or iphone do they think they need to look for? They think someone might be doing espionage? Well I hate the break the news to ya but you don't need a laptop or a USB storage device to transfer data. It's called cloud computing and cloud storage. Jesus no wonder our government is failing we got a bunch of retards at the helm.

edit on 3-1-2014 by sean because: (no reason given)

It has almost entirely been used on the southern border to search for illegals and drugs. They inspect laptops and such just because there's no restriction and people get a power rush from it.

Xcathdra
Be heard...
Contact your reps...
Vote...

Let the government know you are watching what they do...

Vote? for these clowns? why would anyone with any self respect ever vote while there is nobody worth voting for?

All the crap about not voting meaning you dont have a say is bull sh!t. When all your choices are evil, greedy, lying sadistic sons of b*tches then I refuse to vote for who I believe to be the lesser of 2 evils.

they know people are watching them. They dont care because they also know that not enough people are brave enough to stand up against them. They know we have the power, but they know we wont use it.

the best thing is for EVERYONE not to vote at all. force change in the system

Silicis n Volvo
All the crap about not voting meaning you dont have a say is bull sh!t. When all your choices are evil, greedy, lying sadistic sons of b*tches then I refuse to vote for who I believe to be the lesser of 2 evils.

Who ever said you only have two choices? In the last election I decided from several candidates before deciding who I would vote for.

Aazadan

Silicis n Volvo
All the crap about not voting meaning you dont have a say is bull sh!t. When all your choices are evil, greedy, lying sadistic sons of b*tches then I refuse to vote for who I believe to be the lesser of 2 evils.

Who ever said you only have two choices? In the last election I decided from several candidates before deciding who I would vote for.

"the lesser of 2 evils" is just a saying.

I think you get my point. Voting is just playing into their hands

reply to post by bobs_uruncle


Nope, they're saying every navigable waterway is considered a border- that is 100 miles.

reply to post by Aazadan

The lesson of this story? Our constitution means so little these days that it's best to create your legal defenses assuming it won't protect you.

I'm sure most in America have al kinds of disposable cash for this.

reply to post by CornShucker



You want to know the answer? Make sure that there is not a world of "Haves" and "Havenots". Raise the standard of living worldwide instead of exploiting it. Then living in the USA will be no more desirable than living anywhere else in the world(excluding extreme climates).

Peace

CornShucker
S&F!


That said, there are parts of the judge's ruling that at least sound reasonable. The problem is adjusting 21st century logic to rights written when the state of the art was a quill pen. I'm a simple man and admit I don't have any answers to the big questions.

The pen really hasn't evolved at all. The modern ones are easier to use.


Its just f-in amazing that it seems only logical to some that a restricted and trimmed down constitutional application is what the modern age requires.

The only logic here represents an economic/federal reserve and state power/security concern as the only true interpreters of the rights of man and his relationship with government and contrary to those laid down in the constitution. Mans rights are only relative to state concerns is the age old mantra, nothing new here, removing a free society from the face of the earth.

Illuminawty
reply to post by Aazadan

 

The lesson of this story? Our constitution means so little these days that it's best to create your legal defenses assuming it won't protect you.

I'm sure most in America have al kinds of disposable cash for this.

When all else fails, when speech against the powers isn't free and there is no solution in the redress of grievances the constitution gives us the age old default position.

A right not exercised is a right lost. We have the government we deserve. We the people... Is it me or is that tree getting really thirsty?

The problem with a Constitution Free Zone is that it nullifies protections under the Constitution. Funny how mad grabs of power can bite you in the butt. Take this little gem:

Article 1
SECTION 6

The Senators and Representatives shall receive a compensation for their services, to be ascertained by law, and paid out of the treasury of the United States. They shall in all cases, except treason, felony and breach of the peace, be privileged from arrest during their attendance at the session of their respective Houses, and in going to and returning from the same; and for any speech or debate in either House, they shall not be questioned in any other place.

Now if we only had some quasi-militarized police officers that were tripping on their own authority that have little to no problem with exploring facets of new found unlimited power or jurisdiction in this country ...

sean
This is so retarded it can't be real and if it is, then it's time to reform that law. Seriously what info on a laptop or iphone do they think they need to look for? They think someone might be doing espionage?

Well, if you believe them (And I don't) they seem to be suggesting they need to be able to do this primarily to prevent another 9/11. The person in question apparently seemed suspicious to them in some way (again, if you believe the official story).

I suppose if you believe 9/11 was what they say it was and if you believe Islamic terrorism is really that big of a threat, I could kind of see the reasoning behind feeling the need to search suspicious people at the borders. Not that I think it's a good excuse. But I could at least comprehend their concern. IF I believed them. Unfortunately, these days, the government just has no credibility.

reply to post by Imightknow

Trying to go to your link resulted in 404

Not Found

The requested URL /2014/01/01/judge-reaffirms-constitution-free-zones-100-miles-inside-u-s-borders/ was not found on this server.

anyone else unable to get the link?

The constitution applies all the way to the border as far as I'm concerned. Can you imagine how many will take advantage of this? Also, isn't the ACLU a foreign organization?

Now, for my biggest concern: Why is West Virginia the only state on that ACLU map that doesn't have the capitol highlighted??? Does the ACLU not recognize WV as a state, or is there something that I'm missing here??? It's the only one!!

solongandgoodnight
reply to post by Imightknow

 

our rights are slowly being eroded away. it kind of reminds of the frog getting boiled alive, because he never notices the temperature being gradually heated. Finally it boils, and it's too late.

our rights are only "eroded away", if we ALLOW them to be...

it really frustrates me to hear, and read people saying things like "they're taking away our rights"

they can only take what we allow them to...when the government serves the people, you have liberty. When the people serve the government, you have tyranny...if the government makes another BS rule, and you just accept it, even if it violates the supreme law of the land, then you've allowed them to take a right from you. if you read it, and say "that's illegal, i'm not gonna accept that", then you are asserting your right as a citizen to not observe, or acknowledge an illegal law..

Imightknow
Judge reaffirms Constitution free Zone 100 miles inside U.S. Borders

www.theminorityreportblog.com...

Nothing that takes away the rights of the people of this country surprise me anymore, so I'm not going to pretend that this surprises me one bit. All it says is that border officials must have probably cause LOL. This is nonsense. Will everybody getting off a flight from the Middle East be a reasonable enough reason to have their laptop or cell phone searched?

Utter nonsense.

America has had a "constitution free zone" since the Patriot Act.