It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Rendlesham Forest…, A Christmas Story from 1980 - Can We ‘Let it Be’?

page: 155
87
<< 152  153  154    156  157  158 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jun, 3 2017 @ 03:23 PM
link   
a reply to: mirageman

Yes.

And there is now Gary Heseltine with his comments so I see.




posted on Jun, 3 2017 @ 03:25 PM
link   
a reply to: ctj83






One of the producers, I believe, paid for the hypnosis of John Burroughs.


Care to expand with this one.



posted on Jun, 5 2017 @ 04:23 AM
link   
a reply to: Baablacksheep

I've done so a few times in this thread, no point me repeating myself.



posted on Jun, 5 2017 @ 05:47 AM
link   
a reply to: ctj83

But you feel the hypnosis payment by one of the produces important..yes?...



posted on Jun, 5 2017 @ 05:14 PM
link   
a reply to: Baablacksheep

Tracey Torme has said the producer was taken out to a Lake and told something about UFO Coverup Live that scared him.

Why doesn't UFO Coverup Live! mention the RFI? Why does it leak the existence of the parapsychology department? Why does the Shatner documentary reveal hypnosis for reading the future (and smart watches?)

Why does Uri Geller talk about ideas to use a group of 9 or 10 remote viewers to send a city into hyperspace as also revealed in the recent CIA document release?

Why is that 'town in hyperspace' idea to be found in "The Philadelphia Experiment", when it plays no part in the myth?

I don't have the answers but it seems more important than the UFO story that the parapsychology element is supposedly just a part of?
edit on 5-6-2017 by ctj83 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 5 2017 @ 06:18 PM
link   
a reply to: ctj83

Strangely the RFI was also left completely out of mainstream media special "Seeing is Believing" with the late and highly respected journalist Peter Jennings who was well known in the whole of the English speaking world. This was produced in 2005 almost two decades after the UFO Coverup Live and chose to build up the mystery for an hour or so before coming down hard and debunking it all....



Alternative link : click here



posted on Jun, 6 2017 @ 02:14 PM
link   

originally posted by: Baablacksheep
a reply to: mirageman

Yes.

And there is now Gary Heseltine with his comments so I see.



I am trying to avoid getting too bogged down with the sit-com developing in other areas of the interwebs. Even though it can be amusing at times. Things are not very amusing at the moment there.

However if anyone didn't see it I did post a framework of a theory as to the events surrounding what happened at Rendlesham in another thread. Which I will repeat here.......

This is based on the history of the Suffolk area (radar and many other technologies have been developed and tested that corner of England) and the time the incident took place. It was also a period when non-lethal weapons were being looked into, the Soviets were employing the Duga over the horizon radar and developing anti-satellite technology (amongst trying to develop other non-conventional weaponry').

In the mid-1970s the US was developing a Space Shuttle and the Soviets were developing their own Buran Shuttle. In the Soviet Politburo a guy called Mstislav Keldysh had convinced the then Soviet Premier, Leonid Brezhnev, that the Space Shuttle was actually an attack spacecraft and was going to be used in a pre-emptive strike to 'nuke' Moscow.

In Dec of 1980 US diplomats were still being held hostage in Iran. In Poland the Solidarity movement was threatening to destabilize the government there. Yes it's always a cliche that this was the height of the Cold War. But with Reagan about to enter office with his anti-Soviet rhetoric plus Western Europe agreeing to accept Pershing & Cruise nuclear missiles on their soil ,things were very twitchy. A lot of secret things were going on behind the scenes. You can even dig some of this out from documents released and posted earlier in the thread..(An example : UK laser and non-nuclear electro-magnetic pulse weapons).

Oh and the first time the Space Shuttle would be rolled out onto the tarmac was due on what day? December 29th 1980.



Remember Brezhnev believed that this was coming to bomb him into oblivion. There were also rumours in the early days of the story about the 'comets' being important and that perhaps a Soviet satellite had been attacked and even brought down. There was even speculation that Soviet and Royal Navy warships were on patrol off the coast of Suffolk. Later there was talk of something being taken away on a C-5 transport from Bentwaters just after the incident.

So I would postulate that military experiments were going on in the Suffolk area with some very exotic technologies being used at a time (Christmas) when the bases nearby would be operating at a minimum. Possibly to 'protect' the new Space Shuttle once it was in flight and maybe to interfere with Soviet space weaponry/satellites. The natural celestial events that occurred over the Christmas period may have alerted the base. Then the Bentwaters airmen stumbled upon whatever was going on. My gut felling is that this was military and intel boys playing with their expensive toys. They possibly caused a potential international incident but a UFO story has been allowed to build and conceal the real truth. Rendlesham is probably not an isolated case and other UFO (and possibly none UFO) events could be linked.

I can't prove this beyond reasonable doubt so it's there to be picked apart, and trashed or augmented, depending on your own (or the Halt) perspective.



posted on Jun, 6 2017 @ 03:14 PM
link   
a reply to: mirageman

Do you mean there were no ‘Unidentified Flying Objects’ involved at all? Because they were also seen by civilians so in that case civilians must be part of the conspiracy, too.
Or do you mean that the UFO’s were caused by military technology? In that case they can still be called ‘UFO’s'


I wonder if you've read something new in ‘The Halt Perspective’ by the way. Does Halt provide any personal perspective on Bustinza’s story?

Halt may go after Larry Warren, but Bustinza recently claimed Warren was involved. Back in 1984, Bustinza gave Fawcett a description of a landed craft. He even called it a ‘machine’ and claimed he was within 6 to 10 feet from it.

What's Halt’s perspective on that I wonder?



posted on Jun, 6 2017 @ 04:14 PM
link   
a reply to: Guest101

I don't want to go into to tiny details because I haven't worked this all out by any means. But I am suggesting the UFOs (perhaps the term UAPs should be used) were caused by 'something' the military were testing.

I sort of gave up on the Halt Perspective. It lists every light in the sky seen over Suffolk since before Sir Alf managed Ipswich Town. Only about a third of it covers Halt's perspective on Rendlesham and you are continually jumping around to follow the same story. Its more like an encyclopedia in the way the information is presented. I'll have a dig through it to see if he mentions anything on that. Halt currently claims Bustinza never left his side. Which could be interesting seeing as on his tape Bustinza is on the radio saying "Sergeant Bustinza…We’re all outta gas…We’re at East Gate…East Gate over." whilst Halt is out in the forest.



posted on Jun, 7 2017 @ 04:57 AM
link   
a reply to: mirageman

Hello. i find easier thinking :

UFO - An actual vehicle/structure unidentified

UAP - Ball of luminous plasma for military purposes unidentified

UFO/UAP - A mix of the 2 as described from Greg Bishop in Project beta flying out of Kirtland.



posted on Jun, 7 2017 @ 09:54 AM
link   
a reply to: mirageman






I sort of gave up on the Halt Perspective.


And to think there is another in the making.




Otherwise you are on an interesting track with your thoughts . Keep it up!




posted on Jun, 7 2017 @ 09:56 AM
link   
a reply to: ctj83






Tracey Torme has said the producer was taken out to a Lake and told something about UFO Coverup Live that scared him.


And .. ? Any idea what spooked this person. I am clueless am afraid.



posted on Jun, 7 2017 @ 12:05 PM
link   

originally posted by: mirageman

Halt currently claims Bustinza never left his side. Which could be interesting seeing as on his tape Bustinza is on the radio saying "Sergeant Bustinza…We’re all outta gas…We’re at East Gate…East Gate over." whilst Halt is out in the forest.


Yes, Bustinza can only be heard at the beginning of the tape and has always said in interviews that Halt sent him out to get new light-alls (or to refuel the existing ones), even as early as in1984 (during his interview with Boeche):


”What I remember clearly was that when we got there, Col Halt pointed to the individuals that he wanted to go with him. So we went back to Bentwaters base; grabbed 2 light-alls and had a patrol refuel them”


On the tape you can hear Halt deciding to send someone back to get another light-all:



LT COLONEL HALT: Having a difficulty can't get the light all to work.
LT COLONEL HALT: . . . gonna send back, get another light all. Meantime, we're gonna take some readings with the Geiger counter, and err, chase around the area a little bit waiting for another light-all to come back in.


So Bustinza appears to have been separated from Halt and his team, though Halt may not remember this.
He probably came back after Halt was already further out in the forest chasing the red light.

Who knows what happened next?

edit on 7-6-2017 by Guest101 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2017 @ 03:14 PM
link   
a reply to: Baablacksheep

I've no idea. I can only tell you what Torme said in a video interview. He was part of UFO Coverup Live as well.

Fun fact: Curtis M Brubaker was the supervising producer on UFO Coverup Live and arranged the hypnosis session. The only other UFO media event he worked on was Disneys 'Alien Encounter'.

Not surprising as his main career has been as an industrial designer and prolific inventor!
edit on 7-6-2017 by ctj83 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2017 @ 04:23 PM
link   
a reply to: Guest101




I wonder if you've read something new in ‘The Halt Perspective’ by the way. Does Halt provide any personal perspective on Bustinza’s story?


Bustinza is listed multiple times in the index of Halt's book. Forgive me for not getting through it all. A lot of mentions are not directly related to Halt.

One large Quote from Halt on Bustinza can be found on p291 (I've included the whole segment as I think it's relevant to the whole case as well).




Over the years I hae been asked all manner of questions including whether I experienced missing time, did I see any aliens, was I subjected to a vigorous interview by the Air Force Office of Special Investigations, was the whole thing an alert of elaborate exercise, designed to test the response of the security personnel on the base? The list goes on. All I can say is I did not sustain any ill effects. I cannot speak for the other individuals involved, as I'm told that several feel they have sustained lasting health problems. I talked with John Burroughs and Jim Penniston. They are now convinced that military experiments caused us to experience what we did, but I'm not convinced. The guys that hypnotized and drugged them are probably gloating over their success with all this disinformation. I did meet with Mike [Sacks?] and Harry [Harris?] about 1982 and we all agreed not to reveal the meeting. General Williams was never involved.

Bustinza is a puzzle, as he was with me the whole time. We rode out in the jeep together and he stayed with our small group that went forward until we returned to the service road (where the other cops and the light alls were). He stuck to me like glue, as he was frightened. When we got back to the light alls, I ordered the cops back to the base. Some had already departed. Burroughs was still there. He again asked to go forward. As I remember, he and Bustinza were allowed to go to the 'landing site' while we waited.

All the other cops, except one or two, had departed. Then we all got in the jeep and remaining truck and returned to the base. If Warren was out, which I doubt, he would have long since departed...."

Source : The Halt Perspective


To illustrate one of my problems with the way the book has been written I am assuming "Harry" is Harry Harris, a Manchester Solicitor, and "Mike" is Mike Sacks (a colleague) as both were interested in the case in the early 1980s. However Mike Sacks is not mentioned for another 60 or so pages AFTER this quote. Anyone with no real knowledge of this case would have to guess who they were.

As to Halt's actual comments. They seem to contradict that Bustinza was at some time tied up at East Gate. Maybe his memory is failing him. At one time Halt tried to make out Bustinza was not with him at all. But now it suits his agenda as it means he can dismiss Warren's story as Warren had claimed he was never with Halt but was with Bustinza.

He dismisses any ill effects and remains unconvinced this was a military 'experiment/exercise'. He also asserts that HIS men were subjected to hypnosis and drugs. Elsewhere he has stated that he did not know this until many years after. But that's rather strange isn't it. Halt had a duty of care to all the men under his command. As Deputy Base Commander any investigations involving hypnosis and drugs (in peace time on his own men) would have been highly irregular. If he was unaware what was going on then that's alarming. The other possibility is that he wasn't and he is still concealing something to this day. Or maybe he was meddled with as well and they did a better job on him than anyone else and really are gloating at their success.

Most notable of all is that, he has very little to say about Burroughs and Bustinza going forward to the 'landing' site. Almost like it was of no consequence. The Halt Tape offers even less information on what was going on.



PS : Mentioned earlier in the thread is the work of Dr. Kit Green with those who have been injured after UAP contact events. This came from the book "Phenomena" by Annie Jacobsen. Annie can be heard talking about this and more on John Burroughs' radio show of almost the same name. Download link :

National Security Investigative Journalist - Annie Jacobson



edit on 7/6/17 by mirageman because: had another point to make



posted on Jun, 8 2017 @ 07:53 AM
link   

originally posted by: mirageman

One large Quote from Halt on Bustinza can be found on p291

Bustinza is a puzzle, as he was with me the whole time. [...] He stuck to me like glue, as he was frightened.

Source : The Halt Perspective


Thanks for that info MM!

If Halt is right, Bustinza’s narrative should closely follow the Halt tape. So let’s compare the Halt tape with what Bustinza told Boeche in 1984 (source: www.stealthskater.com/Documents/Woodbridge_01.doc page 6):


“We were in the alert area, and I was on my way over to RAF Woodbridge base [at around] midnight. While we were over there, one of my patrols sighted an object of some sort. He didn't describe it, he just said it was like a fire in the forest area. I notified my acting commander -- which was Lieutenant Englund -- and he went ahead and called the Commander that night -- which was Colonel Halt -- and he told Lieutenant Englund to check out the situation. We proceeded to check out the situation -- myself, Lt. Englund, and Sergeant Ball.”

“What I remember clearly ws that when we got there, [Col. Halt] pointed to the individuals that he wanted to go with him. So we went back to Bentwaters base; grabbed 2 "light-alls" and had a patrol refuel them; and once we refueled them, we took them out there to see if we could light up the area to see if there was anything out there. In the process of trying to check the light-alls, everything was malfunctioning. When we got to "Point A" -- the sighting of the object -- we had trouble turning the light-alls 'on'. Our truck wouldn't run either. It was kind of like all the energy had been drained out of both light-all units…”


This corresponds very well to the initial part of the Halt tape:



LT COLONEL HALT: Having a difficulty can't get the light all to work.
LT COLONEL HALT: . . . gonna send back, get another light all. Meantime, we're gonna take some readings with the Geiger counter, and err, chase around the area a little bit waiting for another light-all to come back in.



“We started to search. … One individual had said that he had spotted the object -- like sitting on the ground. We proceeded to look and in the process found kind of like triangular tripods … burned into the [ground] at 3 different standpoints. … They were like it was a heavy object. They took radiation readings of the holes. And they got a radiation reading as I recall.”


This corresponds very well to the subsequent investigation of the landing site as it was recorded on the Halt tape.


“Then I recall that we were walking through the woods and came upon the lights again. And that's when I first saw the object …”

“We got -- I think it was the flight chief [Sergeant Ball] and I believe another individual officer. We kept searching the area -- kind of like trying to follow the object. And it was moving through the trees. And in the process, we came upon a yellow mist about 2-or-3 feet off the ground. It was like dew, but yellow … like nothing I've ever seen before. … We kind of like ignored it. We were worried about the object … to see if we could locate it again or catch up to it again …
We did see the object again.”


Again a good match with the Halt tape, the chase of the strange red light and the light(s) approaching them while particles are shooting off.


“It was hovering low, like moving up-and-down anywhere from 10-to-20 feet -- back up, back down, back up.”


This corresponds with:



LT COLONEL HALT: OK we're looking at the thing, we're probably about two to three hundred yards away. It looks like an eye winking at you, it's still moving from side to side and when you put the starscope on it, it, it's sort of a hollow center right, a d-dark center, it's...it's...
LT ENGLUND: It's like a pupil...
LT COLONEL HALT: Bit like a pupil of an eye lookin' at you, winking. And the flash is so bright to the starscope, that err... it almost burns your eye.
(BREAK IN TAPE)


Bustinza then continues:

“There was a red light on top and there were several blue lights on the bottom. But there was also an effect maybe like a prism … with rainbow lights on top, scattered about .. [and] several other colors of light. It was weird … It was a tremendous size. It even surprised me that it was able to fit into the clearing. A tremendous size -- and I use the word 'tremendous' carefully. It was a round, circular shape. I hate to say like a "plate", but it was thicker at the center than it was at the edge.”

"It was gone in a flash, almost like it just disappeared. When it left, we were hit by a cold blast of wind which blew toward us for 5-or-10 seconds. … It was a really scary feeling. … I was just frozen in place at first … my life actually passed in front of my eyes."


The Halt tape continues with:





...and then the Halt perspective suddenly has jumped to the second farmer’s field…



posted on Jun, 8 2017 @ 02:11 PM
link   
a reply to: Guest101

This Halt gap corresponds with a few alleged incidents.

Before Randles, Street and Butler got hold of the Halt recording they heard a few rumours.

The first was that Halt and his men came under attack from the Phenomena, and that Halt ordered the men to shoot.

The second is what a whistleblower told Randles - that on the tape before the battle Halt got closer and exclaimed "Oh my God, it's a Ma...'

Apparently the side of the tape cut off at this point. Penniston warned the trio that when released the tape would be heavily edited to give a certain impression.

Of course when released the tape had no such mention. It gave the impression of matching the rotation of the lighthouse beam.

More interesting than this... Mike Sacks (not sure if I've got the right person) and Harry Harris went to see Halt without the female trio. The inference was that Halt wanted to see only the men.

He told them about 'The Machine' - and you can find this confirmed by Randles herself in my APEN thread.

Of course Ronnie Dudgale mentioned having some critical information regarding what was said by Halt to Harris but I don't think it ever saw the light of day?

I've really no idea what to make of this other than this information was rumoured before the tape was released several times but never appeared.

I can't say it fits with any other story including Bustinza's!



posted on Jun, 8 2017 @ 03:05 PM
link   
a reply to: ctj83




The first was that Halt and his men came under attack from the Phenomena, and that Halt ordered the men to shoot.


If they were armed on UK land and then discharged weapons. That would have definitely been against the SOFA (I don't mean leaving their guns on the couch!).




The second is what a whistleblower told Randles - that on the tape before the battle Halt got closer and exclaimed "Oh my God, it's a Ma...' Apparently the side of the tape cut off at this point. Penniston warned the trio that when released the tape would be heavily edited to give a certain impression.


Interesting as we've discussed Halt on the tape exclaiming "My God, it's a Ma.." (machine???). But it has long disappeared from the narrative. Is it folklore? There were also stories of a farmer reporting seeing a strange object. Is this the same farmer from the farmhouse that was seen "glowing" by Halt and his team? Did he ever go on the record?

Also Penniston's modern retelling of the tale is that he was keeping schtum whilst he was in the Air Force and never piped up until the 90s when he retired. Hmmmm......



posted on Jun, 9 2017 @ 01:06 AM
link   

edit on 9-6-2017 by Baablacksheep because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 9 2017 @ 01:10 AM
link   
a reply to: ctj83






Of course Ronnie Dudgale mentioned having some critical information regarding what was said by Halt to Harris but I don't think it ever saw the light of day?


I guess Dugdale is about to treat the radio listeners to a few treats
soon from what I am reading.

We are to stay tuned.

edit on 9-6-2017 by Baablacksheep because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
87
<< 152  153  154    156  157  158 >>

log in

join