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Judge claims DHS delivering smuggled children

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posted on Dec, 19 2013 @ 06:38 PM
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reply to post by WeAreAWAKE
 


The best way I've found to shut up a ranting progressive is to point out the hypocrisy between "amnesty" and Obamacare.

oth are laws.

Both are being manipulated and selectively enforced by this administration.



+1 more 
posted on Dec, 19 2013 @ 08:29 PM
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WeAreAWAKE

How is this then...send back all those who broke the law to get here, haven't paid any price for breaking the law and send all those who benefitted from them breaking the law back also. Do you by chance see the difference? Breaking the law versus following the law? All my family came here legally as did most people's families. WE ARE TALKING ABOUT NOT PROFITING FROM YOUR CRIME! Or don't the laws of this country mean anything to you. Oh...maybe you are a liberal and laws only matter when their result ends up with you getting your way...you know...like Obama. The biggest law breaker in the country.


Legally?
The Native Americans were the LEGAL land holders and owners of the Americas.
Down in Mexico, we had the Aztecs.

The USA, and other American Continental nations were ILLEGALLY obtained through force of arms and philosophies like Manifest Destiny.
Oh, wait, the natives didn't have a FLAG, so, any claims they had to the land didn't count?


Thus, sure, you can say things like "Our ancestors came here LEGALLY", but, in reality, they did so "LEGALLY" according the laws of an entity which illegally invaded and stole land from the natives.

What does "Liberal" and "Obama" have anything to do with anyone or anything anyway?
This whole "Send them back where they came from", thing has been going on since the very early days when self entitled, racist, uneducated, common folk everywhere or anywhere had any kind of complaint about any specific ethnic influx of immigrants.

People cried the old "Send them back where they came from" with the Chinese and other Asian influx on the West Coast.
People cried the old ""Send them back where they came from" with all the Irish on the East Coast.
They've done it with the Jews, the Cubans, the Japanese, the Mexicans, Blacks, Germans, Italians, Polish, and every ethnic persuasion that's ever come to America.

The African country of Liberia exists as a result of a "Back to Africa" movement, some of which was sponsored, and/or pressured by the old "Send them back where they came from".

It has nothing to do with "Liberals", "Conservatives", Obama, or anything else unless, of course, certain people want to MAKE it into issues about parties as opposed to focusing on the actual ISSUE.

As far as "breaking laws" to get there, there's a big difference between risking one's life, and selling everything they own for a chance at a better life, that just happens to conflict with some arbitrary laws on the issue, and breaking laws of the sort like Murder, Terrorism, Kidnapping, Gang Violence, Organized Crime, and those sorts of things.

This is my last post in this thread.
Send them back where they came from?
*vomit*




edit on 12/19/2013 by AliceBleachWhite because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 19 2013 @ 09:00 PM
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reply to post by AliceBleachWhite
 



It's actually pretty easy. We aren't talking about sins of our forefathers here, we are talking about the safety and security of our country today.


It's that easy. That's how easy it is for these people to dismiss your points. Quick wave of the hand and a "well… that was a while ago".



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 02:00 AM
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reply to post by AliceBleachWhite
 


Kudos for being the only poster in this thread with the slightest clue of how to properly approach the immigration issue from an ethical and intellectual stand point.

For those dismissing history willy nilly, you are asking for it to be repeated, and from the sounds of it, some of you richly deserve it.



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 06:34 AM
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reply to post by AliceBleachWhite
 


And the Native Americans also emigrated into what is the U.S. and killed other people as well. Heck if you knew the real history of the U.S. before it became the U.S. you would know that "Native Americans" also fought amongst themselves against other tribes...

There is no nation, or people on earth that didn't displace other people and conquered their lands and that includes native tribes who also emigrated into America.

BTW, the problem is that children are being smuggled INTO the United States with the help of the drug cartels from Mexico...

The U.S., and the Obama administration has been caught before aiding the drug cartels from Mexico, for example, do research on "fast and furious"... The Obama administration gave fully automatic weapons to the drug cartels to in fact attack the Second Amendment, and when they were caught, after some of those weapons were used by the drug cartels to kill U.S. border patrol law enforcement personel, the Obama administration claimed that the weapons were being tracked. But guess what? Most of the weapons, if any at all, seized by the U.S. border patrol were found with NO tracking device...

The Obama administration and Eric Holder, had been claiming the over 2,000 weapons were being allowed to be sold to the Mexico drug cartels "in hopes of tracking them" but that was a lie, just like Eric Holder had been lying about when he found out about "Fast and Furious".


...Agents with the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives lost track of many of the weapons. The guns later showed up at nearly 200 of crime scenes in Mexico and 11 in the U.S. Two were recovered at the scene of a U.S. Border Patrol agent's slaying in Arizona in December.


www.latimes.com...


The same Obama administration who alongside the Mexican President CLAIMED that the drug cartels were getting fully automatic weapons "because of the U.S. Second Amendment" were in fact the real culprit behind allowing the drug cartels in Mexico to get those weapons...


edit on 20-12-2013 by ElectricUniverse because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 11:54 AM
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reply to post by ElectricUniverse
 


Wide receiver. WiFi tracking of RFID chips placed in weapons and smuggled into Mexico.
Bush project.
This only came after Jon Snow and Dana Perino helped Bush put safe guards in place to protect all gun manufactures and retailers to protect them from lawsuits. And the assault weapons ban was dropped. Then after that Jon Snow teamed up with Dan Quayle to buy up all the gun manufacturers under the name Cerberus.

Dana Perino was fired from the BBG Broadcast Board of Governors the day of Sandy Hook because of her connections. Hell Adam Lanza had a strange file on his computer which was released in the list of evidence. Admiral Stockdale? Gulf of Tokkin. He led the attack after the false flag happened. He also debated Dan Quayle as a VP in the Presidential Election back in the day.

Arizona ATF was behind the guns being smuggled after Wide Receiver was changed to Fast and Furious by Obama which said no guns cross the border. Arizona got hacked by government hackers called Anonymous to get information about what happened because they were hiding it. It was easy for them to do it. No one in charge of the ATF. Arizona Governor Jan Brewer, Arizona Senator John McCain, and that other woman from Arizona Janet Napolitano. Jan Brewer wagged her finger at Obama at the airport after She knew it was the Federal Government who hacked Arizona. And Sheriff Joe Arpaio got revenge on the NSA for doing this. They used the NSA because of Janet Napolitano running DHS was interfering also. But Joe Arpaio had a plan a Cold Case Posse who he sent to Hawaii. Who never spoke to any officials there about a Birth Certificate. Instead they went and talked to Edward Snowden.

So think again about what you think you know.



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 12:54 PM
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Sorry, finals week and I have been a little busy.


AliceBleachWhite

It's one thing to talk lofty notions about Security, Terrorism, Drug Gangs, and all the other preprogrammed FEAR that's being sold to the general public and willingly swallowed, and it's another thing altogether in wasting resources on deporting children and their families that pose no threats to security, are not terrorists, and don't belong to any drug gangs.


all ex text from Texas D.P.S. :
Preprogrammed fears? If you lived in anywhere near the southern border these fears would be very very real:

Cartel member arrests in Texas:
Major multi-agency investigations have resulted in the arrest of hundreds of Mexican cartel members and associates who operated in Texas. Since 2007, these arrests have included at least 131 from the Gulf Cartel, 9 from the Juarez Cartel, 165 from La Familia Michoacana, 98 from Los Zetas, and 2 from the Sinaloa Cartel.
Cartel related homicides in Texas:
Since 2009, there have been 38 homicides in Texas related to cartel criminal activity. The assessment of whether a crime was related to the Mexican cartels is based upon the best available information from ongoing investigations, confidential informants and intelligence reporting.

As for the children and families that pose no threat, when the administration does things which encourage more innocents to try to cross the border they are providing means for the cartels to exploit their own countrymen and extort more money:

Cartel kidnapping, extortion and unlawful restraint in Texas:
Human smugglers regularly kidnap groups of illegal aliens in Texas and hold them against their will in safe houses while demanding ransom payments from their families. In other cases, cartel members and associates have abducted individuals in Texas to force them to align themselves with the cartel.



In the end, it comes down to a thin veil of racism, and US vs THEM, where we get these proclamations of "Send them back where they came from"!

I will not respond to this statement, as it is simply opinion designed to shame myself and others by branding us with the scarlet "R".


If we're talking about Criminals (not some ambiguously defined interpretation of "criminal"), real criminals that are indeed Terrorists, Drug Dealers/Gangs, etc, then, forget sending them "back" somewhere, where it would seem they just boomarang back again and again, but bury them in accordance with heavy criminal accountability for their actions.

Agreed. I think illegals engaged in organized crime should be shot and buried upon conviction. But somehow I think that in reality you would have a problem with that.


Children and their Families? People that just want to work?
Unless you're Native American, your ancestors were one of these at one time too, and illegal, or no, they're people and should be treated with all due respect and humanity in giving them opportunity for safety, and a place to prosper.

Again, we aren't on the hook for the sins of our fathers. We do not owe citizens of another country opportunity for safety nor a place to prosper. That is the duty of their fellow citizens, and their government. In spite of that, we *do* offer those things to citizens of other countries through legal, legitimate immigration.
Does our immigration system need serious revamping for the 21rst century? Yes, IMO. But that discussion is for another thread.


Sending people back "where they came from" solves nothing, as "they" just keep coming back.
Prosecute the criminals, the real criminals, and allow the same kinds of people that made the "American Dream" a reality to begin with once upon a time when America was a beacon of Immigration, to continue to reach for and even realize that "American Dream".

They do keep coming back, because for some odd reason the federal government (for many administrations now) have refused to secure our border.
As for 'beacon of immigration' ... there was a time when America had far more land and opportunity available, and the immigration then was legal, and controlled, and accounted for.


Every day we've these threads about America turning into a Police State, and the very same people complaining about the Police State then turn around and want to close America's Doors, which, would require that whole Police State thing to more adequately enforce against all these unchecked threats of Terrorism, Drug Gangs, and other ambiguously vague 'Security' issues all programmed to the background beat of FEAR within the public social consciousness, all the while, the only people ever profiteering from this are those with stock in the companies supplying all the hardware and "Security" technologies.

So, which one? Police State? or No?


Sorry, that entire last bit is fallacious: yourlogicalfallacyis.com...
A tightly controlled border does not mean that a police state must be imposed across the entire country.




posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 01:33 PM
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reply to post by AliceBleachWhite
 


"Back where they came from", in the way it was used above, is "back where they are citizens".

I have native heritage myself. And have to say that while the philosophical side of what you say has merit, in reality it is just dumb. We are in a whole different world than 200 years ago. Just think about it.

The world changed, and we have to get on with it. Or we have to tell all native Americans to get out, as they weren't supposed to be here either. This wasn't originally populated by humans. Just how far back do you want claims on this land to go? If a dinosaur is ever brought to life in a lab, should he be able to kick you out of America and tell you to go back to Japan or Siberia, or where ever the natives came from originally?

LOL



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 04:37 PM
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When the border is wide open (the default setting) anyone can come on over; we specifically are worried about criminals and drug gangs. The bloody terrorism they have used in northern Mexico is spilling into our southern states.

Legalize all drugs. No more drug gangs! No more bloody terrorism in Northern Mexico. Problem solved. Most of the crime coming from the borders is due to our draconian drug policies that we try to force on every other nation. I won't go into why this would work as that is a whole thread in itself.
Immigration, illegal or otherwise, is NOT the main issue. It is perspective and most people in this country are brainwashed by the government propagandists.



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 05:18 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 07:49 PM
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reply to post by JBA2848
 


Fast and Furious was an ATF operation that began in 2009, under OBAMA. Administration officials, like Eric Holder, of course were claiming they came to know about this operation a couple of years later, but that is a lie. Such an operation has to be approved by high level officials first. Not to mention that again the weapons that were confiscated from crimes in Mexico and the U.S. were found to have no tracking device at all, despite the U.S. administration claiming they were being tracked. BTW, this is still happening to THIS DAY...


...Yet the U.S. has approved the sale of more guns to Mexico in recent years than ever before through a program called "direct commercial sales." It's a program that some say is worse than the highly-criticized "Fast and Furious" gunrunning scandal, where U.S. agents allowed thousands of weapons to pass from the U.S. to Mexican drug cartels.
...
Here's how it works: A foreign government fills out an application to buy weapons from private gun manufacturers in the U.S. Then the State Department decides whether to approve.
...

www.cbsnews.com...

The whole claim by Eric Holder and the rest of the Obama administration that they were not aware of this operation until months or years AFTER it started is a LIE...


Now they are helping/allowing drug cartels from Mexico to smuggle illegal children into the U.S. meanwhile U.S. families are given the middle finger because of laws like Obamacare...

But hey the Obama administration is all about "hope' right?...


edit on 20-12-2013 by ElectricUniverse because: add info.



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 07:56 PM
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bigfatfurrytexan
...
I have native heritage myself. And have to say that while the philosophical side of what you say has merit, in reality it is just dumb. We are in a whole different world than 200 years ago. Just think about it.
...


The native tribes have stories on how they also migrated INTO the United States. They didn't sprout out of the ground. They also have stories on how they have fought different tribes for territory.

I know it sucks but it is a FACT that all people/races have displaced others for territory and resources.

Anyway, I am Hispanic, and even I know that the U.S. government smuggling illegal children by using smugglers from the Mexican drug cartel is simply WRONG.


edit on 20-12-2013 by ElectricUniverse because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 08:32 PM
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reply to post by AliceBleachWhite
 


Give it up already, we're not in the 1500's anymore.

On topic, I'm glad their now with their parents. Now we can ship the whole family unit back to their country of origin. If they so choose to try coming to the U.S. legally, I'll be more than happy to shake their hands and welcome them aboard. But if they can't even abide by the U.S. laws from the get go, how do we know they ever will?



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 08:40 PM
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As someone whom has worked in and around the Child Protective Services and foster care system .most attorneys will tell you its not illegal to be a parent.And in most cases children have to right to be with there parents regardless of the where,why or how.I dislike illegal immigrants as much as the next guy but being a illegal immigrant does not mean you can not be a parent



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 08:47 PM
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reply to post by deadcatsrule
 


No, it just means they're selfish. If they leave their kids behind to immigrate illegally and hope to raise the child as an illegal too sometime down the road - What do you call that?

If you're in the U.S. (or any country for that matter) illegally and have a child knowing that your future is uncertain and that you're not in the position to care for a child and provide them with stability - What do you call that?

I call it selfish. But you are right, however the way to solve the problem is to deport the parents. Not break more laws.



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 09:10 PM
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reply to post by Auricom
 

you are %100 correct and it should be stopped at the border.Hold the children at the border and make the parents come and get them,then deport them
my point is that its not illegal to reunite children and there parents .the original story makes it sound like the act of reuniting children and there parents is illegal.
Should they be reunited then deported? absolutely
a bus/plane ticket is a lot cheaper than the millions our government is handing out

I wounder if i could claim 15 million dependent's on my taxes



edit on 20-12-2013 by deadcatsrule because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 11:37 PM
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reply to post by ElectricUniverse
 

Thanks for sparing me the duty of giving Alice a pre-history lesson.

Human history is filled with war and conquest; no civilization is free of guilt. Drudging up past transgressions not only obfuscates the topic, but works against long-term stability. This is about national security, squandered tax dollars, and disregard for law.



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 11:43 PM
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Auricom
reply to post by deadcatsrule
 


No, it just means they're selfish. If they leave their kids behind to immigrate illegally and hope to raise the child as an illegal too sometime down the road - What do you call that?

If you're in the U.S. (or any country for that matter) illegally and have a child knowing that your future is uncertain and that you're not in the position to care for a child and provide them with stability - What do you call that?

I call it selfish. But you are right, however the way to solve the problem is to deport the parents. Not break more laws.


Were we in the US, Canada, or the EU, i would agree with you completely. But that isn't how it is in Mexico. I live less than 3 hours from the border, and it isn't that way here, either to be honest. We barely follow the laws that we are forced to follow out this way.

Children are sometimes just the byproduct of living life. Not everyone plans out their familes....i know very few that do that kind of stuff. You just do what young people do, and kids are a result. In a nation that is predominantly Catholic, you can imagine that children tend to come from areas with less money and in need of cheap entertainment. That is the way it works in poor, less affluent areas: more kids are born.

You can't denigrate a culture that arises from decades of US sponsored corruption residing in a country left in shambles from that corruption. Whether we like the current situation or not...our parents and grandparents helped create it. And now we, too are helping. Same with everything else going wrong in a way that has been decades in the making.



posted on Dec, 20 2013 @ 11:54 PM
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reply to post by AliceBleachWhite
 


There is a running joke in my family that America came to us, I am the decedents of Spanish missionaries getting it on with the locals, We go back to California and Texas PRE-mexican american war. Grew up around many "illegals" In So Ca, most of which fine law abiding people, for every negative story I could tell a positive, My best friend would be considered an "anchor" Baby.

This country would not function if the "illegals" where kicked out, people who talk like that are just nuts, deport them all is frankly, just as ludicrous as Mass Amnesty.

Massive reforms are needed, and both sides of the debate need to drop the rhetoric and vitriol, these are human beings so certainly a level of humanity is required in the issue but that doesn't mean being a door mat about it, stopping the flow of new incoming immigrants should definitely be looked at, and no matter the age of the individual we should be enforcing the laws on the books.



posted on Dec, 21 2013 @ 08:41 AM
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reply to post by AliceBleachWhite
 


Much of that land was purchased and what wasn't or what was won in battle well the natives claim that no one owned the land so,how do you steal what is essentially there for the taking?
As for returning it but leaving the infrastructure, well no. You didn't build it you don't get it. You get the low end casinos .



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