Hawaiian Official Who Released Obama's Birth Certificate Dies In Crash

reply to post by yorkshirelad


THANK YOU! I thought that maybe it was just zaphod and I in this thread who can utilize critical thinking and are capable of looking at a death associated with Obama as something other than a conspiracy.

Assuming it was a deliberate act by TPTB... am I missing something? It would make more sense if she'd revealed that the certificate was fake, not legitimate.

reply to post by yorkshirelad

What if...
-TPTB agent wasn't on board... (this makes sense to you doesn't it?)
-Everyone on board was supposed to die in the crash.

But no one was killed?

A cleanup crew makes sure that the target didn't survive.
That is how the conspiracy theory went for the Ron Brown crash.... except that they killed all of the survivors.

cheebie23
reply to post by Zaphod58

 

And not everything is simply black & white. If you don't believe in "conspiracies", why are you on ATS?

It's pain staking obvious why people like that are here....there needs to be a balance, if you know what I mean.

Thought this article from USA Today might fill in a few missing details...

SOURCE: USA Today

The Hawaiian health official who verified the authenticity of President Obama's birth certificate died in a small plane crash.

The plane, carrying a pilot and eight passengers, went down Wednesday in the water a half mile off the Hawaiian island of Molokai, the Maui Fire Department said. The lone fatality was Loretta Fuddy, who has served as state health director since January 2011...

Fuddy, 65, made national news in April 2011 when she verified the authenticity of certified copies of President Obama's birth certificate. Obama had requested the release to curb claims by so-called "birthers" that he was born in Kenya and not eligible to be president.

Makani Kai Air President Richard Schuman said the crash of the Cessna Grand Caravan was caused by engine failure.

...

The plane went down about a half-mile northwest of Kalaupapa peninsula...

Okubo said the department's deputy director, Keith Yamamoto, also had been booked on the flight.

Coast Guard Petty Officer Melissa McKenzie said a Coast Guard helicopter got three passengers out of the water while Maui fire crews picked up five people. One person swam ashore.

I have no idea whether this was all accidental or not, but it sure sounds at least potentially suspicious. These are a few of the questions that occur to me:

1. What exactly failed in the engine, and why?

2. Of the 1 pilot and 8 passengers on the plane, the Coast Guard says they picked up 3 passengers, the Maui fire crews picked up 5, and 1 person swam ashore. That accounts for everyone on the plane, but which group was Fuddy in?

3. What was the cause of Fuddy's death?

4. Was she already dead when the Coast Guard and Maui fire crew arrived, or did she die after being picked up (or swimming to shore, if she was the swimmer)?

5. Who swam ashore, and was there any reason someone might have wanted that person dead also (if it wasn't Fuddy)?

6. How hard would it have been for someone to swim to shore from a half-mile northwest of Kalaupapa peninsula?

7. Had any news just come out regarding Fuddy and the birth certificate or hinting she might be talking to anyone such as the Sheriff's Posse about the birth certificate?

butcherguy
reply to post by yorkshirelad

 

What if...
-TPTB agent wasn't on board... (this makes sense to you doesn't it?)
-Everyone on board was supposed to die in the crash.

But no one was killed?

A cleanup crew makes sure that the target didn't survive.
That is how the conspiracy theory went for the Ron Brown crash.... except that they killed all of the survivors.

Thank you for bringing that up...people are quick to call it legitimate without questioning and looking at all possibilities.

reply to post by ikonoklast


You're not suppose to ask these thought provoking types of questions....just accept what the media tells you and be a good little citizen.

A 65 yr old woman dies in a plane crash. We don't know what the status of her health was. For all we know it could've induced a heart attack, that ultimately killed her. Those little island hopper planes aren't exactly the epitome of safety.

I believe in some conspiracies, but i don't believe in creating one for the sake of one.

reply to post by ikonoklast


Excellent questions , couldn't have said it better myself.

reply to post by beatbox


Except butcherguy debunks his own hypothesis at the end of the post by saying that the previous event in question killed all the survivors. In this case, she was the only fatality. Wouldn't the survivors notice someone being segregated and then "dying" later on? It just leaves too many witnesses to ask questions, especially since thanks to the article posted by the previous poster, one of the other passengers also worked in her department. It makes more sense to err on the side of it being a legit accident and to MAYBE investigate other possibilities, but not to get your hopes up.

EllaMarina
Assuming it was a deliberate act by TPTB... am I missing something? It would make more sense if she'd revealed that the certificate was fake, not legitimate.

Yes and no. Someone could have gotten to her and was able to prove what she did. So before it gets out the tie up lose ends. She was obviously someone who would know if they are legitimate. Maybe she had a change of heart and was going to go public. "They" caught word by the good ol NSA and did the "needful".

Zaphod58
reply to post by cheebie23

 

I know its really hard to believe since Obama is involved, but it happens. Especially when you have a small plane.

They (the slashdot crown) thought the same about the death of Seymour Cray in Silicon Valley, who died when his offroad 4x4 overturned on the freeway and he wasn't wearing a seatbelt.

Personally, it annoys me when every single death warrants conspiracy theories now... you wonder why people call the users of this site paranoid?

Deny ignorance, sure... I can see why we question such things, but to blatantly say that someone's ignorant and wrong because they say that sometimes a cigar is just a cigar is not okay.

This seems silly to me. She wasn't important enough to kill. Obama could walk out on the White House lawn, urinate on the press corp followed by grandly announcing he was born on the 12 moon of planet HoobieJoob, and it wouldn't change a thing.

Those who control such things don't care where he was born. And after walking away without a scratch from many other lies, what would there be to fear even if the birth certificate was a fraud? He'd say, "Oh, just trying to protect myself from the racists," the media would fawn, Congress would do away with the natural born citizen requirement retroactively, and that'd be that.

I'm thankful for the so-called birthers, simply because society needs people who are vigilant about the truth. The fact is, the average citizen is rarely supplied with the information to verify the truth of anything these days, so the more people looking for holes in stories, the better. But I think they should focus on more important issues, is all. If he was born elsewhere, it wouldn't change anything. Put that energy into fixing the corrupt system that would make birth locale a moot point, instead.

reply to post by Krazysh0t

Except butcherguy debunks his own hypothesis at the end of the post by saying that the previous event in question killed all the survivors.

Hardly.
If you will take notice, the survivors were in separate groups.... one group had one person in it that was a half mile away from the others.

Sure, nothing untoward could possibly happen.

In the case of one survivor in the Ron Brown incident, she was seen moving around, quite alive. She arrived at a medical facility with a broken neck.

Maybe one survivor was in an ambulance that took a detour on the way to the hospital?

xuenchen
Maybe she was all ready to "testify" before Congress.

I bet somebody missed a payment and she threatened to "talk".

Or maybe she was scheduled to "meet" with the Sheriff's Posse.

Very odd "coincidence" indeed.

If we're going to indulge in hypothesis and hyperbole, maybe there were extreme right-wing elements who wanted her out if the way because she is standing in the way of making up some bs with forged documentation to go along with it 'proving' Obama is not an American.

reply to post by butcherguy


Your premise relies on a lot of whatifs working out exactly in the right way. What if the person doesn't die in the crash, what if she isn't separated from the rest of the survivors, what if another survivor decides to swim to shore with her, what if another survivor sees her alive before being picked up by rescue efforts, etc. Someone swimming to shore definitely proves they had no broken bones or injuries, therefore if they wind up dead later on there would be foul play afoot, and the swimmer was the only one separated from the rest of the survivors. Seriously, you guys need to stop and think about what you are suggesting, the mere fact that there were 8 other survivors pretty much discounts the foul play aspect.

I mean wouldn't it have been much easier to sabotage the engine then shoot (or drown) any survivors? You know instead of hoping that the ONE person you are trying to kill isolates themselves from the rest of the group? I mean what you are suggesting is A LOT of work to kill someone that the majority of the public forgot even existed. It would be much easier to bump her off quietly.

reply to post by SirMike


Summarised in four words: Obama says "Bwahahahahahaha! Yassah!"

...and the idea of influential Birthers being behind the crash never arose...

reply to post by Skyfloating


I noticed the lack of observation regarding this concept.

This woman verified the birth certificate as being accurate; if there was a conspiracy (which I do not believe there was), doesn't it make a lot more sense for extreme right-wing birthers to be implicated?