Court in India criminalizes homosexuality

reply to post by Desiflame


Since you registered today, and experience from the environment i grew up, the first part of you name indicates that you might be on Indian decent.

Do you have any thoughts about this law? how bad is this over there and can this be reversed?


Im pretty sure you live in Britain or europe but im sure you have family back home?

I do have Indian friends, they are so "white-washed" to know crap.

khimbar

dellmonty

coming from a stinking no good defeated smelly britt,I consider your reply that of an ape.glad in your in Brittan,were we kicked your a#@es back to .have a good day you red coat faggot lover.

edit on 12-12-2013 by dellmonty because: to make sure the britt reads it correctly!

And this, children, is why drugs are bad, mmmkay.

hey khimbar...there are still a lot of these types in America, as well as in other first-world countries......it's like having that crazy uncle that lives in the basement, and every time he comes out for a family event, he embarrasses the hell out of everyone else because of his ignorance

luciddream
reply to post by Desiflame

 

Since you registered today, and experience from the environment i grew up, the first part of you name indicates that you might be on Indian decent.

Do you have any thoughts about this law? how bad is this over there and can this be reversed?


Im pretty sure you live in Britain or europe but im sure you have family back home?

I do have Indian friends, they are so "white-washed" to know crap.

Actually my name is based on my favourite pizza from my favourite delivery company

I have no connections to India beyond having Indian mates and enjoying the odd curry every now and then.

Sorry to disappoint.

reply to post by Desiflame


Damn.. :/ oh well my bad!

I know there are few active Indians on ATS, maybe they can chime in.

dellmonty
Iran has the answer to this problem.

So you think that the 94% of 'straight' people should go and kill the 4% homosexuals and the 2% bisexuals? Hang them simply because they were born homosexual or bisexual? Seriously .. YIKES.

This story is sad, but if there's one thing I am sure about...this is a battle that the Indians are going to have to fight on their own.

Gays and lesbians in India have complex issues not found in the Western world.

Aside from being criminalized for gay sexx now, they still have the issue of family to deal with. In case you don't know how many marriages work over there, gays and lesbians(and everyone really) have arranged marriages regardless if they've been with someone for five years or not. Of course there is the tough gays(there always are) who refuse to give in and subsequently become penniless outcasts, but for the majority that means that they consistently have to have their hearts broken when marriage time comes.

Like a story of this one lady I knew where she had been with her girlfriend for seven years and had to say goodbye...oh yeah the gf wound up killing herself. Sounds like a Hollywood lesbian story from the 50's.

I don't know what the answer with but one thing is for sure: as soon as women's rights become a priority in a country, glbt rights follow soon after. Any country or society that disrespects women to the point of raping them on a regular basis. Any country that bars them from pursuing real education and forces them into unwanted marriages where they are responsible for taking care of the elderly. Any country that has such a disdain for anything with a vagina is automatically going to have disdain for men who they perceive to act like women(teh gays) and women who don't follow their abusive relationship practices(lesbians).

It is no coincidence that with more egalitarian societies the rights of glbt follow shortly after.

Unfortunately this a battle that only India can win from within. It is still sad to read about though.

reply to post by dellmonty


You have the freedom to believe what you want, and to say what you want. if you don't "approve" of me or anyone else because we are gay, you have that freedom. if you saw one of my drag shows and yelled hateful remarks the entire time, you have that freedom, if you saw me in the streets you again have that freedom to make any remarks you want, your opinion of me is none of my business, but all those freedoms you have we are afforded the same, we have the freedom to kiss, hold hands etc with anyone we want to in public.

this is taking away peoples rights, and you are advocating taking away the rights of Humans just because you don't agree with their sexual orientation

The title of this thread is rather misleading. A court didn't ''criminalize'' homosexuality making ''criminals'' out of gay people.... And the police aren't going to be cracking down on gays. What happened is that the supreme court simply reversed a 2009 high court ruling that had ''decriminalized'' homosexuality. Its basically just mundane paperwork that really changes nothing for anybody. This whole thing is a storm in a teacup really.

I said this in the original thread on this story but here goes. This is nothing more than citizens in India being allowed to have their country governed the way that they want. The court kicking this down to lawmakers was wise to me because they represent the people as opposed to a special interest group that represents a very small but loud minority trying to twist the courts to suit their point of view.

India recognizes transsexuals and allows them to identify as so on the census but views homosexuality as a personal choice that corrupts family values. You know family values? Those things Americans used to have before they allowed Hollywood and government to destroy them. Back when people had a sense of community. This is a conservative country that is home to a number of faiths most of which are probably in agreement with the ruling.

Progressives complain about countries being invaded and national sovereignty but then condemn them when their culture and views don't mirror our own.

sk0rpi0n
the supreme court simply reversed a 2009 high court ruling that had ''decriminalized'' homosexuality.

There is nothing 'simply' about it.
Washington Post

India’s Supreme Court overturned a historic lower-court decision on homosexuality Wednesday, making gay sex a crime in the world’s most populous democracy, with violators facing up to 10 years in prison.

See that? Did you read it? What is it called when a person having sex is committing a crime?
They are being a criminal. So yes, the rule made homosexual behavior, once again, criminal.
Criminal behavior that puts someone in prison for 10 years.

Another thing is, even if homosexuality was ''decriminalized'', it isn't really going to magically change the mindset of the people into accepting gays as equal to them. To the average Indian, the mark of a man is to be with a woman. He would deem as unnatural the very idea of same sex relationships. India has the right to lead its own way of life and it is unreasonable to expect them to be like somebody else.

@FlyersFan ....... Tell Washington times that the Indian police aren't about to go snooping in peoples bedrooms to arrest gays like criminals. Like I said, the court ruling was just paperwork that really changes nothing. You can expect to see gays publicly protest the supreme courts decision over the next few days, without getting arrested.

reply to post by beezzer

To force our values and ethics onto another culture that is doing nothing to interfere with our own, is wrong.

How about if we simply express our values instead - and support those people in other countries that are struggling with the same exact things we're still fighting for here?

Words are powerful things

The world is smaller now - the internet has changed how we share information - and how fast we share it

This is nothing I can prove, but even in our own country things have changed for the gay community in ways we might not have expected even 10 years ago. I think the internet has had something to do with that. Society has participated in an ongoing, public back and forth conversation - this is what changes people's minds. Force never works - and no country or culture is made up of a single kind of people who all think the same way. Our own country is a perfect example of this - and we're still working on equality. The fight hasn't been won yet

I read Indian news sites all the time - I imagine they're reading anything and everything as well. We always imagine ourselves to be more sophisticated or enlightened than everyone else - and in a position to judge. If I were to read only American media and nothing else - I would not see us as being all that together frankly. Sometimes we sound completely looney tunes - and not in the fun way

There are plenty of people in India working on this, same as they are here. I'm sure there is a great deal of support going back and forth - things will change in time

reply to post by theantediluvian


India is a very conservative country.

There are laws already banning gay behavior which have been challenged recently.

The Supreme Court has re-affirmed the existing laws.

The two largest religious groups - Hindus and Muslims, both are against gay behavior.

India is still a deeply religious country. Supporting gay behavior is going to be a bigger challenge for the Police, as the religious brigade is sure going to oppose any change.

A country where arranged marriages still rule, open gay behavior is unthinkable.

I think Western people look at India from their mindset, which is not the correct way.

India has many fundamental issues to tackle before such trivial issues as sexual freedom.

Vedic religion is very clear - any unnatural sex is equal to rape.

Unnatural sex is any sex except union between man and woman to produce an offspring.

All Hindus generally go by Vedic laws as Hindu sects (Shaiv, Vaishnav, and Shakt) have no separate laws.

The Muslims also consider same-sex unions as against their religion.

sk0rpi0n
@FlyersFan ....... Tell Washington times that the Indian police aren't about to go snooping in peoples bedrooms to arrest gays like criminals. Like I said, the court ruling was just paperwork that really changes nothing. You can expect to see gays publicly protest the supreme courts decision over the next few days, without getting arrested.

India is a country where a man and woman cannot kiss publicly. So you can understand the conservative attitude of people.

Will police raid the gays and lesbians??? They can if there is a complaint. I think open same-sex behavior is quite difficult except in very big cities.

So, the Supreme Court said the laws are the laws and we are not changing the laws. In other words, they do not legislate from the bench unlike our own courts in the US do far too many times no matter which way you swing ideologically.

They did not say that India's government could not eventually change those laws.

It seems to me that when the time is right for India and her people who are the ones who will have to live with this, there is a chance those laws could change, but until social attitudes of the people change, changing the laws won't do anything.

No one can legally force tolerance or acceptance if society won't have it.

GargIndia

sk0rpi0n
@FlyersFan ....... Tell Washington times that the Indian police aren't about to go snooping in peoples bedrooms to arrest gays like criminals. Like I said, the court ruling was just paperwork that really changes nothing. You can expect to see gays publicly protest the supreme courts decision over the next few days, without getting arrested.

India is a country where a man and woman cannot kiss publicly. So you can understand the conservative attitude of people.

Will police raid the gays and lesbians??? They can if there is a complaint. I think open same-sex behavior is quite difficult except in very big cities.

And this comes back to the question I keep asking, "What is 'openly gay'?" If it's simply going about and doing your business in the company of your partner, fine, but since no one really has a problem with that (at least in America and possibly not in India), then what are you missing? If it means being able to mack on your partner in public, then no one really wants to see me mack on my husband in public either. They really don't and wouldn't even if we were Pitt and Jolie. There are just some things that are meant to be kept in the home.

Criminalizing homosexuality is as ridiculous as criminalizing marijuana. How can something that is natural be illegal? Is Mother Earth illegal? Man's law attempts to create order, but really just sows the seeds of chaos. Natural Law > man's law.