Giant Eagles in the Hobbit and LOTR

In these movies the giant eagles are 'gods'.
They annoy me.
When some little hobbit or dwarf or nearly powerless 'wizard' needs to be rescued, out of nowhere the giant eagles show up and save the day.

Neither ageless wizards nor elven rings of power can pull this off.

On page 1of LOTR Gandalf should have duct taped the one ring to the king of the giant eagles, and had him high altitude and speed fly the One Ring to mount doom and drop it in.

You know this would have worked. How irresponsible to make a hobbit do it. All they do is whine about missing Linner.

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear


Would have made a boring book and movie though.
I can't wait till the 15th Iam taking my Mum on her birthday to see the 2nd part
Oh and Evangiline Lilly as an elf

They dont just "show up" as you so ignorantly put it.
Gandalf tells a moth to go get them for him!!!

If you dont wanna look stupid do your some research before you post nonsense like the above statement

reply to post by boymonkey74


Ya I agree... its all about the story

I always liked the eagles... I think about the most powerful creatures in middle earth, and I think the eagles are somewhere near the top of the list...

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear

They could not have flown the distance.
It's clear from the books that they get weary just like any living thing.
The magic of the ring would not have allowed Frodo to be parted from it, so he would have had to be taken too. Extra weight.
Also a lone eagle could not have fought off the Nazguls which would have attacked it.

Finally, the decision to take the ring to Mordor was made at a meeting where there were no eagles present.
So how would they have got the ring to the eagles in the first place? It would have required an equally long journey northwards, and endless climbing, and they did not even know exactly where the eagles were.
There were no shortcuts in that war.

reply to post by DISRAELI


Once again they could have just sent a moth to let the Eagles know they were needed.
Truth is they couldnt trust the Eagles coz birds like shiny things. It would have set off with the best of intentions but halfway through the journey it would have thought "I bet if I take this back to my nest Ill get a ton of hot Eagle tail" Hence they had to send Frodo

True story

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear


In a sense, but only a small sense, you may be correct in that these Eagles are what in Literature and Theater is a plot device called Deus Ex Machina, or "God from the Machine".

This is a literary/theatrical device which manifests in some fantastic event, however it's rationalized or justified in specific works, that saves the day.

A deus ex machina (pronounced [ˈdeus eks ˈmaː.kʰi.na], /ˈdeɪ.əs ɛks ˈmɑːkiːnə/ or /ˈdiːəs ɛks ˈmækɨnə/; from Latin, meaning "god from the machine"; plural: dei ex machina) is a plot device whereby a seemingly unsolvable problem is suddenly and abruptly resolved by the contrived and unexpected intervention of some new event, character, ability, or object. Depending on how it is done, it can be intended to move the story forward when the writer has "painted himself into a corner" and sees no other way out, to surprise the audience, to bring a happy ending into the tale, or as a comedic device.

I'm fairly certain that's in Literature 101 in any freshman University course.
I don't mean this as an insult, but as encouragement towards all the wonderful and fascinating things that can be learned and taken away from such.

reply to post by AliceBleachWhite


Yes Amy (Farrah Fowler) **. I am quite conversant with the phrase
and nearly included it in my own post. However in fact, I
nearly put that post in 'rant' not 'chat' as those eagles
annoy me. I dislike inefficient use of strategic resources,
and don't need to include Latin or obscure random academic
references to parade my very high IQ past one and all.

In short, those giant eagles piss me off. And I don't care
for literary gimmicks; it's a sign of poor writing overall.

(** meant affectionately)

KPB

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear


Because the Ring would of taken over it and we would have our Giant Eagle Overlord!
Or it would work for a really short story.

reply to post by DISRAELI


Dang!

That's a more passionate reply than I usually get
when I'm posting about UFOs, spirituality or
conspiracies! I'd better watch my step or the
smack will get put down on me!

(note to self: stop bad talking the giant eagles)

freakshowfatty
reply to post by KellyPrettyBear

 

Because the Ring would of taken over it and we would have our Giant Eagle Overlord!
Or it would work for a really short story.

edit on 6-12-2013 by freakshowfatty because: (no reason given)

Well I for one, welcome our new Giant Eagle Overlords!

KPB

reply to post by IkNOwSTuff


Those moths let everybody boss them around and/or eat them!
Good thing a random sparrow never ate one of Gandalf's moths
or Sauron would have won!

Who says that a butteryfly flapping it's wings on the other
side of the world doesn't change things!

reply to post by AliceBleachWhite


nice spear from wiki there i wont tell. well maybe i will.

en.wikipedia.org...

they appear, usually and intentionally serving as agents of eucatastrophe or deus ex machina, in various parts of his legendarium, from The Silmarillion and the accounts of Númenor to The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings.

However I do not agree that Tolkien had "painted himself into a corner" as this wiki page would put it and used the Great eagles to get himself out of trouble.
The Eagles were described as :

The difference between "common" eagles and Great Eagles is prominently described in The Hobbit: Eagles are not kindly birds. Some are cowardly and cruel. But the ancient race of the northern mountains were the greatest of all birds; they were proud and strong and noble-hearted.

The reason why Gandalf just couldn't give the ring to the Eagles to take to the mountain is it corrupts the holder, imagine a highly intelligent evil Eagle "with a wingspan of 30 fathoms (180 ft; 55 m)" with the most powerful WMD created.

The story behind the great eagles is far more intricate than A deus ex machina flick to the side, the books are far more in depth than the movie's and paint a completely different picture.
Take the time to check this web page out and take up the books for a few hours and enjoy

eldorion.com...

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear


Hi KPB,

What is your favorite fiction book? Often I am able to suss out what a person likes to read, but you are impervious to my powers of liber-prescience.

reply to post by Bybyots


I rather liked "The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant",
and I loved Isaac Asimov's Foundation Trilogy+Foundations Edge
and the Robots of Dawn series. Also loved "Stranger in a Strange Land".
"Cities in Flight" by James Blish. A bit of Harlan Ellison. Read LOTR
3 times.. but it was slightly subpar from my real interests.

That was 30+ years ago now.. haven't read a fiction book
since then.

But in general, any series which involves space/other dimensions,
and/or themes such as "what is sentience" and "what are the real
limits of the human mind" / Science and Mysticism reach the
same place. Equal parts science and mysticism; it's all the search
for knowledge and the stabilization/Improvement of culture that
has always fascinated me.

No, actually, as evidenced by the Peter Jackson movies, Elrond should have just pushed Isildor into the volcano with the ring right at the outside. That probably explains why the guy look so sour throughout the whole trilogy - He messed up and he knows it, and now Bilbo has to die.

reply to post by ketsuko


And to think that Sauron was just a minor lieutenant, a flea
compared to Morgoth; and that Sauron put 1/3 of his power
into that ring. And Sauron didn't even have a body any more.

Talk about pitching softballs to the heroes of that age..
compared tot he horrors of the previous age.

And even then, the heroes failed at the last moment...
and a cursed soul / villain saves the day.. along with
giant eagles.

A good morality play I guess.. with all the classical elements.

One does not simply post on AboveTopSecret and get a logical answer,,
Its forums are guarded by more than just mere moderators.
There are Conspiracies Theories there that do not sleep, and the Great Google eye is ever watchful.
It is a barren wasteland, riddled with disinfo and individuals of questionable character,
the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume.
Not with ten thousand stars could you do this.
It is folly.

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear


Have you read the Silmarillion? I did not. I listened to the whole damned unabridged thing on CD. Twice. It's pretty awesome. I think that you would enjoy it as it would provide you with even more fodder for your satire.

When I was a kid some of my peers in my circle of friends were reading the Thomas Covenant novels, but they never quite made it on to my list; I understand they have a following, though.

Have a good one,

reply to post by Bybyots


Yes I did read it. The best of the bunch.. though it was actually
finished by JRRT's son if I recall.

Have a good one.