Water Fluoridation will NOT kill you.

reply to post by superman2012

I can keep this up all day - here is another: Fluoride causes bone cancer and is a carcinogen

WeAre0ne

superman2012
So you are claiming that it does, it may, it may not, cause something to happen to your body? How is that an argument for not fluoridating water?

This quote of yours just highlights your inability to read. I clearly state, what you consume affects your body no matter the dosage. Then I say, no matter what it effects your body. I then say the effects (meaning something absolutely happened to your body) may or may not be noticeable. Just because it is not noticeable, doesn't mean there was no effect. How on Earth did you read, "it may not cause something to happen to your body"???

For example, CANCER, in it's early stages shows no signs or symptoms. A lot of illnesses show no NOTICEABLE signs or symptoms at first. Meaning your body is effected, but you don't notice it. Do you understand now?

Fluoride has the same effect. It destroys your organs like all other toxins do at small dosages unnoticeably, and at large dosages destroys your body noticeably. Yes, salt, alcohol, chlorine, and all the other toxins we consume in small and large dosages kill us slowly, leading to many different illnesses that we have been brainwashed to shrug off as old age. That is why they are classified as toxins. Many people try to avoid these toxins, but they can't when it's in their water and food.

As for the rest of your post, you prove yet again you are closed minded, and you are ignoring posts, and or not comprehending what the posts say. You are not debating, you are just ignoring peoples posts and they saying "prove it", even though countless research papers, studies, and absolute logic have been shoved in your face.

It's hard not to comment about you on this topic since you seem to be the main character provoking replies with ridiculous amounts of ignorance.

edit on 16-12-2013 by WeAre0ne because: (no reason given)

If you can't notice it, how on Earth can you link everything to fluoride?

Please provide credible sources for your claims.

Edit: You say I just say prove it and are angry about that for some reason, when you people demand the same of me, I prove it. Any other parts of this debate that I have to take part in that the anti-fluoride people are exempt from? It would be nice to know in advance so I don't ask for pesky things like "proof", "scientific evidence", and the like. I would hate to embarrass myself again by thinking this was a level playing field.

reply to post by Murgatroid


All those graphics sure are scary if there is no context provided with them.

Have any credible sources?

I love how I have quoted Dr's for this and have been told that Dr's also said asbestos, cigarettes, etc, were dangerous, but you quoted a Dr who has head of the AMA from 1936 - 1937 when these claims were being made and BEFORE water fluoridation took place.

Tell me again how those graphics are supposed to scare ME? I know they scare people, they are designed for that. Just tell me how they help your argument and are supposed to scare me.

Edit: I did stop going through them and just now caught the Nazi connection, which if you had read the thread (first 3 posts), you would have realized that that lie is just that, a lie. You are not helping your cause by repeating lies. It just shows the unbelievable lengths that an anti-fluoridian goes to support their cause and the unbelievable lengths they go to, to not research it on their own. Google graphics, good grief.

jibajaba
reply to post by superman2012

 

I can keep this up all day - here is another: Fluoride causes bone cancer and is a carcinogen

In the first one lead is the one doing all the dirty work, causing all those deaths. So are you saying the fluoride was contaminated with the lead in the first place or the lead in the pipes got into the water because of the fluoride?
I would like to see those studies as well, do you happen to have a link to them?

Thanks!

superman2012
If you can't notice it, how on Earth can you link everything to fluoride?

Please provide credible sources for your claims.

There is a thing called chemistry, and chemical equations. We know the chemical composition of fluoride, and the chemical composition of different parts of our bodies, and we can calculate the reactions when the chemicals combine, and their effects. That has been done, and that is why fluoride is classified as a toxin. We found that the chemical reaction induced by fluoride in our bodies physically damages our bodies / organs, so we (science) labeled fluoride a toxin.

When I say, "you may not notice the effects of fluoride" I am talking about bodily symptoms, not physical evidence. There may not always be noticeable symptoms at small doses, such as reduced thyroid function, and or instant decrease in brain functionality, or flu like sickness, but there will always be a physical effect on our bodies which we can prove chemically. A silent killer so-to-speak.

If you want a credible source take a Chemistry 101 class. Or, simply take off your blinders, open your mind, and do some google searches for information that discredits your beliefs, instead of searching for info that erroneously supports them like you have been.

WeAre0ne

superman2012
If you can't notice it, how on Earth can you link everything to fluoride?

Please provide credible sources for your claims.

There is a thing called chemistry, and chemical equations. We know the chemical composition of fluoride, and the chemical composition of different parts of our bodies, and we can calculate the reactions when the chemicals combine, and their effects. That has been done, and that is why fluoride is classified as a toxin. We found that the chemical reaction induced by fluoride in our bodies physically damages our bodies / organs, so we (science) labeled fluoride a toxin.

When I say, "you may not notice the effects of fluoride" I am talking about bodily symptoms, not physical evidence. There may not always be noticeable symptoms at small doses, such as reduced thyroid function, and or instant decrease in brain functionality, or flu like sickness, but there will always be a physical effect on our bodies which we can prove chemically. A silent killer so-to-speak.

If you want a credible source take a Chemistry 101 class. Or, simply take off your blinders, open your mind, and do some google searches for information that discredits your beliefs, instead of searching for info that erroneously supports them like you have been.

edit on 17-12-2013 by WeAre0ne because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-12-2013 by WeAre0ne because: (no reason given)

So again, instead of showing anything that proves your claim (like I have) you resort to more silliness in the form of personal attacks?
That sure is the surest sign of a strong argument!

I showed how it is beneficial in the proper doses and how it would take 500+ years for the proper dose to hurt anyone.
What have you shown again? (with credible evidence)
If you took Chemistry 101 you should be able to show me, or teach me, or prove your claim.

I'll wait.

reply to post by superman2012


If you weren't so busy ignoring posts you would have noticed I posted proof long ago on this topic.

Also, I didn't post any personal attacks, I'm just stating facts. You are ignoring evidence and logic that proves you are incredibly wrong.

Should I post more info how small doses of fluoride affects the thyroid.... AGAIN? Proving that you are supporting a lie, AGAIN.

500 years? It only takes a few hours for small doses of fluoride to reduce thyroid function, and in turn cause various problems throughout your entire body. I already proved that in posts long ago.

You have proven that any "debate" with you is pointless. So I will not continue here. I'd rather talk to a brick wall.

---

I supposed you have read these resources?

1) Gosselin, RE; Smith RP, Hodge HC (1984). Clinical toxicology of commercial products. Baltimore (MD): Williams & Wilkins. pp. III–185–93. ISBN 0-683-03632-7.

2) Baselt, RC (2008). Disposition of toxic drugs and chemicals in man. Foster City (CA): Biomedical Publications. pp. 636–40. ISBN 978-0-9626523-7-0.

3) IPCS (2002). Environmental health criteria 227 (Fluoride). Geneva: International Programme on Chemical Safety, World Health Organization. p. 100. ISBN 92-4-157227-2.

WeAre0ne
reply to post by superman2012

 

If you weren't so busy ignoring posts you would have noticed I posted proof long ago on this topic.

Also, I didn't post any personal attacks, I'm just stating facts. You are ignoring evidence and logic that proves you are incredibly wrong.

Should I post more info how small doses of fluoride affects the thyroid.... AGAIN? Proving that you are supporting a lie, AGAIN.

500 years? It only takes a few hours for small doses of fluoride to reduce thyroid function, and in turn cause various problems throughout your entire body. I already proved that in posts long ago.

You have proven that any "debate" with you is pointless. So I will not continue here. I'd rather talk to a brick wall.

---

I supposed you have read these resources?

1) Gosselin, RE; Smith RP, Hodge HC (1984). Clinical toxicology of commercial products. Baltimore (MD): Williams & Wilkins. pp. III–185–93. ISBN 0-683-03632-7.

2) Baselt, RC (2008). Disposition of toxic drugs and chemicals in man. Foster City (CA): Biomedical Publications. pp. 636–40. ISBN 978-0-9626523-7-0.

3) IPCS (2002). Environmental health criteria 227 (Fluoride). Geneva: International Programme on Chemical Safety, World Health Organization. p. 100. ISBN 92-4-157227-2.

edit on 17-12-2013 by WeAre0ne because: (no reason given)

Do you read your resources or just blindly post them?

From your resources:

1) In high concentrations, soluble fluoride salts are toxic and skin or eye contact with high concentrations of many fluoride salts is dangerous. Referring to a common salt of fluoride, sodium fluoride (NaF), the lethal dose for most adult humans is estimated at 5 to 10 g (which is equivalent to 32 to 64 mg/kg elemental fluoride/kg body weight).

Nothing to do with the topic of water fluoridation.

2) Ingestion of fluoride can produce gastrointestinal discomfort at doses at least 15 to 20 times lower (0.2–
0.3mg/kg) than lethal doses.

Discomfort, not death or harm. Again nothing to do with water fluoridation.

3) I'm assuming #3 also came to the same conclusion as #2 as they are listed together.

I don't have a problem with taking sources from wikipedia at all. Just make sure they support the argument that you are attempting to debate. No one has said that fluoride isn't harmful in high doses. This thread was about the untruths listed at the beginning of this thread regarding properly dosed water fluoridation.

As for your claim that you have proven something awhile ago within this thread. I haven't seen it, not even when I go back into your post history and check it all out in regards to this thread. Are you sure it wasn't on another thread? I'm only asking because you seem so convinced that you have "proven" something already.

Unless of course you are referring to this link provided by you earlier which I had to copy and paste later to show you that it had nothing to do with water fluoridation and if I remember correctly (which doesn't happen often) had nothing to do with fluoride at all. So please explain how a study done not on water fluoridation or fluoride has to do with the subject at hand???

Anything to add to the topic of the thread or is the brick wall in your way?

Edit: I starred you too so I could throw my hat in with the crowd that stars for the fun of it.

reply to post by superman2012


I run it threw an 8 stage filter. Only chemicals could get threw that which I think is what that is. The city website shows how much flouride they put in. It's not much fortunately, but still, bothers me

The problem isn't the amount...

It doesn't take a lot of poison to kill rats.

The only thing needed is a lot of DECEPTION.

If rats KNEW they were being poisoned, it would no longer work.

This is why the fluoridation controversy is backed by nothing but lies and fraud.

"Fluoridation is the greatest case of scientific fraud of this century, if not of all time." ~ Robert Carton, Ph.D

"We would not purposely add arsenic to the water supply. And we would not purposely add lead. But we do add fluoride. The fact is that fluoride is more toxic than lead and just slightly less toxic than arsenic." ----Dr. John Yiamouyiannis

Only six days after almost every major newspaper around the world announced the results of a scientific review undertaken by the NHS Center for Reviews and Dissemination at the University of York - reporting the fluoridation of public water supplies to be a safe public health measure - shocking evidence was presented Thursday, 10-12-00, during an interview aired on Vancouver radio station CKST AM 1040 which revealed that the review thought to be the "final word on fluoridation" might well turn out be the greatest scientific fraud ever undertaken by a center in charge of evaluating scientific information in the interest of public health.

Greatest 'Scientific' Fluoride Fraud Yet?

reply to post by superman2012


Pathetic...

You were arguing that low doses of fluoride are harmless, and I proved you wrong. I explained to you that low doses of fluoride were once used as medication to reduce thyroid functionality. Reduced thyroid functionality causes a multitude of problems in the body, even life threatening problems in the long run.

I provided a link that "has nothing to do with water fluoridation" because within that link is a quote and a source about fluoride used as a medication, and its effect on the thyroid. The other resources I mention contain other information about toxicity, and key points of information that make you look like a fool, but you have not read them, so there is no point discussing them. I just proved you didn't read any of the sources I posted in completeness.

If you limit yourself to links and information only discussing "water fluoridation" specifically, and ignore everything else regarding fluoride and consuming toxic chemicals, you will miss out on a lot of important information... no wonder you support such a ridiculous and ignorant position on the matter.

spartacus699
reply to post by superman2012

 

I run it threw an 8 stage filter. Only chemicals could get threw that which I think is what that is. The city website shows how much flouride they put in. It's not much fortunately, but still, bothers me

An RO unit will take everything out but will lower the pH down to around 5.00 (assuming it was neutral coming in) so there could be problems with that. That's why they usually add sodium hydroxide to raise the pH levels after it goes through the RO system in a municipal water treatment plant.

WeAre0ne
reply to post by superman2012

 

Pathetic...

You were arguing that low doses of fluoride are harmless, and I proved you wrong. I explained to you that low doses of fluoride were once used as medication to reduce thyroid functionality. Reduced thyroid functionality causes a multitude of problems in the body, even life threatening problems in the long run.

I provided a link that "has nothing to do with water fluoridation" because within that link is a quote and a source about fluoride used as a medication, and its effect on the thyroid. The other resources I mention contain other information about toxicity, and key points of information that make you look like a fool, but you have not read them, so there is no point discussing them. I just proved you didn't read any of the sources I posted in completeness.

If you limit yourself to links and information only discussing "water fluoridation" specifically, and ignore everything else regarding fluoride and consuming toxic chemicals, you will miss out on a lot of important information... no wonder you support such a ridiculous and ignorant position on the matter.

You are the brick wall.

edit on 19-12-2013 by WeAre0ne because: (no reason given)

You haven't proven anything. I have shown, in every example provided by you, that it was wrong or completely misleading.
I am the brick wall to you. I don't let garbage claims through.

reply to post by superman2012


Again with your foolishness...

www.nap.edu...

articles.mercola.com...

According to a 2006 report by the National Research Council of the National Academies1 , fluoride is "an endocrine disruptor in the broad sense of altering normal endocrine function."

This altered function can involve your thyroid, parathyroid, and pineal glands, as well as your adrenals, pancreas, and pituitary.

Your thyroid gland and its associated hormones are responsible for maintaining your body's overall metabolic rate, and for regulating normal growth and development. As all metabolically active cells require thyroid hormone for proper functioning, disruption of this system can have a wide range of effects on virtually every system of your body. Thyroid dysfunction is considered among the most prevalent of endocrine diseases in the United States.

This happens at low doses. Now get out of here with your B.S.!!

WeAre0ne
reply to post by superman2012

 

Again with your foolishness...

www.nap.edu...

articles.mercola.com...

According to a 2006 report by the National Research Council of the National Academies1 , fluoride is "an endocrine disruptor in the broad sense of altering normal endocrine function."

This altered function can involve your thyroid, parathyroid, and pineal glands, as well as your adrenals, pancreas, and pituitary.

Your thyroid gland and its associated hormones are responsible for maintaining your body's overall metabolic rate, and for regulating normal growth and development. As all metabolically active cells require thyroid hormone for proper functioning, disruption of this system can have a wide range of effects on virtually every system of your body. Thyroid dysfunction is considered among the most prevalent of endocrine diseases in the United States.

This happens at low doses. Now get out of here with your B.S.!!

Please show me exactly where it says anything about the low doses does what you described. Quoting something and then talking about it and making claims does not prove your point. If it stated that, you should have quoted where it said that to make your argument. I will not read through 530 pages to find the point that you claim is there.

You do realize that your second "proof" has nothing to do with water fluoridation right? It was about the Chinese study already mentioned many times in this thread.

Since when is my calling out your out of context, silly sources BS?

Edit: Don't think that your attempt to ignore this has been overlooked. Care to discuss?

This thread is about the first 3 posts. If you cannot argue any of those facts listed, then what exactly are you arguing about?

superman2012

spartacus699
reply to post by superman2012

 

I run it threw an 8 stage filter. Only chemicals could get threw that which I think is what that is. The city website shows how much flouride they put in. It's not much fortunately, but still, bothers me

An RO unit will take everything out but will lower the pH down to around 5.00 (assuming it was neutral coming in) so there could be problems with that. That's why they usually add sodium hydroxide to raise the pH levels after it goes through the RO system in a municipal water treatment plant.

hmmm I didn't know that. Interesting.

superman2012
You do realize that your second "proof" has nothing to do with water fluoridation right? It was about the Chinese study already mentioned many times in this thread.

Are you talking about this??

articles.mercola.com...

If so, thanks for proving you are mentally challenged. The whole thing is about water fluoridation and the effects of fluoride on the human body.

Since you failed to read it:

Surprisingly Tiny Amounts of Fluoride Can Change Your Thyroid Function

Altered thyroid function is associated with fluoride intakes as low as 0.05-0.1 mg fluoride per kilogram body weight per day (mg/kg/day), or 0.03 mg/kg/day with iodine deficiency. Increased prevalence of goiter (>20 percent) is associated with fluoride intakes of 0.07-0.13 mg/kg/day, or 0.01 mg/kg/day with iodine deficiency.4

For a 70 kg (154 pound) adult, this means that 3.5 mg fluoride per day (or 0.7 mg fluoride per day with iodine deficiency) could result in thyroid dysfunction. The most recent exposure analysis by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency5 estimates that the average American adult is consuming nearly 3 mg fluoride on a daily basis, and some are routinely ingesting 6 mg per day or more.

Even more concerning, however, are the doses of fluoride in children.

For a 14 kg (30 pound) child, fluoride intakes greater than 0.7 mg per day (or 0.14 mg per day with iodine deficiency) puts the child at risk for endocrine dysfunction. The EPA (2010) estimates children within this weight range (1-3 year-olds) consume over 1.5 mg fluoride each day, or more than twice the amount necessary to induce altered thyroid function, even with an adequate iodine intake.

These chronic exposures could have profound and life-long effects on the intellectual, social, sexual and overall physical development of children.

Numerous studies have found a relationship between relatively low to moderate levels of fluoride exposure and reduced IQ in children6 . Even fluoride levels of less than 1.0 mg/L have been associated with reduced IQ and increased frequency of hypothyroidism in children experiencing iodine deficiency7.

I'm done here. The information I linked proves this topic is a hoax, and should be moved to the hoax forum.

reply to post by WeAre0ne


Actually, the whole thing is about naturally occurring fluoride being in water. And you might want to check the doses there. It isn't in the same units that water fluoridation is measured in.

And yes, that was part of the "Harvard Study" notice it is two villages in China.

Edit: You still haven't provided any sort of proof, but I am pleased that you are done, I'm getting tired of bringing up the same information and replying to every "what if" situation.

I also did notice that you did not refute anything listed in the first 3 posts and if you read the whole thread, you will see that not one point has been shown to be wrong yet (although rickymouse came close to convincing me).

reply to post by Artlogic


You do realize that the guy who runs that page has been sued countless times and has no credibility whatsoever, look into it, he is a quack and has no understanding of health and healing. Obviouslly a paid schill of the AMA.


www.anh-europe.org...

Alright I have been reading through this and will try to limit my response. I find it impressive to say the least that at this point anyone has any faith in the "government authorities" let alone the corporate funded facts they spit out and support. I will not even bother making a distinction between the unholy fascist alliance that is our Food,Healthcare, Energy, Industrial and alphabet government watchdogs. However to believe that they would not put fluoride in the water because it is harmful is simply laughable.

It is from that same logic that we saturate our earth with pesticides/herbicides that have not accomplished any of the stated goals of the green revolution. On top of that result in deficient soil/food which results in a deficient population. Which conveniently fund the trillion dollar a year healthcare industry that promotes this allopathic model of therapy, which has its uses but I mean come on how do they still go after homepathic medicine as quackery, using the sheer genius of the human body to heal itself is basic. It is a scam from the top to the bottom.

Lets take a look at another common sense problem, why is it that we are not utilizing HEMP for its many uses, while continuing to cut down trees, which are essential for our health as well as the planets. Same goes for the subsidizing of oil/coal/nuclear/fracking, the do not give a damn about us being healthy or not, it is quite obvious that hey have stake in the exact opposite.

Not even going to get started on the food industry,I should not have to. I understand the desire for concrete facts and scientific data to prove your point, however science has its price and with the added intimidation of certain interests good luck finding it. I will go with my gut instinct and that is to honor my body and be my own doctor.