A Positive Look at Cops.

reject

semperfortis
reply to post by intrepid

 

While some of my time was taken up by public beating, money laundering and accepting bribes..

Is this for real?

I think it's what we call sarcasm here on ATS.

And veteran LEO's making light of people's negative views of them.

reply to post by semperfortis


just checking

reject
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

Why would my suggestion be an injustice?

In fact, it barely evens out the playing field because being "insiders" of the system does give you advantages whether we accept it or not.

That's just human nature.

Such a provision in the law would deter those already in power and would make aspirants think twice if they know they have inclinations that would get them in trouble.

Officers have different standards they are held to already, due to training and their course of duty. Making punishments harsher does nothing more than institute a class system.

Do you really think intelligence precludes committing something immoral?

No. But it makes one more insightful and gives them better judgement potential.

fewer cops?

edit on 5-12-2013 by reject because: (no reason given)

absolutely. I believe in personal responsibility. I don't need another person to protect me and mine 99% of the time. Its not like cops really prevent crime (we aren't talking about victimless crimes like drugs/prostitution). They investigate and prosecute, they don't really prevent.

Power goes to the head. Cops think they're better than the rest of us. There's just too much one could say to complain about it but why bother because they won't change. Power goes to the head and corrupts the morality until nothing is left but the beast. Not every single cop, but many of them.

semperfortis
reply to post by intrepid

 

Well I'm a big bad cop

While some of my time was taken up by public beating, money laundering and accepting bribes..

MOST of my time was spent doing..

1. Slowly patrolling neighborhoods looking at your homes to make sure all is well
2. Changing tires
3. Treating and holding injured and dead people until loved ones and EMS arrives
4. Finding lost children
5. Changing light bulbs
6. Slowing speeders down before they kill someone I have to hold again
7. Running toward a gun fight
8. Running toward a fist fight
9. Running into a riot
10. Telling families their loved ones have died

Yeah yeah I know.. I get paid for it and it is my job..

But you are WRONG.. Yep.. W..R..O..N..G...

It is NOT a job, it is a life calling

Great post sir,

However, even my uncle, who is one of the highest ranking police in Canada, has finally had to admit, that an infiltration has taken place over the years...

And by now there is total recognition that "cops" are mostly decent individuals, but the programs and politicians that run them do not have to be , and likely are taking orders from well, somewhere that no one can see.

"Cops" are not allowed to deal with them! And that is the only real problem, and do not think that officers that are the complete opposite of yourselves are in many detachments, and are dedicated to completely other things.

rickymouse

I get along with the police, they are doing the job they are paid to do. I always did what I was paid to do. I tried to stay away from jobs that broke the law, that way I did not get on the wrong side of the bars.

I live in a European country so I cannot talk about US cops. Our cops are on some level "very nice" and get crap every time they use violence even if it is very justified. Our cops are too held back and pacifist to deal with the criminals we have in our country. The police arrest bad people and the courts and social services let it slide and when they do not let it slide they get a lot of crap.

But I have had I cop with bad temper giving me crap I did not deserve verbally but that was probably because she was standing out in hard rain in the middle of the night. I have myself yelled at a cop doing a alchohol test on me for wasting time when he should be chasing criminals in a high crime area. He yelled back at me but seem to be equally frustrated at the high crime area that I live in.

I hate the politicians who have created this crappy system that is more interested in statistics instead of really solving the real crimes the population are facing. After a while you stop reporting the small time destruction of property or getting assaulted by a teen under 18 since no real punishment will happen anyway.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


I agree with most of what you say.

However, I do not agree with your opinion that cops don't or can't prevent crime. I believe we do prevent individual crimes on a regular basis. Don't get me wrong I know a lot of the time we come after the fact (that is why I believe in the 2nd amendment for all). Which I think is no fault of our own and should be no surprise. Especially when for example my agency generally runs 10-15 officers a day/night for a population of 100,000. We can't be everywhere.

I mean a good officer that does their directed patrols of neighborhoods and businesses can absolutely prevent individual crimes from happening.

You don't think an increased marked vehicle presence in a neighborhood decreases the chances that a crime will be committed there?

You don't think that when a burglar is cruising down a main street scouting out houses to hit he changes his mind when he sees patrol vehicles pulling people over in the area on a regular basis?

Traffic stops do more than just net citations. They can help correct peoples driving mistakes that may cause an accident and also (arguably just as important) serve as a deterrent to real criminals scouting an area to commit a crime. (I know there are some BS citations out there that shouldn't even be law)

You don't think the criminal will think twice about robbing the 7-11 when my vehicle is parked out front?

I mean we can argue the fact that we are just pushing the crime to another city where the police aren't doing their directed patrols. However, that is on the other agency not me or my agency. We are doing our part to keep our city safe and deter/prevent crime. I have no say in how neighboring agencies perform their duties.

Sometimes it can be a hard statistic to measure. I mean it is easy to say X amount of crimes occurred. You just look at the reported crime numbers. It is a little harder to measure how many crimes an officer may have prevented/deterred.

It is a little unfair to say that we don't prevent/deter crime.

TorqueyThePig

It is a little unfair to say that we don't prevent/deter crime.

You're parked out in front of that 7/11 24 hours 7 days a week?

At best in a given very specific moment you might delay a crime or cause an even exchange as the target just becomes the 7/11 two blocks down.

Tossing a stone into a river doesnt deter the flow. It just alters it ever so slightly.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


Sorry but you are and have been proven wrong

As shown by Dr. Wilson in his study titled Broken Windows, the effects of random drive byes by marked patrol units are SIGNIFICANT in the reduction of criminal actions

It is a good read by the way

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


No, I am not parked out in front of a 7-11 24/7.

However I am there several times a day to use the restroom, get a drink, check up on the employees during my 12 hour shift. Other officers in the city do as well. Not to mention the Deputies and State Troopers that go there as well during different times of the day.

It was one of several examples.

Do you think that an increased marked vehicle presence patrolling neighborhood does nothing to prevent/deter a crime, or crimes from happening?

When not answering calls for service I do spend the vast majority of my day patrolling my areas neighborhoods and businesses.

reply to post by whatnext21

They cant do that.

State boys (police), forget about it. Their "job" is to literally hand out tickets.

Inner city cops, an argument could be made that theyre needed, even though the best deterrent to crime is a well trained and armed citizenry.

But suburban cops, which are the majority of police, have now become revenue generators.

Crime is at such historic lows, that if they dont harass the average citizen (shaking us down over traffic and code violations) theres no further justification for their jobs.

More Tickets in Hard Times .

“When I first started in this job 30 years ago, police work was never about revenue enhancement, but if you’re a chief now, you have to look at whether your department produces revenues,” he says. “That’s just the reality nowadays.”

And they LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE the "war on drugs". Instant reason to violate your rights and confiscate your property.

Combined with these out of control civil forfeiture laws and for-profit prison systems lobbying politicians for MORE rules, regulations and even STRICTER laws...

Welcome to the Police State Industrial Complex.

reply to post by TorqueyThePig


Yeah. I just didn't want to type that many more words to convey my thought.

I think that a well armed populace is the best deterrent to crime. I also think that the best way to make crime worse is to imprison people for "moral crimes". A guy i went to school with was a good kid. He got busted with some white powdery substance while with his brother. He was 17 and straight laced. Just was out with his brother, who had picked up a rather large amount of said white powdery substance.

Both went to prison. The formerly good guy who was straight laced is no longer such a good guy. My first indication was the big "Latin Kings" tattoo across his throat.

I think that to really impact crime, you remove the "prison culture" aspect from pop culture. Because prisons are notorious for making non violent criminals a little less hestitatnt to be violent.

reply to post by gladtobehere


A serious question. Why do you think crime is at historic lows?

TorqueyThePig
reply to post by bally001

 

I am also tired of chasing the same people year after year. Hardened criminals who commit robberies, home invasions, burglaries, murder etc, are rarely ever punished properly by the judicial system. Almost every day I feel like what I am doing is in vain.

It is not in vain even if it is a uphill battle. Keep up the good work and be the best you, you can be. . A person who do the right thing in a messed up situation is still doing the right thing. You might not be able to fix all that you want to fix but you can fix some. And that some is making a difference for the people who are involved in that some.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


No argument from me. I agree the war on drugs is BS. Granted I have seen people do horrible, horrible things to innocents while using and in the search of funds for drugs. So I am on the fence about that one.

I was commenting specifically on your opinion that you don't believe police prevent/deter crime.

I was specifically talking about officers preventing/deterring crime by doing uniformed patrols through neighborhoods. The crimes I was referring to were burglaries, robberies, vehicle theft etc. (I am not even talking about burglars that do it for drugs. Which believe me there are a lot)

So you don't think that officers prevent/deter crimes by doing directed patrols through neighborhoods and businesses?

reply to post by gladtobehere


And this is really the crux of it.

Police have been transformed from citizens who were entrusted with executing laws in a common sense manner into what seems to now be militarized revenue collection forces.

And, as semper pointed out, there are greater numbers of police in high crime areas (trying to prevent and prosecute). High crime areas tend to be in low income areas. Consequently, the people who are being targeted most for the "revenue collection" via traffic stops and other fines are the low income people.

It is easy to see why police are thought of in the way they are. Carrying out their duties carries as a consequence focusing more on those who can least afford to pay. Thus, the people with more wealth percieve the police wholly differently than those without wealth, who live in areas that are policed more heavily.

TorqueyThePig
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

No argument from me. I agree the war on drugs is BS. Granted I have seen people do horrible, horrible things to innocents while using and in the search of funds for drugs. So I am on the fence about that one.

I was commenting specifically on your opinion that you don't believe police prevent/deter crime.

I was specifically talking about officers preventing/deterring crime by doing uniformed patrols through neighborhoods. The crimes I was referring to were burglaries, robberies, vehicle theft etc. (I am not even talking about burglars that do it for drugs. Which believe me there are a lot)

So you don't think that officers prevent/deter crimes by doing directed patrols through neighborhoods and businesses?

absolutely. I run a business, and give 25% discounts to off duty cops, and 50% discounts to on duty cops. Im not a fool.

semperfortis
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

 

Sorry but you are and have been proven wrong

Proven? That's a little absolute isnt it? Considering the theory is anything but.

From your own link it's a tenuous connection.

Criticisms of "Broken Windows"

TorqueyThePig
reply to post by gladtobehere

 

A serious question. Why do you think crime is at historic lows?

Lead. We have reduced environmental lead considerably, and see crime reduction in almost identical levels.

See here for details: www.motherjones.com...

disclaimer: i typically avoid motherjones. But the data in this story is seemingly remarkable and well supported.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


Again no argument from me. I back the second amendment 100% and agree an armed citizen is a great deterrent to crime.

However, when you are at work and your house is unguarded or at night when your business is unattended you being armed is not deterring it from being burglarized. Hopefully me driving by is.

I look at it as a team effort. I love the assistance I get at times from the public.

I think if more officers and citizens looked at law enforcement as a team effort and focused on the more serious things all would be better off.

I think we are pretty much on the same page.