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SYDNEY: If humans have free will, then so do subatomic particles such as electrons, say U.S. mathematicians.
“If experimenters have a certain freedom, then particles have exactly the same kind of freedom,” wrote mathematicians John Conway and Simon Kochen, of Princeton University in New Jersey, in a recent paper published in Notices of the American Mathematical Society.
“Indeed, it is natural to suppose that this latter freedom is the ultimate explanation of our own,” they said.
“Conway and Kochen prove that the randomness does not depend on anything. They prove that the outcomes of these quantum random events are really completely independent of anything that has happened in the past,” he added.
If experimenters are free to choose between experiments – that is, the choice of experiments is not predetermined by past events – then the particle must also decide how to act on the spur of the moment.
That's the most you can say on one trip, but you will more than likely make 100 purchases and then we can say that most likely 70 of them will be Doritos and 30 of them will be Funyuns.
neoholographic
I've picked Doritos 70% of the time and Funyuns 30% of the time.
This is the most you could say:
There's a 70% chance I will buy a bag of Doritos and a 30% chance that I will buy a bag of Funyuns.
neoholographic
reply to post by KellyPrettyBear
What??
The post is about current scientific understanding not metaphysics.
Have you read about quantum biology or the article on subatomic particles and free will? It has nothing to do with metaphysics.
According to this criteria there could never be a post in the science section on String Theory, loop quantum gravity, branes, Hawking Radiation or extra dimensions.
Riffrafter
reply to post by neoholographic
Outstanding!
And I absolutely agree with all of the premises of your OP. I've often said that the key to real understanding of the true nature of reality will come from breakthroughs in Quantum Physics and Neurobiology with a large supporting role played by Mathematics all validated by certain areas of Metaphysics.
BTW I didn't know there was a field of quantum biology - I think that's terrific - and shows at least some people are on the right path.
The human brain is a quantum device that also has electrical & chemical properties associated with it because it is of course living tissue. The mind on the other hand, is the observer and somewhat-controller of that device. As this OP can spawn multiple threads that will fit nicely within many different forums so I'll leave it there for now.
We live in a quantum universe. Just because there are also "laws" that work on a more macro-scale (Einstein, Newton et al) does not invalidate that. Those laws are simply different expressions of quantum physics that work on a larger scale. And so the search for the grand unified theory goes on. But it is now and always has been a misnomer. We don't need a unified theory. We need a much better understanding of the quantum world and from that all else will flow.
Again, great OP - S&F. It will be interesting to see where this discussion goes.
ETA - BTW, be prepared to be jumped on for your post. Many will vehemently disagree, others may try and change the subject and some will simply troll. But don't worry - that just means you're on the right track. Hang tough.
edit on 11/23/2013 by Riffrafter because: (no reason given)
I'm probably close to an authority on this subject.
SasquatchHunter
reply to post by neoholographic
The universe has laws that apply to everything that exists within it, no matter how small or large.
Nootropic
SasquatchHunter
reply to post by neoholographic
The universe has laws that apply to everything that exists within it, no matter how small or large.
This statement is completely false. On the quantum level, particles do not follow the same laws that we observe around us. If electrons followed Newtonian physics, then electrons would spiral into the nucleus of the atom, giving off visible light, and eventually collide with it. This is not the case.
Instead, what we see is that electrons occupy very specific energy levels (orbitals), resulting in their location being measured as a probability of being in a certain three dimensional area dependant on their energy level. All sorts of other interesting rules become very important, such as the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, which essentially states that if we know a particle's position, we may not know it's momentum, and vice versa.
So yeah, there's a crash course on high school chemistry.
There might be some laws we don't know yet or have wrong but they exist and they are constant and we know that.