Moderate Muslim´s peace conference in Oslo.. speaks volumes !

Sorry but if you attend any kind of "religious conference" you are not a moderate anything, your hardcore!!!

I also dont buy the whole room agree with the guy, in a situation like that if your in the crowd what can you do? Your not gonna be the one person who stands up in the middle of his speech and says "No sorry but I dont agree"
They were all just doing what religious people of all denominations do best which is blindly agreeing with someone who knows more about their particular god than they do.

reply to post by winofiend


I do see a sarcasm.. but im not a liar this is where your sarcasm turned sour.

The difference between US and European according the muslim issue is that in States you have been more careful who can and who cannot immigrate. In States there is no sharia laws in the streets like in some citites in Europe, there is no real muslim ghettos in States either but there are many in Europe. So what you see in States is not even close to what people are confronting in Europe. To see what really happens this side of globe you need to take your head from that softy pillow and stop daydreaming IMO.

The fact is that radical thoughs are increasing and violence in the streets by radicals is getting out of the hand.
There were a time in Scandinavia when you could leave your door open in a day also over night and windows too to get cool air inside when it´s hot in summer. But nowadays you can´t, I live in rural area and we also faced the point that we had to put surveillance cameras to our property.. Its a shame that things have come to this in one decade.
We tend to believe everything is ok untill something bad happens to someone who is close to us.. it is a sad wake up call.

Look, the sortof Muslim that will attend things like this will be either moderate (actually radical but hide under the term moderate) and radicals, the ordinary Muslims are trying to distance themselves from these thugs.

The radicals just use these things to spread their word, recruit and generally extol their wondrous peaceful virtues on us ie bring shariah in, lets behead x y z, lets kill the homosexuals, you know, peaceful stuff like that.

You will find anything but PEACE at these hypocritical meetings..

dollukka
reply to post by winofiend

 

I do see a sarcasm.. but im not a liar this is where your sarcasm turned sour.

The difference between US and European according the muslim issue is that in States you have been more careful who can and who cannot immigrate. In States there is no sharia laws in the streets like in some citites in Europe, there is no real muslim ghettos in States either but there are many in Europe.
The fact is that radical thoughs are increasing and violence in the streets by radicals is getting out of the hand.
There were a time in Scandinavia when you could leave your door open in a day also over night and windows too to get cool air inside when it´s hot in summer. But nowadays you can´t,

Whilst I agree with you I thought I'd just update you a little on the US, its not as proactive against the Radicals as you think, to the public they say they are but in truth the poor Americans are getting the same crap we are in the EU, its just hidden a bit better.

The US actually has a city devoted almost entirely to Muslims, its called Dearborn, look it up, the streets are all dual named, one in English, the other in Arabic writing (true), the town basically runs non Muslims out and Police the streets to make sure as few Non Muslims are there, the Police basically don't visit it unless there's a major event.

Also the US has numerous 'super mosques' being or already built, they are basically self contained fortresses for people to both pray and live in as well as visitors, many of these are in area's that maybe have 20 Muslims locally yet they house hundreds at a time.

They wanted to do the same in London but thankfully they were turned down, we already have X times Mosques compare to the number of other places of religious Non Muslim worship.

As for your door being locked, blame your government for shipping in thousands upon thousands of totally uneducated radicalised people who serve NOTHING to your economy despite the lies in fake / controlled reports.

Note, I say Radicals, not Muslims in general, any one who wants Shariah law is radical and its a culture alien in every way to our own.

Mclaneinc
Look, the sortof Muslim that will attend things like this will be either moderate (actually radical but hide under the term moderate) and radicals, the ordinary Muslims are trying to distance themselves from these thugs.

The radicals just use these things to spread their word, recruit and generally extol their wondrous peaceful virtues on us ie bring shariah in, lets behead x y z, lets kill the homosexuals, you know, peaceful stuff like that.

You will find anything but PEACE at these hypocritical meetings..

Well, perhaps the "ordinary Muslims" need to take their religion back. The "ordinary Muslims" need to be louder and more aggressive in what they expect of their brothers and sisters in their religion. Sure, the radicals may indeed make up a small percentage; however it is this group that is speaking for the entire religion.

It is one thing for people to "distance" themselves from other less than desirable people; it is entirely different when it is your faith (or party, or community, and et al) has been infiltrated. Once infiltrated, there is no "distancing" without abandoning your own community. A very loud and very aggressive campaign against the 'undesirables' is what is needed. Otherwise, the perception from the outside is that the "ordinary" is either blindly following or simply ignoring the bad seed in their group. It is easy to ignore, or "distance'" (yeah right) when you know you are not their target.

I agree with a previous poster, moderates dont go to "conferences". Moderates to me would be the muslims who live in my local area. My daughter is a minority as a white child at the school, my area has a large muslim population, but i dont feel threatened walking around, I think because muslim or not, we are normal people, we want to work raise our children and have a happy life.
I would say i was a Christian, but i dont want to stone gay people or burn wiccans.

With regards to immigrant crime in norway, I'd say this is mostly an immigration issue....not a religious one. So punish the criminals the way the laws demands it. The perpetrators of those crimes may have ''muslim'' names, but are behaving in a manner that is far removed from what Islam teaches. Criminal actions by muslim are not ordained by the Koran. Consider ''muslims'' who drink alcohol. They act in an unislamic way on their own, not because they were following religious laws. Apply the same to the immigrant criminals in Norway. -........................................................................As always, the crimes of some muslims are used to blame regular muslims who just try and live their lives. So by the same standards should we also blame regular christians for the acts of christian witch burners. Strange how christians shy away from applying their own reasoning to themselves and instead insist on being exeptions to their own reasoning.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


Its both. There are other immigrants too from non muslim countries which do not create chaos or try to bring sharia law in the streets and violence is not as excessive by them. I do appreaciate your efforts tho to beautify this but reality is what reality is.

Quran is not guide book its a law book. When Sharia Law which origin is in Quran is brought to the streets its also a religious issue. Sharia Law is not about the love its a rule how true muslims have to behave and act and tells exact ways how to do it. As in Video this moderate muslims tells isn´t it the best way to do it when these instructions comes from Allah.

reply to post by dollukka

Its both. There are other immigrants too from non muslim countries which do not create
chaos or try to bring sharia law in the streets

Criminal incidents by immigrants from Muslim countries does NOT mean they are trying to bring Sharia law in the streets. They are just being criminals. Period.

Under Shariah you would see those same criminals being hung in public, according to Shariah.

Sharia Law is not about the love its a rule how true muslims have to behave and act and tells exact ways how to do it.

Like I said earlier, I know Muslims who drink alcohol. Are they drinking because Shariah law asked them to drink? Tell me, what law under Shariah commands muslims to drink alcohol?

If you can't answer that directly, its because there ARE Muslims who do things on their own, outside of Islamic law. Those criminals fall under the same bracket.

Old topic with personal accounts.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Is Sweden is being destroyed ?

I think it is deliberate, but I still don't know the reason

sk0rpi0n
reply to post by dollukka

 

Its both. There are other immigrants too from non muslim countries which do not create
chaos or try to bring sharia law in the streets

Criminal incidents by immigrants from Muslim countries does NOT mean they are trying to bring Sharia law in the streets. They are just being criminals. Period.

Under Shariah you would see those same criminals being hung in public, according to Shariah.

Sharia Law is not about the love its a rule how true muslims have to behave and act and tells exact ways how to do it.

Like I said earlier, I know Muslims who drink alcohol. Are they drinking because Shariah law asked them to drink? Tell me, what law under Shariah commands muslims to drink alcohol?

If you can't answer that directly, its because there ARE Muslims who do things on their own, outside of Islamic law. Those criminals fall under the same bracket.

Difference is there punished for it as well. Biggest problem with many Muslims is they dont see rules of Islam as only applying to them. They feel this is a command from god and applies to everyone. In the west we have a hard time understanding this because Christianity went through this hundreds of years ago spanish inquisition being an example. Unfortunately today these ideas are even more archaic then in the middle ages which is going to lead to a huge clash in society. Watch this video and you see how people feel they need t impose there beliefs on others its a tenant of Islam that it will be the only religion and some people try to bring that about with violence. Others willing to sit and wait until others bring this about knowing it is going to be the outcome thus they dont condemn violent actions.

reply to post by Stormdancer777

After 9/11: Is the West Protecting Radical Islam?

In the video it mentions they continue to vote with the left, the strange partnership with the left, their polar opposite ideologically, but they need the left because it encourages Muslim immigration and

This has been happening in virtually every western nation since 9/11, and helping it spread.
McCain and Obama siding with radical Islamic terrorist in Syria.
therightscoop.com...
So what are they really up to?

Another thing I noticed here,
Why the groups that are even more conservative than most conservatives vote Democrat.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Is there a concerted effort to bring down western society?

This has so many layers.

youtu.be...

You are confusing religion with culture. The Muslim religion does not promote any form violence, in fact, it's against Islam to break the branch of a tree. The eye for an eye part exists but it is better to forgive. I know a few Muslims and they are some of the most peaceful, open minded and caring people I know. There are cultures that are considered Muslim who would kill, torture and rape but doesn't every culture?? Just because they do it in a different way it makes it not OK?? This just feels like classic xenophobia to me, I agree that crimes like what are discussed should be put to an end, but minorities shouldn't be singled out as the only perpetrators and immigration should not be blamed, any decent country NEEDS immigration and countries don't need people to create rifts between our brothers and sisters on this planet.

Stormdancer777
reply to post by Stormdancer777

 

-- snip --
Is there a concerted effort to bring down western society?
-- snip --

Might be a good time to remind ourselves that there wouldn't even BE a "western" society if the Europeans hadn't paid Columbus (and probably others) to risk attempting to reach the Far East by a route other than the ones controlled by Muslims. There has been so much attention paid to the barbarous aspects of the Crusades that history has been rewritten to be politically correct...

In the words of Historian Thomas Madden, "The crusade, first and foremost, was a war against Muslims for the defense of the Christian faith.... They began as a result of a Muslim conquest of Christian territories." Madden says the goal of Pope Urban was that "the Christians of the East must be free from the brutal and humiliating conditions of Muslim rule."

Source

The indigenous people of North and South America may well have been better off had Europe never known of them, but that is for another time or thread.

I studied history at a level and degree level.
it was pretty much accepted that the crusades for the most part were about sending the riff raff of out of europe so they wouldnt harrass the locals but would be occupied harrassing the muslims.
While some might have bought the ideological argument, it was really a matter of spring cleaning.

Auricom
reply to post by dukeofjive696969

 

There has been no "advancement" within Islam.

I am going to ignore the rest of your post, because wow, and just focus on this part.

When the Crusades were in their third incarnation, the Templars and the Christians were getting desperate despite holding the holy land for 88 years. They salted the earth of towns they butchered, they raped women and killed the old, and did this all in the name of God. Saladin, or Salah al-Din ibn Ayyub, was a great Muslim general who would go on to become sultan of Egypt. When he came onto the stage and started to clash with the Templar forces, he imposed rules to the combat between the two. No killing non-combatants, respect for each other in combat, etc.

When his forces met the Christian forces at the Battle of Hattin in 1187, he took the high moral ground. Unlike when the Christians took the city ( killed the inhabitants and generally bloodied everything up ) Saladin treated his foes with respect and the civilians caught in the crossfire with even more care. He spared all life who was not in battle, winning the respect of his foes and friends alike.

Islam has had a colorful history, to be sure, but so does literally every other group in the history of the world ever. Right now, Islam going through a violent cycle - Christianity has been through -SEVERAL-, just like Buddhism and Hinduism and indigenous beliefs. Everyone kills everyone else for all sorts of reasons, but it is up to everyone who does not agree with what is going on to work to change that and put a stop to any sort of violence they experience.

So, in closing, there has been plenty of personal advancement within Islam. Right now, their history is dark, but there are Islamic followers who are working to put a stop to blind, unfettered hate.

And I didn't even bring up the fact that they practically made science with Europe was scratching it's collective butt in mud because they saw science and philosophy as different ways to understand God.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


What alcohol has to do with this? Those muslims in video supports violence and most likely they do not drink. or do they?
Alcohol is not exactly forbidden in Quran and Mohammed did drink also. Mohammed is considered to be an example to all muslims how muslims should live their lives.

Quran 2:219 “They ask you concerning alcoholic drinks and games of chance. Say: in them are harm and goods for men, but their harms exeeds their good effects.“

Quran 4:43 “Do not approach prayers while you are drunk.”

Quran 5:90 “O you who believe! intoxicants and games of chance and (sacrificing to) stones set up and (dividing by) arrows are only an uncleanness, the Shaitan's work; shun it therefore that you may be successful..”

This verse doesn´t forbid using but guides not to use alcohol.

Quran 16.67 “And of the fruits of the date palms and the grapes, you obtain alcoholic drinks and goods. Verily in that is a sign for a people who use their understanding.”

Muslim 3753 “We were with the prophet of Allah and he was thirsty. And a man said: ‘O prophet of Allah, do you want to drink wine?’ Prophet of Allah said: ‘Yes’. The man went to get the wine. The prophet of Allah said: ‘Make it intoxicated’. And he drank.”

When people neglected their prayers, priests did forbid using alcohol..

Even then there is a fact that even moderate muslims do accept violence. When the muslims really openly stand against such a action as raping non muslim women we non muslim people would appreaciate it and see somekind of hope. But as Quran teaches muslims to think other muslims as their brothers and sisters it is not seen suitable to stand against fellow muslims.. this is propably the reason we don´t see muslim society forbidding such a crimes.

reply to post by Unsympathetic


Why?

WilsonWilson
I studied history at a level and degree level.
it was pretty much accepted that the crusades for the most part were about sending the riff raff of out of europe so they wouldnt harrass the locals but would be occupied harrassing the muslims.
While some might have bought the ideological argument, it was really a matter of spring cleaning.

Well in your case i strongly suggest a refresher course. Because your clueless first in the crusades it was the nobility and people with social standing that went mostly to impress the pope in hopes of increasing there prestige. Why i can discuss but not the thread for it is it?

Moderate muslims? Hard to believe this.. If you are not a 'hardliner' in your muslim community, you will be left out.. Including your family.. -and not in a nice way-
Whatever they say to please the western media, please, remember.. A muslim is allowed to lie if it is needed to deceive your enemies.. Like in a holy war... In a dhymmy land, like the western world.
Some muslims have actualy resisted the dogma, they get 24-7 security...