Electric Comet ISON - Revealed

reply to post by Tallone


*sigh* Could you give at least one example, please?

Tallone
Why would he bother to set up a page on his site dedicated to ISON?

You dont need to ask us, he states the reason quite clearly on the page itself.

This site opened: August 12, 2013

Note that this date is the date that the comet was first recovered after being on the other side of the sun for a few months. At this time, there was still reason to believe that this comet would still be "the comet of the century". It would make sense for him to open up a new web page for this comet, given this possibility, given he was the first to recover it, and given the media hype that had been created up to this date.

Note that in several places on that page, on later dates, he has indicated thoughts about not bothering to continue the page anymore.

Tallone
...and why I have called ISON in the title of this thread an 'Electric comet'!
...AND what is being said and not said by 'the experts'
Watch the 4 videos I posted on page 7.

The videos, yourself, all state there are plasma interactions betwen the sun and the comet, so for a second time I'll ask you to state a PREDICTION about what should happen according to your theory.

For conventional science, the activity of the sun is not linked to the comet, but to the 11 year sunspot cycle. CME's of various intensities and frequencies will be emitted over the course of the next few months, as one would expect for the sun being at the peak of the sunspot cycle.

For EU theory, the CME's should increase both in intensity and frequency over the next few days, even more so above the 4 CME's proudly announced in previous postings, resulting in a PEAK of activity even more intense than seen in the last week, on the 28th as the comet is at perihelion. With the increasing distance of the comet thereafter, the intensity and frequency of the CME's will diminish.

Yes? No?

Edit - for what its worth, the sun is all but completely dead today. Nothing going on at all. Nothing forecast.

Joint USAF/NOAA Solar Geophysical Activity Report and Forecast SDF Number 326 Issued at 2200Z on 22 Nov 2013
Solar activity has been at low levels for the past 24 hours...
Solar activity is likely to be low...
The geomagnetic field has been at quiet levels for the past 24 hours...
The geomagnetic field is expected to be at quiet levels on days one, two, and three (23 Nov, 24 Nov, 25 Nov).

Does this fit electric comet predictions?

"Tides go in, tides go out, you can't explain it" - Bill O'Reilly

But the Electric Universe theory will explain it!

Do you believe the Earth is flat?

Earth Is Not Really Orbiting The Sun
www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDYQzMYi0Sc
www.youtube.com...


Note: I didn't title the video, but after you watch the video you will understand the title!

This will help some people visualize!!

It's kinda what a particle accelerator impact graphic looks like with all those spirals and loops.

What happens in a particle accelerator
www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcyYNxq27Fs
www.youtube.com...


Things are going so fast, if things touch, this happens.

Shoemaker-Levy 9 impact on Jupiter
www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zNuT4dbdjU
www.youtube.com...


Comet hit Jupiter again in 2012:

Impact Jupiter 11 Sep 2012
www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TPqaxkB06I
www.youtube.com...


September 11th Comet impact of Jupiter....Coincidence?

reply to post by AbleEndangered


Able, I can't see the relevance to either EC or DST models or where the association is with comet ISON. Can you say what you trying to say with all of that? I ask in a friendly, kind of curious, but totally f***** if I can see what you are getting out with those videos kind of way.

Why is our sun changing polarity just now when a tiny piece of dirt flies around?

S&F OP for educational thread. Lot of good debunkers' work here too.

PapagiorgioCZ
Why is our sun changing polarity just now when a tiny piece of dirt flies around?

It's the old superstitious mode of thiking, the one the was prevalent in ancient and medieval times. A black cat crosses your path, and right away lightning strikes the tree nearby. Do you blame the lightning strike on the cat? Same thing here. The Sun is way too large/massive/powerful to be affected by a tiny object like ISON in any way.

Most of EU/EC rhetoric boils down to the same kind of pointing and blaming that the superstitious people do, with no regard to the actual physics and science side of it. "A comet flares up as it comes close to the Sun? Yessss, that's because it's interacting with the Sun electrically, our theory is proven!" ... "Craters on the Moon? Yesss, they were caused by electric machining/spluttering, our theory is true!!!" ... "Mainstream scientists admit they're surprised or baffled by something they observed? Yesssss!!! it means their theories are all wrong and our theory is right!"

Personally, I'd love to see something legitimate come out of the EU camp, but so far they look like buffoons. They're not that different from creationists.

reply to post by AbleEndangered

This doesn't really have anything to do with ISON. The Earth is orbiting the Sun, due to Sun's gravitational pull. That the Solar System is moving through the galaxy is no secret, so I don't understand why make woo-woo videos about it. Unless we come to a part of Milky Way that affects us in some notable way, the Solar System can be perfectly well regarded in its own frame of reference.

reply to post by wildespace

All of that may well constitute an argument against EC and in favor of DST. But plain and simple all of the points you are making in this post are gross generalisations, non specific, or more simply grossly specious.

I can't see why you would bother to spend so much of your time on a thread when you find the subject irritates you so much.

Every single point in your post could equally apply to DST.

The data coming from ISON is demonstrating that DST is full of holes, and is definitely supporting EC. ISON the comet that just won't stop pointing out DST is wearing no clothes.

EDIT
You may be right about the post by Able. It looks like it has nothing to do with the EC/DST debate. But let's wait for a reply and clarification from the poster before we make up our minds. Many posters on this Space forum are not scientists but are insightful and knowledgeable amateurs - like those that discover most of these comets in the first place.

reply to post by Tallone

The data coming from ISON is demonstrating that DST is full of holes, and is definitely supporting EC. ISON the comet that just won't stop pointing out DST is wearing no clothes.

What data coming back from ISON? Just saying data coming back from ISON supports your theory doesn't make it true. The only observation of ISON that could support the Electric Universe Theory is if the emission lines of its spectrum showed evidence of the Zeeman effect. It does not, ergo the Electric Universe Theory is wrong. Period.

www.astrosurf.com...

Who knows how Ison, or any comet for that matter, effects the giant plasmasphere that is our solar system. From my understanding, there is no major scientific effort, no advanced instrumentation looking at the primary state of matter in our solar system.

The fact remains that space is filled with plasma.

books.google.com... &hl=en&sa=X&ei=mQiRUqusCMfc2AWBoIGwDA&ved=0CJEBEOgBMAk#v=onepage&q=solar%20system%20plasma%20mapping&f=false

Plasma science is well established, and anyone who claims different is only exposing their ignorance. Look up scientists like Kristian Birkeland (1867-1917), Norway; Irving Langmuir (1881-1957), USA; Hannes Alfven (1908-1995) - The Father of modern Plasma Physics, Sweden; and David Bohm (1917-1992), USA.

As a scientific field, it is relatively new, and not very popular with mainstream science, because the evidence strongly suggests that current institutional science is looking in the wrong direction. Everything about the sub-atomic structure of plasma seems to demonstrate that current models of the atom are completely wrong.

But hey, as far as I am concerned, considering what institutions have done with technology, let them keep blundering about in the dark, because it seems that every new break through is quickly used for destruction by the PTB.

reply to post by poet1b

Yep, Plasma Physics. What poet1b said.

reply to post by DJW001

 

What data coming back from ISON? Just saying data coming back from ISON supports your theory doesn't make it true. The only observation of ISON that could support the Electric Universe Theory is if the emission lines of its spectrum showed evidence of the Zeeman effect. It does not, ergo the Electric Universe Theory is wrong. Period.

www.astrosurf.com...

Have you bothered to keep up with the latest research? Or any of the more recent facts acknowledged by NASA since 2010? I mean that don’t fall in neatly with DST? I took a look at that site you linked to.

The first bit of info it gives on ISON is the magnitude of it, Mag. 10.1. That was back in October 11 2013! Have you any idea of what has taken place with the magnitude since then. Of course you have. The comet has vastly brightened. So much so and so quickly that it has led astronomers like Bruce Gary to wonder how this could be. I and others also have posted copiously about that anomaly on this thread.

So what is the point of dragging us back to data from October? The data has not stopped coming in since then. What we have now entirely supports EC and reveals the massive holes in the DST hypothesis. DST cannot account for the rapidity of the magnitude increase. Again links have been given.

DST advocates have been claiming the magnitude increase is due to fragmentation taking place and then going on to predict the eminent demise of ISON – see the CIOC crowd. Bruce Gary commented there is no evidence for making such a prediction. Again this has already been noted on the thread, quoted and linked to. DST advocates are contradicting themselves it seems - some of them such as BG do have open minds about the possibilities and are not afraid of pointing out the large gaping holes in the DS model.

The second bit of (old) info given on ISON in your linked source is a reference to CN. The EC model has no problems with the idea that CN is apparent and gives a MUCH better explanation for the evident gas production in comets than does the attempt by DST which simply cannot quote with the anomalies already observed with other comets.

You heard of ‘the CN anomaly’?

That is what NASA reported in September 22, 2010, when Comet Hartley 2 produced large amounts of Cyanide gas (CN). NASA reported at the time they had not a clue why the comet was producing so much in so shorter period. They went so far as to state about their observed anomaly that, “We’ve never seen anything like this before… the CN gas increase exploded.”

BTW in the same observations made of Hartley 2 by the EPOXI probe, while gas increased there was NO dust increase apparent to NASA. Another interesting point of those findings was that the cyanide abundance was not detected in the jets they observed to be venting – which would as DST advocates would claim proves it is coming from the nucleus.
www.nasa.gov...

The EC model DOES account for this and explains the presence of CN and other gases (as I have noted in other places on the thread) to be the result of electrochemical processes in the coma.
The cyanide abundance is likely to have originated “…in the electrochemical activity in the coma…electrical exchange between a highly active comet and charged particles from the Sun…”

The same process accounts for the 5 points observed to be taking place in comets by EC and anyone else with eyes. See the third image in my second part of my OP on the page 1 HERE

These EC advocate claims were independently verified by Dr. Franklin Anariba, an electrochemist. See the video I linked to on EC in the first page of this thread.

DJW001, just a couple of small requests of you. I trust you won't ignore the opportunity to hammer home your own supporting evidence, and demonstrate your expertise. Explain why you want to throw in the Zeeman Effect here. Explain your understanding of the Zeeman effect and exactly why according to you it constitutes "the only observation of ISON that could support the Electric Universe Theory"?

This is Bruce Gary’s latest ISON animation. Awesome!


www.brucegary.net...

The changing coma shape is due to constant adjustments “contrast/brightness adjustments.”

V-mag is now (or at least was a couple of days ago V-mag 3.68. The comet was still brightening according to the last measurements taken November 21 before overcast conditions set in, with an expectation of V-mag 5.5 today!!
SOURCE

Bruce Gary puts the coma brightness down to the rotational pole turning toward the Sun, and with a “new surface area” exposed different gases begin to be sublimated. The idea that this outburst is a product of ice and the venting of emissions from the nucleus is rejected by EC that postulates the volatiles are a product of the electrochemical process on the surface of the nucleus. The ionic coma and tail are evidence of the ongoing comet discharge, not of gas emissions from inside the nucleus according to the EC/EU model.
We have seen several X class flares hurled directly into Comet ISON, and we have seen ISON brighten as a result. A causative relationship between Sun and comet is suggested from previous observations of comets (although not stated as such by the DST advocates). 96P/Machholz was in perihelion at AU 0.12 and was hit by a very large flare. ISON is expected to come within AU 0.012 or approximately 1.165,000 km (724,000 miles) at perihelion! ISON has already been hit by not one but three X flares.

Here is a link to the solar flaring going on as the same 96P/Machholz passed out of perihelion in 2002. Its not ISON so will just include the link here.
www.youtube.com...

BTW 96P/Machholz was a fairly small comet less than 5 km across but passed fairly close to the Sun surface and the Sun was observed to flare on the comets passing. I have already suggested on my previous thread (and on this thread embedded several more recent videos discussing the analysis of NASA images of ISON and their similar conclusions) that ISON is much larger than the 1-6 km across size we are being offered. Makes sense then that there would be far more interaction between the Sun and a larger comet travelling closer to the star’s surface, doesn’t it?

Tallone
V-mag is now (or at least was a couple of days ago V-mag 3.68. The comet was still brightening ... with an expectation of V-mag 5.5 today!!

You're giving away your lack of astronomical experience here.
Despite your exclamation marks, a magnitude of 5.5 is DIMMER than a 3.8.

The confusion comes from Bruce's lengthly website using a combination of different measurement methods, different coma sizes, different spectral bands and so forth. Maybe its just that he didnt update that last sentence for the chart after the entries of the 8th. You can go back through it all and figure out exactly which error you've made if you choose.
The point is that its a simple basic astronomy 101 error that you've made. It doesnt mean what you think it does. Anyone who actually gets out under the night sky with a telescope to actually view comets would know that.

Anyone who actually gets out under the night sky with a telescope to actually view comets would know that.

reply to post by alfa1


Tell me how you know this to be true , or are you in the business of spreading falsehoods?

Tallone
We have seen several X class flares hurled directly into Comet ISON

You keep saying that, but is it even true?

Back on page 7, you said, citing a youtube video as your source:

There has been 4 X class flares from the Sun in the direction of ISON in just as many days.

and

Consider also Comet ISON has withstood the direct impacts of X flares 3 times so far in less than five days.

So... is this claim true? Its easy enough to find lists of flares in the days before that youtube video of the 21st was posted.
Here is the list:
November 19th. 10:26 UTC X1.0

Yes, thats it. Just one. Not four. Just one single solitary X class flare.

The previous X class was on the 10th. but the guy in the youtube video isnt talking about that. What his actual words are, and here I quote from the video starting at 1:06 ...

Another flare. Another coronal mass ejection was fired again today. That would be the fourth in as many days.

Note however, that he NEVER says that they were X class flares. The confusion you have is the reference he makes to X class CME's in other parts of the video.

And since the 19th, there has been no X class flares at all. None. Solar activity has been rather quiet.
Its almost as if the approaching of comet ISON to the sun does NOT have any effect on solar activity... isnt it?

reply to post by alfa1

NB The lower the magnitude number the brighter is the comet.
HERE


Ah. Me bad. Yes, seriously distracted when I posted that. It looks like I dropped the sentence out between "V-Mag 5.5" and the '!!'

I get DST turned around to SDT sometimes too. But hey niiiiice proof reading skills.

reply to post by alfa1


X-ray solar flares.

There were 4 in 5 days, as I said.

Check it. November 16 X-ray flare M class in active region 1900. To of em.
Check it. November 17 X-ray flare M class in active region 1900. Only the one.
Check it. November 19 X-ray flare X class in active region 1893. Only the one.

I'll give you some links to help you with your checking.
www.raben.com...
www.tesis.lebedev.ru...

5 days 4 flares. Some smack on ISON. One a bit off target.

Just as I said.