Electric Comet ISON - Revealed

reply to post by poet1b


So, is there a uniform theory?

Sounds a whole lot like straw clutching.

I've seen plenty of sun diving comets where the EU proponents say that as the comet hits the sun it causes a CME to erupt, you're saying as a comet approaches and I've seen divers and grazers where the sun didn't react at all.

Those times the EU proponents flick down the blinders and ignore the exception to their (loose, random) rules.

So what is it?

ISON didn't 'react' with the sun... at least not in the way it is being suggested here.

Was there some activity? Sure.

Does that mean the activity was caused by the comet approaching? Absolutely not.

Correlation doesn't necessarily mean causation.

Example: Many men that get married, also go bald. So marriage must cause baldness!

See the problem with that?

Also.... we are in solar maximum so the sun is going to naturally be more active right now.

daryllyn
ISON didn't 'react' with the sun... at least not in the way it is being suggested here.

Was there some activity? Sure.

Does that mean the activity was caused by the comet approaching? Absolutely not.

Correlation doesn't necessarily mean causation.

Example: Many men that get married, also go bald. So marriage must cause baldness!

See the problem with that?

Also.... we are in solar maximum so the sun is going to naturally be more active right now.

It turns out that we are not seeing a solar maximum, as it had been so expertly predicted. Could it also be that we don't really know whether or not those CME's were a reaction to Ison.

www.nytimes.com...

The one thing that I have learned is that we need to learn a lot more and stop letting the experts dictate what is or is not.

Witness2008

daryllyn
ISON didn't 'react' with the sun... at least not in the way it is being suggested here.

Was there some activity? Sure.

Does that mean the activity was caused by the comet approaching? Absolutely not.

Correlation doesn't necessarily mean causation.

Example: Many men that get married, also go bald. So marriage must cause baldness!

See the problem with that?

Also.... we are in solar maximum so the sun is going to naturally be more active right now.

It turns out that we are not seeing a solar maximum, as it had been so expertly predicted. Could it also be that we don't really know whether or not those CME's were a reaction to Ison.

www.nytimes.com...

The one thing that I have learned is that we need to learn a lot more and stop letting the experts dictate what is or is not.

At first, heliophysicists were puzzled. All the signs had pointed to a solar max taking place in 2013. Then came the new hypothesis: a double peaked solar maximum. According to that theory, instead of a single fiery climax, the Sun would exhibit a small peak, taper off into a valley, then peak again at the end of 2013 into the beginning of 2014.

Well, the end of 2013 is upon us, and so is a very active Sun. October 27th, 28th, and 29th all saw X-class flares, the strongest and most dangerous variety. NASA reported three X-class flares between October 23rd and 28th, accompanied by more than 15 M-class flares, one level down.

Source

It hasn't been a typical maximum, and it isn't anything that hasn't been seen before, or that doesn't have a reasonable explanation.

poet1b
Watch the video from NASA, and clearly the sun becomes active as ISON approaches.

Maybe it doesn't meet your exaggerated interpretations

Exaggerated interpretations??
It wasnt me that was doing the exaggeration.
As I mentioned before in another of Tallone's comet ISON conspiracy theory electric universe threads, the proponents of the EU theory were saying this is what would happen:

"Worldwide Power Disruptions", "X flares", "its going to increase radiation on earth", earthquakes, "the resulting photon flare up will engulf the Earth", "the photon flash will be so great that it will instantly turn everything on the Earth’s surface into light", CME's, pole shifts, "earth changes", "elevated electron levels", "can cause fault slippage", "an extinction level event", "another Carrington event", "economic collapse", changes in "vibrations", blackouts, increase in crime, looting and pillaging, emitting X rays, causing the sun to go dim, affects on our magnetic field, energized changes on Earth, "super storms", "radio disruption", "dangerous", TPTB censorship and coverups, TPTB false flags, influencing weather, people will behave differently,
"a major major super huge thing", "this is exactly like armageddon", and "...there is absolutely nothing anyone can do about it except panic."

reply to post by daryllyn


My point was that we (including the experts) don't KNOW anything for sure, including Dean Pesnell, the project scientist for NASA’s Solar Dynamics Observatory, who by the way was left scratching his head as to why the sun seemed so tame during the year that they had predicted a maximum.

For scientists trying to understand the dynamics in the interior of the Sun, it has been a humbling experience enlightening them about how much they do not know. “If there’s anyone who has figured it out, I haven’t heard, that’s for sure,” said Douglas Biesecker, a physicist at the Space Weather Prediction Center and the chairman of a panel that had issued predictions about the solar cycle.

Again.....www.nytimes.com...

reply to post by poet1b

Watch the video from NASA, and clearly the sun becomes active as ISON approaches.

Then it goes very calm.

That looks like there was interaction.

Maybe it doesn't meet your exaggerated interpretations, but there is definitely enough action taking place to demonstrate that something happened.

Probably more so than claimed proof of the existence of quarks.

Yes. too right you are!

Add to that the claim that comets are composites of ice and dirt. ISON evidently has a metallic nature.

There is something about ISON that NASA and government agencies elsewhere do not want public knowledge. I have already set up a thread on that. Unfortunately it has been shut down, but it can be accessed by clicking on 'Tallone' above my avatar image. It is the second thread title below this one on that list. However, it is now relevant to this thread. Because I am guessing here that comet ISON is no snowball, and that evidence has for the moment at least been held back from us.

NASA and assorted official sources were very quick to call ISON dead. But really it is easy to see how many of the last group would jump to that conclusion if they were relying on images from NASA.

We were all waiting with great anticipation the release of images of Comet ISON as it shot behind the Sun. These would have been EXCELLENT images, indicating the nature of the comet. But these were not shown. Nothing. Nada. Zip!

My guess is NASA couldn't show these. Maybe they were told not to. Or to be less speculative it could have been a technical fault but that would be a little odd, since we have not been told of any problem NASA is having with those satellites. The fact the images NASA released supposedly recorded as the comet went through perihelion that showed the time stamp rolling but only over the SAME frozen image is does not reflect well on what NASA thinks of the minion observers out there. It also does not reflect well on the professionals and amateurs alike who failed to notice, but then who would be checking? Someone should have been. Some ones have.

Two videos to bring to attention here. Both have been posted on Youtube over the past hour.

The most recent. Busted!


The first to note the issue of missing images and post.

reply to post by Tallone


That pseudo-scientific video apparently busting NASA for faking the SDO footage has itself been BUSTED!

You won't see any movements in such a short timespan, unless you catch an event like a CME.

Don't believe me?

Try it yourself.

Or watch the videos of comet Lovejoy on SDO.

Tallone
Two videos to bring to attention here. Both have been posted on Youtube over the past hour.

Busted!

Note where it says "171".
The image is from the EIT camera on the SOHO. 171 Angstroms wavelength.
This camera only updates images twice per day.
Once every 12 hours.
Its been that way for years now so there's no reason to get all excited and dramatic about it as if you're discovering something amazing about it not being like "real time" TV.

####SNIPPED####

Edit - something was bugging me, so I double checked. The EIT camera is on the SOHO spacecraft, not SDO as originally stated. Text updated to reflect reality.

reply to post by alfa1

This camera only updates images twice per day.
Once every 12 hours.
Its been that way for years now so there's no reason to get all excited and dramatic about it as if you're discovering something amazing about it not being like "real time" TV.

And THAT is exactly why people need to stop it with these youtube 'experts'.

reply to post by alfa1

 

alfa1

Tallone
Two videos to bring to attention here. Both have been posted on Youtube over the past hour.
Busted!

Note where it says "171".
The image is from the EIT camera on the SDO. 171 Angstroms wavelength.
This camera only updates images twice per day.
Once every 12 hours.
Its been that way for years now so there's no reason to get all excited and dramatic about it as if you're discovering something amazing about it not being like "real time" TV.

It really is just down to the ignorance of the youtube guy (and yourself).

edit on pmFridayfpm1 by alfa1 because: (no reason given)

Your statement on how often the camera's are set to update is no explanation at all. It only means you have not even bothered to go to the NASA site itself to read what has been stated there for sometime now.

On November 28, 2013, the SDO (Solar Dynamics Observatory) spacecraft will off-point at three different positions as Comet ISON moves through perihelion. This website will display near realtime images and movies of this sungrazing comet. Images should begin appearing sometime between 12:45 pm and 1:00 pm ET.

cometison.gsfc.nasa.gov...

(Emphasis added by me)

So my question to NASA. Where are those images you promise of ISON in perihelion? I and many others from both sides of the EC / DST debate would really like to see those.

deleted double post

Tallone
Your statement on how often the camera's are set to update only means you have not bothered to go to the site to read what has been stated there for sometime now.

You still dont get it, do you?
The youtube guy was specifically talking about how the EIT camera was not updating.
The SOHO has many different cameras, taking images at different rates. The EIT camera is just one of them.

Tallone
So my question to NASA. Where are those images you promise of ISON in perihelion?

My question to you is "which images?"
Be specific.
Exactly which images, which times, from which cameras, which wavelengths, are missing?

If you're going to make a claim that something is hidden and kept secret, you do have to say what it is.
At the moment, you're just saying rather vaguely "stuff" is secret, cause the youtube guy said so.

reply to post by alfa1

My question to you is "which images?"
Be specific.
Exactly which images, which times, from which cameras, which wavelengths, are missing?

If you're going to make a claim that something is hidden and kept secret, you do have to say what it is.
At the moment, you're just saying rather vaguely "stuff" is secret, cause the youtube guy said so

You haven't been to the site yet. All cameras.

None. Can you find one of the images of ISON promised by NASA from those cameras? There are plenty of astronomers looking. Maybe you can do what no one else can?

Tallone
You haven't been to the site yet. All cameras.

None. Can you find one of the images of ISON promised by NASA from those cameras? There are plenty of astronomers looking. Maybe you can do what no one else can?

You dont get it, do you?
***YOU*** and youtube guy are the ones making a claim. It is up to you to provide evidence to support the claim. I'm not going to waste time searching through all cameras on all spacecraft on all wavelengths for missing images.

And in any case, you've moved the goalposts.
Your original claim (via youtube guy) was that *IMAGES* were kept secret and not available to the public.
Now you've changed that to "cannot see comet ISON in the images that I've looked at".

Nobody ever made the latter promise. The nature of the comet was such that it always had the possibnility of vaporising or being too small to see.

But in any case, back to the first original claim. Do you still wish to defend it?

Electric comet ISON and its interactions with the sun.
Great streams of plasma filling the sky, multiple X class flares, and activating the sun to create a huge doomsday Carrington event.
As predicted.

Joint USAF/NOAA Solar Geophysical Activity Report and Forecast SDF Number 333 Issued at 2200Z on 29 Nov 2013
Solar activity has been at low levels for the past 24 hours.
Solar activity is expected to be low.

Or not.

Uh. Yeah okay.

On with it then.

I get a total agreement from Thornews!! Well not literally, I don't know him. I ought to have linked to him much much earlier on in the thread though. Sorry for that Thornews. You are dude indeed.

A short summary of the video. A chronicle of NASA' BS from the beginning of their monitoring of ISON right through to the present moment. Unbelievable. Totally and utterly unbelievable, if you had not witnessed it all for yourself.

Here we go then, let's just call it what it is. NASA conspiracy. No better still call it what it is...

'Comet ISON : TOTAL CONSPIRACY'




NASA idiocy is another phrase that comes to mind, except the organisation itself are not idiots. The shills on the whole are a mindless lot though. And you have to wonder at the capability level of some of the scientists that have sprung to their defence over the past few weeks. Then there is the utterly ludicrous charade that has been the Comet ISON Observing Campaign.

The way I see it now, once you assemble the facts in a line, time-wise, with NASA at one end and comet ISON at the other - it all comes down to a simple equation. And here it is.

NASA + (OUR) TRUST + ISON FACTS = BIG FAT LIE

There you are. I told you it would be simple.

Tallone
I get a total agreement from Thornews!!
Here we go then, let's just call it what it is.

1. So do I assume then that you'd abandoned your claim of huge plasma interactions with multiple X class flares between the comet and the sun and instead sidestepped with a "go look at this youtube video"?
2. So do I assume then that you've abandoned your argument that there are missing images from SDO that are being hidden from the public?
3. At 0:40 "comet ISON was set to pass Mars, and the EPOXI/Deep Impact Spacecraft"
Not true.
At no time has comet ISON ever going to be "passing" the spacecraft, since they're on opposite sides of the sun. Nowhere near each other, and never will be.
4. At 0:49 "5 minutes before EPOXI was supposed to take photos of comet ISON, it went crazy and started flipping out. Broke, died and spun out into outer space."
Not true. All fiction.
The spacecraft had already taken several images of the comet at times earlier in the year quite successfully. In September there was a communication loss. No evidence to suggest any "spun out into outer space" scenario.
5. At 1:50 onwards, he doesnt know how orbits are calculated, nor does he appear to be aware of the significance of an orbital eccentricity near 1.0. His ignorance cannot be blamed on anyone else but himself.
6. At 2:42 "they all pointed the cameras, all of them in the wrong direction".
Not true. Although its a claim made many times in the video, he is simply ignorant again. The cameras were indeed facing the right direction, as promised.

Much of the rest of it the same, where he's just some dumb moron who hasn't any idea what he's even talking about.

reply to post by alfa1


1. I have clarified this. Above. Why demean yourself with plain trolling? There is strong evidence of interaction between the Sun and ISON on the 19th. Similarly with the series of M class flares. You have been pointed to another example above. It has been interacting with the Sun following perihelion.
2. A wrong assumption by you.
3. Yes, 'dude' has a studied slackness, but you are missing the point. He (and I) do not trust what is coming out from NASA. And so far NASA is looking less than credible over its coverage of ISON.
So if as you say the spacecraft had already taken several images of the comet at times earlier, - then isn't it awfully bad luck that in September it suffers a communication loss? Just before ISON arrives for a close up?

Where do YOU think EPOXI/Deep Impact is right now according to its orbit??

5. Do you have specific examples?
6."The cameras were indeed facing the right direction, as promised."
So I ask you then, where is a SINGLE promised image of ISON from Mars to completion of perihelion from all of NASA's expensive hardware?? Huh?

You keep evading the issue presented. You attack observations made with evidence supplied without providing any counter evidence what so ever, apart from a scrappy copy of magnitudes and scribbled notes my kid can do a lot better.

Give counter points with linked evidence. You know, show you are not trolling.

BTW About that CanadianGreekMe video with the two examples of cameras failing to get a single image of ISON in perihelion. Above you throw this at me. "At the moment, you're just saying rather vaguely "stuff" is secret, cause the youtube guy said so. " And you make the same accusation in two posts one after the other - I guess it is really significant to you.

I made that claim almost 24 hours before CGM posted the video on youtube! See moi HERE. I posted his video to demonstrate others are watching NASA. Not accepting the BS of that is the supposed ISON coverage from NASA and its hysterical defence by their associated shills.

Pay attention.

Tallone
1. There is strong evidence of interaction between the Sun and ISON on the 19th.

"strong evidence" isnt the same as "random". We're at the peak of the current solar cycle and all that has been so far has been the normal happening of the sun as per normal.
Also, I'd like to see your definion of "interaction" because a few random low power flares at random times in random directions isnt it, compared to your previously stated predictions.
So i'll have to ask you again. Have you or have you not abandoned your previous claim of X class flares at perihelion?

Tallone
2. A wrong assumption by you.

And yet... you still havn't put forward any details about the asserted missing images.
In this post where you originally made that claim, and here also you clearly stated a belief that it was entire images being held back from the public:

The fact the images NASA released supposedly recorded as the comet went through perihelion that showed the time stamp rolling but only over the SAME frozen image is does not reflect well on what NASA thinks of the minion observers out there.

and used two youtube videos from others who were also saying that entire images were being held back, while saying:

The first to note the issue of missing images...

And yet I can only see from from you now an admission that ALL images are in fact accounted for.
Or not.
You seem to be very hard to nail down on that point.
So I'll have to ask you again. Have you or have you not abandoned the claim that images were held back from the public? If so, which ones?
Which images are held back from the public?

Tallone
3. Where do YOU think EPOXI/Deep Impact is right now according to its orbit??

Have you forgotten the video that you yourself posted only a few days ago? See time 1:10.

As a side note its important to mention that Deep Impact was only ever meant to take photographs of comets at close range. Back in September, the earth was much closer to comet ISON than the spacecraft, and backyard amateur astronomers were taking much better photographs than an old probe on the far side of the sun ever could.
Apart from a "thats nice" or simple curiosity value, its not clear to me what value any distant grainy low res pictures from the craft would have served anyway... but there's still the feeling among a lot of ignorant people that simply because something is "out in space" that it is somehow magically positioned better than us losers here on earth to image anything else "out in space". Not true.
Lots of people are putting a much higher value on the loss of those photos than they actually deserve.
See the poor low resolution images from earlier in the year as good examples for what I'm saying.

Tallone
6."The cameras were indeed facing the right direction, as promised."
So I ask you then, where is a SINGLE promised image of ISON from Mars to completion of perihelion from all of NASA's expensive hardware?? Huh?

You're not even going to rebutt me then???
So you seem to be accepting that there cameras were indeed pointing in the right direction and youtube moron was wrong. Or at least, you're not protesting the issue. The framing is exactly in line with their declaration beforehand of how the cameras would be pointed. I cant help it if the comet was too faint *at those specific UV wavelengths* to see next to the glare of the sun.
So you'll have to be clear, are you or are you not abandoning the argument previously stated that *all* the cameras were in the wrong direction?

Tallone
Give counter points with linked evidence. You know, show you are not trolling.

I do have to admit its rather difficult to argue with you, because you keep shifting goalposts. eg. Used to be " four X class flares in as many days", yet now any old thing will do. Used to be X class flares, then it was just that any old X ray flare would do. Used to be totally missing images, now its just "I cant see it". eg. used to be no images at all from Deep Impact, now its just the september ones. ***
For once, I'd like you to go back to the previously stated assertions you've made and say whether you still actually stand by them. Or not.

*** and I particularly dislike your tactic of throwing forward a youtube video to support your case, and when challenged, say "oh, I never really believed all that anyway", as you did here.
So please dont do it again with that latest video.