How Does Going to Hell Look Like?

RevelationGeneration
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

Ah I see your a Preterist who think's Jesus already returned in 70AD. You realize this doctrine was founded by the Jesuits back in the time of the Reformation? It kinda falls flat on it's face because the Book of Revelation was not even written until about 95 or 96 AD.

edit on 23-11-2013 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

And what has that got to do with what hell looks like?

Sounds like preaching and trying to prove the validity of the bible to me.
Which I may add has been used ever since its inception to control the masses in a political way.

The different christian denominations of christianity cannot even agree with each other, let alone anyone else.

reply to post by OneManArmy


Cool... This is the second time you've decide to chime in on the topic with nothing worth while to say. So i'm simply going to ignore you now like I do with people who reply to me attempting to troll. You can be added on the list with boymonkey and Akragon.

reply to post by RevelationGeneration

Ah I see your a Preterist who think's Jesus already returned in 70AD.

That is the most obvious interpretation.
A futurist interpretation requires ignoring parts and taking other parts out of context, and then making fantastic leaps of logic.

You realize this doctrine was founded by the Jesuits back in the time of the Reformation?

I realize that futurists make that claim but I have yet to see the evidence.

It kinda falls flat on it's face because the Book of Revelation was not even written until about 95 or 96 AD.

That is based on a hundred and thirty year old theory that has long since been refuted and rejected by serious scholars who are not futurist partisans.
It was based on a faulty understanding of the nature of so-called Christian persecutions by the Romans.
To me, putting that late of a date on Revelation is the same as declaring its lack of authenticity as an Apostolic writing.

RevelationGeneration
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Cool... This is the second time you've decide to chime in on the topic with nothing worth while to say. So i'm simply going to ignore you now like I do with people who reply to me attempting to troll. You can be added on the list with boymonkey and Akragon.

edit on 23-11-2013 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

Talking about having anything worthy to say, maybe you can show me where anything you have been saying has anything to do with the OP.

All I asked is for proof to your grand assertion that the only way to salvation is Jesus?

Your reply... to hide and ignore explorative questions.
Interesting.

reply to post by OneManArmy

And what has that got to do with what hell looks like?

What it has to do with hell is that futurists misinterpret the prophecies and parables of Jesus in order for them not to be talking about Jerusalem's historical fall in the first century.
There has to be a fake interpretation created by the futurists, so it makes people think that it is talking about a future hell scenario, in order to distract people from understanding the completed nature of these predictive statements.

reply to post by OneManArmy

All I asked is for proof to your grand assertion that the only way to salvation is Jesus?

The proof is in the Bible.

No one would even know about Jesus unless he was spoken of in there.
So people taking the name, Jesus, and making statements supposedly about him, while ignoring what the Bible says is just so much misdirection.

OneManArmy

RevelationGeneration
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Cool... This is the second time you've decide to chime in on the topic with nothing worth while to say. So i'm simply going to ignore you now like I do with people who reply to me attempting to troll. You can be added on the list with boymonkey and Akragon.

edit on 23-11-2013 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

Talking about having anything worthy to say, maybe you can show me where anything you have been saying has anything to do with the OP.

Maybe you should read a few pages back.

RevelationGeneration

OneManArmy

RevelationGeneration
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Cool... This is the second time you've decide to chime in on the topic with nothing worth while to say. So i'm simply going to ignore you now like I do with people who reply to me attempting to troll. You can be added on the list with boymonkey and Akragon.

edit on 23-11-2013 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

Talking about having anything worthy to say, maybe you can show me where anything you have been saying has anything to do with the OP.

Maybe you should read a few pages back.

I read back and what I saw was more grand assertions made by you as to the only possible outcomes of death being heaven or hell. So I ask again, where is your proof for your "definitive" grand assumptions?
I saw you describing spirits as fallen angels, yet you provide no evidence but a book written with an agenda 2000 years ago.

jmdewey60
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

All I asked is for proof to your grand assertion that the only way to salvation is Jesus?

The proof is in the Bible.

No one would even know about Jesus unless he was spoken of in there.
So people taking the name, Jesus, and making statements supposedly about him, while ignoring what the Bible says is just so much misdirection.

So anyone not fortunate enough to be born into a society that follows the new testament, or to come across the new testament themselves be damned?

Doesnt sound like the actions of a fair and just god to me.

RevelationGeneration
i'm simply going to ignore you now like I do with people who reply to me attempting to troll. You can be added on the list with boymonkey and Akragon.

They are two of the better posters at ATS. That's your loss ...

You were asked to prove this statement .....

RevelationGeneration
There is only one path to Heaven and that is through Jesus Christ.

Instead of having a civil christian discussion with someone ... you called them a name and cut them off. The Christian thing to do would be to have a nice discussion and SHOW them Jesus ... BE Jesus to that person. Instead, it looks like you are the one trolling.

Here at ATS if you make a definitive statement like you did ... you are expected to back it up.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Ah! Someone else who understands! I thought I was the only one...

Something profound has just occurred to me, about this whole notion of preaching hell to be "saved" from it.

Jesus went to the cross and took the hit because of love, and to set us free for the sake of freedom to freely love as we are loved.

It's about freedom or liberation, and love.

This idea that a person can be "saved" by fear and threat of hell cannot serve or function as the basis for salvation, because the opportunity to respond to God's love has been robbed from the potential recipient by the preacher preaching it, and thus, anyone who was "saved" by it, will in turn preach the same "Gospel" which is no Gospel at all (Good News).

That's a purely mercenary affair, and does not contain or posses the love of God, just a perverted Gospel that's been contaminated by this threat, and fear. Any "repentance" extracted will therefore be inauthentic, and the loving response to God's love also inauthentic, because it's not freely evoked by a free expression of love in kind.

Jesus spoke of this type of "conversion", and those who preach it.

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are.

~ Mathew 23:15

I once knew a young person who had been converted and "saved" by this type of preaching, but instead of basking in the love of God, and celebrating the victory, he was absolutely obsessed by the sins, present and future which would result in the loss of his "salvation" on the basis that it's value cannot be retained and is lost by the sins committed, which didn't help at all in terms of his ability, by the power and reason of God's love to overcome his sinful obsessions.

He didn't get the love part, didn't receive it, and his repentance wasn't authentic, nor his love for God because his salvation wasn't authentic. He couldn't trust it.

Thus the tendency for some to think that it can be found or preserved through a mastery of scripture and adherence to a strict doctrine, and by preaching the very same message by which they were "saved", but the love and freedom is not present, so it's not a happy, joyful and triumphant affair with good humor and charm, but a dead thing that kills, and prowling around like a lion seeks not really to save, but only to devour and steal away God's children from his loving presence.

I've been to hell twice. Getting there is quite pretty but you know you're in hell soon enough.

intrepid
I've been to hell twice. Getting there is quite pretty but you know you're in hell soon enough.

In that case Ive been very close to hell.

Im counting my blessings.

RevelationGeneration

I am still waiting for you to answer this question: Did Christ take up the same body in which he died at the resurrection? (Yes/no)

Well as I said before, you don't die at a resurrection, which is the entrance into a new life. But in answer to your question, yes of course, the same body, and it's a good thing too that his legs were not broken as they were the other two to his left and right.

reply to post by NewAgeMan

you don't die at a resurrection

Then why is it called a resurrection?

Hell and the near death experience.

As with heaven, there are various hell realms witnessed by near-death experiencers. We can even see many manifestations of hell right here in the physical realm. There are people in prison, in the Bahamas, in mental institutions, universities, skid row, palaces, crack houses, all kinds of life situations. While hell realms can be seen outside all around the world as a manifestation of an inner hell within humans, hell realms in the spirit world are an even greater manifestation of inner hell within humans. Near-death accounts show that the hell realms in the spirit world are actually the spiritual/mental manifestations of spiritual conditions that humans create within themselves while on Earth.

"Why do some people have NDEs that resembles the fire and brimstone hell of the Bible while other people describe a different kind of hell? The quick answer is that there are many kinds of hells and many kinds of heavens. A person's situation in life and after death is based upon many factors including: perception, perspective, cultural and religious background, spirituality or lack thereof, and education. If you examine enough hellish NDEs that resemble the traditional hellfire and brimstone, you will notice that they mostly occur to fundamentalist Christians.

Source

AfterInfinity
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

you don't die at a resurrection

Then why is it called a resurrection?

It's the opportunity to live again and enter into a whole new domain of possibility, and whatever death is to be experienced, although many who are really saved will go straight from death to new life, will occur prior to the resurrection.

I am convinced that the death and resurrection points to an evolutionary principal of life meeting life, and to a degree RevGen is correct insofar as the price of sin is death, but that price has been paid in full by Jesus who so loved us that he was prepared to take upon himself all the sins of the the world as an atonement and reconciliation or simply put, to go to or experience hell (experience separation from God) so that we would not have to go there and could be forgiven our sins in absolute terms, leaving ONLY the love of God, and not another duality (of the knowledge of the tree of good and evil) like RevGen preaches based on a conditional love demanding obedience and submission under threat of hell, at his urging/"invitation".

Thus the opportunity for forgiveness, and acceptance, according to an unconditional love is forever extended to humanity, and therefore the opportunity to be reintegrated in and with God (as the all in all, among other things including a fully informed self aware objective perfect observer), and thus removed from all fear of any kind, even the fear of hell or of "death" which has passed away and "lost it's sting" (indignity, last word).

As to what our resurrection will look like. I'm with C.S. Lewis on this one where I think it will represent something that will absolutely delight, based on our innermost heart's desire appropriately expressed and even exceeded, so it will transform and convert all (or most) our deepest desires and impulses, which in our earthly life might have contributed to our sinful acts and expressions when sought out for purely narrow, selfish reasons, into their heavenly equivalent, which has a strange humor and irony to it which seems to be in alignment with God as I have experienced God, who just loves to surprise and delight in the best possible way. And if we lose something in the process, it will be that which was totally warped and distorted, causing us to sin and rebel against the love of God, so it was nothing reasonable or valuable in any way to begin with, so it must die, yet in it's death, even then something else will emerge and arise. Funny!

It's a free gift the gift of eternal life which extends itself to us even now. There is nothing however that we can do to earn or deserve it, and no amount of good deeds or saved souls (like notches in one's belt) which can allow us to earn or deserve it, or preserve it. It exceeds us even in spite of ourselves no matter what we do or do not do, so mirth and charm and love in kind, even joy and humor, is the appropriate response, like a great joke told at the expense of the devil within for whom it might be a "groaner" while a great cheer goes up in the heavens among the angels at the return of the Prodigal Son, who indeed must come to his senses and make a return path home, of his own free will, and not because some heartless, unloving a-hole who thinks he knows God only by the words on a page has demanded it of us, under threat of hell - woe to him!

There are few people who, when it comes right down it in their inmost heart of hearts, hates the love of God, and if you'll take the time to read Lewis' "The Great Divorce", you'll note that those who rejected God and chose hell did so out of some form of self-absorbed insanity of some kind or another. They had already imprisoned themselves in a hell of their own making (locked, from the inside) and had lost the opportunity to be a REAL human being, which is what's needed to enter heaven and experience even greater glories, perhaps even now while we're still on the way..?

There's just the slightest twist however in the heartless, cold and unloving preaching of the "Gospel" by RevGen that we can instinctively tell isn't of of the love of God or of Jesus Christ and therefore.. (a lion on the prowl?)

He thinks he's doing the right thing, but if he was really saved and had the Lord, he would BE that love, would evoke it, extend it, and it would be the love of God for it's own sake and for what it is and represents and offers us, not a mercenary thing at the tip of a sword under threat of hell, which is really THE most abhorrent thing, anywhere, because it's loveless, and also robs us of the opportunity to freely respond to the love of God, with love in kind, and yet professes to speak on behalf of Jesus himself while wielding the scripture, a devilish thing if there ever was one, although I do realize AI, that you wish to also demonize me too, but I still love you, for REAL! LOL!!!


Best Regards,

NAM aka Bob

reply to post by OneManArmy


Good post. Which makes me think - what kind of heaven does a person experience who only sought it out, to avoid hell?

What can flower, in resurrection, out of that?

OneManArmy
Hell and the near death experience.

As with heaven, there are various hell realms witnessed by near-death experiencers. We can even see many manifestations of hell right here in the physical realm. There are people in prison, in the Bahamas, in mental institutions, universities, skid row, palaces, crack houses, all kinds of life situations. While hell realms can be seen outside all around the world as a manifestation of an inner hell within humans, hell realms in the spirit world are an even greater manifestation of inner hell within humans. Near-death accounts show that the hell realms in the spirit world are actually the spiritual/mental manifestations of spiritual conditions that humans create within themselves while on Earth.

"Why do some people have NDEs that resembles the fire and brimstone hell of the Bible while other people describe a different kind of hell? The quick answer is that there are many kinds of hells and many kinds of heavens. A person's situation in life and after death is based upon many factors including: perception, perspective, cultural and religious background, spirituality or lack thereof, and education. If you examine enough hellish NDEs that resemble the traditional hellfire and brimstone, you will notice that they mostly occur to fundamentalist Christians.

Source

edit on 201311America/Chicago11pm11pmSat, 23 Nov 2013 13:56:39 -06001113 by OneManArmy because: (no reason given)

This bears more consideration, and is tied into free will mandate...Bardo Thodol and to a certain extent, The Egyptian Book of the Dead address the mechanisms involved, and the navigation through them, athiest and theist alike...as niether is exempt from these generationaly created realms.

Å99