Courts Quietly Confirm MMR Vaccine Causes Autism

DJW001
reply to post by Rubinstein

 

The misconception which a lot of people have is that Wakefield's study concluded "MMR vaccine causes Autism", we have a lot of people replying who would benefit from reading the orginal study.

What he said was:

Onset of behavioural symptoms was associated, by the parents, with measles, mumps, and rubella vaccination in eight of the 12 children

and:

Interpretation We identified associated gastrointestinal disease and developmental regression in a group of previously normal children, which was generally associated in time with possible environmental triggers

You will note that his assumption is that the children were "previously normal," rather than autistic individuals who had not yet exhibited symptoms. This is a confirmation of the parents' bias, and sets up the implied causality of "environmental factors," ie; vaccination. So, no, he did not come out and say "MMR vaccine causes Autism" in the original paper, but he has been loudly proclaiming it ever since.

Yes, you are correct, while he recommended more research in his paper, his own belief is clearly that the MMR is the culprit, but it's difficult for him to prove on his own without a lot of funding. Andrew Wakefield is in good company with his beliefs, as the former chief of the UK Department of Health, Dr Peter Fletcher, agrees with him, and the former head of the CDC admitted the same thing on a television interview. In fact Dr Peter Fletcher says that this is a conspiracy by powerful people to protect their reputations.

Andrew Wakefield was known as one of the best doctors, that's why people took so much notice when his study first appeared, now he's been smeared by Big Pharma hitman Brain Deer, but hopefully one day the justice will be done and Wakefield will be knighted for his work.

DJW001
reply to post by Rubinstein

 

Take a look at the line below from the end of the same study:-

"the hyper-immune response to measles virus might indicate virus reactivation that triggers a misguided humoral immune response in children with the disorder"

This fits in with what Wakefield suggested and recommended more research into i.e. injection with the live Measles virus (via MMR) is triggering an autoimmune disorder in the gut which is causing children to show Autism-like symptoms.

Once again, the issue is with the implied causality. A proper study would see if children with celiac disorders are prone to develop autism, or if there are autistic individuals who are not hypersensitive to measles. To the best of my knowledge, it is still unclear whether there are genetic markers for autism. If there were, it might be possible to do more controlled studies.

Indeed, proper studies are required, unfortunately the people with the money to do them are not interested, the words of the former UK Department of Health Chief Dr Peter Fletcher put the MMR/Autism debate into perspective

Dr Peter Fletcher, former UK Chief Scientific Officer at the Department of Health said

"it is the steady accumulation of evidence, from a number of respected universities, teaching hospitals and laboratories around the world, that matters here. There's far too much to ignore. Yet government health authorities are, it seems, more than happy to do so."

...

"the refusal by governments to evaluate the risks properly will make this one of the greatest scandals in medical history"

...

"There are very powerful people in positions of great authority in Britain and elsewhere who have staked their reputations and careers on the safety of MMR and they are willing to do almost anything to protect themselves."

....

"Clinical and scientific data is steadily accumulating that the live measles virus in MMR can cause brain, gut and immune system damage in a subset of vulnerable children,"

Rubinstein
Same thing happened to the chap who discovered Thalidomide was causing disabilities in newborns, you get the pattern? If you cost Pharma money they target you, they want to scare off other scientists from doing the same. Big Pharma want complete control of what information gets given to the public, they do not want random scientists becoming heroes and proving that Pharma are poisoning us.

paraphi
(Ex) Doctor Wakefield. Ruling by the General Medical Council...

Accordingly the Panel has determined that Dr Wakefield’s name should be erased from the medical register. The Panel concluded that it is the only sanction that is appropriate to protect patients and is in the wider public interest, including the maintenance of public trust and confidence in the profession and is proportionate to the serious and wide-ranging findings made against him.

Read the findings of the GMC Panel investigation into the corrupt scumbag, whose research was all wrong.. www.gmc-uk.org/Wakefield_SPM_and_SANCTION.pdf_32595267.pdf‎ opens as a PDF.

All those who smugly think Wakefield was good news support poor research.

Regards

edit on 24/11/2013 by paraphi because: (no reason given)

I think on the strength of what Wakefield says in his interview is that its not just big pharma, it is also the corrupted government officials that gave the pharma companies carte blanche and freedom from prosecution.
I think that is fundamental as to how this whole MMR debate has progressed.
I would say that if Brian Deer is being paid by anyone, it is corrupt government officials.

OneManArmy

Rubinstein
Same thing happened to the chap who discovered Thalidomide was causing disabilities in newborns, you get the pattern? If you cost Pharma money they target you, they want to scare off other scientists from doing the same. Big Pharma want complete control of what information gets given to the public, they do not want random scientists becoming heroes and proving that Pharma are poisoning us.

paraphi
(Ex) Doctor Wakefield. Ruling by the General Medical Council...

Accordingly the Panel has determined that Dr Wakefield’s name should be erased from the medical register. The Panel concluded that it is the only sanction that is appropriate to protect patients and is in the wider public interest, including the maintenance of public trust and confidence in the profession and is proportionate to the serious and wide-ranging findings made against him.

Read the findings of the GMC Panel investigation into the corrupt scumbag, whose research was all wrong.. www.gmc-uk.org/Wakefield_SPM_and_SANCTION.pdf_32595267.pdf‎ opens as a PDF.

All those who smugly think Wakefield was good news support poor research.

Regards

edit on 24/11/2013 by paraphi because: (no reason given)

I think on the strength of what Wakefield says in his interview is that its not just big pharma, it is also the corrupted government officials that gave the pharma companies carte blanche and freedom from prosecution.
I think that is fundamental as to how this whole MMR debate has progressed.
I would say that if Brian Deer is being paid by anyone, it is corrupt government officials.

Yes, agreed, it's high-ranking government officials who are in bed with Big Pharma, if the truth ever comes out there'll be more of a witch-hunt for the government officials who allowed this to happen despite being warned.

It has actually been admitted that Brian Deer was funded by the pharmaceuticals to do a smear-job on Wakefield. That's not to say that the government officials won't have been rubbing their hands together with evil smiles on their faces.

Rubinstein
That's a sample size of 2 i.e. not statistically significant. Also, how do you know the MMR vaccine didn't reduce their IQ or push them towards a disease in the future?

maryhinge
reply to post by angryhulk

 

AGREED

my eldest now 12 and twins of 10 had the MMR vaccine and they are alright

edit on 22-11-2013 by Rubinstein because: (no reason given)

12 and twins of 10 = sample size of 3 are you sure you didnt get the jab

only joking

to answer your questions IQs all three kids are doing really well at school

as for future illnesses i hope there will be non

Hopefully your kids got lucky and haven't been harmed too much by the vaccines, some kids cope better than others, though getting a small amount of metal in the brain is almost unavoidable. (see scientific explanation at 17m 50s in the video below.)

maryhinge

to answer your questions IQs all three kids are doing really well at school

as for future illnesses i hope there will be non

OneManArmy

paraphi


All those who smugly think Wakefield was good news support poor research.

Regards

Im finding it increasingly true, that those who smugly support biased research done by the very people making the drugs/vaccines support poor research.
It would seem bad research is on all sides of this argument.
No one has a right to be smug.

Lets hear what Wakefield has to say for himself.

edit on 201311America/Chicago11pm11pmSun, 24 Nov 2013 15:11:50 -06001113 by OneManArmy because: (no reason given)

Wakefield ran like a scalded cat when he was confronted with the unassailable evidence that not only had he faked his results but he had duped the parents of disabled children to perform colonoscopies on them.
Had his (extremely limited) study been robust and had he not had his hands deeply in the pocket of the legal aid system he would have stood his ground and responded with further studies vindicating his findings just like every decent scientist in the world does.
He did not.
He ran into the arms of the anti-vax movement who have looked after him very well indeed.

In the video he is hardly going to be truthful and say that he's a fraud, a conman and a charlatan is he?
Saying that, even if he did, those of you with your Youtube medical degrees and your blindfolds on would still think he's innocent.

And if you actually take time to read Wakefield's fraudulent paper you would read that he even stated in it that he couldn't prove a link between MMR and autism.

In the actual study straight from the conman's mouth himself....
"We did not prove an association between measles, mumps and rubella vaccine and the syndrome described..."
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
That completely contradicts what he said at the press conference though as he recommended that the MMR be suspended until further research was carried out EVEN THOUGH HIS OWN FAKED STUDY SUGGESTED NOTHING OF THE SORT.
Prior to the Brian Deer investigation his own colleagues dismissed him after the press conference.

As for some of the parents speaking out in that video, several of them were recruited by a legal firm acting against the vaccine so their testimony isn't exactly unbiased is it?
My friend wasn't one of them though.
Yes, Wakefield's a lovely man. Very honest and trustworthy indeed...
My friend (and I) are both dying to meet him.


And Rubinstein, the studies you've posted are about as suggestive of a correlation with MMR and autism as you are as a credible medical authority.

Pardon?
Wakefield ran like a scalded cat when he was confronted with the unassailable evidence that not only had he faked his results but he had duped the parents of disabled children to perform colonoscopies on them.

Complete rubbish, Wakefield stands by his work, he'll keep on fighting to defend it until the day he dies.

Pardon?
And if you actually take time to read Wakefield's fraudulent paper you would read that he even stated in it that he couldn't prove a link between MMR and autism.

He said there was good reason to fund research into it, he was right, his research is now being reproduced around the world as has been shown by the studies posted in this thread.

Pardon?
In the actual study straight from the conman's mouth himself....
"We did not prove an association between measles, mumps and rubella vaccine and the syndrome described..."

To PROVE with a high degree of accuracy there would need to be large-scale studies, that is why Wakefield can only point us in the direction of "More research". One should wonder why the CDC and other health agencys are avoiding such studies, this should give the game away.

Pardon?
Prior to the Brian Deer investigation his own colleagues dismissed him after the press conference.

Wakefield is still highly thought of by both his colleagues and the parents of the children in his study. They strongly believe in his work.

Brian Deer is simply a hitman journalist hired by Big Pharma to take out a man who has lost them a lot of money, anyone who thinks otherwise has not looked into the case in detail. Always be careful when basing your beliefs on newspaper headlines.

Any none essential visit to a healthcare "professional" is statistically more dangerous than staying at home.

I used to work in the Bio-Pharma industry (yes - Bio-Pharma is very much in control of policy and accepted treatments in healthcare that you, as the patient, ultimately receives) and it's exactly the same as any other industry where profit and shareholder expectations are placed before social responsibility.

The number of times I saw otherwise brilliant people with good morality look the other way or refuse to acknowledge something obvious because it makes them money/moves them up the corporate ladder astounds me to this day.

reply to post by Rubinstein


For the reasons I said in my previous post Wakefield is bound to stand by his work however he has had plenty of time and resources to confirm his study but strangely he hasn't.

HE may have SAID there needs to be more research into it but that was contradictory to what the study actually showed.
The research is being reproduced like this one in which they tried to fully replicate Wakefield's...
www.plosone.org...
And that's one of many.
Can you provide one which supports Wakefield's bogus study?

You mean a large scale study with a few thousand subjects rather than just 12?
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
Yes, everyone's avoiding the study above.
Oh wait,....

Wakefield is highly thought of as a fraud and a charlatan by his EX-colleagues and by several of the parents involved in the study (aside from the ones who he recruited at a kid's birthday party and waved the lawyers chequebook at...).
The only people who think of him as otherwise are other sycophantic frauds and charlatans.

As for Brian Deer, Wakefield was already being investigated by the BMJ way before his expose. Irrespective of who conducted the investigation, the evidence is there for all to see anyway so you're just shooting the messenger.

Jukiodone
Any none essential visit to a healthcare "professional" is statistically more dangerous than staying at home.

I used to work in the Bio-Pharma industry (yes - Bio-Pharma is very much in control of policy and accepted treatments in healthcare that you, as the patient, ultimately receives) and it's exactly the same as any other industry where profit and shareholder expectations are placed before social responsibility.

The number of times I saw otherwise brilliant people with good morality look the other way or refuse to acknowledge something obvious because it makes them money/moves them up the corporate ladder astounds me to this day.

Going to the toilet is also more dangerous than staying at home...
en.wikipedia.org...

And I'm guessing the rest of your post relates to Wakefield too in as much that he had his head turned by the lawyers bringing the case against the MMR and that he stood to make a fortune from his vaccine patent?

Thanks for sharing your experience

Jukiodone
Any none essential visit to a healthcare "professional" is statistically more dangerous than staying at home.

I used to work in the Bio-Pharma industry (yes - Bio-Pharma is very much in control of policy and accepted treatments in healthcare that you, as the patient, ultimately receives) and it's exactly the same as any other industry where profit and shareholder expectations are placed before social responsibility.

The number of times I saw otherwise brilliant people with good morality look the other way or refuse to acknowledge something obvious because it makes them money/moves them up the corporate ladder astounds me to this day.

Another interesting one

Hib Vaccine Causing Diabetes Type 1 - Conclusive Evidence
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Rubinstein
Another interesting one

Hib Vaccine Causing Diabetes Type 1 - Conclusive Evidence
www.abovetopsecret.com...

And a very interesting reply from the researcher who conducted the study that they cited as background....
(It's from Frank Di Stefano who Classen cites in his original study).

pediatrics.aappublications.org...

And Classen owns Classen Immonutherapies, "Classen Immunotherapies, Inc. is a privately held research stage biopharmaceutical company devoted to discovering safer uses of vaccines, drugs, devices, chemicals and related products. Classen Immunotherapies discovered that common vaccines are one of the most important causes of diabetes in children and in highly immunized adults."
www.vaccines.net...
So no conflict of interests there then.

But what this has to do with MMR is anyone's guess.
Clutching at straws perhaps?


EDIT: Ah yes, now I see the correlation, thanks for bringing this to our attention.
Classen fudges a study in the hope his company will profit from it and Wakefield fakes a study in the hope he will profit from his single vaccine patent (even though he already profited from the lawyer's money).
Just like two charlatans in a pod.

The thread isn't based on just one study, there is a strong argument showing that the Hib vaccine is causing Diabetes Type 1, you cannot debunk it because the evidence is too strong www.abovetopsecret.com...

The Hib vaccine causing Diabetes Type 1 has everything to do with any other thread relating to a vaccine which can cause lifelong disability; you are grasping at straws trying to think of any way possible to censor this information.

Pardon?
And a very interesting reply from the researcher who conducted the study that they cited as background....
(It's from Frank Di Stefano who Classen cites in his original study).

But what this has to do with MMR is anyone's guess.
Clutching at straws perhaps?

Rubinstein
The thread isn't based on just one study, there is a strong argument showing that the Hib vaccine is causing Diabetes Type 1, you cannot debunk it because the evidence is too strong www.abovetopsecret.com...

The Hib vaccine causing Diabetes Type 1 has everything to do with any other thread relating to a vaccine which can cause lifelong disability; you are grasping at straws trying to think of any way possible to censor this information.

Pardon?
And a very interesting reply from the researcher who conducted the study that they cited as background....
(It's from Frank Di Stefano who Classen cites in his original study).

But what this has to do with MMR is anyone's guess.
Clutching at straws perhaps?

I think you'll find that thread is based upon one study, the Classen one which I have just debunked.
Or rather the guy who did the original research the study cited has debunked.

I think you need to read it again.

The chap looks into the safety of vaccines, but that doesn't mean his results are wrong. The data stands up for itself. The man is an expert on the topic, the best person to ask. You only want data direct from Big Pharma and that's where you're going wrong.

The thread contains three studies along with population data. You cannot deny that the Hib vaccine is causing Diabetes Type 1, this is no secret. Only someone in denial or with an agenda would try to deny the obvious.

Pardon?

Rubinstein
The thread isn't based on just one study, there is a strong argument showing that the Hib vaccine is causing Diabetes Type 1, you cannot debunk it because the evidence is too strong www.abovetopsecret.com...

The Hib vaccine causing Diabetes Type 1 has everything to do with any other thread relating to a vaccine which can cause lifelong disability; you are grasping at straws trying to think of any way possible to censor this information.

Pardon?
And a very interesting reply from the researcher who conducted the study that they cited as background....
(It's from Frank Di Stefano who Classen cites in his original study).

But what this has to do with MMR is anyone's guess.
Clutching at straws perhaps?

I think you'll find that thread is based upon one study, the Classen one which I have just debunked.
Or rather the guy who did the original research the study cited has debunked.

I think you need to read it again.

Rubinstein
The chap looks into the safety of vaccines, but that doesn't mean his results are wrong. The data stands up for itself. The man is an expert on the topic, the best person to ask. You only want data direct from Big Pharma and that's where you're going wrong.

The thread contains three studies along with population data. You cannot deny that the Hib vaccine is causing Diabetes Type 1, this is no secret. Only someone in denial or with an agenda would try to deny the obvious.

Pardon?

Rubinstein
The thread isn't based on just one study, there is a strong argument showing that the Hib vaccine is causing Diabetes Type 1, you cannot debunk it because the evidence is too strong www.abovetopsecret.com...

The Hib vaccine causing Diabetes Type 1 has everything to do with any other thread relating to a vaccine which can cause lifelong disability; you are grasping at straws trying to think of any way possible to censor this information.

Pardon?
And a very interesting reply from the researcher who conducted the study that they cited as background....
(It's from Frank Di Stefano who Classen cites in his original study).

But what this has to do with MMR is anyone's guess.
Clutching at straws perhaps?

I think you'll find that thread is based upon one study, the Classen one which I have just debunked.
Or rather the guy who did the original research the study cited has debunked.

I think you need to read it again.

edit on 27-11-2013 by Rubinstein because: (no reason given)

Wrong again, the "chap" is trying to promote his company on the back of a dodgy study.
Read the link I posted earlier about Di Stefano who cites a real study showing that there is no correlation between the vaccine and diabetes and that diabetes had been on the increase prior to the vaccine being introduced.
These citation are referenced and the original data can be found quite easily.
Unlike Classen's.

The thread contains one study about the link, Classen's.
Which has been refuted.
There is another study showing incidence of diabetes and another which is unrelated, the Plos One link.
Refuting this has nothing to do with any big pharma data whatsoever only maybe in your conspiratorial mind.
Like I said, read the thread again then tell me there's more than one study referenced.

Mountainmeg
I have a 14 year old son with autism. I do not blame the vaccinations because his symptoms were noticeable before the MMR shot. After he was diagnosed, it was pretty easy to follow both lines of the family and find cases of possible asperger's and definite autistic traits. Son was the first in the family with full blown autism.

My nephew was born after my son's diagnosis. His parents had him vaccinated, but argued for an extended schedule so he wouldn't get multiple shots at one time - something I think is pretty smart. He was diagnosed with asperger's two years ago - but he functions much better than my son.

My big concern is the total vaccination load currently given to babies. It's not unusual to give a one year old four jabs in one appointment. And I have been unable to find ANY safety studies on the entire vaccine load. Yes, one shot may have a good safety study. What happens when you add in 3 other shots given at the same time?

But what really bothers me is the lack of concern regarding autism. The latest CDC figures put the autism rate at 1 in 88 children. 1 in 54 when you look at boys. So, something is taking out 1.85% of our male children - you would think that would be a national emergency.

CDC Autism Rates 2013

I know we here at ATS are not encouraged to reply to comments simply to say "good post", or something similar, but every once in a while a comment comes along that makes it difficult for me not to do so.. such as yours. You make very good (& reasonable) points without blaming or criticizing anyone/anything, and to me sounds like an educated opinion piece. I felt inspired by reading it actually. So thank you!!

Forget Wakefield, forget autism.

MMR caused Meningitis in UK. American Journal Of Epidemiology The vaccine was removed from sale.

Japan banned the MMR in 1993. Why Japan Banned the MMR

Early Fears about MMR in secret papers - 2007

Swine Flu Vaccine can Trigger Narcolepsy

CDC "Disappears" page linking Polio vaccine to cancer causing SV40 virus

In fact, CBS News has found nearly 1,300 cases in which vaccine-related brain damage has been compensated in court over the past 20 years.

Source - CBS News
That roughly equates to 65 per year. And thats just the ones that went to court and won.

I understand that it a matter of the greater good, but if the dangers of vaccination havent been properly studied then there is a problem.