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Man lets himself die while having faith that God will heal him

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posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 05:22 AM
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Believing his faith would heal him, a Greenwood County, South Carolina man sat down in his recliner after an injury in March and never got up...

...Webb says Tillmon tore his ACL in March and drove to a doctor's office...

...Webb says he returned to the recliner, picked up his Bible and became determined that faith would heal his leg.

Greenwood County authorities say they found Tillmon covered with sores, and that he appeared to weigh about 800 pounds. They say he was stuck to his chair, and they had to saw the recliner apart.

Source with video

This reminds me of the "Why doesn't God heal amputees?" argument.
The guy deserved what he got though; HE chose to sit there and rot to death. He could have taken care of himself, but he refused, instead simply giving up and asking God to fix his problems for him.
Just one more dramatically failed faith healing to add to the list.




posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 05:34 AM
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reply to post by trollz
 


I'm fairly sure the bible is quite explicit about this sort of stuff... "God helps those who help themself" or something along those lines. I wouldn't help buy someone a ferrari if they refused to work or get their drivers license, so why would god heal someone that refuses to get medical treatment?



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 05:41 AM
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I always say "Pray to God, but row for shore".

You have to be willing to help yourself. God heals in many different ways and doctors are just one of them. I am not sure why people refuse to help themselves then blame God because they didn't use the common sense He gave them.

It is a sad story indeed.
edit on 11/16/2013 by Kangaruex4Ewe because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 06:39 AM
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LordGoofus
reply to post by trollz
 


I'm fairly sure the bible is quite explicit about this sort of stuff... "God helps those who help themself" or something along those lines. I wouldn't help buy someone a ferrari if they refused to work or get their drivers license, so why would god heal someone that refuses to get medical treatment?


The Bible doesn't say "God helps those who help themselves".

What it does say is that Christians should be "wise as serpents and innocent as doves"...
...and in no way is neglecting or refusing medical attention wise!



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 07:23 AM
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"God helps those who help themself"




"Pray to God, but row for shore"


EXACTLY, which translated means "you do all the work, and God will get half the credit".

To an impartial observer it would seem as everyone is alone in the end.

In history there have been infinite times when people tried their best, prayed, but still "somehow" failed and died...

What is your take on THAT?
Oh, right, the good ol' "The Lord works in mysterious ways".

HA, religion: It has all the answers, and yet none of them makes sense.

(BTW that's ALL religion, from Christianity, to Islam, to the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.)



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 07:55 AM
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reply to post by MadHatter364
 


I must be honest. I initially thought, without looking closely at your avatar, that it was a painting of Jesus. So I'm thinking it's Jesus, then I read your post and I'm taken aback.

Then I look at your avatar closer and realize it's Eddie Vedder, or Tommy Lee Jones, or a random hippy. Threw me for a loop is all.

To address the OP - that's horrible.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 07:57 AM
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What about faith healers who let children die? Got any excuses for those cretins? I just saw a thread recently about nine kids...NINE KIDS...who died because their guardians relied on a higher power to save them.

Oh, and this:


EXACTLY, which translated means "you do all the work, and God will get half the credit".


I tried to say something about that, but this covers it beautifully.
edit on 16-11-2013 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 08:27 AM
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reply to post by trollz
 


His choice to believe or not to believe...who are we to say what one person should believe in but everyday someone on ATS or in the media is taking a shot at religion. It makes some members on here crazy that someone could believe in a god but somehow not so crazy to believe in bigfoot, ghosts, giants, ufo's, shadow people, skinwalkers, or an honest government.

There is a good deal of hypocrisy on this site. Seriously, I'm not taking a shot at you OP but who cares why someone chooses to die if it does not effect the rest of us? You and I both know where this conversation will end up with the bulk of the ATS members.

People make horrible decisions all the time. Most make excuses around bad choices they make and many use religion as an excuse for having done those bad things.

You can give sane people a gun and they do right by it and you can give sane people religion and they will do right by that...give a crazy person either or and nothing good can come from it...
edit on 16-11-2013 by chrismarco because: (no reason given)


If any of you really believe that getting rid of religion will make the world a better place you are wrong. We will find other ways to justify our primitive and self serving behavior and often perverted behavior. If you can't molest children as a priest you can go work at the YMCA or open a day care, maybe work as a coach or a scoutmaster. It may go away at some point but children will continue to be neglected and wars will continue to be fought. Nothing will change...
edit on 16-11-2013 by chrismarco because: sorry for the edits...



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 08:38 AM
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reply to post by trollz
 


Even Jesus said go to the physicians.

That's why we have physicians, they have been given the knowledge and wisdom to heal. But then again, some of them don't.

Jesus is the Great Physician, but He also told us to have wisdom. And doctors have knowledge. But at least Jesus won't cancel your insurance policy. But medicine can only do so much. A torn ligament can be repaired. I have Multiple Sclrosis, it is not fixable, but it is healable. I can go through this with God and have faith in Him that it might one day be cured, but my hope rests in Him healing me, and if He chooses to heal me through the medical establishment, then I would not have a problem going that route.

Heal us and we will be healed. In other words, send the cure, we already have the sickness.

Do you know how many people told me all the ways Multiple Sclerosis could be healed? I have been told to drink fruit juices, drink milk, don't eat certain foods, use other things, have chiropracty, everything, except have faith in God. Those ways are just as destructive and damaging because it gives a false hope.

But I would never say to anyone they will always be healed in this life. Sometimes you have to accept some illnesses won't be cured or healed here. But as God gives the knowledge, some people are cured of many things. But prayer is a good place to start, and faith is a good thing to have. It is only wise to seek help where help is.

I have seen miraculous healings in my life. I believe there are times for miraculous, but to me, it is a miracle also of why we have all the medical knowledge. I'm still waiting, with hope, for the cure for MS, and not just for me but the 2 million people worldwide and their families. I would never take hope from them either. And I would not give them false hope.

But the man's problem in the OP, is that he didn't act on faith, which is what we are supposed to do. He just sat back and waited. It does not mean one does not have faith to go to a doctor, it means they act on faith.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 08:41 AM
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reply to post by WarminIndy
 


I believe "wait" and "sit" and "pray" all qualify as verbs and are therefore actions.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 08:42 AM
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reply to post by trollz
 


This is a sad story, but I don't believe that this man's death had much to do with his belief that God would heal him. I think it has more to do with apathy, depression, mental and physical illness and a loss of will to live. His death can also be attributed to his family's neglect.

The man was 550 pounds and sat in his recliner, naked, for 8 months. He didn't / couldn't get up to bathe or use the toilet, and had sores all over his body. He had to be cut out of his recliner, after he died.

In my opinion, he read his Bible and prayed for last 8 months of his life, to solidify his relationship to God and to be sure that he would be taken to heaven. This man did not want to live, which is why he died.




edit on 16-11-2013 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 08:44 AM
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reply to post by chrismarco
 


Because this man's mentality causes the death of innocent children to this very day. Parents and guardians who let their children die rather than allow a doctor to act in God's stead. Even if you don't care about that, we do.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 08:47 AM
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AfterInfinity
What about faith healers who let children die? Got any excuses for those cretins? I just saw a thread recently about nine kids...NINE KIDS...who died because their guardians relied on a higher power to save them.

Oh, and this:


EXACTLY, which translated means "you do all the work, and God will get half the credit".


I tried to say something about that, but this covers it beautifully.
edit on 16-11-2013 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)


What about the woman who died in the waiting room of the hospital, still waiting to be seen by the doctor after 12 hours? What's the excuse for those cretins?

Where's my cure for MS? Do you have my cure? Does the doctor have my cure? Why am I still here, waiting and waiting and waiting while the MS Society raises millions of dollars for research, and no cure yet. Oh, they are working, yes, but in the meantime, what should I do?

How about the millions of people misdiagnosed? What about that? What about people who have died because the doctor didn't treat them right? What about the people who have died on the operating table in routine surgery?

Don't we hold doctors accountable? Don't we hold them for Malpractice? Isn't that why they have to pay Malpractice Insurance?

What about the people who were operated on by dirty instruments and instruments left in their bodies?

The medical establishment isn't perfect either.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 08:51 AM
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AfterInfinity
reply to post by WarminIndy
 


I believe "wait" and "sit" and "pray" all qualify as verbs and are therefore actions.


Then what's wrong with why he waited?

Is he crazy because he chose to wait?

What about the millions of parents today in an ER somewhere who waited for a doctor to come out and tell them "We did all we could, but we couldn't save your child"?

The doctor said "We DID all we COULD...." but it didn't heal that child.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 09:05 AM
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reply to post by WarminIndy
 



Is he crazy because he chose to wait?

Yes.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 09:17 AM
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wildtimes
reply to post by WarminIndy
 



Is he crazy because he chose to wait?

Yes.


Yes, you and I agree that it is craziness.

The man just seemed to be lazy, in my opinion.

And that's where it all gets sticky. People in this world still visit shamans and medicine men. Is it crazy to visit a shaman who performs a ritual and then blows smoke over the person, while the hospital is just down the road?

But then, we start to trample on their religious beliefs, which aren't Christian. Shamans and medicine men have been around a very long time, people have faith in them as well.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 09:24 AM
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reply to post by WarminIndy
 



Shamans and medicine men have been around a very long time, people have faith in them as well.

Absolutely. Medicine men and herbalists and shamans were the FIRST doctors. Modern medicine is so entrenched in "materialism" that they forget how much effect the mind has on the body, and vice versa.

This is where quantum physics and traditional Newtonian theories now diverge.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 09:35 AM
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wildtimes
reply to post by WarminIndy
 



Shamans and medicine men have been around a very long time, people have faith in them as well.

Absolutely. Medicine men and herbalists and shamans were the FIRST doctors. Modern medicine is so entrenched in "materialism" that they forget how much effect the mind has on the body, and vice versa.

This is where quantum physics and traditional Newtonian theories now diverge.



Yes, the materialism doesn't help. I looked up the Hippocratic Oath, it seems to have changed in the wording. Originally, doctors swore by Apollo, Aesclepius and Hygiea. And were bound in their oath to heal, or be killed. In ancient Greece, they took oaths seriously.

This is the modern Hippocratic Oath, a small section..

I will remember that there is art to medicine as well as science, and that warmth, sympathy, and understanding may outweigh the surgeon's knife or the chemist's drug. I will not be ashamed to say "I know not," nor will I fail to call in my colleagues when the skills of another are needed for a patient's recovery. I will respect the privacy of my patients, for their problems are not disclosed to me that the world may know. Most especially must I tread with care in matters of life and death. If it is given me to save a life, all thanks. But it may also be within my power to take a life; this awesome responsibility must be faced with great humbleness and awareness of my own frailty. Above all, I must not play at God.


I have met neurologists who thought they were God, and that's why I am no longer their patient.

The AMA has to address these very issues, and why some doctors are wanting to resort back to the original, because it was binding, it made the doctor accountable within the medical community. Even under the old Hippocratic Oath, they were sworn to not perform abortions. So the Hippocratic Oath changed to accommodate this culture.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 09:40 AM
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reply to post by WarminIndy
 



What about the woman who died in the waiting room of the hospital, still waiting to be seen by the doctor after 12 hours? What's the excuse for those cretins?


How about you link that incident so I can give you an informed response, given the lack of context provided in your question?


Where's my cure for MS? Do you have my cure? Does the doctor have my cure? Why am I still here, waiting and waiting and waiting while the MS Society raises millions of dollars for research, and no cure yet. Oh, they are working, yes, but in the meantime, what should I do?


Live life while you got it. Praying for a miracle sure ain't gonna get the miracle done.


How about the millions of people misdiagnosed? What about that? What about people who have died because the doctor didn't treat them right? What about the people who have died on the operating table in routine surgery?


You got me. I have no answer for you. In fact, we'll just let the religious types pray all over the place and not get a damned thing done. Those kids who die without ever getting medical attention because faith is the all-powerful and omni-applicable miracle drug? Screw 'em. If they die, it's because they deserved it. Praise Jesus!

The mistakes of science do not excuse the mistakes of religion. While we work on ours, you work on yours. And when we're finished working on ours, we'll eliminate yours. Science will shove religion off the wheel and steer us to a safe landing. Because that's what science is for. Giving us answers when our blindfold fails to make the problem go away.



posted on Nov, 16 2013 @ 09:41 AM
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reply to post by WarminIndy
 



Then what's wrong with why he waited?


Did you not read my first post? Go back and read it.





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