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The Cash-Landrum suppressed government file

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posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 03:44 PM
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Just published online, a 36 page PDF from the Texas Department of Health’s Bureau of Radiation Control file on their investigation of site radioactivity in Cash-Landrum UFO case of 1980.

The file contains the report of a field investigation by TDH agents, the results of their geiger counter tests and also the analysis of soil samples taken at the scene. While the results were discussed in the media, I'm unaware of any previous publication of the report itself, and certainly not of the raw files themselves.

There's an article giving background details and an index of the files at
Texas Department of Health file on the Cash-Landrum UFO case

To go directly to the files themselves, go to Cash-Landrum TDH file 36 page PDF


There's an excellent existing ATS thread on the case at An in-depth (re)view of the Cash/ Landrum case. But I felt that this news was worthy of a new thread.

The information in the files about the sighting location is fairly earth-shaking to the case. My attempts to contact the original investigators have failed, so I've chosen to disclose it publicly. This is a serious matter worthy of further investigation.




posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by CardDown
 


Oh dear , another one bites the dust ?
At best this taints a case that was thought to be solid , I mean I thought the Cash-Landrum UFO was a military test but if it turns out they made it up then Wow ....fooled me .
edit on 12-11-2013 by gortex because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 04:28 PM
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From the other thread:




Schuessler even went to the place in question and took pictures of the burned road


Where are those pictures?



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 05:50 PM
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Where are those pictures?


Exactly! I've scoured UFO literature and websites, collecting as many original magazines or copies of original newspapers ask can find. Zero. The closest thing is a photo of the reenactment by Unsolved Mysteries, but nothing of the real thing. All the real photos are long distance shots of the roadway. No close ups of the UFO-damaged pavement.

Also, John Schuessler's book has an appendix of 80 or so pages of photos and documents. Plenty of room there and the perfect place for such a photo, but again, zero.



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 06:23 PM
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CardDown

Where are those pictures?


Exactly! I've scoured UFO literature and websites, collecting as many original magazines or copies of original newspapers ask can find. Zero. The closest thing is a photo of the reenactment by Unsolved Mysteries, but nothing of the real thing. All the real photos are long distance shots of the roadway. No close ups of the UFO-damaged pavement.

Also, John Schuessler's book has an appendix of 80 or so pages of photos and documents. Plenty of room there and the perfect place for such a photo, but again, zero.



Is he still around? Maybe it'd be worth it to try to get him on here.



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 06:53 PM
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No big surprize there, governments will supress and hide any info they see as to their interest. We have been kept in the dark since long, long ago, and there are those who want to keep us there. One day there will be disclosure, and mankind will have their eyes opened as a whole. As the weak minded gains a foothold, let it not be for nothing....



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 07:04 PM
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Where is the evidence that this document was ever "suppressed"?



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 07:14 PM
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reply to post by JadeStar
 


Really??? I personally never got my fingers on it, and have no control of any of it. All I am saying is that like anything else or anywhere else(roswell maybe) We are kept in the dark by the very people we pay and trust (not really). I have seen things that "did not happen" from my superiors, I know information is supressed, but proof should be a two sided coin...



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 07:38 PM
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JadeStar
Where is the evidence that this document was ever "suppressed"?


You've got me there! I'll admit it makes a more powerful title."Suppressed" usually implies forcibly preventing release, but another definition is: "to withhold from circulation or publication".

In this case, these were pertinent documents that should have been included in the discussion of the case by the UFO researcher. Since it did not lend credibility to the case he ignored it in favor of other material. That kind of behavior is kosher for lawyers in court, but that's not how a scientific investigation is supposed to be run.



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 08:55 PM
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reply to post by CardDown
 


As a firm believer in alien UFOs, I also believe that we have craft derived from those craft. The triangles would be the modern version, but probably we've had several versions each better than the last.

I have two things to add to this discussion, but I don't intend to get caught up in a back-and-fort discussion of what I report or what others think. By fate or destiny, I seem to have been caught up in key aspects of the whole UFO business as my many post and some threads on ATS indicate. What I know about this case is trivial, but I'll throw it out here.

First, a family member of mine used to drive twice a week on the state road on which the event happened north of Houston. That state road is 1960.. He told me that asphalt road had a burnt spot as evidence where the craft landed. Since that road was on his bi-weekly route, he said that short section was soon resurfaced with fresh asphalt.

At some point after that event, Walt Andrus, the then head of MUFON was in Austin to discuss with our group the topic of UFOs in general. After his talk, I asked him about the Cash-Landrum case and what MUFON discovered about it. He said that they were told that the strange craft was from a secret project underway in the gulf from an aircraft carrier. And that explained why there were so many helicopters involved: they were carrier based. My understanding was that that point was one reason why the case was thrown out because the government proved that it could not have had that many 'copters in the air that night despite what the victims claimed. (Frankly, I don't think that they could have accurately counted over twenty 'copters buzzing around in the short period of time of the event given the circumstances and emotions.)

I'll add that I can't say that I necessarily believed Andrus' explanation. MUFON has always dragged its feet when it came to really wanting answers about UFOs. I battled with them when they refused to accept abduction case. Another time I did a lengthy report about an excellent sighting of two triangle-type craft that an ex-paratrooper and his son witnessed in southern Oklahoma. I sent my lengthy report to Andrus--I was not a member--and eventually had to query him about what had come of their investigation of the sighting. He sent me a scrawled post card with the short answer that they had checked with the local airport tower for that night and were told that "maneuvers were taking place," and as a consequence, they saw no need to follow up on my report??? I've found that MUFON has not been the org that it had set itself up to be. My personal conclusion is that more or less it has taken the place of Project Blue Book.



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 09:30 PM
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Bumpity 'cause CardDown ain't no fool. Hope I can read it tonight and get back, but I wiil be back even if it takes me a minute. Thanks, CD...Cash-Landrum deserves attention to detail.



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 09:35 PM
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CardDown
In this case, these were pertinent documents that should have been included in the discussion of the case by the UFO researcher. Since it did not lend credibility to the case he ignored it in favor of other material. That kind of behavior is kosher for lawyers in court, but that's not how a scientific investigation is supposed to be run.

THAT is the gist of the problem with "pop-ufology" researchers. They ignore data--such as high-strangeness accounts or even gubmint involvement--that doesn't fit their preconceived agenda: Stanton Friedman anyone, ahem?



posted on Nov, 12 2013 @ 10:36 PM
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Aliensun
reply to post by CardDown
 

At some point after that event, Walt Andrus, the then head of MUFON was in Austin to discuss with our group the topic of UFOs in general. After his talk, I asked him about the Cash-Landrum case and what MUFON discovered about it. He said that they were told that the strange craft was from a secret project underway in the gulf from an aircraft carrier. And that explained why there were so many helicopters involved: they were carrier based. My understanding was that that point was one reason why the case was thrown out because the government proved that it could not have had that many 'copters in the air that night despite what the victims claimed. (Frankly, I don't think that they could have accurately counted over twenty 'copters buzzing around in the short period of time of the event given the circumstances and emotions.)


Well - given the carrier connection - is it possible the helicopters involved were Sea Knights and not Chinooks?



posted on Nov, 13 2013 @ 04:00 AM
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Oh dear , another one bites the dust ?


I can't see anything in that report which proves that the witnesses were lying about what they saw. Can someone enlighten me as to why this case might now be suspect?



posted on Nov, 13 2013 @ 04:37 AM
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reply to post by Mogget
 





I can't see anything in that report which proves that the witnesses were lying about what they saw

I'm not saying it does hence the question mark but it does raise more questions about the claim , inconsistencies in the story regarding the location of the incident may be an indication that all is not well with the case .

I also find this troubling ...

Charles Russ Meyer began his TDH investigation by contacting Vickie Landrum on September 2, 1981. She gave him a brief description of events and suggested he contact John F. Schuessler, for further details. Meyer and two TDH associates met with Schuessler September 10th. Schuessler provided them with a detailed account of the events and the medical treatment given to Betty Cash.


John F. Schuessler seems to be a key player in the case acting almost like their agent , why did Vickie Landrum send the official investigation team to him for the full details when it was she that had the experience .

I have yet to read the files themselves but will try to later today although the article posted raises significant questions about the involvement of John F. Schuessler in my opinion .



posted on Nov, 13 2013 @ 07:50 AM
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gortex
John F. Schuessler seems to be a key player in the case acting almost like their agent , why did Vickie Landrum send the official investigation team to him for the full details when it was she that had the experience .


Excellent observation, gortex. Schuessler served a similar function when the DAIG investigated the case. Here's how John Schuessler characterized his relationship with the witnesses:


Schuessler soon became "a sort of rabbi" for the three friends. He obtained their medical records… "ANTI*MATTER" OMNI Magazine February 1982

(The rabbi comment was a quote from Schuessler himself.)

Schuessler's role in this case goes far beyond being an investigator, but his absence and inaction in key events is puzzling. He did not participate in the witnesses meeting with Air Force officials at Bergstrom AFB (and may have asked them not to mention his name). Most significant developments in the case were set in motion by someone other than Schuessler- members of CUFOS, FUFOR or the witnesses themselves. Schuessler's main role seems to have been to document the progress, liase with the press and report on it at UFO lectures.


Edited to add:
This new information does not reflect on the witnesses, just the investigator. Their truthfulness isa separate issue. What we may be looking at here is like P.T. Barnum finding a real unicorn...
edit on 13-11-2013 by CardDown because: addition
edit on 13-11-2013 by CardDown because: spelling



posted on Nov, 13 2013 @ 08:33 AM
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I've now read the PDF .
In 1981 John F. Schuessler says in one of the documents ...

Due to the late hour and the ladies emotional state they could not remember the exact location and could only state that they believed they saw the object on the straight portion of FR 1485 between the beer joint and some kind of highway warning sign

Yet in an interview with MUFON dated Nov 4 2000 he says ...

Second, we had the effects on the highway underneath it where the blacktop was actually melted to the point that the yellow line was actually swirled, the no-passing line. Third, we had burns on the trees on both sides of the road which would indicate the heating the people had.

But we have no pictures of this important evidence and there is no mention of it in the 1981 documents.

His account of the the helicopters in the MUFON interview differs from that of Vickie Landrum as well .

The helicopters weren’t there initially but they came in.....The object was there several minutes before the helicopters arrived.


Where as Landrum says in a telephone conversation with David Lacker of the Bureau of radiation control taken from the PDF.

She noted there were a number of helicopters flying around the area .there was a bright flash and fire began falling from the sky


I have a feeling that although the trio did see something that night the story has been embellished and blown up to be more than it was .
As a long time supporter of this incident my aim is not to just knock it down but find the truth and although I can't say for sure what happened I do suspect something is not right with this case .

MUFON interview with John F. Schuessler

Although only a small mention was given I also found it interesting that this little birdie was sniffing around John F. Schuessler

we started getting leads from people like Bill Moore that this may have been a device that flew from Los Alamos to Ellington Field which didn’t pan out at all.


Bill Moore later became a controversial figure within UFOlogy due to his involvement with a group of intelligence contacts known as ‘The Aviary’.
en.wikipedia.org...

See what you've done to me The Gut .... I'm seeing spooks everywhere


National Institute for the Discovery of Science Science Advisory Board:
John Alexander, Ph.D.
Warren Burggren, Ph.D.
Douglas P. Ferraro, Ph.D.
Albert A. Harrison, Ph.D.
Edgar Mitchell, Ph.D.
Melvin Morse, M.D.
Martin Piltch, Ph.D.
Harold E. Puthoff, Ph.D.,
Chairman of the Board Theodore (Ted) Rockwell, D.Sc.
John F. Schuessler, M.S.
Jessica Utts, Ph.D.
Jacques Vallee, Ph.D.
Jim Whinnery, M.D., Ph.D
www.skinwalkerranch.org...


edit on 13-11-2013 by gortex because: edit to add



posted on Nov, 13 2013 @ 09:25 AM
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The issue that Klass had raised was that while claims were made about physiological effects on the witnesses, the obvious question of what was their medical condition and treatment history PRIOR to the event was never answered. Their medical records were never disclosed nor was any neutral medical investigator even given permission to read them privately to see if there was anything relevant to the post-incident medical issues.



posted on Nov, 13 2013 @ 11:02 AM
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reply to post by JimOberg
 


Phil Klass' files on the Cash-Landrum case can be obtained from the American Philosophical Society library. I've got a set and it shows a lot of backstage drama. Klass was asking valid questions about the case, but the correspondence shows that Schuessler was evasive and unwilling to share the medical information with anyone outside his circle. It wasn't just skeptics that were denied. He also shut out fellow UFO researchers such as his former colleague Dr. Niemtzow, and Jim and Coral Lorenzen of APRO, who had turned the case over to him.

The medical evidence is not the only information that was under lock and key. Due to Schuessler's virtual ownership of the case, almost all information on the events are limited just to what he presented. We don't know what he chose not to reveal. Evidence suggests that he only presented material that supported the UFO case and alleged government cover-up.



posted on Nov, 13 2013 @ 12:03 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 

WOW, great investigation by CardDown and gortex! And I LOVE this case. It's one of the few major cases I still attach to.

Something certainly stinks here and it deserves to be aired. I'm with gortex, though, in that I still tend to believe that the ladies and lad had a strange experience.

And CardDown's quote:


This new information does not reflect on the witnesses, just the investigator. Their truthfulness isa separate issue. What we may be looking at here is like P.T. Barnum finding a real unicorn...


I am willing, however, to let it go from my heart if much more is added to what has already been uncovered.

I'm proud to be a member of this fambly when I see folk dig, and question, and follow the evidence wherever it may lead. Kudos.



gortex: The Horror, The Horror, Them Birds!


edit on 13-11-2013 by The GUT because: (no reason given)





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