Why God Exist!!!?

a reply to: bastion

Why do you assume it has to be a person creating it?...you need proof to back up that claim

Like I said, design, that is meaningful design with purpose requires intelligence.

A "something" can't posses intelligence let alone wisdom, but an Entity can.

A "something" can't project directed and controlled power but an Entity can.

Just these two logic alone is more than enough proof that God Exists.

Anything else you come up with will be the opposite of logic.

Try if you may, you'll just struggle explaining it because ONLY an Entity, a "person" posses the ability to transform Energy into matter.

That is, if we're capable of creating new materials from a photon beam in a LHC, what other logical explanation can you come up with as to how the Singularity was formed?

Densest material ever created announced at LHC Read more at www.zmescience.com...

The Large Hadron Collider (LHC) continues on its quest to find out exactly what happened in the first seconds after the Big Bang, unveiling what is the densest material known so far to man.
Read more at www.zmescience.com...

www.zmescience.com...#!OWHmH

originally posted by: edmc^2

To all unbelievers, here's a simple yet profound question that merits an honest answer.

That is:

Should not the existence of "something" uncreated and infinite proves the existence of "someone" uncreated and infinite - God?

At first my answer was a simple, "No". Then, at second and third glance, your question makes about as much sense as it's supposed to and that you're likely used to experiencing.

originally posted by: gusdynamite

originally posted by: edmc^2

To all unbelievers, here's a simple yet profound question that merits an honest answer.

That is:

Should not the existence of "something" uncreated and infinite proves the existence of "someone" uncreated and infinite - God?

At first my answer was a simple, "No". Then, at second and third glance, your question makes about as much sense as it's supposed to and that you're likely used to experiencing.

Care to elaborate?

a reply to: edmc^2

If it helps - absolutely, yes. I could probably have figured out what your question meant, but the language wasn't enough for me to distinguish your exact meaning.

If you could put it in a simpler form, I'm sure my slow mind would be better able to make sense of it an answer it. I feel as though you asked people who don't believe in a god or creator why they didn't and how they couldn't, in the face of what you likely consider to be proof?

If I got it right, let me know.

a reply to: edmc^2
I dont know this is just a guess but, maybe space-time is what god is or maybe just a part of what god is.

Peace.

originally posted by: gusdynamite
a reply to: edmc^2

If it helps - absolutely, yes. I could probably have figured out what your question meant, but the language wasn't enough for me to distinguish your exact meaning.

If you could put it in a simpler form, I'm sure my slow mind would be better able to make sense of it an answer it. I feel as though you asked people who don't believe in a god or creator why they didn't and how they couldn't, in the face of what you likely consider to be proof?

If I got it right, let me know.

Yes you got it right gusdynamite.

In other words, my question is simply to show the obvious. That if/since Space-Time is infinite therefore it has no beginning and no end, hence always existing. But if such a "thing" is even possible - a reality, then why not an Always Existing Entity with the power and ability to transform Energy into matter - the Universe hence us - living things?

After all, isn't a fact that life can only come from life?

Thus an always existing Life will be and IS the source of life.

Hence "Out of someone eternal comes something - the material universe".

a reply to: edmc^2

I would say then, my answer is I think my mind is incapable of comprehending the existence of a supreme being. I like the idea of it and I lean in that direction, but I also don't discount there is no creator.

There's no proof one way or the other and when I see threads like yours I wonder why someone hasn't yet realised it's futile to bother with the question in the first place. I understand that it's your field of interest and I assume you have faith that whatever you believe the creator to be does exist and I respect that. It might not have been evident after the tone I took in my initial reply.

I never-the-less still think the question is pointless and bound to only cause friction. Even if there were proof - imagine that - everyone would probably all still bicker and fight over what kind of creator it is, the story and history etc.

originally posted by: Lichter daraus
a reply to: edmc^2
I dont know this is just a guess but, maybe space-time is what god is or maybe just a part of what god is.

Peace.

Actually, if you're familiar with the Scriptures - God himself says that He is beyond Space-Time. In other words, He transcends these "things".

To put it in a very simple term, the Creator/ Maker is greater than the materials from which he creates "things" - living as well as non-living.

originally posted by: gusdynamite
a reply to: edmc^2

I would say then, my answer is I think my mind is incapable of comprehending the existence of a supreme being. I like the idea of it and I learn in that direction, but I also don't discount there is no creator.

There's no proof one way or the other and when I see threads like yours I wonder why someone hasn't yet realised it's futile to bother with the question in the first place. I understand that it's your field of interest and I assume you have faith that whatever you believe the creator to be does exist and I respect that. It might not have been evident after the tone I took in my initial reply.

I never-the-less still think the question is pointless and bound to only cause friction. Even if there were proof - imagine that - everyone would probably all still bicker and fight over what kind of creator it is, the story and history etc.

Yes, I thought of that too? That it's pointless to ask such a question.

But the reality, it's NOT because it's a valid question that deserves an answer.

In fact it's one of the fundamental questions that needs answering. I mean why spend billions and billions of $$ and man power and countless research to find out where we came from?

If it's pointless, then why do the researched?

It is not NOT because basic to understanding the origin of life or for that matter the universe is the understanding of where it came from.

Knowing the answer to this basic question will shape ones view of life for better or for worse.

But most of all, understanding and knowing where all of these came from, one can gain understanding as to WHY they exists!

In other words, they didn't just happen to be, but were intentionally and purposefully created.


Hence, then 2nd basic question is what's the purpose of all of these?

a reply to: edmc^2

I wonder if the answer to the second question of why life exists might be just to experience it. I see a higher purpose in that simplicity.

originally posted by: gusdynamite
a reply to: edmc^2

I wonder if the answer to the second question of why life exists might be just to experience it. I see a higher purpose in that simplicity.

Simplicity is the best!

To quote Einstein:

Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler.

Put it in a Father and child relationship - what's the most loving gift that you can give to your son or daughter?

If you know the simplest answer to this question then my friend, you might have an idea of the purpose.

a reply to: edmc^2
Very true. I think the concept that we are accidents and are all alone in existence is just too utterly terrifying for many of us that it's not an option. It must be an option if we are to take all others seriously.

originally posted by: gusdynamite
a reply to: edmc^2
Very true. I think the concept that we are accidents and are all alone in existence is just too utterly terrifying for many of us that it's not an option. It must be an option if we are to take all others seriously.

Agree, " utterly terrifying" to contemplate "that we are accidents and are all alone in existence" because left on own devices, we will destroy ourselves - there's no doubt about it.

Thus the Creator has to eventually "step in" to put a stop to this madness.

Hence the "divine plan".

Question is - why so long? What's the point of prolonging the madness if there's indeed a plan.

A wise man once said:

"Wisdom is proven by its works". When the time is right then it will be realize.

But the thing to remember is He is in full control. Now it's up to you to trust Him. Or as they say have "faith" in Him.

Otherwise, we're just but a mere spec of dust in the infinite space - here today and forever gone tomorrow. An accidental product of mindless chance event with the tendency to self destruct.

Sad case if that's the reality.

ciao

a reply to: edmc^2

Where we differ - aside from that I am agnostic - is that if a creator exists, shouldn't it's useless ass have stepped in a while back?

Edit: I don't believe a creator should or ever will 'step in' unless it's a just creator and not the source of everything.

a reply to: edmc^2

Well, like I said it was a guess but thanks for giving me something interesting to look into and read about


Peace.

originally posted by: gusdynamite
a reply to: edmc^2

Where we differ - aside from that I am agnostic - is that if a creator exists, shouldn't it's useless ass have stepped in a while back?

Edit: I don't believe a creator should or ever will 'step in' unless it's a just creator and not the source of everything.

Most definitely we differ but it's understandable because of your agnosticism and I would add your lack of understanding about the matter.

That is, besides the observable, there's also the written message from Him - the Scriptures where it contains His thoughts and plans for the future. In fact it contains what He has been doing since the beginning and what's He's about to do in the very near future. All of it according to His timeline!

In fact He's been active, even at this very second.

Consider the principle of entropy, that is the tendency for all things to decay. In other words the second law of thermodynamics states that when things are left alone they tend to break down.

This is true of anything, except when it comes to the Universe. That is, why does this law doesn't seem to apply?

Why is the Universe in such high state of order from the very beginning?

If nothing or noone is keeping it in check, shouldn't it not be in chaos by now?

But it's not . It's steady as she goes.

Exactly what Astrophysicist Alan Lightman and people like him had observed and noted that they:

“find it mysterious that the universe was created in such a highly ordered condition.”

One logical conclusion - Someone is behind it - controlling it day in day out.

That's just one, but there's million more things He does, unseen to mankind - especially to people who have no faith. They don't see it nor experience it.

a reply to: edmc^2

I understand the matter as best as anyone can at their respective age, who has given the subject any thought. Christianity and the common religions don't have an exclusive insight into the afterlife any more than a crazy hobo yelling on the street - I might even be better convinced by the hobo.

I think when discussing the subject matter and applying the principle of decay in any form is far too narrow - as is almost any theory or principle.

Like I have mentioned previously, I truly don't think it's for us to know. We can make up all the theories and stories we like, but at the end of the day that's all they are.

We simply do not know if a creator or source of all things exists. I hope it does and I tend to think it makes sense to my mind, but that doesn't mean diddly. I love the discussion, but I think so not to appear as just another arrogant know it all it needs to be said that we just have no idea.

a reply to: gusdynamite

I think when discussing the subject matter and applying the principle of decay in any form is far too narrow - as is almost any theory or principle.

I think I'll create another thread based on this subject (decay) because it also touches on the subject of proving the existence of God.

Who knows we might learn something new that we haven't thought of before.

After all like you said - no one has exclusive insight of the whole thing - 'xept God of course.

ciao..

a reply to: edmc^2

It'll be a great thread to read through. Don't forget to include the prospect of god not existing, though.

As frightening as it is to some of us.

originally posted by: gusdynamite
a reply to: edmc^2

It'll be a great thread to read through. Don't forget to include the prospect of god not existing, though.

As frightening as it is to some of us.

Sure, as long as we don't sacrifice common sense and logic in exchange of pre-concieved ideas or crimes committed by man. It'll be an interesting topic. But in the meantime, there's more talk about the existence of God - based on the existence of Time and Space or vice-versa.

Taken at its face value, if Space-time is not infinite and that it had a beginning then we're still at the starting point of when did it began and who or what started it? In other word's we're just kicking the "space_time continuum can" to the next stage. On and on this will go.

Hence, the only logical and commonsensical thing to do is to face the facts, that the other or I should say the ONLY alternative is to ACCEPT that space_time continuum had no beginning and no end. That it always existed.

Hence, if such THING is possible, and it is, what would prevent us from logically concluding that an always existing Entity - God - exists?

I'd say none other than closing our mind from it.

Of course if we close our mind from it then we have this question to answer.

That is, why is Space_Time_Continuum then INFINITE?

Why is it always existing?

And how - without SELF AWARENESS can IT create a highly organized Universe?

How can IT create the PARAMETERS from which the Universe is was based on?

In other words, how could a "thing" have consciousness?