New 13-billion-dollar, next gen U.S. carrier christened

Washington (AFP) - The American navy christened the first of its next generation of aircraft carriers, a multi-billion-dollar vessel hailed as the most technologically advanced warship ever built.

The USS Gerald R. Ford, which has been plagued by huge cost overruns at a time of growing budget pressures, is due to begin service in 2016.

Yahoo
BBC

Now, what I'd like someone to elaborate on is the supposed "EMP" tech people are always bandying about. If this electronics disabling EMP stuff is legit, why bother with all this fangled, expensive technological wizz-bang gadgetry — won't it all be disabled and useless in the event of a war and we'll all be reduced to musket charging trenches, anyway?

Or is the notion of an all nullifying electromagnetic device just the thing of The Matrix films and tin foil clad conspirators' wet dreams?

reply to post by iLemming


Because there are ways to shield against EMP. An EMP will damage a conventional non-shielded device. The military is well aware of the effects, and has been for a long time. They've spent years and lots of money researching various shielding options, from passive to active, and built them into their systems.

reply to post by iLemming


Man, I hope they don't cross those streams!

reply to post by iLemming


Muskets? Really? Because as far as I know modern guns do not depend on electronics. Just thought I'd point out . Just because they keep building ships does not mean we are going to war. I live in the city right next to Newport News where the ship was built and christened this past week. Newport News Ship Building is the biggest employers in the region. With base closings ( yes reducing the military) and staff reduction it doesn't seem to me that they think we are on the brink of war. So I just wonder why you put this in the WW III forum. It should be in some economics forum perhaps but WW III NO. They keep the economy in this region thriving.

It's great to see the US solving it's economic problems by investing in future wars.

I can't wait for the future !

AutumnWitch657
So I just wonder why you put this in the WW III forum.

Because, a) ATS doesn't exactly have a sub forum structure that canvasses the entire gamut of possible current affairs topics and subject matter, and b) because, although a new ship being built doesn't necessarily mean we're moving to Defcon 5, it does play a part as a deterrent to prospective antagonists.

Jobs / employment are the most pressing needs and concerns--yes. But, the primary objective of military investment is always the projection of power. Without which the U.S. would be nothing but another ailing economy being sent to the wall by dollar-a-day Chinese serfs.

reply to post by Ismail


Better than having all those people unemployed and all those companies that make parts for them bankrupt.

Ismail
It's great to see the US solving it's economic problems by investing in future wars.

I can't wait for the future !

Well, at least the future has a chance of staying Western and civilised if the likes of the U.S. aren't resting on their laurels. Because to think that the rising Asian nations aren't eyeing a bigger piece of the pie now that they're done making our plastic sporks and underwear, is a dangerous degree of obliviousness.

Zaphod58
Because there are ways to shield against EMP. An EMP will damage a conventional non-shielded device. The military is well aware of the effects, and has been for a long time. They've spent years and lots of money researching various shielding options, from passive to active, and built them into their systems.

What of this quote I found from a seemingly knowledgeable person:

Military electronic hardware, save for acceptable commercial-off-the-shelf (COTS) components, area built to specific interface standards like MIL-STD-464 (Electromagnetic Effects Requirements for Systems), MIL-STD-461 (Requirements for the Control of Electromagnetic Interference Characteristics of Subsystems and Equipment), and MIL-STD-2169 (Classified) (High Altitude Electromagnetic Pulse Environment). The latter is probably most pertinent to the question, and for obvious reasons unavailable to the public at large. However, the ugly truth about high altitude EMP is that no amount of shielding, save being buried deep under hundreds of feet of rock or dirt, is really adequate to protect sensitive microelectronics. By their nature, the electronics are delicate and sensitive to small levels of excess voltage, and it is nearly impossible to make a practicable sensor, communication system, or avionics control that has to interface with the outside world and yet is adequately isolated against large pulses.

reply to post by iLemming


And there is a lot in the black world that people would say is impossible. The reality is that in the 1960s, they detonated a high altitude nuclear weapon, that blew out 400 street lights and a phone junction in Hawaii, over 600 miles away, and yet the planes and ships directly underneath the EMP blast didn't even notice it. None of the planes crashed, none of the ships had to be towed in.

Zaphod58
reply to post by Ismail

 

Better than having all those people unemployed and all those companies that make parts for them bankrupt.

That wasn't ironic, was it ?
Please... It has to be ironic... Or are you actually suggesting that people dying on the other side of the world is better than some dudes getting layed off ?

Edit to add : jesus someone starred you ?

Because in the real world it is easy to shield against EMP attacks.

Of course those that want America to get destroyed will have you believe that China and Russia are ready to launch destructive EMP attacks that will shutdown every piece of US military equipment in the world within a few seconds while not impacting any other country.

reply to post by Ismail


Who's dying on the other side of the world because of this carrier being built? No one. Carriers also serve a lot of good in humanitarian aid after disasters.

Getting rid of the military isn't going to suddenly make the world get along, and not building equipment isn't going to suddenly bring about world peace. It's the world we have, and we have to make the best of it. Until everyone around the world gives up their military, the world won't get along. And even then it probably still won't.

as a navy vet who served on the u.s.s. nimitz (cvn 68), 87-91, this very interesting. was wondering when the next generation of carriers was coming out. the only thing for me, though, is that i wish they would not name them with the names of CURRENT presidents. it reeks too much of ego and propaganda. sort of like the recent former dictator of turkmanistan who had almost every thing named after him or his family members. please keep the names to some one who was actually involved in the navy, or if a president, more of the founding fathers.

opethPA
Because in the real world it is easy to shield against EMP attacks.

Several potential adversaries have or can acquire the capability to attack the
United States with a high-altitude nuclear weapon-generated electromagnetic pulse
(EMP). A determined adversary can achieve an EMP attack capability without having a
high level of sophistication.
EMP is one of a small number of threats that can hold our society at risk of
catastrophic consequences. EMP will cover the wide geographic region within line of
sight to the nuclear weapon. It has the capability to produce significant damage to critical
infrastructures and thus to the very fabric of US society, as well as to the ability of the
United States and Western nations to project influence and military power.
The common element that can produce such an impact from EMP is primarily
electronics, so pervasive in all aspects of our society and military, coupled through
critical infrastructures. Our vulnerability is increasing daily as our use of and dependence
on electronics continues to grow. The impact of EMP is asymmetric in relation to
potential protagonists who are not as dependent on modern electronics.
The current vulnerability of our critical infrastructures can both invite and reward
attack if not corrected.

Commission To Assess The Threat to the U.S. from EMP Attack
Government Executive Report
Defense Tech
One Second After

reply to post by iLemming


And yet, in all the tests where EMPs were generated, with aircraft, and ships in the area not once did anything happen to any of them from the EMP. That includes Starfish Prime, which was the exact same kind of high altitude EMP burst you're talking about, H bomb tests in the Pacific, and all the desert tests, with aircraft flying overhead.

And strangely, as dangerous as EMP is supposed to be, all the ships and planes that were right next to these EMP bursts, kept functioning perfectly afterwards.

iLemming
Several potential adversaries have or can acquire the capability to attack the
United States with a high-altitude nuclear weapon-generated electromagnetic pulse
(EMP). A determined adversary can achieve an EMP attack capability without having a
high level of sophistication.

I don't disagree with any of that but as I said, in the real world..it's not hard to prep for an EMP and milspec resources that require protection have been built that way for a long time.

reply to post by Zaphod58


Building war machines is not the answer. The amount of theft these military industrial companies do at the top is outrageous.

We should be funding out future in education and streamlining our infrastrcutre. Every empire that takes this route fails and will fail.

iLemming
Now, what I'd like someone to elaborate on is the supposed "EMP" tech people are always bandying about. If this electronics disabling EMP stuff is legit, why bother with all this fangled, expensive technological wizz-bang gadgetry — won't it all be disabled and useless in the event of a war and we'll all be reduced to musket charging trenches, anyway?

Or is the notion of an all nullifying electromagnetic device just the thing of The Matrix films and tin foil clad conspirators' wet dreams?

because carriers and other advanced weapons are expendable in a full scale war, they exist to prevent invasion, to attack weaker enemies or to give an early advantage if we are attacked so there's enough time to ready other less advanced options on a larger scale for the long haul.

It's quoted somewhere in that report that the estimated cost of "hardening" civilian and infrastructure targets against EMP attacks on in the U.S. would cost $500 billion. I doubt such a number would even be posited if the threat weren't a legitimate one.

Taking out the American mainland would serve as even more effective a strike than any single military target ever could. The time and cost of repairing infrastructure would be such that it would render the U.S. a Third World nation for an indefinite duration.