My "it's complicated" has further complicated herself...agonising choice ahead...

reply to post by TrueBrit


Your choice; your drama. You've been used. It's an old story. I've been there, too. It's always the same. Guy loves girl. Girl is indifferent, but he's kind of handy, picks her up off the floor when she loses it, so she strings him along, gives him a little taste once in awhile when there's nothing better going on. And believe me, there IS better going on! But you're second string. The only time you get up to bat is when the star is sick. So you think this is your real chance, but it isn't. You're temporary. As soon as the star is well again, or she finds another one, you go back to the minor leagues. It's like using porn to get off. You're not the real thing. (And yeah: It sucks.)

So now you've decided to take a stand. "I will not go silently!" you proclaim indignantly! After all, you've helped her out lo these many times and she owes you! And here comes the drama, the heart-wrenching display, bringing tears to the eyes of the sympathetic. It's just so, so heart wrenchingly sad! She will not just be erased; she will be ERASED with a FLOURISH of bold italic underlined! Let THAT teach her a LESSON!

But what is she thinking? God, there he goes off the deep end. He's always thought he could tell me what to do, tell me who to hang out with. He thinks it's all about him and what he thinks of as his gracious ways. I shouldn't have done it. I just felt sorry for him. I was trying to be merciful. He's helped me out a couple of times so I was just being thankful, that's all. Feelings? Sure, like a brother. He wants "love" and it's just kind of a sick sweet syrup sticky to the touch. I want fire, and he just doesn't do it for me. I'm sorry. But now he's yelling at me? I really don't need this. Maybe I should call the cops.

I was just trying to think of some way of handling the issue differently than the traditional way, something with a little more class and a little less angst, something that would force her to take the initiative and investigate what the issues were.

Go ahead and get angry with me if you want, but you brought it up publicly. You can't expect every answer to be completely in tune with what you want to do anyway. Otherwise, why bother? We're not here to be co-dependents for you. I'm just suggesting you consider an alternative that might have more impact. But if the whole drama plays out like you envision, it won't be the last time.

reply to post by schuyler


I wasn't getting angry with you in replying as I did. I am merely trying to ensure that your understanding of the scenario is complete, and I thank you for your input thus far.

For five long years you held on to this relationship. I'm sure that you felt or even still feel that she will change and you will finally have a real and meaningful relationship with her. True Brit, please think about that for a minute. Five long years and she has had other men in her life. She never decided that you were all she ever needed or wanted. Love is blind. Love is not rational. She will not change. I only see you being hurt and dissapointed over and over and over again.

You deserve so much better than that my friend, not some part time roll in the hay with the pony tail chick who always chooses other men over you. The only reason your relationship has lasted this long is because you put up with her bull. I sense that deep down inside you know this is true, you know you deserve better. It hurts, hell yeah, and it will for some time, but in the long run wouldn't it be wonderful to have someone love you, not use you, but truly love and appreciate you for who you are?????

You seem like a nice guy True Brit. You deserve a nice woman and you will find her, but only when the other one is out of the picture.

Truebrit may I ask some questions?

What is the age gap between both of you?
How long ago, in your friendly relationship, was it intimate?
Who in this relationship has the better deal?
What are the odds that, this woman has chosen the worst possible type of human to associate with and you knowing his background?
I'm only asking because your answers may help you.

To contemplate giving this woman an ultimatum is in some way controlling on your part, bare with me please.
With your help, advice and energies that you have devoted to her in the past 5 years, shows that you feel she owes you some kind of loyalty. You say you are the longest she has stuck around with. Is that some kind of medal you're wearing?
You don't need to give her this ultimatum, you have done your best in this relationship you have with her.
You must make the decision to walk away now and let her control her future without you to guide her.
Sometimes we have to let go and go through the grieving process of losing that special part of our lives. And you will grieve because of your nature of being a nice guy.
She has already moved on and has made her decision.

We have the capacity to love many in our lifetime, we are always in love to start with, then it might go sour.
I say many times that a relationship is just a try out with another human and with all the oddities that go with it, might work might not. This includes just friendships too.

Can you fill in some gaps? Does she use her male friends for financial as well as for more ephemeral support? Does she have any friends with whom she is close, but not sexually involved? Does she have any female friends?

Her decision to associate with a noxious predator such as the one you describe because he's putting out monetarily does not speak well for her. Maybe she's charming, and maybe she has a full roster of pity-me stories to deploy-- most sociopaths do.

I might be jumping the gun, but she's not a free-spirit, she's a parasite.

Rid yourself of her the way you would a tapeworm and find the relationship you want and deserve.

Hardly complicated. You need a better paying job.

# 77

sussy
Truebrit may I ask some questions?

What is the age gap between both of you?

I am twenty eight years old, she turned twenty nine in August.

How long ago, in your friendly relationship, was it intimate?

If you mean sexually intimate, March of this year, but if you mean in the wider sense, we took a massive walk all over the borough at the end of summer, spend time together on a regular basis, hold hands when we walk, and so on.

Who in this relationship has the better deal?

My opinion on that is of very little value, because I am terrible at assessing my own worth. I can only say that our connection is one that I place a massive value on.

What are the odds that, this woman has chosen the worst possible type of human to associate with and you knowing his background?

I am not sure what you mean by this question.

I'm only asking because your answers may help you.

To contemplate giving this woman an ultimatum is in some way controlling on your part, bare with me please.
With your help, advice and energies that you have devoted to her in the past 5 years, shows that you feel she owes you some kind of loyalty. You say you are the longest she has stuck around with. Is that some kind of medal you're wearing?

I do not believe she owes me anything. If I had an issue with her loyalty, I would never have become involved in the first place, since I was never under any false impressions where that is concerned. And regarding me wearing the length of our connection like a badge or medal... hardly. I have no control over her what so ever, and I would not want any. Her freedom of spirit is that of a wild horse, or a soaring bird of some kind, and I would never wish to curtail that in any way.

You don't need to give her this ultimatum, you have done your best in this relationship you have with her.
You must make the decision to walk away now and let her control her future without you to guide her.
Sometimes we have to let go and go through the grieving process of losing that special part of our lives. And you will grieve because of your nature of being a nice guy.
She has already moved on and has made her decision.

There have been times, and situations in my life, where a certain level of stealthy withdrawal have been necessary. Discretion is indeed, the better part of valour in some circumstances. However, one cannot base a life on the ability to merely retreat into the shadows. I am so tired of stepping back, moving aside and generally shuffling off and letting people just get on with it, no matter the cost to myself. Been there, done that, had the t-shirt foisted upon me by an overzealous marketing manager, and frankly, its taking up closet space that I could be putting to better use.

Eidolon23
Can you fill in some gaps? Does she use her male friends for financial as well as for more ephemeral support?

She has never used me that way. In fact, even when we are out for an evening together she will not permit me to buy her a drink, preferring to purchase her own. As to how she rolls where other fellas are concerned, I do not know, but she has always said to me that she does not like to have things bought for her, because she does not want to owe anything to anyone. She is also pretty uncomfortable with receiving gifts on birthdays and Christmas, and only got comfortable with the idea that no matter her objections, I will insist on at least getting her a fresh rose on Valentines, in February this year.

Does she have any friends with whom she is close, but not sexually involved? Does she have any female friends?

Yes, and yes.

Her decision to associate with a noxious predator such as the one you describe because he's putting out monetarily does not speak well for her. Maybe she's charming, and maybe she has a full roster of pity-me stories to deploy-- most sociopaths do.

The money thing is one of the things that concerns me the most, because she has always been firmly against being "kept" if you understand my meaning. She has always preferred to get her own drinks, make her own way in the world, than to offer anyone any leverage over her what so ever, and although it took some getting used to (for a traditionalist, door opening, lay your jacket in a puddle type of fellow that I am), I learned to respect that. In terms of her psychopathology, I would not say that she is sociopathic. She may be bi-polar (that does run in her family a bit), but I would have recognised the markers of a sociopath. My father was very much that way, and I tend to spot them a mile off.

I might be jumping the gun, but she's not a free-spirit, she's a parasite.

Rid yourself of her the way you would a tapeworm and find the relationship you want and deserve.

She is no parasite. The only thing she has had from me, other than some utterly valueless trinkets (and when I say valueless, I mean costing bugger all, and having only sentimental value), is my care and attention for five years, and my company of course. If she had drained my pocket of its scant resources, and still demanded more, then maybe she would be classifiable in such terms. What she is however, is willful and stubborn, and when she is set on an idea, she will ensure it comes to pass. That is why I feel I have no choice but to do as you suggest and leave her to her own devices.

Simply put, I cannot be a part of her life, if she wants the bastard that has caused all this trouble, in it. She is unlikely to see reason, but I cannot just turn away and allow her to invent some toxic reason for that in her head. I must lay it out clearly, that although I love her, could... nay HAVE filled notepads and refill books with page after vomit inducing page of poetry in her name, and would do pretty much anything you could name just to see a smile on her face, this is something with which I cannot come to terms.

I appreciate the sentiment though Eidolon!
:p

reply to post by TrueBrit


Holy crap, dude, that's wicked rough.

My deepest sympathies and ardent wishes for a good outcome.

I'm thinking that your affections for her are blinding you from the truth. Or at the very least, making you not care. She's a bar-fly, a "free spirit" and now friends with a child predator because he helps take care of her. That's the wild card that changed the game. She's put herself in the position where anyone is better than her current new "friend". Seems like her "free-spirit" ways are starting to get the best of her. As if she wants to be that way only for the sake of it and, as a result, is starting to make some really bad decisions.

You posted that guy on another part of the internet, here, where it originally wasn't, thereby exposing him to a larger population. As a result, you made even more of a reason to disassociate yourself from her. By associating with her, you are also indirectly tied to him now because she is associating with both of you. Since he's a child predator/molester, that "guilt by association" thing is very bad for you. You seem like a nice guy, you don't need this sh*t.

Forget what you had in the past. It means nothing at this point because of what SHE chose to do. She didn't lie to you though. She told you she doesn't want a relationship and, judging by her actions, that's obvious. She's intentionally doing things to distance herself from good people. As if she's afraid of them. Cut the ties that bind by telling her that if she doesn't want to change, she'll never have anything good because all she's doing is attracting bad people.

Good luck man.

youtu.be...

I still say you deserve so much better. She is thinking of herself, what she wants, what she needs, what she thinks what she feels. What about YOU? It is crystal clear to me that she is not what will make you happy and content in the long run. You are still a young man and there are many woman who would appreciate and love you.

reply to post by Taupin Desciple


Thanks for the wishes of good luck. I have a nagging feeling that I shall have great need of them before the week is out. The act of severing this tie will not be the most difficult part of the process before me as I am sure you can appreciate. The part that concerns me comes later, when I will likely as not be beset by memories and reverie.

Night Star
I still say you deserve so much better. She is thinking of herself, what she wants, what she needs, what she thinks what she feels. What about YOU? It is crystal clear to me that she is not what will make you happy and content in the long run. You are still a young man and there are many woman who would appreciate and love you.

Heh... what about me? I still do not know why she ever laid eyes on me for more than a moment, nor why she invited me into her life. What I do know that amongst all the relationships I have ever had this has been the most honest, of the women I have known intimately, she is the only one who has never lied to me. I can see that from what I have written about this relationship, it would be easy to see me cast as a victim. I think that is probably because of how overshadowed this thread has been, by current events, and the way they have affected my outlook.

You have to understand, this woman, even taking into account the many times her actions have stung me, has shown me more respect than any I have ever been associated with to any significant degree. That she is not perfect has never been a problem for me, and indeed for me to have a problem with such a thing would make me a perfect hypocrite, for I am not without faults, not without failings. Perhaps I have merely had poor fortune with respect to the way I have formed my expectations of personal interactions? I know not. I can only judge by my own experience thus far.

What I do know, is that I cannot think of the future right now, because I have to deal with the present. And the present...the present is deeply unpleasant.

Complicated relationships never get easier, I'm sorry to say. You have spent 5 years actively pursuing this girl (or that is what I get from this, if I'm wrong, correct me), and have nothing to show for it. Seems to me that you are in the "friend with benefit zone". You might be fun to let off some sexual tension and frustration, but not for more. She won't see you as the alpha male, you will never be in that hot seat, and this can't end the way you are hoping it will.

You seem like a nice guy, and you seem to be following your heart instead of your head. While my much younger self would tell you not to give up and love conquers all and all that rubbish, the truth is, nice guys get hurt. They lose their spark and end up getting used as doormats.

I wouldn't abandon this poor girl if you can help it, as in the coming months and years she will need a good friend and confidant. I also wouldn't count on you and her riding off into the blissful romantic sunset. There will be no violins, no romantic word, no loving embrace. If you can just be her friend, then I'd do that. If you can't, it's time to say goodbye.

reply to post by TrueBrit

What I do know, is that I cannot think of the future right now, because I have to deal with the present. And the present...the present is deeply unpleasant.

Can't possibly be more unpleasant than being married for 34 years and having your spouse decide they don't want to be married anymore. Yeah, that's where I am at right now. We still live together though, easier financially for now. I'm not looking for another relationship. I doubt I'd ever trust again.

So yeah, you will be hurting no doubt about that and I am sorry you have to go through this. But...you are much younger than me and still have your whole life ahead of you. For you at least, there is hope, a light at the end of the tunnel. I only wish good things for you and a chance at a better life.

reply to post by Night Star


I am sorry to hear that Night Star. I cannot begin to imagine how you are feeling at this time. Really puts things in some perspective, thats for damned sure.

TrueBrit
reply to post by Night Star

 

I am sorry to hear that Night Star. I cannot begin to imagine how you are feeling at this time. Really puts things in some perspective, thats for damned sure.

I am not handling it well at all. How do you look at someone who has been your husband for 34 years as anything else but your husband??????

Too bad, we are an ocean apart, we could have a few drinks and complain and feel sad together. LOL I would probably ask you lots of questions just to keep you talking. There is nothing more awesome than listening to a british accent.

reply to post by Night Star


Heh, depends on the accent. Most of the people who live in Essex have a really annoying accent! However, I am good at drinking miserably

I dealt with the woman in question today. I wanted to meet with her face to face, but she wanted to know what was up when she called, so I just dealt with it on the phone. Shes blocked from everything. I left it that I would not be available to her until or unless this fellow is out of her life, and if she wants to know me in the future, she will have to come and find me in person when shes got her priorities straight.

reply to post by TrueBrit


That must have been very hard, but it feels good to do what's right, even when it hurts.

Be good to yourself. Reach out when you feel the absence, you've got friends who care for you.

reply to post by TrueBrit


Hang in there, TrueBrit!
I believe you have done the right thing for yourself, and possibly helped her see how serious a matter it is.
Be good to yourself! ((HUG)) You are stronger for this, it is clear to be seen, and I applaud you for your courage.

Hold fast, Son of the Storm...

peace to you,
AB

ps - every time I see you write something terribly self-depricating, I cringe!! are you a lesser soul?? hardly...
my bossiest most irrepressibly busy-body self (thank God she doesn't come out often) would like to tell you to Stop It...or...I dunno, some empty threat or other... but still...self-kindness on occasion won't turn you into an ego-maniac, TB... and I probably cringe because I do the same thing to myself... (yep, I'm a hypocrite *sigh*)