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Does Resurrected = Born Again?, and does one have to be Resurrected first, before one can receive th

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posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 09:56 PM
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akushla99
reply to post by EnochWasRight
 


"He MUST be removed before we can have all things revealed." Quote EnochWasRight

"Passion, like the rain, floods the house.
But if the roof is strong, there is shelter.
Whoever allows impure thoughts,
Suffers in this world and the next.
In both worlds he suffers
And how greatly
When he sees the wrong he has done" Quote EnochWas Right (via Dhammapada)

Thoughts creating worlds??..indeed provided with a proxy-torturer...

Å99
edit on 31-10-2013 by akushla99 because: (no reason given)


Satan must be removed. Yes.




posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 10:04 PM
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reply to post by Joecroft
 

It really doesn't get much clearer than this:

Ephesians 1

13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.

Now read above this passage.

With all wisdom and understanding, 9 he made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ, 10 to be put into effect when the times reach their fulfillment—to bring unity to all things in heaven and on earth under Christ.

I would like your summary of this, including the timing that is clearly listed here. What do you say of this? Doesn't it say, "Sealed with a promise?" When, then, does this happen?

"...when the times reach their fulfillment."
edit on 31-10-2013 by EnochWasRight because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 10:31 PM
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reply to post by Joecroft
 


Here is yet another way to see this.

Revelation 1:7

7 “Look, he is coming with the clouds,”
and “every eye will see him,
even those who pierced him”;
and all peoples on earth “will mourn because of him.”
So shall it be! Amen.
8 “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.”

How can those who pierced Christ be present when he returns? How will every eye see Him at the same time? There is only one answer. All 7 billion of us are here to see this event, even the first century leaders who pierced Christ. They will all see, every eye.

Let's consider the AMEN he does after So Shall it Be. AMN is AMEN, which is the word TRUE. Aleph Mem Nun, which translates, Aleph (Strength), Mem (Water) and Nun (Seed). The word TRUTH is Aeph Mem Tav, which is the first letter of Hebrew, the middle letter (mem) and the last letter. The alpha and omega listed in the last verse then shows you who Christ is. He is the beginning and end. In the middle, we have the waters of baptism.

Truth is literally, "The Strength of the Waters to Save." Tav is two crossed sticks, like the one Christ was crucified on.

Now, connect this to the coming wrath of the first century leaders listed below. How will they be baptized? By fire and the Holy Spirit. Is this a baptism you want, or is water preferable? What is the purpose of water? For one, it puts out fire. Baptism is the immersion of the soul into the waters of life for the purpose of rising to new life, or a process known as involution and evolution.

Matthew 3

7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: “You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. 9 And do not think you can say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. 10 The ax is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.

11 “I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with[c] the Holy Spirit and fire. 12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clear his threshing floor, gathering his wheat into the barn and burning up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”

Clearly, the resurrection is for one purpose. It is to resurrect the soul into the waters again over a period of time. Why? To refine the nature toward a Holy Spirit. The reason I am the only person on Earth saying this does not make it wrong. As a matter of fact, it may very well make it the only right answer. This is not some new Gospel. It is what was taught and understood until 545 AD when Justinian declared it to be heresy to believe what Origen the Christian Philosopher stated was the case.

LINK to Justinian and Origen

What reason would the Romans have for making sure people misunderstand the process of rebirth? They are attempting to keep the Spirit from waking within the person.

Luke 11:52

"Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering."

You misunderstand due to the fixed mindset of theology that has been duped into believing a lie. I refuse to take on the theology of another person. Instead, I listen to the Spirit's leading in my studies. What I have outlined matches scripture to the letter, going as far as the letters themselves. Even the words and letters state the same story. It is unmistakable if you look at the whole and not simply the parts by themselves.



edit on 31-10-2013 by EnochWasRight because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 11:05 PM
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reply to post by Joecroft
 


Since this thread concerns me, I will give the best answers I can.

Acts 1

1 In my former book, Theophilus, I wrote about all that Jesus began to do and to teach 2 until the day he was taken up to heaven, after giving instructions through the Holy Spirit to the apostles he had chosen. 3 After his suffering, he presented himself to them and gave many convincing proofs that he was alive. He appeared to them over a period of forty days and spoke about the kingdom of God. 4 On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. 5 For John baptized with[a] water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”

---When Jesus stated that he would rebuild the temple in three days, he was referring to three thousand years. Two have passed. The last day, as I have outlined, is the day of the lord, or last 1000 years of rest from Satan's influence. Seek Revelation 20 again for details.

6 Then they gathered around him and asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?”

---Remember, this is reference to the coming wrath I spoke about in the last post above. Israel was revived in 1948. Read Hosea 6:2 After two days he will revive us;
on the third day he will restore us,
that we may live in his presence.

Again, 1000 years is as a day to the Lord. This is the sign of Jonah. Three days in the belly of the fish.

7 He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.”

---I do agree that we will have the Spirit come on us in the last days. This is outlined clearly in Revelation and other places. We are indeed living in this end times. The stage is set, but we must see Christ return for those who are waiting.

9 After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.

10 They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. 11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”

---What are we still waiting for? His return, in the last days, when the signs of Matthew 24 occur. Again, when do we receive a Holy Spirit? When we are transformed in the twinkling of an eye. Are you still a sinner, lost in a world of deception? Yes. We are all waiting for the enemy to be removed and the captives set free.

I will keep you informed if I find more places to show the same story. Have I been consistent with scripture? Yes.



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 11:18 PM
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reply to post by Joecroft
 


In the next chapter, Acts 2, we have the story of the Spirit and the tongues. What was the conclusion to the event?

17 “‘In the last days, God says,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
your old men will dream dreams.
18 Even on my servants, both men and women,
I will pour out my Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
19 I will show wonders in the heavens above
and signs on the earth below,
blood and fire and billows of smoke.
20 The sun will be turned to darkness
and the moon to blood
before the coming of the great and glorious day of the Lord.
21 And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved.’

IN THE LAT DAYS. Again, who benefits? What about the souls that lived before Christ? Do they get this benefit? Take a commons sense approach. You MUST be born again. Resurrection is the process. All will be here to see Christ return, even those who pierced Christ (Revelation 1).

What did Paul say?

Acts 24

15 and I have the same hope in God as these men themselves have, that there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked. 16 So I strive always to keep my conscience clear before God and man.

He was in front of Felix, defending himself from the Sadducees for believe in what? The resurrection. He believed that BOTH the righteous and wicked would be raised to see the wicked judged. Again, when does this happen? 2 Days after the first century, leading into the biggest day (1000 years) of the entire Bible narrative. The day Christ returns and the DAY OF THE LORD.

End times are now. We are here. Will the Spirit be poured out? Yes. This is not a good thing if you lack living water. It is a baptism you do not want. If you have repented, it is a good thing. You will benefit from this:

Isaiah 26

19 But your dead will live, Lord;
their bodies will rise—
let those who dwell in the dust
wake up and shout for joy—
your dew is like the dew of the morning;
the earth will give birth to her dead.
20 Go, my people, enter your rooms
and shut the doors behind you;
hide yourselves for a little while
until his wrath has passed by.
21 See, the Lord is coming out of his dwelling
to punish the people of the earth for their sins.
The earth will disclose the blood shed on it;
the earth will conceal its slain no longer.

I hope and pray that I can go to a room to rest while the wrath passes by. Baptism is the flood and Christ is the Ark. We are the beasts riding the raging waters of the Jordan. We are repenting, getting rid of the selfishness of the beast. What was sacrificed in the temple? What is the body? What is the veil over the temple?

What is the Beast?

2 Timothy 3

3 But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. 2 People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3 without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, 4 treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God— 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with such people.

18 items marking selfishness and the animal nature of man. 6+6+6. What are we to sacrifice and what do we overcome? The beast. What is the mark of mankind?

Revelation 13

18 This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man.[e-or of mankind] That number is 666.

Carbon has 6 protons, 6 electrons and 6 neutrons. Life is carbon based and man's mark is the sixth element. We are the beast to overcome. It is each of us individually. Selfishness is this mark.

Why are we resurrected and why are we baptized into the waters of life? To rise to new life the next time. Eventually, the Spirit allows us to be born above. We need seed for this to happen. Fruit comes from repentance. Where is the seed?

You won't hear this from the average Christian. You will get it here on ATS because we are here to deny ignorance.


edit on 31-10-2013 by EnochWasRight because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 11:31 PM
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reply to post by Joecroft
 


My last post for now. Take a hard look at what it will mean to have a Holy Spirit. Then, read acts chapter 4 and 11. What is the difference between having a Holy Spirit and being filled with THE Holy Spirit? When we align ourselves with God, we can be filled with the Spirit of God. Sin separates us. This is a pendulum that swings for all of us each day. At times, we are filled. At times, we sin. Can we avoid sin now? No. Only one soul has ever lived that has the Holy Spirit as a state of being. This is why salvation MUST come from Him. We cannot do this, yet we can be filled with the Spirit. Having this Spirit as a permanent possession requires that we become the host of the Spirit. Think of what it means that God is the Lord of Hosts. What is a possession? What does it mean to be possessed as the host of the Spirit that dwells within?

Before this can happen on a global scale, God must be all in all. When does this happen?

1 Corinthians 15

20 But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For he “has put everything under his feet.”[c] Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28 When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

It must come from the process. The Day of the Lord is the day we receive His presence among mankind.

There is a document from the Dead Sea Scrolls that explains all of this in very clear language.

Eyes Wide Open


edit on 31-10-2013 by EnochWasRight because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 11:55 PM
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EnochWasRight

akushla99
reply to post by EnochWasRight
 


"He MUST be removed before we can have all things revealed." Quote EnochWasRight

"Passion, like the rain, floods the house.
But if the roof is strong, there is shelter.
Whoever allows impure thoughts,
Suffers in this world and the next.
In both worlds he suffers
And how greatly
When he sees the wrong he has done" Quote EnochWas Right (via Dhammapada)

Thoughts creating worlds??..indeed provided with a proxy-torturer...

Å99
edit on 31-10-2013 by akushla99 because: (no reason given)


Satan must be removed. Yes.


From your heads...yes...
2nd line

Å99



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 12:13 AM
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reply to post by Joecroft
 


My opinion on the biblical steps of salvation:
1. Conviction of sin by the Holy Spirit
2. Repentance change of mind and actions
3. Salvation from the penalty of sin
4. Baptism passing from old to new life
4. Sanctification set apart for God
5. Death and resurection

We are set free by the power of Christ's work on the cross to break the power of sin in ones life. If one is constantly being tormened by the power of sin in ones life and there is not the evidence of the fruit of repentance then the conversion was most likly on a mental level rather than a spiritual level.



edit on 1-11-2013 by guitarplayer because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 04:32 PM
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reply to post by Rex282
 





Originally posted by Rex
Joe
Yahoshua never said anyone had a new birth.He said you must be born from above or on high and to enter into the Kingdom Of God which is a realm not a place.It is called the Kingdom of heaven when God is living in "Gods heavens" those "heavens" are mankind.None of this has happened fully.


Yes, there are higher spiritual kingdoms i.e. many mansions etc… but Jesus said in his famous Lords prayer…



“Thy Kingdom come, on Earth!
As it is in Heaven!”


Which draws a clear parallel between how Earth, could become like Heaven. And the reason this is so, is because the Kingdom of Heaven is within you, Which IMO means to come to know who your Father is, and what you are spiritually. The Holy Spirit lets you know both of these things.

This is why the word “see” in the verse John 3:3 should be more accurately translated as, “knowing”, “perceiving” and “understanding” what the Kingdom of Heaven is, and that your in it now. And this can be realized when one receives the Holy Spirit.

Please understand, this does not mean, that your not going to be resurrected into a Heavenly Kingdom (non Fallen World IMO) as well etc…, because one aspect (the Kingdom within) does not cancel out the other, in fact, they both compliment each other IMO.



Originally posted by Rex
In essence what Yahoshua said was when the seed is sown in the good soil and grows to a good tree it produces good fruit.THEN and only then what Yahoshua preached could be understood.They could not understand the parable of the seed(which essentialy was about them) or ANY parable UNTIL the seed was sown and the tree grew and produced good fruit.That is salvation which is a process not an event.The disciples are the first fruits.They had first hand experince of the process.


Yes, I totally agree, Salvation is an ongoing walk with God, and this is exactly what I was saying to Enochwasright, on that other thread, that I linked in my OP.



Originally posted by Rex
Again these are all analogys(parables) because the "real" process can't be undertsood.Yahoshua and John says those that "sin" are "of" their father the devil.Not some relgious sillness about an evil spirit"tempting" them to be bad.Again a metaphor/allegory in relation to the parable of the seeds 3 infertile soils that can't produce a good tree and good fruit.


Well, I agree with you, those were metaphors/allegories, which were really about following our own inner negative egos and selfish ways etc…



Originally posted by Rex
The problem is religion has created a theory(doctrine) based on a very faulty premise and the extrapolations have gone wild.The reality we can percieve should be very obvious.NO ONE is perfected therefore everyone is imperfect (sinful).The fact is there is NOTHING anyone can do (works) to cause this process to happen or acclerate.All the religious conjecture of being born again and sin free but NOT blah blah is all double talk from double minded carnal minds.


You seem like your have a lot of truth in you, and Yes, the “extrapolations have gone wild”, again your absolutely correct, but shouldn’t you be directing this towards Enochwasright’s posts…?

- JC



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 07:06 PM
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EnochWasRight
reply to post by Joecroft

[EnochWasright
At times, we sin. Can we avoid sin now? No. Only one soul has ever lived that has the Holy Spirit as a state of being. This is why salvation MUST come from Him. We cannot do this, yet we can be filled with the Spirit. Having this Spirit as a permanent possession requires that we become the host of the Spirit. Think of what it means that God is the Lord of Hosts. What is a possession? What does it mean to be possessed as the host of the Spirit that dwells within?


This prediliction for SINFULLNESS is too overwhelming. Its an 80lb sack of grain on my back thats going to cause me to loose my balance and fall into the abyss (deep yellow). What is with this obsession of yours? The Temple Order taught that there are three godhead aspects, that of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, different manifestations of the ONE within the SAME dimension. There is no spirit without the other 2 functioning, and these others are what give us our individuality. This is not about 'scripture' its about unity, all things that exist within our consciousness. Jesus was a fully 9 dimensional evolved (Essene) being that accepted the notion swat team style to come down into this frequency to help the human by introducing Light=love=information. I call these introductions overlays or injections. What lifts the planet vibriation; "creative impulse" it decends from the "one/absolutum" assends, then desends like a snowflake becoming hail and over and over gains insight until a manifestation occurs (lifeforms).


EnochWasRight
Before this can happen on a global scale, God must be all in all. When does this happen? It must come from the process. The Day of the Lord is the day we receive His presence among mankind.


Who cares about global scale; the earth will take care of all that, (shes in charge you know). What makes you think God is not already within us, that was Jesus's major teaching without the benefit of scripture HE NEGLECTED OR FORGOT TO WRITE. What is what process, there is no instantaneous cartoon noise "BOINK, PLOP, BOING" scheduled (at least as far as Ive been told). Lets look at the otherworldliness of Jesus and these proclimations, "Before Abraham I was, I am", "Oh father,, glorify Thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with Thee before the world was" "Thou lovest me before the creation of the world".



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 07:21 PM
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reply to post by Joecroft
 


Not to stray off topic, but there should be new catagory within ATS 'FRT' "Scripture Wars" and one can ONLY battle it out using such; as in NO MEANDERING or personal imput; the scripture says it all. The penalty for your biased imput is you get the giant left hand stage hook or the trapdoor underfoot releases onto a loose bed of goose down and duck feathers. Id actually be very good at this type of wordage warfare; my secret weapon? I use the bible as an Oracle (question? flip pages automatically stop on the answer), and IT HAS NEVER BEEN WRONG, so far. Great hidden mystery/magick in the Bible.
edit on 1-11-2013 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 07:40 PM
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akushla99
EnochWasRight
akushla99
reply to post by EnochWasRight


EnochWasRight
He MUST be removed before we can have all things revealed."
"Passion, like the rain, floods the house.
But if the roof is strong, there is shelter.
Whoever allows impure thoughts,
Suffers in this world and the next.
In both worlds he suffers
And how greatly
When he sees the wrong he has done" Quote EnochWas Right (via Dhammapada)



Akushla99
Thoughts creating worlds??..indeed provided with a proxy-torturer..Satan must be removed. Yes.
From your heads...yes...
2nd lineÅ99


Not sure I quoted this right; however, dont you have to recognise Satan to banish/remove it? What if you neglected to give it a big wave hello at the local Starbucks, (knowing its evil intent to walk out on that Large Cappachino/cinnamon sprinkle, bearclaw and lemon bar bill). Maybe Id tackle it in the parking lot (but thats as far as Id go, just slow it down for the catholic cops to arrive). If one believes in satan, you will manifest it. Its interesting how fear is so awesome as in IT CAN CREATE.
edit on 1-11-2013 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 08:15 PM
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TextDoes Resurrected = Born Again?, and does one have to be Resurrected first, before one can receive the Holy Spirit?
reply to post by Joecroft
 


No.

The following is what I have been taught and does not mean to say that all Christians believe as I was taught. There are hundreds of Christian congregations with many different beliefs as well as over fifty prominent bibles in the Christian circles today. I nor anyone can know all of these differences in theology so my answer of No is based upon my own belief and may not be your belief.

We are aware of two creations of substance. The first creation is celestial. The second creation is terrestrial. There may be more but these two are the creations that we are aware of. The human is created in both celestial and terrestrial substance. The celestial substance is everlasting while the terrestrial substance is impermanent. A celestial creation that is not corrupt will have no terrestrial substance intermixed while a terrestrial creation is always corrupt and is always impermanent.

Resurrection can only apply to the celestial creation and not to the terrestrial creation. Resurrection occurs when the celestial and terrestrial substance of the human soul is separated and becomes as the celestial creation. In a resurrection of a human soul the terrestrial body (image) covering a celestial spirit (likeness) will lose the terrestrial body and gain a celestial body. It then becomes as a pure celestial creation. An example of this is that angels are a celestial creation and as a righteous soul dies it then becomes as the angels (Mark 12:25).

When a living human soul receives the Holy Spirit that means that the celestial portion of a person (spirit) is infilled with the celestial likeness of the Creator. In other words the two are joined in knowledge and love.

As a soul dies its image of flesh and blood will perish and return to the corruption of this terrestrial creation while the righteous spirit will then be tried and judged as a naked (unclothed) spirit. It then is given its new name and garment (celestial covering) and allowed into the New Jerusalem to eat and drink of the food and water of life. That is called resurrection (Re Birth). The unrighteous spirit of a soul will remain unclothed (naked) in the underworld of Sheol where hell is located. There are some Jews (and perhaps some Christians) who teach that an unrighteous spirit can be purged of sin in purgatory for one year and then allowed to join the other righteous spirits in New Jerusalem. Naturally this is all theology.



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 08:34 PM
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Thanks for your thoughtful response Joe.

To address what you said(and more!!). What is called the "lords prayer " is not a prayer.Yahoshua was not telling the disciples what or how to pray but proclaiming what prayer is.It follows along with everything Yahoshua said and did as proclamations not formulas or methods of religion.

What Yahoshua proclaimed was the Kingdom of God had(has) come "into" the earth...Yahoshua (God is salvation) was that kingdom of God in the heavens "in" the earth as THE seed.Yahoshua is in all the heavens above ALL heavens.

Again it is the same problem of religion-religion.The doctrines of men have "extrapolated" what Yahoshua (and the apostles ) said and wrote and made doctrines of men out of them that mean nothing of what was said or wrote.Yahoshua accurately said this is what had happened (OT)and will continue to happen(NT).

To be born on high is to be born (enter) into the The Kingdom of God heavens.The fact is no one has been born yet except Yahoshua (the ONLY begotten/born Son of God) into the Kingdom of God.It is not a "place" at all.Yes some (few) are entering in "deeper"however it is only as Paul says... the earnest of the spirit(life)...the beginning...conception and growth.Those are allegorical of the fetus stage of growth where as the majority of mankind are still eggs(soils) or embryos.No one has been birthed yet.

The religious concept of God is completely out of whack with God because it is all ME,ME ME,MINE,MINE,MINE,I,I,I....
If there is a God (and there is) God is doing EVERYTHING.To even presume the slightest variation of that is to be deceived and eventually (very quickly) always leads to complete deception of making God in the image of man(themselves)...that conforms to "their" beliefs .

Gods purpose in this age is to strip us naked of ALL of our beliefs however those beliefs do serve a purpose.To prove by experience how wrong they were! To destroy the religion in us so we can grow.No one can ever perceive truth unless they have experienced the opposite.That is the only purpose for religion (belief) of any kind.The ultimate purpose is to know.To know is to not doubt or...BELIEVE! Belief is the antithesis of knowing...however it is absolutely necessary to have faith first then know.

If you notice Yahoshua never says he believes in the father he always says he knows the father and the father knows him...with everyone else it requires faith to "approach" God...then when belief is destroyed at the wide gate of destruction that MANY (all) enter into .... it leads to the narrow path and the narrow gate to the infinite green pasture field..the Kingdom of God in the heavens....to know/commune with God.

It is God who is causing it ALL to happen.God is sovereign he isn't leaving clues and codes of religion for man to figure out and follow to "know" him.The "many" think they have decoded the mystery yet they still believe many,many things (doctrines of men) in complete contradiction to that very simple concept...God is sovereign and mankind isn't.

Is it really that simple... yes and ...NO...it is infinitely complex in it's function.God has no need and it serves no purpose to explain it all (or even any of it). When you know you know what you need to know(by revelation from the father) no more or less...be content with what you have and know and more will be given...search on your own and you'll never find it because it can't be found because it isn't lost!

The kingdom of God is not over there(in mysticism) or over here (in religion-religion) it COMES WITHOUT observation... it is in your midst.Yes the Kingdom of God is "within" our midst.A embryo is ALIVE because it was conceived by the "seed".THE SEED and egg become "one"(.the meaning of marriage).

The Pharisees ,Sadducee and scribes,gnostic's,lightbearers,kabbalist.Essene etc etc.. were "looking" for it and trying to "qualify it by a measure of religion or mysticism ....all those will ever be is false belief.

The bottom line is God is perfectly capable of causing EVERYONE to enter into the Kingdom of Gods heavens.All the "works" of mans hands and mind of religion,mysticism,philosophy,psychology etc etc...are futile.As Yahoshua said the flesh avails nothing,his words(the living word not "language" words) are spirit and life.One day (age) everyone who has ever existed will "know" this..and that's only the beginning.

As for who this is for.I am only writing in response to your OP.It isn't directed at you or anyone.However anyone who wants to read it can I'm not compelling anyone to believe or know it....A man only hears what he wants hear and disregards the rest.
edit on 1-11-2013 by Rex282 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 09:09 PM
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vethumanbeing
akushla99
EnochWasRight
akushla99
reply to post by EnochWasRight


EnochWasRight
He MUST be removed before we can have all things revealed."
"Passion, like the rain, floods the house.
But if the roof is strong, there is shelter.
Whoever allows impure thoughts,
Suffers in this world and the next.
In both worlds he suffers
And how greatly
When he sees the wrong he has done" Quote EnochWas Right (via Dhammapada)



Akushla99
Thoughts creating worlds??..indeed provided with a proxy-torturer..Satan must be removed. Yes.
From your heads...yes...
2nd lineÅ99


Not sure I quoted this right; however, dont you have to recognise Satan to banish/remove it? What if you neglected to give it a big wave hello at the local Starbucks, (knowing its evil intent to walk out on that Large Cappachino/cinnamon sprinkle, bearclaw and lemon bar bill). Maybe Id tackle it in the parking lot (but thats as far as Id go, just slow it down for the catholic cops to arrive). If one believes in satan, you will manifest it. Its interesting how fear is so awesome as in IT CAN CREATE.
edit on 1-11-2013 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)


You quoted it right VHB.

...and while you're in the parking lot wrestling the loose change out of Nicks sweaty man-purse, dangling the blighter from its ankles...I'm front-row seat with the hand-held camcorder...could not miss the youboob opp...

...'if One believes in satan, you will manifest it'...would be peachy...we are really talking about (at this mome in time) approx 2 billion dedicated mechanisms - tasked with seeking out the dossier profile in some grand Where in the World is Carmen Sandiego plot that's developed it's own side-plots of salvation, resurrection and 'again born' cerebro-spiritual treasure hunts...

There's something Lynch-ianly odd about the contortions that the mind can set itself into, the granny-knots that never untie, the reef knots that go left over right, and left over right...

Å99



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 10:38 PM
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akushla99
vethumanbeing
akushla99
EnochWasRight
akushla99
reply to post by EnochWasRight


Akushla99
Thoughts creating worlds??..indeed provided with a proxy-torturer..Satan must be removed. Yes.
From your heads...yes...
2nd lineÅ99



VHB
Not sure I quoted this right; however, dont you have to recognise Satan to banish/remove it? What if you neglected to give it a big wave hello at the local Starbucks, (knowing its evil intent to walk out on that Large Cappachino/cinnamon sprinkle, bearclaw and lemon bar bill). Maybe Id tackle it in the parking lot (but thats as far as Id go, just slow it down for the catholic cops to arrive). If one believes in satan, you will manifest it. Its interesting how fear is so awesome as in IT CAN CREATE.



Akushla99
You quoted it right VHB.
...and while you're in the parking lot wrestling the loose change out of Nicks sweaty man-purse, dangling the blighter from its ankles...I'm front-row seat with the hand-held camcorder...could not miss the youboob opp......'if One believes in satan, you will manifest it'...would be peachy...we are really talking about (at this mome in time) approx 2 billion dedicated mechanisms - tasked with seeking out the dossier profile in some grand Where in the World is Carmen Sandiego plot that's developed it's own side-plots of salvation, resurrection and 'again born' cerebro-spiritual treasure hunts.


Forgot about the 'ManPurse' too focused on the fake girly wig and 'over the top' mustache, the rubber sword oversized clown feet and bandelero filled with bullets loaded with blanks. Yes, camcorder, we could make some money sending the recording to DAN .otoshian Evil Doings exploiter Extradinaire. If I could anticipate this doings, Id instantly erect bleacher seats and charge virtual admission; 'special heart felt moment' to see Satan manifest ON CAMCORDER ON CUE(got to figure out how to get the 2 billion adolescents ON FACEBOOK! (maybe) to tune into the same frequency to cause actual encarnation) cage it and show it at Brookfield ZOO. "New Exhibit" a paranormal walk into the Darkside of Religous Tenents OBSERVABLE. Raffle tickets sold at 1 dollar, "will Carmen Sandiego finally find its reason de etre?" Find Satan and free it from its confines in a Chicago Suburb, or put it out of its misery, childrens cartoon style?


Akushla99
There's something Lynch-ianly odd about the contortions that the mind can set itself into, the granny-knots that never untie, the reef knots that go left over right, and left over right...Å99


The ants crawling closeup on a dismembered ear, (Blue Velvet) Lynchian syncronicities, its all in the timing/editing.
That quality of mind you describe is so delicate, plastic, subtle, complex and yielding; changes upon your demand (FORFITS any protest) to adapt itself to anything your individualized basic premise as a human being (its positively unatural) needs. If you were to look at knots in general, the hundreds for specific purpose, comes very close to the mechanism that describes brain function because KNOTS ARE PURE MAGICK 'made by humans to tie/secure something to something' TM.
edit on 1-11-2013 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 10:46 PM
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reply to post by vethumanbeing
 


Knots are useful.

Now while one was talking about knots, should you use the proper one for mooring yourself so you don't drift out to sea?



posted on Nov, 1 2013 @ 11:37 PM
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WarminIndy
reply to post by Veteran HumanBeing EXPERT KNOTTER


WarminIndy
Knots are useful. Now while one was talking about knots, should you use the proper one for mooring yourself so you don't drift out to sea


Which one would you suggest; the Overhand, Figure of eight, Slipknot (more to my character), Squareknot (more to your character), granny, Black wall hitch/close/half, Prolonge? You realise these knots have to attach TO AN ANCHOR, are you volunteering your services as the DEAD WIEGHT Mooring device?
edit on 1-11-2013 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2013 @ 12:36 AM
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reply to post by Joecroft
 


Are you confusing resurrection with redemption? Redemption is established for all mankind, as the cosmic and Divine Spirit suffers as its manifold/mankind. If the resurrection of Man could meet the suffering 'face to face' and like Christ conquer death? Heres the problem, even Christs sacrifice is incomplete, as whatever was injected into us as Christ Consciousness must be fulfilled by Man; and so you get the jury and judges weve talked about. How does one spiritualize Matter, by becoming aware of its existance (cosmic Christ infused) into human flesh.
There is no getting around it, as it exists and is part of everyones cosmic makeup; call it what you like, stardust, Holidays, Unicorns, Hello Kitty, pet rocks, dinausaur interest phenomen, bmx bikes. Its all the same, Jesus IS HIDING now as popular culture icons and revealing itself on very base low levels, (see above). Why? because it wants anonimity and NOT the BLAME GAME repercussions. He truely does not want to experience another crucifixion (and no one would believe him if he actualized/incarnated tomorrow anyway). Gods only recourse now is to incite a 'desire of some kind' within mankind in general, something that vibrates to a FORCE/LOOSH/LOVE frequency. Im witnessing great despair/desperation in the attempted failures.
edit on 2-11-2013 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2013 @ 12:59 PM
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reply to post by EnochWasRight
 




Hi Enochwasright

In regards the question in my OP, where currently at…

NO = 98%

Yes = 2%

And it’s only at 2% because I’m giving the poster Rex282 the benefit of the doubt, by sticking him in the NO category. Because to be honest, IMO I think his position is more in the undecided category, than anything else.

But as you can clearly see, the majority Christian view, is that born again, does not = Resurrection. So I’m not the only one who disagrees with you. Which means this shouldn’t be a me, versus you debate. It’s really a YOU verses everyone (Christians) else debate.

Now please understand, my general view on most Christian topics, wouldn’t generally be classified as Christian, even though I accept the standard view, in relation to receiving the Holy Spirit.

The other key factor here is, that you’re the one in the minority perspective, regarding your view on this topic. Which means, you’re’ the one who really has to attempt to prove/show your position to others. And not just to me, but to the majority Christian perspective. Which essentially means putting it up for debate, and denying ignorance…etc

This thread was really just a quick poll, to see people perspectives etc…And not a place to be debating it…

So my advice to you would be, that if you think you have the truth on this, then you need to set up a separate thread, outlining your view on it, as clearly as possible. So that other Christians here on ATS, can address your perspective, and put it to the test, i.e. by questioning it.

Anyway, I appreciate everything you’ve written, but you have written quite a LOT there. And in order to give it a proper response, (either here, or on a new thread) it’s going to take me some time.

Peace…


- JC



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