Example of the importance of remaining in the STATE of GRACE and how do you do that....

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posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 12:45 AM
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After 'water baptism' in the name of Trinity, when we fall into mortal sin with true repentance, confess your
mortal sin to God. God can't be where sin is, He leaves your soul. The "state of grace" means the state of
God's presence in your soul.

I had never read this account until today, oh my gosh, look at what these two men say. One, a very
famous photographer

Both men's words are profound but I am bookmarking, saving and printing off

www.ourlady.ca... An excerpt... See the photo at the link.

Miracle of the Host
Two Photographers

Reprinted with kind permission GARABANDAL JOURNAL July-August 2005
Excerpted from SHE WENT IN HASTE TO THE MOUNTAIN, by Eusebio Garcia de Pesquera, O.F.M., Cap.
Dr. Jean Caux was an esthetic (plastic) surgeon from Paris with a very successful practice (one of his clients was French film star Brigitte Bardou). As an amateur photographer, he went to Garabandal on July 18, 1962, with his camera equipment for the purpose of filming the Miracle of the Host. But things did not work out for him. And while he was not able to film the prodigy with his quality camera and lighting, a businessman from Barcelona, Alejandro Damians, with a borrowed movie camera that he had never used before, was the one to film the Miracle. A year later on August 15, 1963, the two men met and had a conversation that revealed that there was more to who did the filming and why.

Dr.Caux: So you were the one who made the film of Conchita's Communion. I'm very happy to meet you and to have the opportunity to talk to you about that day! Would you mind answering a few questions?
Alejandro terms I'm glad to meet you as well. Ask whatever you like.

Caux: I read your report closely but I would like some more information.
Damians: You must realize that while the report is complete, there were some things I couldn't put down — what I felt inside.

Caux: Tell me, did you keep your eyes on the girl the whole time?
Damians: From the moment I found myself next to her, I didn't look at anything except her. I can swear that I didn't take my eyes off her tongue for a moment. Obviously I could have blinked, but as you know, that would have been a matter of no more than a slight fraction of a second. And I saw how — with a speed too fast for the human eye — the Host appeared on her tongue. To put it a better way, I'd say faster than a split second.

PHOTO (right): The flamboyant Dr.Caux with Conchita in 1965.

Caux: Why didn't you film it from the beginning?
Damians: I was awestruck, stunned! When I came to my senses — I'm not sure it actually happened that way since I don't have a clear recollection — I took the camera and quickly was able to film the last seconds of the miracle.
Caux: Did it occur to you to touch the Host?
Damians: No.

Caux: Was the girl's tongue held out in the usual way for receiving Communion?
Damians: I would say it was extended more than it normally would be.

Caux: Now permit me to ask a question that I've wanted to ask for a long time: Did you feel at that moment a joy so tremendous, so beyond this world, that you couldn't compare it with anything else, that you wouldn't exchange it for anything, even a billion pesetas for example?
Damians: That's a question I've been asked more than once and in similar words. I certainly wouldn't exchange the happiness I felt during those moments for a billion pesetas, nor for anything in the world. It was a joy so intense, so profound, that I can't explain it, nor can I compare it with anything. It was something exceptional! — something for which I'd give my life, and which didn't allow me later to follow the girl's ecstasy, or to go with my wife or with anyone; I was only able to go off into a corner by myself and sob in silence.

Caux: I'm delighted to hear that! Actually it's what I suspected. There are still two things that I'd like very much to know: What was the reason for your great joy? And were you in the state of grace at the time? Pardon my forwardness; don't answer if you don't want to.
Damians: I don't mind answering. I was in God's grace; and my enormous emotion wasn't caused by the miracle itself, or in seeing the girl with the white object on her tongue. (Some said the Host had a cross in the center; others, that the cross was thick; I didn't see any of that.) The great thing that had such a tremendous effect on me was finding myself in the presence of the living and true God. I wouldn't exchange that for anything in the world. If God wants me to see the Miracle that is predicted, I'll be delighted, but if it's not to be, what can I say? [It was not God's will that Senor Damians see another Miracle. He died a few years ago.] It would be difficult for anything in the world to equal the impression I had in seeing Him during that solemn and magnificent moment in my life.
Caux: You don't know how happy that makes me on the one hand and how miserable on the other. I felt the same as you, but with the opposite result! Listen to this. I was all ready to film the event; but everything went wrong and I wasn't able to film anything. Only at the last moment, in the last fraction of a second, did I manage to see the Host as It began disappearing, being swallowed by the girl. At that moment, I was pierced by a terrible pain, a horrible pain that overwhelmed me! It was the pain caused by a God I had come to catch a glimpse of and Who was going away from me.
It was only then that it occurred to me — I hadn't thought about it before — that I was in the state of mortal sin. I wept like you, not from joy but pain! I understood what sin was and what hell was. It was useless for my wife to try to console me; nor could I explain anything, nor could she understand me. That pain was something too great to share or be assuaged. Because of this, I believe that only if God permits me to see the [great] Miracle — now that I try to always be in His grace — will there depart from me this pain so profound that I think it's going to kill me, and which still continues piercing my heart. On that night in Garabandal, I even had the impression that the people were avoiding me, as if they saw my sins!

Damians: I understand everything, my friend, but I must tell you that it wasn't only your impression the people didn't like you; it was the truth. The people thought you had come with a woman who wasn't your wife, and they even asked me to see if I could have you thrown out of the village. Now I understand why God didn't permit that to happen. You suffered more by staying than you would have by being forced to leave.
Caux: You're right. I would have preferred that to happen. But now I know who God is and what He wants of me, what the hell is of not seeing God and how this pain — I would give more than my whole fortune to avoid it — was relieved in confession (and now also with the hope of seeing the Miracle some day). Whatever people say, and although many ridicule me, I cannot abandon the service of the Garabandal cause, to which I owe this profound and terribly awesome feeling which I hope will either leave me or fill me to overflowing on the day of the Miracle. The view of hell moves me to try to move the world myself, announcing what has happened and what is going to happen, so that it can be saved. My family was the first to think I was crazy although now they don't think that way. But I assure you that nothing that anyone thinks of me matters; the only thing that matters to me is God.




posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 12:49 AM
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I ran out of characters with the excerpt. I didn't say who, I am printing off Jean Caux's words and reading
them over and over again.

I don't want to lose God ever... He has given us a remedy when we sin. Repent and Confess your sins
to Him. You know my repeated, Catholics must do more, they must go to Confession.



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 12:56 AM
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The famous photographer did not get the Miracle Host photograph, the other photographer did but God is
so merciful and loving, famous Jean Caux was converted!!

Caux: You don't know how happy that makes me on the one hand and how miserable on the other. I felt the same as you, but with the opposite result! Listen to this. I was all ready to film the event; but everything went wrong and I wasn't able to film anything. Only at the last moment, in the last fraction of a second, did I manage to see the Host as It began disappearing, being swallowed by the girl. At that moment, I was pierced by a terrible pain, a horrible pain that overwhelmed me! It was the pain caused by a God I had come to catch a glimpse of and Who was going away from me. It was only then that it occurred to me — I hadn't thought about it before — that I was in the state of mortal sin. I wept like you, not from joy but pain! I understood what sin was and what hell was. It was useless for my wife to try to console me; nor could I explain anything, nor could she understand me. That pain was something too great to share or be assuaged. Because of this, I believe that only if God permits me to see the [great] Miracle — now that I try to always be in His grace — will there depart from me this pain so profound that I think it's going to kill me, and which still continues piercing my heart. On that night in Garabandal, I even had the impression that the people were avoiding me, as if they saw my sins!



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 01:50 AM
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reply to post by colbe
 


FANTASTIC! Could you please quote from your first post some more so I can understand!??!?



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 01:54 AM
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Feeling separate fom "God" is hell.

The early Christians knew to say Jesus was in their heart to feel that unity in tough times.

Many traditions talk about feeling one with God.



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 07:03 AM
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godsmokes
FANTASTIC! Could you please quote from your first post some more so I can understand!??!?


All you need to understand about the opening post ...

1 - Eight Catholic Bishops in a row have stated and/or upheld the statements that Garbandal wasn't supernatural.

2 - All four girls who had claimed visions of Mary have recanted and said it didn't happen.

3 - What some people call 'the eucharistic miracle of Garabandal' didn't happen. Conchita ADMITTED STEALING A EUCHARIST to pull off the hoax. She stole it and, at the right moment, popped it onto her tongue. She admitted it.

4 - Yes it's important to stay in God's good grace BUT using fake apparitions to scare people or move people to do so is the wrong way to go about it. It's building a house on sand that the first rain will wash away.

ATS Quick Guide to Modern False Apparitions and Seers



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 11:00 AM
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reply to post by colbe
 





God can't be where sin is, He leaves your soul. The "state of grace" means the state of
God's presence in your soul.


Well, I guess that means God can't be with Christians since they admit they are sinners and sin everyday.

Is it like a tug of war with God then? Every time you sin he goes away, then you repent and he comes back, then you sin again and he goes away, repent come back, sin go away, repent come back, etc., etc., etc. everyday for the rest of your life?

Why would God put up with that? Oh, because you believe some guy rose from the dead. Makes total sense. /sarcasm




posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 11:01 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


Hehe, good job ff.


Too bad colbe will never get it though.



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 11:26 AM
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reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


As soon as I saw the title thread I thought, this must be a Catholic person.

There was one person who was challenged on whether or not she was in God's grace, my hero, Joan of Arc. But she did something really spectacular.

I am not sure why it's important to have saints named by the Catholic church, because every day somebody does something extraordinary that never gets recorded.

But these miracles as they call them, I'm kind of skeptical about faces on toast, but what intrigues me the most is why Catholics get stigmata?

I think it would disturb me if someone started bleeding suddenly from their hands and head in front of me. I just never understood that part of it, and I grew up in the Pentecostal faith. Well, my parents weren't so faithful to going to church so we spent many years out of church as children.

Maybe that's why I think some go overboard, looking for any manifestation of something to explain faith.

I think I grew up with the dualism and maybe that's why I look at things differently?



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 11:48 AM
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WarminIndy
As soon as I saw the title thread I thought, this must be a Catholic person.

What the Catholic OP is doing is going against the teaching of the Catholic church.
He continually posts fake apparitions in an effort to make people 'convert'.
But the problem is .. you can't use lies to convert people to God. It doesn't work.


I am not sure why it's important to have saints named by the Catholic church, because every day somebody does something extraordinary that never gets recorded.

Being declared a Saint is more than someone doing something extraordinary. A person is declared a saint after they die and when there has been proof given that the person is in heaven. Everyone in heaven is a saint. So if a person can be proven to be in heaven, then they are called saint. The proof, for the Catholic Church, is two miracles after death. The person who died intercedes to Jesus for people on Earth and the person on Earth receives a verifiable miracle. And the church investigates the miracles very carefully. It is believed that the person has to be in heaven for the miracle to take place. If the person was in hell or a 'wandering soul' on earth or in purgatory, then they couldn't talk to Jesus and ask for a miracle.


But these miracles as they call them, I'm kind of skeptical about faces on toast, but what intrigues me the most is why Catholics get stigmata?

Last I heard there were only 300 stigmatists that the Catholic Church has declared to be authentic during the past 2000 years. Many of them bore the INVISIBLE stigmata. They carried the wounds of Christ, pain and all.

Information on the stigmata
More info on the stigmata

'Old Catholic' beliefs ... those who suffer the wounds of Christ 'earn' graces for the conversion of sinners. Like Jesus died for our sins, these people suffer for our sins. It's being 'Christ like' and sharing in His suffering.

It is believed that St. Paul was the first stigmatist - Info Here

He said "I bear in my body the marks of Jesus" ...



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 11:55 AM
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colbe
when we fall into mortal sin with true repentance, confess your
mortal sin to God. God can't be where sin is, He leaves your soul.

Have you gone to confession and confessed that you lied about me on ATS yet?
And when proven that you lied, you refused to acknowledge and apologize.
Did you confess that as well? NO?? Then you really shouldn't be
preaching at others that they need to repent until you do.
Your Lies = Mortal Sin - So God left your soul. (according to you)



posted on Oct, 30 2013 @ 12:58 PM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


How does one verify a miracle after the person went to heaven?

Then the makers of toasters should be saints, because they make faces appear on toast...

I really don't understand much about Catholicism other than what Catholics have told me, and they seem to hold different opinions about miracles. I actually know more about Islam, Judaism and Hinduism, even though I grew up in a Catholic community and went to school with Catholic kids. But it never seemed to me it was about teaching others why they did the Catechism, it was more about either "you are Catholic and if you are not, then shame on you". That's the perception I got from them. But they were kids and didn't know better themselves, they just had to listen to their parents on the subject, so I don't pass judgment for what they did as children.

I found myself every March being the only kid in my class at my desk as we waited for the others to come from Ash Wednesday service. The school I went to was in rural Ohio and predominantly Catholic. I was never in their loop, so I didn't learn much about Catholicism, but I did argue with a priest one time.

I worked as an in-home health aid for an elderly Catholic woman who believed her house was haunted. As I was not Catholic, I felt the only right thing to do to comfort her was to get her priest to come and bless her home. She was crying all the time because he never came. She was 88 years-old and in the beginning of Alzheimer's Disease. But I did what I thought would bring her some comfort, I called her priest and asked him if he could come and visit her. He refused to until I reminded him that she was paying tithes to his church.

This is what I said to him "It amazes me that you call yourself a priest and yet you can't do the one little thing that Jesus commanded you to do in the first place and that is to be a servant. I don't believe you are a real priest and I don't have faith in your church, if you can't do this little thing to bring comfort to your own parishioner that needs your help the most". He came the next day. She did get comfort because she had been invalid and housebound and could not get out to go to Communion. He did this with her when he came and then blessed the house. Then we had a discussion about prophets, to which he tells me that prophets were merely sent to challenge people. I replied "Well, you must be a prophet then because you have challenged my patience".

But I didn't see this man as higher than me in any way. He lost the argument when he was reminded of his primary duty.

The elderly lady died a few months later, but she was comforted at her last months, because even though I was not Catholic, I made a stand for her rights as a Catholic believer. What is very funny is that when the priest came to give her the Last Rites and left, she asked us to get her one of our preachers to come and pray with her. We did that, because she was dying and everyone should be comforted as they are dying. We kept her last request. I don't know what the prayer was about, I didn't stay in there. But I felt no qualms about challenging this man to do his job.

I didn't tell her daughter though that she asked for another faith minister, her daughter lived in Arizona, but I didn't want her daughter to feel angry with her mother. Surely the priest would remember me always, but eventually that priest was arrested in Dayton, Ohio for soliciting gay sex from a police officer.....darn, he should have been doing his job instead.



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 12:08 AM
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FlyersFan

godsmokes
FANTASTIC! Could you please quote from your first post some more so I can understand!??!?


All you need to understand about the opening post ...

1 - Eight Catholic Bishops in a row have stated and/or upheld the statements that Garbandal wasn't supernatural.

2 - All four girls who had claimed visions of Mary have recanted and said it didn't happen.

3 - What some people call 'the eucharistic miracle of Garabandal' didn't happen. Conchita ADMITTED STEALING A EUCHARIST to pull off the hoax. She stole it and, at the right moment, popped it onto her tongue. She admitted it.

4 - Yes it's important to stay in God's good grace BUT using fake apparitions to scare people or move people to do so is the wrong way to go about it. It's building a house on sand that the first rain will wash away.

ATS Quick Guide to Modern False Apparitions and Seers


None of the above is true, the Garabandal seers, it was prophesied, they would doubt for a bit of time. The miracle of the Eucharist was photographed witnessed by those there at the time in Garabandal. Garabandal fits the Church third category. You can't speak of the Warning in one post and deny prophecy of it in another. The Warning is one of the major revelations of Garabandal.

Here is a wonderful explanation on the status of Garabandal.


The Church has a very strict and precise terminology for judging alleged apparitions (very few apparitions are officially approved). According to the norms of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, alleged apparitions are classified in one of three categories:
Constat de supernaturalitate - It is certain that the events are of supernatural origin.
Constat de non supernaturalitate - It is certain that the events are not of supernatural origin.
Non-constat de supernaturalitate - It is not certain that the events are of supernatural origin.
So where does Garabandal stand? In a clarificatory letter (English translation published in the EWTN website) dated June 8, 1993 written by Jose Vilaplana, Bishop of Santander (the local Diocese to which Garabandal belongs), the Bishop wrote the following:

ALL the bishops of the diocese from 1961 through 1970 asserted that the supernatural character of the said apparitions, that took place around that time, could not be confirmed. [no constaba].
Based on the above, Garabandal is classified in the 3rd category – it is not certain that the events are of supernatural origin. The Bishop did NOT say “it is certain that the events of Garabandal are not of supernatural origin”, which constitutes a condemnation of the apparition. Rather, based on the above note from the Bishop, the Church is not certain of the supernatural nature of the events – which means that the Church is leaving the door open for a possible positive declaration in the future, pending further investigation.(ie. the Warning & Miracle happening as predicted).

In a letter written by Bishop Eugenio Beitia Aldazabal dated July 8, 1965, he clearly wrote that “we have found no grounds for ecclesiastical condemnation.” Bishop Jose Cirada Lachiondo, in a declaration published June 1970, wrote that the messages of Garabandal “do not contain anything contrary to traditional Church teaching on Faith and Morals”. The first commission which studied the Garabandal events, while stating that they found no phenomena which would authentic the supernatural nature of the events, clearly did not condemn the apparition and the messages, declaring that “we have not found anything deserving of ecclesiastical censure or condemnation either in the doctrine or in the spiritual recommendations that have been published as having been addressed to the faithful.”

The bishop who called the second commission, Bishop del Val, upon retiring from office stated in an interview that the message of Garabandal was “important” and “theologically correct.”
In light of the above, even though the Church has not given official approval yet, a Catholic may in good standing believe in the events at Garabandal. The local ordinaries have been very clear to avoid condemnation. In fact, the Bishops allow private pilgrimages to Garabandal – a typical practice when an alleged apparition has not yet been approved or to various negative reports on Garabandal, therefore, the fact is that the apparitions have never been officially condemned by the Church, particularly by several of the local bishops under whose jurisdiction the apparitions fall. Although the apparitions have not been officially approved, they have not been officially condemned either. This is particularly because most of the important parts of the message – the prophetic messages foretelling the Warning, the Miracle and the Chastisement – can only be validated or invalidated upon their actual occurrence. We will never know if the prophesied events are true or not – until they actually happen.


Furthermore, Bishop Dal Val after retiring, actually confessed to his doctor (after a miraculous healing ) that he was WRONG in his initial judgment . ...


www.motheofgod.com...



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 12:15 AM
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3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by colbe
 





God can't be where sin is, He leaves your soul. The "state of grace" means the state of
God's presence in your soul.


Well, I guess that means God can't be with Christians since they admit they are sinners and sin everyday.

Is it like a tug of war with God then? Every time you sin he goes away, then you repent and he comes back, then you sin again and he goes away, repent come back, sin go away, repent come back, etc., etc., etc. everyday for the rest of your life?

Why would God put up with that? Oh, because you believe some guy rose from the dead. Makes total sense. /sarcasm



3NL,

God loves humanity more than anything created. You must have true contrition when you confess your
sins to God, it isn't a game. God knows your heart. It has been revealed since the beginning of Christianity and before in the OT. Read the Book of Maccabees and in the Gospel, Revelation.

Nothing unholy enters Heaven. then, how could God remain in your soul when you or me are in mortal sin?



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 12:29 AM
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WarminIndy
reply to post by FlyersFan
 


How does one verify a miracle after the person went to heaven?

Then the makers of toasters should be saints, because they make faces appear on toast...

I really don't understand much about Catholicism other than what Catholics have told me, and they seem to hold different opinions about miracles. I actually know more about Islam, Judaism and Hinduism, even though I grew up in a Catholic community and went to school with Catholic kids. But it never seemed to me it was about teaching others why they did the Catechism, it was more about either "you are Catholic and if you are not, then shame on you". That's the perception I got from them. But they were kids and didn't know better themselves, they just had to listen to their parents on the subject, so I don't pass judgment for what they did as children.

I found myself every March being the only kid in my class at my desk as we waited for the others to come from Ash Wednesday service. The school I went to was in rural Ohio and predominantly Catholic. I was never in their loop, so I didn't learn much about Catholicism, but I did argue with a priest one time.

I worked as an in-home health aid for an elderly Catholic woman who believed her house was haunted. As I was not Catholic, I felt the only right thing to do to comfort her was to get her priest to come and bless her home. She was crying all the time because he never came. She was 88 years-old and in the beginning of Alzheimer's Disease. But I did what I thought would bring her some comfort, I called her priest and asked him if he could come and visit her. He refused to until I reminded him that she was paying tithes to his church.

This is what I said to him "It amazes me that you call yourself a priest and yet you can't do the one little thing that Jesus commanded you to do in the first place and that is to be a servant. I don't believe you are a real priest and I don't have faith in your church, if you can't do this little thing to bring comfort to your own parishioner that needs your help the most". He came the next day. She did get comfort because she had been invalid and housebound and could not get out to go to Communion. He did this with her when he came and then blessed the house. Then we had a discussion about prophets, to which he tells me that prophets were merely sent to challenge people. I replied "Well, you must be a prophet then because you have challenged my patience".

But I didn't see this man as higher than me in any way. He lost the argument when he was reminded of his primary duty.

The elderly lady died a few months later, but she was comforted at her last months, because even though I was not Catholic, I made a stand for her rights as a Catholic believer. What is very funny is that when the priest came to give her the Last Rites and left, she asked us to get her one of our preachers to come and pray with her. We did that, because she was dying and everyone should be comforted as they are dying. We kept her last request. I don't know what the prayer was about, I didn't stay in there. But I felt no qualms about challenging this man to do his job.

I didn't tell her daughter though that she asked for another faith minister, her daughter lived in Arizona, but I didn't want her daughter to feel angry with her mother. Surely the priest would remember me always, but eventually that priest was arrested in Dayton, Ohio for soliciting gay sex from a police officer.....darn, he should have been doing his job instead.



warminindy,

I am sorry you experienced a not very happy grade school. It happens in other private schools too.
Why were you the only non-Catholic attending, what were your parent's intentions? Did you not tell
them you were unhappy?

And reading further in your post, all your comments are negative. I can't change your heart but I know someone who very soon is going to try and that is Jesus Christ, the Father and God the Holy Spirit.


Trust what God shows you, there isn't going to be divided Christianity much longer.


love,

colbe



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 12:54 AM
link   

WarminIndy
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


As soon as I saw the title thread I thought, this must be a Catholic person.

There was one person who was challenged on whether or not she was in God's grace, my hero, Joan of Arc. But she did something really spectacular.
I am not sure why it's important to have saints named by the Catholic church, because every day somebody does something extraordinary that never gets recorded.

But these miracles as they call them, I'm kind of skeptical about faces on toast, but what intrigues me the most is why Catholics get stigmata?

I think it would disturb me if someone started bleeding suddenly from their hands and head in front of me. I just never understood that part of it, and I grew up in the Pentecostal faith. Well, my parents weren't so faithful to going to church so we spent many years out of church as children.

Maybe that's why I think some go overboard, looking for any manifestation of something to explain faith.

I think I grew up with the dualism and maybe that's why I look at things differently?


WarminIndy,

I like your comments and good question. Miracles are a sign from God to help us come closer to
Him, to believe. It is something that there are still disbelievers, atheists, agnostics when there is witness
to stigmatics in history. They bare the wounds of Christ. St. Padre Pio is the most famous. He bore
the wounds of Christ for fifty years.

You love Joan of Arc, ask her spiritual and temporal help in prayer. She will help you.

colbe



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 05:27 AM
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WarminIndy
How does one verify a miracle after the person went to heaven?


- Let's say you have Lupus.
- Someone dies. Lets say your mother.
- You ask your mother to help you. You ask her to ask Jesus to send a miracle cure for your Lupus.
- You get your cure for Lupus.
- The church investigates and determines if it's a miracle or not
- If it's a miracle, then that is a sign that the cure came via your mother asking Jesus for a miracle.
That would mean that she is in heaven and is a saint (as all people in heaven are).

That's how a miracle is verified.
The Church investigates and determines if it really is a miracle cure or if it was an earthly one.



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 05:30 AM
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colbe
None of the above is true,

EVERYTHING I posted was true. Are you, once again, falsely calling me a liar?
Have you gone to confession yet about all the other times you've called me a liar?
Have you gone to confession yet about not apologizing and not admitting you were wrong?

Stop telling people to get their acts together and go to confession when you yourself
are running around telling false stories about people and refusing to acknowledge your
errors when confronted with facts. It's hypocritical.

ALL EIGHT BISHOPS FROM GARBANDAL HAVE UPHELD THE DECLARATION ....
ALL FOUR CHILDREN HAVE ADMITTED THEY LIED AND THAT IT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

the Garabandal seers, it was prophesied, they would doubt for a bit of time.

Yes, how convenient for them. Oh .. and they aren't just 'doubting', they have RECANTED THE ENTIRE THING. All four of them admitted it never happened. And one even died still saying it didn't happen.

The miracle of the Eucharist was photographed witnessed by those there at the time in Garabandal.

They witnessed and photographed A FAKE MIRACLE.
Geeeze .. what more do you need then the person who faked it, confirming it was faked.
She stole the eucharist. SHE SAID SO.
edit on 10/31/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 08:46 AM
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colbe
None of the above is true,

Oh really? Lets take them one by one ...

1 - Eight Catholic Bishops in a row have stated and/or upheld the statements that Garbandal wasn't supernatural.

Information DIRECT from the Bishops and not filtered through some strange pro-Garabandal site -

Garabandal - False

THE BISHOP OF SANTANDER HAS BEEN AND CONTINUES TO BE THE ONLY ONE WITH COMPLETE JURISDICTION IN THIS MATTER AND THE HOLY SEE HAS NO INTENTION OF EXAMINING THIS QUESTION ANY FURTHER


QUOTE From Jose Vilaplana - Bishop of Santander - Oct. 11, 1996

there was no supernatural validity to such apparitions ... I reconfirm that there was no supernatural validity ...


Cardinal Seper, Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith wrote in 1970 that: promoters of the Garabandal movement have tried to minimize the decisions and the jurisdiction of the Bishop of Santander. THIS SACRED CONGREGATION WANTS IT TO BE CLEARLY UNDERSTOOD THAT THE BISHOP OF SANTANDER HAS BEEN AND CONTINUES TO BE THE ONLY ONE WITH COMPLETE JURISDICTION IN THIS MATTER AND THE HOLY SEE HAS NO INTENTION OF EXAMINING THIS QUESTION ANY FURTHER, since it holds that the examinations already carried out are sufficient as well as are the official declarations of the Bishop of Santander.

Text from Bishop Jose Vilaplana ... 1996
Catholic Info

"Some people have been coming directly to the Diocese of Santander (Spain) asking about the alleged apparitions of Garabandal and especially for the answer about the position of the hierarchy of the Church concerning these apparitions.

I need to communicate that: All the bishops of the diocese since 1961 through 1970 agreed that there was no supernatural validity for the apparitions.

In the month of December of 1977 Bishop Dal Val of Santander, in union with his predecessors, stated that in the six years of being bishop of Santander there were no new phenomena.

The same bishop, Dal Val, let a few years go by to allow the confusion or fanaticism to settle down, and then he initiated a commission to examine the apparitions in more depth. The conclusion of the commission agreed with the findings of the previous bishops. That there was no supernatural validity to such apparitions.

At the time of the conclusions of the study, in 1991, I was installed bishop in the diocese. So during my visit to Rome, as limina visit which happened in the same year, I presented to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith the study and I asked for pastoral direction concerning this case.

On Nov. 28, 1992, the Congregation sent me an answer saying that after examining the documentation, there was no need for direct intervention (by the Vatican) to take away the jurisdiction of the ordinary bishop of Santander in this case. Such a right belongs to the ordinary. Previous declarations of the Holy See agree in this finding. In the same letter they suggested that if I find it necessary to publish a declaration, that I reconfirm that there was no supernatural validity in the alleged apparitions, and this will make a unanimous position with my predecessors.

Given that the declarations of my predecessors who studied the case have been clear and unanimous, I don’t find it necessary to have a new public declaration that would raise notoriety about something which happened so long ago. However, I find it necessary to rewrite this report as a direct answer to the people who ask for direction concerning this question, which is now final:

I agree with [and] I accept the decision of my predecessors and the direction of the Holy See.

In reference to the Eucharistic celebration in Garabandal, following the decision of my predecessors, I ruled that Masses can be celebrated only in the parish church and there will be no references to the alleged apparitions and visiting priests who want to say Mass must have approval from the pastor, who has my authorization. It’s my wish that this information is helpful to you.
My regards in Christ,
Jose Vilaplana
Bishop of Santander
Oct. 11, 1996


Hear that? 8 Bishops in a row and the Vatican itself say it's not supernatural and they have no intention of ever investigating further. The girls say they faked it. The church says it's irrelevant. CASE CLOSED.

2 - All four girls who had claimed visions of Mary have recanted and said it didn't happen.
You already admitted that they did indeed confess that they made it all up.
You claimed 'none' of what I said was true ... and yet you confess this happened.

3 - What some people call 'the eucharistic miracle of Garabandal' didn't happen. Conchita ADMITTED STEALING A EUCHARIST to pull off the hoax. She stole it and, at the right moment, popped it onto her tongue. She admitted it.
She confessed to Father J. Pelletier that she stole the eucharist. That's established.

4 - Yes it's important to stay in God's good grace BUT using fake apparitions to scare people or move people to do so is the wrong way to go about it. It's building a house on sand that the first rain will wash away.
So it's okay to use fake apparitions to scare people or to try to make them 'convert'???
According to you it is.
That's pretty sick that you think it's okay to use fake apparitions to try to get people
to convert to a religion that you aren't even following correctly yourself.


edit on 10/31/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 31 2013 @ 10:25 AM
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Oh I understand now how it works.

In my experience, I have seen miracles from a person while the person is still living. My brother had Spinal Meningitis when he was 11 years-old and my parents weren't the kind to take us to the doctor. When they realized he was so sick with something, they decided they should take him and when they got him to the hospital, the ER doctor had all the tests on him and determined that he was either going to die soon or have an operation because of a large accumulation of infection pressing the back of his brain. He had CAT scans that showed it. But what the doctor had told my parents was that his brain had been too damaged and if he survives the operation, he would be basically a vegetable the rest of his life.

At this point my parents decided to call the pastor of the church they sometimes attended. He came over right away and prayed for my brother to not only make it through the operation, but heal the brain damage. THe next morning, they did the routine pre-operative testing to determine how the infection was spreading. The new CAT scans showed there absolutely was no infection any more and the damage was healed. My brother retired in 2008 as First Lieutenant in the Navy.

I have seen many more miracles in my life, but while the person was alive when they prayed.

We were not Catholic, so the pastor can't be called a saint because he was not either. But there are many people praying all the time to Jesus while on this earth, and Jesus answers them.

Colbe thinks I am too negative, I was relating a story about one priest...not all of them. At the school I went to in rural Ohio, it had previously been a parochial school, because all of the town I lived in, at one time had been religiously segregated. My mom, as a little girl, went to the school near the Nazarene church. But the state of Ohio took over and redistricted the schools, and so the school I went to had previously been Catholic parochial but now it was public and we lived in that district, so that's why I went there.

I must reiterate, I don't have problems with Catholics, there are many, many nice people who are Catholic. The school I attended was across the tiny little country road from the Catholic church and many times the priest there would come to the playground when we were at recess. The kids loved him. But he would still come to the school to have talks with the nun that that state still allowed to work there.

He defended me against her trying to force me into doing fundraisers for the CYO. I remember it well, that she had really said very bad things to me in class. Of course, I told my parents, they went to the school, the school called the priest and he came over and defended me in class in front of the other students and the teacher.

He was so nice, he respected the fact that I was not Catholic and let the other children also know that they also had to respect that. I had to tell him that my parents had told me I could not call him father, that it was against our religion. He told me that was ok. He understood.

I don't remember that priest's name, but he was a good guy.





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