The commissioned citizen program.

So I have been thinking.

What would be root cause of the evils of today going unanswered?

IMO it is because people are just too ignorant. Not that they are lacking in intelligence, something I think is relative to your perceived survival. No. It is that they lack any education /formation in a meaningful way.

You could spend your entire life in school and only achieve the memorization of other peoples thoughts and ideas. You may never learn to learn.

So that is the root cause of all this blatant wrong going unanswered.

Solution?

Well.

What if we had to earn our right to citizenship. Or rather.

What if we upgraded the class of citizen the average joe could be.

Hear me out.

Our governments have effectively made second class citizens of the average people. They have upgraded the status of corporations to be protected by our very own laws meant to protect us.

Immigration is a tool used to usurp a countries ideology by promising citizenship in exchange for votes.

People are disenfranchised and cant do a damn thing about it but not vote for some bumble twat who may or may not echo the voice of the people.

What if we had a class of citizen that went through a formation period where what he was taught was the basic fundamentals of his nations history, its laws, its fundamental beliefs as well as the minor details like how to go about using the various official tools at his disposal which he probably never heard of.

What if citizenship was earned. What if to be a citizen, or rather A COMMISSIONED CITIZEN, you had to prove that you understand the core of what your nation is and what your responsibility is to it.

Like if they were made to earn the same trust you place in any politician....who are by todays standards less than deserving of the trust and responsibility we place in them.

They could take vows to defend their nation from various known evils which we are already aware of. They could do community service while gaining valuable knowledge that will equip them with a sense of national direction and purpose.

I would not say that being born someplace doesnt make you part of it. I would say that everyone born in your country is part of it....but what if they REALLY meant their loyalty and they were asked to take the time to train and prepare for service to their fellow man.

I would suggest everyone be citizens. BUT those who take on the formation and engage their lives in a form of service towards their nation be given a separate title. COMMISSIONED CITIZENS.

They would vote like everyone else. BUT they would have DIRECT votes for elected leaders. They would be part of DIRECT democracy.

They could be trusted since they would be given their title only after proving that they are no different in understanding then any "trusted" representative.

And that is the reason we have representatives. Because when our governments and their body politic was formed, the world was still vastly ....um...RETARDED.

That is not the case anymore. The average person has several interfaces with a modern equivalent of a library of Alexandria in his home. They have the possibility of higher education beyond their desired careers which makes some people have multiple disciplines of expertise in varying levels.

We have literally a new world, yet government is left with all the responsibility since the system it operates by hasnt evolved to finally allow people to take command of their nation.

I would hope not to create second class citizens, but rather a finer caliber of them. I would like to see people actually TASKED with the responsibility of their nations well being.

They would also be given a loose form of their own branch of government. They could not interfere with the federal or state governments....BUT they would be given the power of VETO over any legislation that they deem unfit by special convention with a majority vote by those convened.

In essence they would only intervene to veto possible laws which are going to be passed. They would have to petition government through already established channels to repeal any existing law.

If say for example any legislation was going to be modified or renewed because it expired or was deemed unfit to address a new issue, they could call an emergency session to their chapters and tally up votes to either VETO or accept legislation for consideration by government. The legislation would then proceed through normal channels to either be passed into law or not.

The fact is we need checks and balances that WE ARE IN CONTROL OF ourselves.

Also the majority vote of the various chapters of these commissioned citizens would be able to draft and submit any new legislation for consideration to their state or federal governments with no special consideration....but they could at least submit legislation that echos the peoples wants which government would at least have to consider....like the rest of the back door dealers do...only it would be things that people actually want.

There is allot more to this but that is the general idea. I will continue to meditate on this and follow up with a revised concept and possibly a mission statement.

Thoughts?

reply to post by tadaman

This is a tough topic, very much on my short list of untouchables so thanks for taking a swat at it.

I am still of the mind that we do want legal immigration, that goes without saying.

As far as voting rights goes, this is where I am hoping for a wholesale upholding of all voting rights that we have now.

However, when we look back on what our original voting structure was (the one composed contemporarily with the constitution and bill of rights) a much greater amount of 'skin in the game' was required.

Considering the mess we are in and the prophetic words of Benjamin Franklin, "When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic", it seems that we have no choice but to reevaluate the parameters of our representative republic lest it become an overt democracy.

reply to post by greencmp


I can agree with those statements.

I have one reservation. When are the people ready for direct democracy in any measure? Never?

In no form?

I would say that if the proving ground was valid that we could establish a more direct link to government by those of us that CAN be trusted. That is kind of the point to establishing a program where people are taken through rigorous training and preparation to represent their own people and themselves in government.

An entirely representative form of governance is backwards and counter productive considering even the most minor of changes we have undergone as a civilization.

Instantaneous exchange of information. Vast swaths of information readily available...a deeper understanding of human kind and human nature.

No. I say we are ready for more and if such an opportunity is not taken advantage of, we will breed a new class of destructive citizen. One much like the type an isolated adolescent is when he feels no purpose to his newly revealed potential. Idle hands my friend.... We can employ them to their full potential in a constructive effort, or we can leave them to undermine all the works of the head.

With no heart to mitigate, the hands destroy all that the mind creates. The heart in our case is the very soul of a nation we risk losing.

reply to post by tadaman


Wow, Tada.. that's even better than Starship Trooper. I'm all for it, but who's going to run the Officer Candidate School?
Although sadly it's becoming harder to walk down the street and not see more all the time people going in the opposite political direction from involved. In fact more electronically absorbed and detached from their surroundings than I thought bots with pulses could be, and not bump each other more often.

Maybe another movie came to mind, from the S.King book "Cell".
Don't know if you ever read it-- but I would postulate an afternoon more likely someday with a **pulse** : and "RAST! BREEELAAHhhh!!" than "Sign me on. The work is worth it."
Great pulp.. try it, it's a quick treat.

For now consider me one of the latter, on the condition it affords me no priveleges beyond anyone else. Great treatise, and bumped for the motive alone.

Why do we have to BE what someone else wants?
Why cant I just be myself?
Why should I have to pass a test to live in the same world as you?
I dont hurt others, I dont interfere in there lives, so why cant I just be?

Our Constitution provides these very checks and balances. TPTB control the information/media--because they control the power of the purse. Very few elected officials escape their influence. Your "commissioned officers" were certainly pre-figured by Obama's domestic corps idea.

reply to post by VoidHawk


That is fine.

But lets say for example I wanted you to perform heart surgery....I would ask that you at least go to medical school.

The training facilitates your job....it doesnt take you away from it.

And you wouldnt be less of a citizen. By that same token you would not be part of those who would like to take a more active role in the day to day operations of their nation and their community.

You can just tell them what you think...and it would be their job to know what you think so as to echo that in their works. You dont have to make the sacrifice they would...but THEY WOULD,

reply to post by Tusks

Once upon a time in America it was required for students to take Civics.
Any classes you could not master would keep you back.
You learned, then moved on.
Standards were much higher and most everyone somehow managed to pass.
Imagine that!
My father went to grade school back in the 30's and before he passed away he could still recite the Gettysburg Address, the Preamble to the Constitution and tell you how many Senators and Representatives were in Congress.
That was what they were require to learn.
My dad never failed to vote, even in local elections.
There were once commissioned citizens, as you call them.
They were every child who graduated high school.

reply to post by Asktheanimals


AND THAT is entirely the spirit of this idea.

I noticed that too.

We need that type of people walking our streets again. Making that reality again is the purpose of this idea.

To make us actual citizens again...beyond a passport and our taxes.

We need to regain the mind of actual citizens again.

People like your father are the inspiration for this idea.

tadaman
reply to post by greencmp

 

I can agree with those statements.

I have one reservation. When are the people ready for direct democracy in any measure? Never?

In no form?

I would say that if the proving ground was valid that we could establish a more direct link to government by those of us that CAN be trusted. That is kind of the point to establishing a program where people are taken through rigorous training and preparation to represent their own people and themselves in government.

An entirely representative form of governance is backwards and counter productive considering even the most minor of changes we have undergone as a civilization.

Instantaneous exchange of information. Vast swaths of information readily available...a deeper understanding of human kind and human nature.

No. I say we are ready for more and if such an opportunity is not taken advantage of, we will breed a new class of destructive citizen. One much like the type an isolated adolescent is when he feels no purpose to his newly revealed potential. Idle hands my friend.... We can employ them to their full potential in a constructive effort, or we can leave them to undermine all the works of the head.

With no heart to mitigate, the hands destroy all that the mind creates. The heart in our case is the very soul of a nation we risk losing.

edit on 10 17 2013 by tadaman because: (no reason given)

Noted for most, with some items a given. A direct democracy where public opinion can be corrupted by the existing structure will always fall into disarray and dictatorship.

My question is: can citizens remain sentient and sufficiently vigilant of their public servants to prevent the latter from becoming their masters? My visual experience of a little over 50 years involvement is leaning toward most all of us bathed in enough political and legal ignorance so that by now I'm pressed to believe an average American is capable of self-governance.

I'm not David Rockefeller, and propose no mom-and-pop shop government for us poor dense street tykes. But the greatest freedom being choice removed, who will be compelled to 'improve' his lot if presently satisfied ? I fear more than anything this country is taken over forever from its brain-lazy slumber. If our present improvement potential in the 'cage' is zero, that means (maybe) 1.12 * 0 = still zero.

For the record and at the beginning of your post, I personally feel that a much more rigorous vetting of potential representatives be initiated. That process would probably be a hundred years overdue, if not at least 50.
Flash back briefly to one man representing Tennessee-- who was afraid Guam was going to capsize from all the hardware the military planned to park on it. Unfortunately for the body politic, that wasn't hyperbole.

EDIT: @ AskTheAnimals and all of us--
Here Here! Before I was allowed out of the 8th Grade in that private school, I was required ro recite the Pre, whole Declaration and explain the intent of the Bill of Rights Am by Am after rattling off the big ten. Today I wonder if a quarter our elected representatives could give you even five Amendments.

I am still shamed by that 8th grade exit exam from 1898 in Salina, Kansas. How far we have fallen.. and how much of it is due to change agents, out to make us what we now obviously are?

Wow good read... I wonder how many of you there are
They (we) have tried this a few times in history and it always ends up with the lesser class in ovens...

reply to post by derfreebie


I can still agree with some of that.

We do need to accept that not all of the burden of choice can be given to people since realistically we are not at a point where most people are ready to take on that weight.

Irony, too much freedom is slavery. It causes nausea to even consider it, but is still true to an extent for many people....BUT NOT ALL....and slowly, steadily...not most as time passes.

I also think that we need to burn every copy of little prince and get some real humans in office. The manikins of acceptable and proper backgrounds are nerve wrecking in their exact mindset of those they supposedly overcome and lead. They have no soul or fire to them. No passion beyond insanity and no wisdom beyond self preservation.

We need to maybe have our representatives go through a rigorous training program before they sit behind a desk and get fatter and dumber with every passing year....TERM LIMITS....They also go crazy....

tadaman
reply to post by derfreebie

 

I can still agree with some of that.

We do need to accept that not all of the burden of choice can be given to people since realistically we are not at a point where most people are ready to take on that weight.

Irony, too much freedom is slavery.

..truncated for bandwidth's sake..

We need to maybe have our representatives go through a rigorous training program before they sit behind a desk and get fatter and dumber with every passing year....TERM LIMITS....They also go crazy....

edit on 10 17 2013 by tadaman because: (no reason given)

"They also go..." with hooks to drag us into madness with them. LOL
In the long view, the individual sleeper must awaken. Our system has been designed by geniuses to produce useful, obedient drones.

All I can see for a remedy is enough sunlight to "come in through the window" so more of us get involved.
I'd like to improve on political coma sure.. but you can't smack a stranger on the face like Ren and yell "For God's sake, wakeUP man."
Prime example was the American Reichstag, and the immediate tagline of AlQueda. Smack-Picture-Rhetoric. Psyop. Can't do it with truth, there's their great advantage.
We can all be fed lies forever, but only each one alone must find a truth.

reply to post by derfreebie


How very true.

There is literally a banquet before us as a nation of potential and dreams fulfilled...yet so many arent even hungry.

Snacks ruin appetites...and really all we can do is give out snacks at this point.

I guess there is more meat on this bone, but really it may be too undercooked for their liking.

any hoot.

Once they see the view they will want to go beyond the window. They will realize the door is there for them as well, if they are willing. I guess we have to just let the sunlight shine through as you said and hope they notice.

have a good one.
Hold it down.

tadaman
reply to post by greencmp

 

I can agree with those statements.

I have one reservation. When are the people ready for direct democracy in any measure? Never?

In no form?

I would say that if the proving ground was valid that we could establish a more direct link to government by those of us that CAN be trusted. That is kind of the point to establishing a program where people are taken through rigorous training and preparation to represent their own people and themselves in government.

An entirely representative form of governance is backwards and counter productive considering even the most minor of changes we have undergone as a civilization.

Instantaneous exchange of information. Vast swaths of information readily available...a deeper understanding of human kind and human nature.

No. I say we are ready for more and if such an opportunity is not taken advantage of, we will breed a new class of destructive citizen. One much like the type an isolated adolescent is when he feels no purpose to his newly revealed potential. Idle hands my friend.... We can employ them to their full potential in a constructive effort, or we can leave them to undermine all the works of the head.

With no heart to mitigate, the hands destroy all that the mind creates. The heart in our case is the very soul of a nation we risk losing.

edit on 10 17 2013 by tadaman because: (no reason given)

Never.

True democracy, as they say, is the tyranny of the majority. A system of government that enforces the conclusions of the lowest common denominator. Frankly, a recipe for disaster and is in no way viable.

If people are ever well informed enough to be able to make a democratic system work, we will not need 'government' at all anymore. We will have competent and effective voluntary associations.

Until then, if we must have government, it must be a representative republic and have the absolute bare minimum of power. In this way, its terrible decisions will harm the fewest people in the least destructive manner.

reply to post by greencmp


Well I can say that I would love for our representative democracy to represent the people and not those who own controlling interests of the nation.

I am of the opinion that there is no more lasting lesson then letting someone learn from their own mistakes.

If the people are never to be built up to a point where they are worthy of self determination then they only exist for the needs of the government /political class. They are then in essence only there to provide FOR the government in its quest for self preservation.

Freemen liberate. They seek freemen as their equals.

only SLAVES enslave.

That only leads to ever larger government and ever smaller visible populations in terms of power. We as people are at this point only as valuable and visible as our taxes and our votes of popularity provide, since in reality even our opinion is irrelevant..but the comfort afforded by our toil is not.

If that is the case, then there is no purpose to the population. There is no interest to serve.

Like being a soldier stationed on the ruins of a long gone fort. He may think "what the hell is the point"...as his enemies might...before they laugh.

People then will see their life has no purpose, and when that happens to a society, things get VERY strange.

Ever read about a complete social suicide?

If the people ever realize that they only exist to serve....they will burn it all and themselves...happily...burn it all down and be done with it...to hell with it....consequences be damned.

Why do you think that every great civilization resets itself?

Because our human nature doesn't have a mechanism to adapt to a situation where great power is shared.

It DOES have a mechanism of outright insanity and desperation where all is fair game for destruction by invalidating the very purpose of existence revealed to man.

Humanity now is not different to any other generation of man. Its just what they know that has changed.

All things are known soon enough.

When government exists only for its self preservation and the political class exists only by the merits of its self appointed virtues....everything ends...and we begin the loop again.

Because man would rather kill all then accept his slavery willingly. Impose it, demand it, push it upon him and he may smile. Ask him for it, and he will club you and burn your house down.

We do have the slave mind, but not the slave spirit.

That spirit must be addressed or it will be the death of all. It is equal to all. Accept that and you are ahead of the game...well, doing better at least than all the dust before you.

Accept it not...and stay right where we are...which isnt the end of the path or all that is to be seen.

Like staring at a wall you built in the middle of a road.....because the end of the journey is too far for your tired little legs.

crawl if you must .....but complete the journey.

No one said you must be upright to reach your goal and that your belly must not scrape the ground...only that you must complete the journey.


There is no butterfly in a caterpillar. No fruit or flower in a seed. Only what can come of the transformation. None present nor their ways are that change. Just more seeds and worms. No transformation there....

They---we, must see it through. Or we will never be.

reply to post by tadaman


Works for me. Citizenship needs to be a lofty respected earned thing to be more functional. The idiots interviewed on the streets who don't seem to have a clue about which political end is up are classic horror stories of "citizens" who vote being terminally clueless.

Doesn't work for a democratic republic to have "citizens" like that. It does not work. Cannot work.

The globalists know that and have been neutering values and citizenship for a long time.

They only want Eloi ready to shuffle into the maws of the Morlachs on command.


And though I hate government intrusion into the family big time . . .

perhaps we need to require

MARRIED COUPLES TO EARN the right to have children.

Not as the globalists plan . . . . with test tube DNA matched robotized serfs and slaves resulting . . .

but to require that MARRIED COUPLES DEMONSTRATE loving responsibility and parenting skills sufficient to rear a child into a productive contributing adult.

I think that's a great idea. Too many people destroy and ruin for the sake of it. Petty acts of vandalism, graffiti, scaring the old, etc., would become a thing of the past. Citizenship would be earned, give a sense of belonging and give the citizen a pride in their country.

My only concerns would be that there must be some kind of incentive attached. If it has to be earned then there must be something which elevates a citizen over a non-citizen.

Also, there must be some kind of control over the honesty of the information required. By this, i mean that when tested for citizenship, there must be some kind of knowledge of the facts, and not what we're told. Why did we go to war with Iraq? Do we repeat the official line of spreading democracy or do we answer that it was to rape them of their natural resources. Obviously, this sort of question could be the difference between becoming a free thinking citizen or a repeater of government lies.

reply to post by Scorchio


INDEED.

And not only that . . .

How does one DEFINE THE CRITERIA FOR CITIZENSHIP AND EXEMPLARY CITIZENSHIP?

And How does one prevent such defining from being taken over by something like the current globalist oligarchy and twisted to tyrannical ends?

. . . essentially . . . WHO WATCHES THE WATCHERS?

AND WHO WATCHES THE WATCHERS OF THE WATCHERS?

AND WHO WATCHES THE WATCHERS OF THE WATCHERS OF THE WATCHERS?

Without an elegant, honorable, fool-proof structure, system . . . it could get unwieldly fast.

Yet, every STRUCTURE and SYSTEM known to man has proven to be corruptible . . . at least as corruptible as the folks inhabiting the positions in the structure.

Therein, is the fatal flaw, I think.

The only solution, imho, is the Biblical prediction that God will write His law ON OUR HEARTS . . . of those who've chosen Him as THE ALL IN ALL.