Using A Sexy Video Game Avatar Makes Women Objectify Themselves

This might be the best thread on ATS in a while.

My name "which is a inside joke" is considered female. Who would of thought?? So there are many times that online it is considered that and can make for very funny dialog.

reply to post by calstorm


Saints Row IV has an awesome character creation. I was running around as an obese Southern woman sporting the most glorious moustache ever. Of course, they still did the whole eye candy thing but at least they left it up to the player as to what they wanted to look like. Had a grand time with it and some of the most hilarious cut scenes ever.

I'm actually not fond of most of the female characters that get put into games simply because they are too skimpily dressed or wield an unusually large bosom that would give serious back problems in reality. Generally a combination of both.

To the guys that think that being a female gamer is so easy, try walking in my shoes someday. Back in the late 90's, I made the mistake once of revealing my gender in a game. I had 19 guys on a 24 player server telling me in chat that they were going to do some very violent things to me in a highly graphic manner. When I won a gaming tournament, I spent my celebratory evening playing on my sponsor's server where I had guys joining the server to say some pretty appalling things all because the sportscasters remarked that I was a woman on the broadcast. I had the gall to be their first female champion. I've had so many guys say some pretty horrific things to me simply because I was a female fps gamer that I've lost count. I don't get mad. I just play harder. I cannot say precisely what any of these lowlifes said to me on ATS because it would smash the T&C. Imagine some of the worst things that you could say to another human being with a sexual twist and you'd probably be pretty close. I will say this though. Times are a-changing because the last time I played a FPS game and some guy started to sexually harass me in a pretty gruesome fashion, the entire server banned him without me ever saying a word. I couldn't believe it.

But I suppose some of you would call those guys "white knights". Better to have some common decency for your fellow gamer than to do nothing is what I say. I do the same thing for my fellow gamers, regardless of gender, when they are being harassed.

reply to post by WhiteAlice
Playing harder knowing you are beating dudes in a game is perfect. The nasty comments just make it so much better.

Nyiah
reply to post by BrokenCircles

 

I think we sporadically forget that the avatars aren't real, and since we're hardwired to respond to humans, and especially attractive ones, in social environments, it's like forgetting that you're online & going about the interaction like you would in person. I've seen people do it, too. I'm not bothered often in games, it's usually in PvE queues where I do the most chatting (coordinating strategies & placements, idle chatter in lulls, etc) For context, I play Star Trek Online, and it's a myriad of avatars and interactions all around. I think it mostly depends on the ages on the players, too. Older folks don't tend to be too bothersome or chatty in-game, but the younger ones, teens and twenty-somethings, sometimes approach attractive players in public areas. Most often, it's a simple "Buzz Off" in the zone chat that gets them laughed out of the instance. So yeah, I don't discount that attractive avs get attention. If it were a real life grouping, I doubt it would go much differently with the attractive people.

And I concur, it's like clothes to me, but my 4 Trek avs are all clothed as best possible (full uniforms, with the acception of my Orion, who gets tattered pants & a tattered top---she's an opportunist raider, hard life) When I log out of the game, that's like taking those "clothes" off, for the most part. They're not necessarily me or extensions of me in-game, but since I did create them with my tastes in mind, they have elements of me in how they're dressed.

And to the PP who said we're like unicorns. You'd be surprised, man. If the boobs are huge, it's typically a guy gamer. If a girl wants to not be noticed, she's usually one of the male avatars

edit on 10/10/2013 by Nyiah because: (no reason given)

edit on 10/10/2013 by Nyiah because: (no reason given)

I've had my same avatar since I joined....and I never got any special treatment... There have been a few times where guys were mean to me, so no, I think it matters....but then my avatar isn't "cute" either....she is sexy, but tough.....now maybe if I had an avatar of say....a bikini model....maybe.

This reminds me of a song. Do you wanna date my avatar. I highly suggest watching this hilarious video. And it has felicia day in it if i remember correctly.

reply to post by Crakeur


and not all female avatars are of the female some are of men being female and vice versa. thats why i play non avatar games. the next time one is being a female av ask yourself this is that really a female.... oh yea the same can be said for men is that really a man? is rambo rambo...

reply to post by bekod


If you go back and read the rest of my posts, you'll see that I did have a female avatar a while back, in a game so I am absolutely aware of that.



Alice - see above. I have walked in your shoes, with regards to gaming, and it was a real eye opening experience.

reply to post by WhiteAlice


You know, I am beginning to think it is not specific to gender though.

I have noticed that the second someone "singles themselves out," they start to get harassed. I think people are really used to the anonymity, and once there is a solid "real" aspect to latch onto, many people do so. It stands out like a chess piece on a checkerboard. And I think, culturally, we are quick to find the parts that make others "different," and subsequently use it as some sort of tether for mistreatment.

I have seen it done with everything from gender, to race, to speech impediments, to age, to occupation, to even physical disablement. Heck, I have been kicked from groups because of health issues with the excuse of "well, you arent physically well, so we need someone who is actually good at the game."

I think its just the forces of anonymity at play, it makes us do some interesting things.

Nyiah

Arnie123

That avatar...I want to say that's Rikku from the final fantasy 13....

You know, it never crossed my mind to ask. Now that you're pondering it, I'm curious as to where her image hails from.

Speaking of avatars on ATS, if I take a fleeting glance at yours, I somehow see a Tholian in an enviro suit.

--
lol, thanks! close but no cigar...
en.wikipedia.org...

Crakeur
reply to post by bekod

 

If you go back and read the rest of my posts, you'll see that I did have a female avatar a while back, in a game so I am absolutely aware of that.



Alice - see above. I have walked in your shoes, with regards to gaming, and it was a real eye opening experience.

I have used female characters gaming when they have bigger guns. I always like to have the bigger gun Crak

Crakeur
reply to post by Evil_Santa

 

I was talking about the fool of an avatar I have here. It was a joke.

The last time I picked an avatar for a game, I made a hot little red headed woman and wound up getting all kinds of gifts, and some ugly chat, from dudes who assumed I was a woman. I wound up changing her name to Xysys Nohlayde (this is no lady) and, eventually, the dudes backed off.

I eventually found it easier to play your own sex otherwise you had to get used to faking chat that was expected responses to people who always assume. I had one guy ask if I would take game money to "talk dirty to him" dumb guy I could have been anyone he didn't care as long as the avatar was sexy.

Still my main is an ugly looking male!

I love watching my military son, when he play a female he uses the language in chat "yes hun could you do that for me" he gets whatever he wants it is hilarious he is a 6.2 macho man who flies an apache. People do way more for my female than male characters and expect less of them, it is very interesting the behaviors.

reply to post by Char-Lee


the one time I used a female avatar, I didn't actually pretend I was a woman. if anyone talked to me, it was made clear rather quickly although I did hold my tongue when folks would offer me gifts of gear or try and act like some stud protector.

then, once I'd save their hide and show them who was boss, I'd mention that it might be easier if they called me Steve.


Nothing like a small spoon of humility to put someone in their place.

I don't play multi-player games because my computer is too slow but I remember back when I would play Age of Empires being a girl would cause the boy teams to team up and try and destroy me. Maybe war games are different? I never understand why people can't just play people like opponents. Everyone is on equal footing in gaming. Either way it's definitely interesting from a psychology standpoint.

I play WOW a lot and have a pretty cool mix of toons both male and female. One night was sitting on a hill on my female pally and a dude came up and sat by me and tried to hit on her. I explained I was a guy and said wouldn't it be nice if it was that easy to just walk up and chat.

reply to post by Char-Lee


your post prove my point , gender avs should not influence the game play or chat but it does, it should be based on skill not looks, but then it does reflect society.

bekod
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

your post prove my point , gender avs should not influence the game play or chat but it does, it should be based on skill not looks, but then it does reflect society.

I have been playing for 14 years and I agree with you, it does.

hoochymama23
reply to post by WhiteAlice

 

Playing harder knowing you are beating dudes in a game is perfect. The nasty comments just make it so much better.

Yep. I don't let them run me off of any game server. In fact, I nail them very hard on multiple psychological levels as I will also make an offer of being an empathetic ear to why they chose to say the things that they did. It's effective about 99% of the time as it undermines them on multiple levels. Gone through this so many times over the year that I've figured out the most effective response.

reply to post by Serdgiam


Absolutely agree, believe it or not. Most of the time, I'm very quiet when playing a game in those that have in-game voice communications. What gets me noted on a server is typically the fact that I'm doing very well at the game. These individuals will look at my Steam profile and note my gender and will use my gender as a basis for attack. I have a lot of friends who are or have been pro-gamers and are male. They, too, will get attacked on servers but under a different kind of flavor as opposed to extreme sexual harassment. I also have made a lot of friends with 13 year olds because I stood up for them when they were attacked for simply speaking over voice comms. Also, I've encountered a couple instances where a gamer was black and his speech and profile made that clear who ended up being subject to racial attacks. So yeah, absolutely. People that will engage in this kind of behavior will use whatever perceived weakness/information about the other player as a target for verbal assault. A lot of times, the predicating factor for them doing this (except in the young kid case) is the player on the receiving end tends to be really good at the game. It's also usually the players at the bottom of the scoreboard that are doing it. However, it's not consistent.

I used to be an editorial writer for a gaming website (now defunct) years ago. I decided that I would run an experiment in a FPS game soon after in-game voice was added to the game to answer the question as to how gender influenced perception and treatment by other gamers. I created a duplicate Steam account and nickname that was completely without gender and set out to become a regular on the server. After two weeks of regular play, I was greeted by multiple other regulars. Some expressed joy that I was on their team. Just about everybody liked me and those who hated me, due to probable peer pressure, simply made remarks like "oh god, it's *****. There goes my fun." and the like. One more week and it was consistent. I was generally well-liked and admired as a good player. Then I spoke for the first time on the in-game voice comms and the chat on the server erupted. I had some guys try to hit on me. The majority hated me and when one of those who weren't fond of me previously began to sexually harass me, that majority joined them including those who had attempted to flirt with me. My advice to female gamers subsequent to this experiment was to make a choice--either hide your gender and be assured peace or don't hide it because it does nothing to rectify the problem.

About 10 years later, during the broadcast of my championship match on G4, an inequity made itself very visible that was remarked upon by both strangers and friends. It was very marked that one of my teammates had deliberately ignored my calls for assistance. Now I had suspected that I was recipient to some inequity both on public servers and in matches by my own teammate. I decided that the best way to figure out if it was simple paranoia on my part or if it was actual would be to do a repeat of the above experiment. This time, however, I would be playing with the exact same people that I normally played with. Second account of Steam and the game, name was Ti|ted to allow for the common presumption that I was male. Zero use of voice comms. Nothing to identify me to my "friends". This game has a healer class that can heal teammates. The test was whether or not I would get healed more as Ti|ted--a virtually unknown player--than as myself. The results broke my heart as even those so-called friends healed me as Ti|ted more than they ever did me. My KPD went from 3:1 to nearly 20:1 It was very dramatic.

I decided to push it a little more, however, and using a voice morpher, I tweaked my own voice so that I sounded male. However, the effect was that I sounded like a flaming male and I went with it. Ti|ted "came out of the closet" and, using the voice morpher, I became a gay flirtatious male on that same server. Remarkably, although my healers indicated how uncomfortable I made them, they still kept healing me more than they ever did as myself. So even when I was presumed to be very much homosexual, I was treated more equitably than when I was me--a female gamer and a champion gamer no less. That hurt and was so very depressing. These were people who were always friendly to me and several were actually on my friends list.

Although the level of sexual harassment is definitely lower in fps games these days, sexual discrimination still exists. These people avoided assisting me in game even if it meant losing a round. So yeah, some people will target others on any perceived weakness--absolutely agree. However, among my friends on Steam that were also pro and competitive gamers, every single one of them will say that I, as a female and former pro gamer, get harassed at a significantly higher level in both number and execution than they do in addition to observing the inequity that also occurs. A second observation that has been made repeatedly is that, compared to other female gamers within the same gaming community, I still have a higher rate of being grossly harassed than those other females and the difference is that I do very well in the games. Basically, if you're female and you're really good, you're not going to get respect. You'll be attacked because you are going against all the norms and stereotypes held by a still predominately male gaming community.

reply to post by WhiteAlice


Thank you for sharing those stories.. and I certainly believe them. While I think the harassment is specific to whatever "thing" you want to throw out there, there is still some wierd stigma with females and gaming.

Anyway, that said, if you are ever playing a game that I am, you are MORE than welcome on my team. My only rule is "Respect All," which sadly means my guilds/corps/teams tend to be very small groups. It seems like disrespect is seen as a complete and totally legitimate form of PvP in its own right, and I find it repulsive.

I only play GW2 now, until another game comes out with mass scale PvP (love the added strategies large scale fighting adds into the mix).

We should start an ATS gaming group Only rule: Respect All. Period.

I dont think the avatars really have anything to do with any of this, honestly. We see this type of behavior everywhere, just with different stigmatized groups. I think it just shows peoples true nature when they are given the appearance of anonymity.

White Alice, wow, I should count my blessings that I've never come across that kind of behavior! I used to play the hell out of Hero back in the day (before it went to total crap from hackers & bots) Between my husband & I, we made a lot of enemies from map to map because we'd encroach of some high-level doof's "territory". We'd trade off on the in-game "assassinations" against the gamer enemies we made. We'd hear murmurs of them planning to take us out, & one of us would end up taking them out first (lol) I don't recall anyone ever targeting me for being female in that one, it seemed to be almost entirely a "This is MY MAP" deal, and they were pretty vicious about it. I've also played Forsaken World & PWI, and a few other fantasy genre games & never encountered or even saw outright gender bias like you experienced.
This makes me wonder if it has anything to do with a genre's subculture more than the genre itself? I'm sure if I looked hard enough in any game, I'll find a like-minded group of blowhards hellbent on harassing Target X for whatever reason. I guess that depends on how much influence they have over other players as well.

reply to post by Nyiah


In my experience, FPS games tend to have some of the most vicious people you can find. Most gamers can be rude, but the worst gaming experiences I have had have ALL been in FPS games. Especially when my twitch skills started to go because of health issues, this became very apparent. So, I dont play them much anymore.

WhiteAlice mentioned FPS, and while I dont know if thats ALL she plays, I can say that for whatever reason.. that type of game brings out a very dark side in some people. Very, very dark..