Batman vs. Superman: Fans won't influence film

TDawgRex
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

I'm wondering when the wack-a-doodle writers over at SYFY are going to get a chance at the big screen. Sharknado 2: It's Hammerhead Time. (in 3D)

edit on 26-9-2013 by TDawgRex because: spelling

I wished I could give you a thousand stars for that...
The end of the original is classic...

I love comics and think that the last decade of comic based movies have been horrible. The creators of these films completely spit in the face of history or continuity. They change characters looks and backgrounds to appeal to non comic readers. I watched Iron Man 3 last night and was disgusted with the way they took a well known villain from the Iron man books (The Mandarin) and then they just completely rewrite things changing the character forever in the movies. This pissed me off because the previews have you expecting to see the Mandarin using his power rings but well I wont spoil it but the final product was a kick in the nuts to me.

The worst part is the fact is that now these movies are driving the comics in some ways. Marvel changed a lot of their characters to match the looks in the movies and are focusing their books to reinforce the movies. For the last year Marvel has been all about the Avengers hoping to prime the public for the next movie.

Who asked for a Guardians of the Galaxy movie to be made? No one. Those characters are so mediocre compared to the stable of stories and icons in the marvel comics.

I think a lot of the problems with not sticking to continuity come from the fact that these stories traditionally do not work with the agendas that Hollywood is attempting to push in their films thus causing massive rewrites.

Wrabbit2000
reply to post by the owlbear

 

Apoco-what? lol... Yeah, I missed that one too. I also wasn't one of his fans on Christ. If I wanted to watch 2+ hours of flogging and torture mixed with total boredom in foreign languages? I'd tune in to coverage from the UN General Assembly floor. At least that's timely....but one can't argue the success of it.

Then he also made We Were Soldiers and Braveheart. I'd consider them both defining movies for their selected topics. A couple Vietnam vets, including my Father, mentioned back when it came out that it was as close as they'd seen to the real thing on screen. That is his success I think. Good old fashioned hard work to make the film accurate to the topic by research and caring to get it right.

If more Hollywood studios focused on that and less on retreads of what they figure will work just because the last one did...or a couple back, in some cases, ...they may have a much better time in box office take.

I feel you. But that's the way things were back then...even today. Torture continues...
My old man was a Viet Nam vet...jungle combat trained...dropped him off in the Oregon woods with nothing but a knife and expected them to make it out. He was also waterboarded and tortured to make sure he wouldn't talk if caught. Rode a little boat up and down the Mekong...unlike Kerry, he was actually IN Cambodia, saw guys in unmarked Hueys in suits jumping out...but forget I said that He couldn't finish "Full Metal Jacket" because it was that real.

NihilistSanta
I love comics and think that the last decade of comic based movies have been horrible. The creators of these films completely spit in the face of history or continuity. They change characters looks and backgrounds to appeal to non comic readers. I watched Iron Man 3 last night and was disgusted with the way they took a well known villain from the Iron man books (The Mandarin) and then they just completely rewrite things changing the character forever in the movies. This pissed me off because the previews have you expecting to see the Mandarin using his power rings but well I wont spoil it but the final product was a kick in the nuts to me.

The worst part is the fact is that now these movies are driving the comics in some ways. Marvel changed a lot of their characters to match the looks in the movies and are focusing their books to reinforce the movies. For the last year Marvel has been all about the Avengers hoping to prime the public for the next movie.

Who asked for a Guardians of the Galaxy movie to be made? No one. Those characters are so mediocre compared to the stable of stories and icons in the marvel comics.

I think a lot of the problems with not sticking to continuity come from the fact that these stories traditionally do not work with the agendas that Hollywood is attempting to push in their films thus causing massive rewrites.

edit on 26-9-2013 by NihilistSanta because: (no reason given)

You have a beef with Rocket Racoon and Groot?!?
I just hope Galactus gets at least a walk-on

the owlbear

NihilistSanta
I love comics and think that the last decade of comic based movies have been horrible. The creators of these films completely spit in the face of history or continuity. They change characters looks and backgrounds to appeal to non comic readers. I watched Iron Man 3 last night and was disgusted with the way they took a well known villain from the Iron man books (The Mandarin) and then they just completely rewrite things changing the character forever in the movies. This pissed me off because the previews have you expecting to see the Mandarin using his power rings but well I wont spoil it but the final product was a kick in the nuts to me.

The worst part is the fact is that now these movies are driving the comics in some ways. Marvel changed a lot of their characters to match the looks in the movies and are focusing their books to reinforce the movies. For the last year Marvel has been all about the Avengers hoping to prime the public for the next movie.

Who asked for a Guardians of the Galaxy movie to be made? No one. Those characters are so mediocre compared to the stable of stories and icons in the marvel comics.

I think a lot of the problems with not sticking to continuity come from the fact that these stories traditionally do not work with the agendas that Hollywood is attempting to push in their films thus causing massive rewrites.

edit on 26-9-2013 by NihilistSanta because: (no reason given)

You have a beef with Rocket Racoon and Groot?!?
I just hope Galactus gets at least a walk-on

Which Galactus the bad ass devourer of worlds from the comics or the cloud from the FF movie?

I need to also add to this thread that Changing the ending to Watchman = Blasphemy . No wonder Alan Moore hates everything these days.

I know they're different companies...but I'd like to see Iron Man vs. Batman.

Both rich as all get out, both brilliant, both just dudes in suits with technology.

I think Tony Stark would ultimately kick Bruce Wayne to the curb. If we follow cannon from the Iron Man comics, Stark would have the Extremis (the real version, not the movie version from Iron Man 3). Batman doesn't have anything even close to that...

reply to post by MystikMushroom


That would be an interesting battle. I would give the edge to Batman though. I am sure he would have some EMP device ready for Tony's suit. Batman always has a way of exploiting his enemies weaknesses. Bats is about stealth too so perhaps he would get the drop on Tony. I kind of miss Iron man being a drunk. They completely removed that from the movies.

reply to post by NihilistSanta


IDK, Tony got pretty torn up at his birthday party in Iron Man II ...

But I hear ya. He's got a lot of demons, kind of like Bruce Wayne.

NihilistSanta
I need to also add to this thread that Changing the ending to Watchman = Blasphemy . No wonder Alan Moore hates everything these days.

Agreed on the blasphemy...

And the only Galactus I know is a guy formerly known as Galen who was the only survivor of the last universe in 616 terms.
Now, he wears short pants and a funny hat and eats planets

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

::Hands wrabbit some carrot cake::
That's for all your other great threads. I really enjoy them, and agree with about 90% of what you say on here.
That being said, I have to respectfully disagree with you on this point.
I have to stand up for the director on this one. The fans aren't complaining about the script. They're not complaining about the portrayal of the characters. They are WHINING because they don't like Ben Affleck being cast as Batman. For the love of God, they started a petition on whitehouse.gov to get Obama to step in and do something about it! Like he could, or should, have any ability to do something about this.
I like Ben Affleck as an actor. I didn't think the Michael Keaton Batman could be any good, having watched Beetlejuice, but once I saw it I thought he did really well. Personally I'm reserving judgement on the movie till I at least see a trailer. Till then, or until at least a script leaks, I have to support the director staying the course and "ignoring the fan base".
Personally I'm hoping they do the Frank Miller storyline about Superman vs. Batman, but I'm expecting it to be a setup for the JLA movie DC pushed back rather than have it square off versus Avengers 2.

the owlbear
He couldn't finish "Full Metal Jacket" because it was that real.

Little known fact (For most anyways): Full Metal Jacket was based off the book, "The Short-Timers" by Gustav Hasford. The movie pissed me off because it pretty much ended half-way through the book. But it was fairly spot on up to that point.

Hey Hollywood! If you're going to base a movie off a book...finish the story.

reply to post by NowanKenubi

I too am a Marvel over DC fan, never really got into the comics that much except for their Vertigo line. However, while Marvel is conquering the big budget movie field, DC has steadily been whipping out direct to video animateds for most of the DC big boys, and they're doing well with it. They even did the Frank Miller Superman vs Batman (which is part of why I don't think they're going to do it for the live action) and I highly recommend them. Superman vs the Elite was VERY good. A group of superpowereds decide to "stop following the rules", and the world begins to support their method over Superman's boy scout ways. I won't give away the ending, but they did it very well. I thought it also sent a very important message.
As I said, never really a big DC fan, but I think most would enjoy the DC direct to video line, and for the most part they stay truer to the original origins than most of the live action movies or even the comics.

reply to post by the owlbear

Thanks, I couldn't remember the name of the graphic novel. Did you know they just released it last year as a two part direct to video animated, which stuck fairly close to the original? I read the original when it came out, and I highly recommend the videos. As stated above, I recommend most of DC's direct to video animateds, even though I'm not a big DC fan. My favorites were always their "Elseworlds", DC's equivalent to Marvel's "What If..."

reply to post by NihilistSanta

I understood the need to change the ending to Watchmen. The whole city block sized alien octopus thing just wouldn't have worked. They part they changed I couldn't stand was having Owlman and Silk Spectre 2 kill the thugs in the back alleys. It's been about 15-20 years since I read the graphic novel, but I watched the motion comic right before I went to see the movie, and I was pleasantly shocked at how incredibly close it stayed to the original comic.
The only thing I found truly disturbing (which still stuck to the comic book) was the constant view of Lower Manhatten throughout the movie...

reply to post by NihilistSanta

What's wrong with a Guardians movie? Is Marvel only allowed to make the big boys, like X-men, FF, and the Avengers spinoffs? Guardians is supposed to set the stage for Avengers 2, much like the various Avenger character prequels did for the first. Personally I don't mind seeing some of the lesser known ones, especially considering what they did to X-men and Ghost Rider (2 of the series that I grew up on. GR2 was blasphemy.)
Dr. Strange, Black Panther, and a Nick Fury origin are being tossed around right now. There are a few others, but those 3 are the only ones I know of that there's even half a push to do. Oh, and a Deadpool flick, which has a script ready to go, but so far the project is stalled because of them trying to figure out how to tone it down enough to get it back down to a PG-13 movie so they can pull in "the big audience" (Really, that's a GREAT idea.)

Wrabbit2000
reply to post by Pinke

 

I'd disagree entirely with the idea that new ideas can't go anywhere or that risky films by Hollywood's standards can do very well. Ask Mel Gibson about how going off your own direction and laughing at convention works out.

Can't attack Snyder and Goyer for doing what they want whilst praising Mel Gibson, and a handful of risky films doing well doesn't detract from the point that it's safer to make a high concept film which was my point.

It would be ludicrous to imply that I was saying all risky films and new ideas don't go anywhere, but new ideas and risky films are rare in their success.

Not a single movie in the top 15 is a sequel and while a few are made from very well known books?

The list you're using is incorrect I believe?

I have to look at it more, but it seems budget loss isn't taken into account properly in certain cases and some massive films aren't looked at. The Blair Witch Project, Halloween, Paranormal Activity, possibly Holy Grail, and a certain porn documentary would blow several of those films out the water to name a few ... The budget of Star Wars on that list is wrong also, the actual budget was 10 to 11 million from memory.

If they introduced inflation the list would change again and you would expect Gone with the Wind and maybe Doctor Zhivago or something to show up there. Some of the film budgets also have extenuating circumstances.

The 'found footage reality horror' trend is an excellent example of how Hollywood works. One 'original' cheap idea = lets redo it till they stop paying for it.

They can write movies for each other or they can write movies for the audiences. They seem to be choosing each other.

There are a few more successful directors around now with the power to make their own decisions, but the fast majority of them are getting crunched under studio boot heels who are basing their choices and investment on audience trends.

You're much more likely as a director to be forced to hire certain actors and produce certain scripts over being given artistic freedom.

Batmans like Sherlock holmes with some fancy tech gadgets.
Supermans made out dense matter and can stop a train on its tracks and fly though space.

How will Batman beat him without kryptonite

Sounds silly.

Sounds about typical for the modern audience of cyborgs tho.

Personally, I want to see Freddy Kruger vs Dexter.

That'd be some horrorshow !